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Another puzzle !!

Blogs > Thats_The_Spirit
Post a Reply
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Thats_The_Spirit
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Netherlands138 Posts
October 31 2009 15:10 GMT
#1
Inspired by DoctorHelvetica's cool puzzle, I thought I give you guys and gals another one:

[image loading]


Donnie is standing on a train track, while a train is coming towards him with a constant speed of 60 km/h, without the ability to stop.
Unfortunately donnie lives in a 2D world, and doesnt have the leg power to jump over the train. So he has 2 options:
1) Run away from the train and get hit exactly at point A.
2) Just get it over with and run towards the train, and get hit at point B.

The little vertical beams on the track are of equal distance from eachother.

Question: what is the average running speed of Donnie?

*
Dr.Lettuce
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United Kingdom663 Posts
October 31 2009 15:17 GMT
#2
We'll never know because we don't know the distance between sticks.
Julmust
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Sweden4867 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-10-31 15:25:39
October 31 2009 15:24 GMT
#3
yeah exactly, we need either the distance between the "sticks" or the time it takes the train to reach either point A or point B.

or wait you might be able to figure it out with the diffrence of point B and point A in mind, nothing I am gonna do now though.
AdministratorI'm dancing in the moonlight
stenole
Profile Blog Joined April 2004
Norway869 Posts
October 31 2009 15:29 GMT
#4
+ Show Spoiler +
You know that if Donnie runs to the left, he will be at one notch to the right of A then when the train is at B. You also know that in the time he runs one notch and reaches A, the train has moved 3 notches to meet him there. So the train is on average 3 times as fast as Donnie. 60kmph / 3 = 20 kmph.
Thats_The_Spirit
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Netherlands138 Posts
October 31 2009 15:31 GMT
#5
On November 01 2009 00:29 stenole wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
You know that if Donnie runs to the left, he will be at one notch to the right of A then when the train is at B. You also know that in the time he runs one notch and reaches A, the train has moved 3 notches to meet him there. So the train is on average 3 times as fast as Donnie. 60kmph / 3 = 20 kmph.


Congrats, you solved it
404.Delirium
Profile Joined May 2008
United States1190 Posts
October 31 2009 16:14 GMT
#6
The fact that he's named Donnie makes me think of Donnie Darko which makes me want to give an entirely different answer.
seriously next disrespectful comment in this blog is ip ban. Be happy or get the hell out. // SC2 is like playing with neutral-colored Play-Doh while BW is like colorful Legos.
JeeJee
Profile Blog Joined July 2003
Canada5652 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-10-31 18:56:42
October 31 2009 16:41 GMT
#7
+ Show Spoiler +

edit: usually i'd clean up my solutions but i wanted to leave my thought process this time lol

ok let's see..
so the key here obviously is that from donnie's current position, A is twice as far as B
wait
we'd also have to know how far away the train is, no?
if not.. let's assume it's 60km away from pt b, so donnie can run 1 bar in 1hr
so he can make it to A in 2hr, so the train is 120km away from pt a?..
so each bar is 20km so donnie runs at 20km/h? that's pretty fast but not unreasonable if ur a world class runner. hmm
now does the distance of the train matter..
if not.. let's assume it's Xkm away from pt b, so donnie can run 1 bar in 1time
so he can make it to A in 2time, so the train is 2Xkm away from pt a?..
so donnie can travel 2 bars in the time it takes the train to travel 2X, and we also know X is 3 bars
so donnie travels 2 bars in the time it takes the train to travel 6, aka 20kmh

(\o/)  If you want it, you find a way. Otherwise you find excuses. No exceptions.
 /_\   aka Shinbi (requesting a name change since 27/05/09 ☺)
Railxp
Profile Blog Joined February 2008
Hong Kong1313 Posts
October 31 2009 16:49 GMT
#8
this smells suspiciously like a homework thread.
~\(。◕‿‿◕。)/~,,,,,,,,>
Thats_The_Spirit
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Netherlands138 Posts
October 31 2009 22:49 GMT
#9
On November 01 2009 01:49 Railxp wrote:
this smells suspiciously like a homework thread.


The last homework assignment I turned in was quite a few years ago.

And I wish that I used to get homework like this.
JeeJee
Profile Blog Joined July 2003
Canada5652 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-10-31 23:19:34
October 31 2009 23:17 GMT
#10
On November 01 2009 07:49 Thats_The_Spirit wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 01 2009 01:49 Railxp wrote:
this smells suspiciously like a homework thread.


The last homework assignment I turned in was quite a few years ago.

And I wish that I used to get homework like this.


true that
homework rarely makes you actually *think* in the same way
and i'm like graduating from uni soon
sad

here's a random question, best asked in person so you can see people's thought process.. so if you answer it, write down your thoughts as you think about it =)

you have 2 houses on unequal ground connected by rope. The rope also has some "sag" in it, i.e. it's not tight. the vertical distance/sag height from the lowest point of the rope to the highest point is ten meters. the rope is attached at a fixed point on each house, points A and B, such that A and B are perfectly level with each other. the rope is 20m in length. how far apart are the houses?
(\o/)  If you want it, you find a way. Otherwise you find excuses. No exceptions.
 /_\   aka Shinbi (requesting a name change since 27/05/09 ☺)
igotmyown
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States4291 Posts
November 01 2009 00:26 GMT
#11
Why even bother saying they're on unequal ground if A and B are level?

You can solve these problems by dividing the rope up into segments and solving the differential equation, not sure if it falls into Newton's concatenary(?) object, which would be high point to low point.
KurtistheTurtle
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States1966 Posts
November 01 2009 00:29 GMT
#12
why would a 2d person ever get on train tracks? that seems stupid of donnie
“Reject your sense of injury and the injury itself disappears."
JeeJee
Profile Blog Joined July 2003
Canada5652 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-11-01 00:32:20
November 01 2009 00:30 GMT
#13
On November 01 2009 09:26 igotmyown wrote:
Why even bother saying they're on unequal ground if A and B are level?

You can solve these problems by dividing the rope up into segments and solving the differential equation, not sure if it falls into Newton's concatenary(?) object, which would be high point to low point.


please continue writing your thoughts if you're intent on solving the problem =)
(\o/)  If you want it, you find a way. Otherwise you find excuses. No exceptions.
 /_\   aka Shinbi (requesting a name change since 27/05/09 ☺)
Thats_The_Spirit
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
Netherlands138 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-11-01 00:43:22
November 01 2009 00:40 GMT
#14
On November 01 2009 08:17 JeeJee wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 01 2009 07:49 Thats_The_Spirit wrote:
On November 01 2009 01:49 Railxp wrote:
this smells suspiciously like a homework thread.


The last homework assignment I turned in was quite a few years ago.

And I wish that I used to get homework like this.


true that
homework rarely makes you actually *think* in the same way
and i'm like graduating from uni soon
sad

here's a random question, best asked in person so you can see people's thought process.. so if you answer it, write down your thoughts as you think about it =)

you have 2 houses on unequal ground connected by rope. The rope also has some "sag" in it, i.e. it's not tight. the vertical distance/sag height from the lowest point of the rope to the highest point is ten meters. the rope is attached at a fixed point on each house, points A and B, such that A and B are perfectly level with each other. the rope is 20m in length. how far apart are the houses?



+ Show Spoiler +

[A and B are level with eachother] + [vertical distance = 10 m] + [rope length = 20 m]

i can only think of 1 conclusion: the houses must be only a couple of inches apart, with just enough space for the rope to hang in between
JeeJee
Profile Blog Joined July 2003
Canada5652 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-11-01 01:30:55
November 01 2009 01:26 GMT
#15
On November 01 2009 09:40 Thats_The_Spirit wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 01 2009 08:17 JeeJee wrote:
On November 01 2009 07:49 Thats_The_Spirit wrote:
On November 01 2009 01:49 Railxp wrote:
this smells suspiciously like a homework thread.


The last homework assignment I turned in was quite a few years ago.

And I wish that I used to get homework like this.


true that
homework rarely makes you actually *think* in the same way
and i'm like graduating from uni soon
sad

here's a random question, best asked in person so you can see people's thought process.. so if you answer it, write down your thoughts as you think about it =)

you have 2 houses on unequal ground connected by rope. The rope also has some "sag" in it, i.e. it's not tight. the vertical distance/sag height from the lowest point of the rope to the highest point is ten meters. the rope is attached at a fixed point on each house, points A and B, such that A and B are perfectly level with each other. the rope is 20m in length. how far apart are the houses?



+ Show Spoiler +

[A and B are level with eachother] + [vertical distance = 10 m] + [rope length = 20 m]

i can only think of 1 conclusion: the houses must be only a couple of inches apart, with just enough space for the rope to hang in between


+ Show Spoiler +
ding ding ding =) it was a (paraphrased) question from one cognitive science book; this particular chapter was talking about different approaches to problems/proofs.

i must say at first i fell into the same mindset as igotmyown.. i was asked this in person (as originally intended) so i was like "yeah, i can do this but i'd need a paper/pen" and just kinda got stuck at that mindset.. then after a brief chat i was forced to think about it some more and approach it differently "so you can't solve this?" "i can.. but i need a pen/paper" "so you can't right now?" "no" "are you sure?" "well..Oh."

it's a fun little exercise to see how people approach a problem.. which is why it doesn't work as well over the internet
(\o/)  If you want it, you find a way. Otherwise you find excuses. No exceptions.
 /_\   aka Shinbi (requesting a name change since 27/05/09 ☺)
N.geNuity
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States5112 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-11-01 01:51:16
November 01 2009 01:48 GMT
#16
Forgive my ignorance, but for the train:

The train needs to travel 8 "ticks" to point A. Donnie needs to run 2 ticks. Ego, the train would be 4 times as fast.....his average is 15 km/h.

If he ran to point B, he'd cover 1 tick in the time that the train would travel 5. Thus, the train is 5 times as fast. That'd be 12 km/h.

If he runs 1 notch left when the train reaches point B, he averages 12 km/h on that interval. The next interval he would have to speed up to 20 km/h to reach A (as people have noted). His average is less than 20 and is 15. He doesn't run at 20 km/h the whole time.

iu, seungah, yura, taeyeon, hyosung, lizzy, suji, sojin, jia, ji eun, eunji, soya, younha, jiyeon, fiestar, sinb, jung myung hoon godtier. BW FOREVERR
igotmyown
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States4291 Posts
November 01 2009 01:49 GMT
#17
+ Show Spoiler +

(un)luckily I'm more interested in how to solve problems than solving them, and paying attention to the numbers is too much unnecessary hard work (usually). That's why god invented engineers, to think about those boundary condition problems.
KlaCkoN
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Sweden1661 Posts
November 01 2009 11:27 GMT
#18
On November 01 2009 10:48 N.geNuity wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but for the train:

The train needs to travel 8 "ticks" to point A. Donnie needs to run 2 ticks. Ego, the train would be 4 times as fast.....his average is 15 km/h.

If he ran to point B, he'd cover 1 tick in the time that the train would travel 5. Thus, the train is 5 times as fast. That'd be 12 km/h.

If he runs 1 notch left when the train reaches point B, he averages 12 km/h on that interval. The next interval he would have to speed up to 20 km/h to reach A (as people have noted). His average is less than 20 and is 15. He doesn't run at 20 km/h the whole time.



You can't assume that the train takes 8 ticks to reach b though (if it did the problem would be inconsistent)
x = distance in kilometers between 2 ticks, y distance in kilometers between train and B, t = time in hours it takes donnie to run x kilometers.

then

y/t = 60
(y+3x)/2t = 60
-> x/t = 20

at least that's how I did it ~~

For jeejes problem it felt as if having access to pen and paper was almost cheating, (draw picture and done), kind of nice trick otherwise though :p
"Voice or no voice the people can always be brought to the bidding of their leaders ... All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger."
N.geNuity
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States5112 Posts
November 01 2009 16:31 GMT
#19
On November 01 2009 20:27 KlaCkoN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 01 2009 10:48 N.geNuity wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but for the train:

The train needs to travel 8 "ticks" to point A. Donnie needs to run 2 ticks. Ego, the train would be 4 times as fast.....his average is 15 km/h.

If he ran to point B, he'd cover 1 tick in the time that the train would travel 5. Thus, the train is 5 times as fast. That'd be 12 km/h.

If he runs 1 notch left when the train reaches point B, he averages 12 km/h on that interval. The next interval he would have to speed up to 20 km/h to reach A (as people have noted). His average is less than 20 and is 15. He doesn't run at 20 km/h the whole time.



You can't assume that the train takes 8 ticks to reach b though (if it did the problem would be inconsistent)
x = distance in kilometers between 2 ticks, y distance in kilometers between train and B, t = time in hours it takes donnie to run x kilometers.

then

y/t = 60
(y+3x)/2t = 60
-> x/t = 20

at least that's how I did it ~~

For jeejes problem it felt as if having access to pen and paper was almost cheating, (draw picture and done), kind of nice trick otherwise though :p


It's not 8 ticks to point B for the train. It is 5. And why separate "y" as a separate variable than x? y is five ticks, and every tick is the same length.....keep x as the distance between two ticks and t as the time donnie takes to run x.

y = 5x
(5x + 3x)/2t = 60
4x/t=60
x/t=15

Let's say each tick is 60 km. The train is 8 ticks away, so it is 480 km away. It takes the train 8 hours to cover 480 km.

Donnie is 2 ticks away. He is 120 km away. In 8 hours, he must travel 120 km.

120km/8h = 15km/h

IF donnie averaged 20 km/h, he would not get hit at point A. He would have travel 160km, well past point A.
iu, seungah, yura, taeyeon, hyosung, lizzy, suji, sojin, jia, ji eun, eunji, soya, younha, jiyeon, fiestar, sinb, jung myung hoon godtier. BW FOREVERR
KlaCkoN
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Sweden1661 Posts
November 01 2009 16:39 GMT
#20
On November 02 2009 01:31 N.geNuity wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 01 2009 20:27 KlaCkoN wrote:
On November 01 2009 10:48 N.geNuity wrote:
Forgive my ignorance, but for the train:

The train needs to travel 8 "ticks" to point A. Donnie needs to run 2 ticks. Ego, the train would be 4 times as fast.....his average is 15 km/h.

If he ran to point B, he'd cover 1 tick in the time that the train would travel 5. Thus, the train is 5 times as fast. That'd be 12 km/h.

If he runs 1 notch left when the train reaches point B, he averages 12 km/h on that interval. The next interval he would have to speed up to 20 km/h to reach A (as people have noted). His average is less than 20 and is 15. He doesn't run at 20 km/h the whole time.



You can't assume that the train takes 8 ticks to reach b though (if it did the problem would be inconsistent)
x = distance in kilometers between 2 ticks, y distance in kilometers between train and B, t = time in hours it takes donnie to run x kilometers.

then

y/t = 60
(y+3x)/2t = 60
-> x/t = 20

at least that's how I did it ~~

For jeejes problem it felt as if having access to pen and paper was almost cheating, (draw picture and done), kind of nice trick otherwise though :p


It's not 8 ticks to point B for the train. It is 5. And why separate "y" as a separate variable than x? y is five ticks, and every tick is the same length.....keep x as the distance between two ticks and t as the time donnie takes to run x.

y = 5x
(5x + 3x)/2t = 60
4x/t=60
x/t=15

Let's say each tick is 60 km. The train is 8 ticks away, so it is 480 km away. It takes the train 8 hours to cover 480 km.

Donnie is 2 ticks away. He is 120 km away. In 8 hours, he must travel 120 km.

120km/8h = 15km/h

IF donnie averaged 20 km/h, he would not get hit at point A. He would have travel 160km, well past point A.


Ok so say it's five ticks between train and b
then y=5x

5x/t=60
8x/2t=60
-> 48=60
clearly doesnt work.
"Voice or no voice the people can always be brought to the bidding of their leaders ... All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger."
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