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Active: 1671 users

How not to Bandwagon. A simple guide

Blogs > Diggity
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Diggity
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
United States806 Posts
October 20 2009 00:57 GMT
#1
This is (of course) a direct response to the front page article Bandwagon Broodwar which can be found here

Let me start off by clearly defining where I agree and disagree with hotbid

I agree that new fans should not be harassed by old fans. Being an old fan doesn't give you any special rights or privileges to bash newcomers. However feel free to bash any bandwagon jumpers.

I disagree that starcraft is more entertaining today or that starcraft "sucked back then". On the entertainment level its simply different which comes down to viewer preference. On that level, oranges aren't "better" than ice cream. As far as player skill I will address that in this article.

The two main points I want to address are
1) "bandwagon jumping" is okay.
2) Boxer sucks… (that I cannot abide)

Allow me to sum up Hot_Bids arguments paragraph by paragraph

1) New is better
2) Everyone is a bandwagon fan since the baseline motive for becoming a fan is being enamored by skill. Only successful players have skill QED.
3) We shouldn't flame fanboys. Its not worthwhile rooting for a player that sucks.

The major issue I have with this article is the complete lack of understanding when it comes to the term bandwagon and corollary that the only reason to respect or follow a player/team is if they are winning.

I am not surprised at all that both Hotbid and many of the comment posters that followed have no conception of bandwagon jumping.

Let us consult a source of great wisdom... Urban Dictionary
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=bandwagon

And I quote

1. bandwagon
When someone adopts a popular point of view for the primary purpose of recognition and/or acceptance by others.


2. To follow the group as it has the majority or a vast number of followers


3. What people will "ride" or get on when they want to be accepted, espescially in the NFL. People will get on the (Colts) bandwagon and suddenly become their fans because they are doing really good or because they have a large number of fans so they can be accepted.


For a real life example of this....

My roommate during my sophomore year of college rooted for the Lakers because Kobe Bryant (the lakers star player) looked EXACTLY like his favorite rapper Tupac Shakur (which sounds like a lot like a protoss name)

For comparison:

[image loading]


[image loading]

For Aiur

Uncanny resemblance....


What is wrong with Bandwagon Jumping?


The root question beneath this is: what is being a fan really about? How do fans and the players interact?

Fans live vicariously through the players. A fan emotionally connects with the team/players successes and failures.

That being said its important to examine the nature of the vicarious experience. I would hope that the entire point of following a particular player/team is to learn from their triumphs and struggles.

When you bandwagon jump you are only engaging in a fraction of the total experience and therefore completely missing out on important life lessons. Its like eating nothing but super sugary desserts.

Bandwagon jumping gives you the view that the strong were always strong, the skilled always skilled, the best always the best. In reality it takes HARD work to become good at anything. Winning doesn't happen in a vacuum. Additionally no one stays on the top forever.

True fans emotionally invest in the total experience. That includes the devastating losses and the lack luster wins.

While you get a quick cheap rush from victory with bandwagon jumping, dedicated fandom makes those same victorious all the more worthwhile and meaningful. Long term dedication gives us a small reflection of the long emotional perseverance of the victorious player themselves. .

Translating that into life lessons:
Isn't that the essence of starcraft itself; your first breach into C- as a direct result of continuous effort and emotional perseverance? In my opinion this is the essence of all competition and self improvement.

So in response to the article

1) New is better

This is a quote from later in the article.
That's not disrespecting him. Because sucking now doesn't change his win back then, and winning then doesn't
affect us recognizing he sucks today


Sorry to break it to you, but that is disrespecting boxer. You are putting all of his accomplishments in a single isolated time frame and determining your fandom based on that time frame. It’s a very shallow and empty dedication, particularly to someone who brought so much to the game.

Like I said earlier, no one stays on top forever. But people who put in the time and dedication, who fought for the right to be on the champions podium EARNED the respect to not be questioned like this. Boxer may not be playing his absolute best right now, but that does not mean he will always be playing poorly and that definitely doesn’t mean that its ok to suddenly stop supporting him, particularly if you are EVER going to call yourself a boxer fan in the present past or future.

I know its cliche but winning isn't everything. A player is more than his W-L ratio.

Continuing along the same lines of thought To quote Violetak,
If you are a fan of starcraft you are a fan of Boxer


Starcraft is what it is today directly due to the efforts of the great players of yester years. The game is different and exciting today BECAUSE OF THEM. Even recently Boxer and Oov spiced up the game by implementing Valkyries

Show some damn respect to the hardwork boxer, yellow and the other greats put in. Not saying you have to be super excited about their current level of play, but they have given us so much we owe it to them to give some support back.

[image loading]

This means you

Even if they aren't face stomping noobs right this second, they earned the respect and admiration of every starcraft fan through their pure guts and dedication.


2) Everyone is a bandwagon fan

BS. Plenty of people gave kwanro support even when he was playing terribly. I guarantee that even though he didn't take an MSL championship people will still be sticking with him the next season.

There are a ton of Savior fans supporting him right now even though he totally sucks at the moment.

This is true fan support in my opinion. Giving players encouragement particularly when they are down and when its the most difficult.

Next time you are at a low point in your life, you will find that you truly appreciate those that stick by you and encourage you through it. The people that are there on your good days and gone on your bad days mean exactly piss.

Addressing the opposite side of the argument, people become fans for more reasons than just “victories”. The classic example is FireBatHero for his goofy attitude. Focusing on pure play another good example is UpMagic. Upmagic loses CONSTANTLY. He always has. But he is still a great player to watch even if he doesn’t pull out a win in his latest 2 hr tvt game of epic maneuvering.

3) a) We shouldn't flame fanboys. b)Its not worthwhile rooting for a player that sucks.

Go ahead and flame fanboys. Fan opposition is one of the corner stones of sports at large. As long as it is lighthearted and in good fun it enhances the experience as a whole. True fans understand that getting jeered is part of the ebb and flow of the game itself.

Sometimes you get to rub it in, sometimes you are on the other end of the mockery. b) This is another problem with Bandwagon jumpers: they never stick around to receive what they give. If the going gets tough they just pick a new team or a new player to follow. It shows weak character. I would rather have 1 person that will stick it out with me through thick and thin than 1000 people who will abandon me at the first sign of trouble.


All that being said

How to not bandwagon jump



1) Follow a player/team because you like their personality, and/or play style, not just because they are winning.

Its ok to root for someone because they are exciting to watch. Even if they lose there is some visceral satisfaction that can be gleaned from the game. If wins are rare they are all the more exciting. Hunger is the best spice.

2) Stick with your player.

Yea maybe Nada Savior and Boxer may never take another championship. So what? Stick with them and relish the games they win. If they do rise back to prominence their victories are all the more satisfying.

Stork, Bisu and Xellos fans, you know what I am talking about.

3) Once you are a fan of a player/team, then gather with other people that share your viewpoint. Don't gather with a majority of people and then adopt their viewpoint.

This is the difference between sheep and individuals.


In conclusion, I hope that everyone takes notes from this and then applies those lessons directly to their local foreigners. I know that support means a lot more to guys like Whitera Brat_OK and Louder (maybe even CSL players) right now since they barely get recognized (let alone paid) for the TON of hardwork they put in.

I would also like to highlight sparkyzcast to all the OGN fans: http://www.youtube.com/sparkyzcast





****
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
October 20 2009 01:03 GMT
#2
Wow, this topic has really gotten a lot of attention recently.

On October 20 2009 09:57 Diggity wrote:
2) Stick with your player.

Yea maybe Nada Savior and Boxer may never take another championship. So what? Stick with them and relish the games they win. If they do rise back to prominence their victories are all the more satisfying.

Stork, Bisu and Xellos fans, you know what I am talking about.


I think this is really what it all leads up to. Everyone gravitates to the player that's doing well. That's natural. What separates normal fandom from bandwagoning is when they jump OFF. The average, well-respected fan sticks to their player and gives their support even when they're sucking. The bandwagoner jumps off and gets on the bandwagon for the next big thing.
Moderator
Sharp-eYe
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Canada642 Posts
October 20 2009 01:04 GMT
#3
you know Hot_Bid said that respecting old Pro-gamers is a must?
Are you truly so blinded by your vaunted religion, that you can't see the fall ahead of you? - Zeratul III AKA WikidSik ingame (anygame)
NrG.Bamboo
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States2756 Posts
October 20 2009 01:06 GMT
#4
Diggity I goddamn love you ^>^ Very well written, and I agree 100%

That said, go WeMade, bitches!

+ Show Spoiler +
I MISS KEKE, AND FIREFIST IS A SELLOUT, SHUNNN
I need to protect all your life you can enjoy the vibrant life of your battery
Slaughter
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
United States20254 Posts
October 20 2009 01:08 GMT
#5
Always have been and always will be a Yellow fan.
Never Knows Best.
Chef
Profile Blog Joined August 2005
10810 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-10-20 01:15:39
October 20 2009 01:14 GMT
#6
How not to Bandwagon: Chef's Improved Version

Cheer for who you want, when you want.
LEGEND!! LEGEND!!
mahnini
Profile Blog Joined October 2005
United States6862 Posts
October 20 2009 01:19 GMT
#7
stop bandwagoning on bandwagon threads
the world's a playground. you know that when you're a kid, but somewhere along the way everyone forgets it.
LxRogue
Profile Blog Joined March 2007
United States1415 Posts
October 20 2009 01:20 GMT
#8
Good response, although I think Hot_Bid was being a bit facetious.
Ilikestarcraft
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Korea (South)17731 Posts
October 20 2009 01:21 GMT
#9
On October 20 2009 10:19 mahnini wrote:
stop bandwagoning on bandwagon threads

this please
"Nana is a goddess. Or at very least, Nana is my goddess." - KazeHydra
Djabanete
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States2786 Posts
October 20 2009 01:23 GMT
#10
"Boxer currently sucks."
"I have lasting respect for Boxer."

These sentences are not mutually exclusive. What's there to debate?
May the BeSt man win.
NSANE.hydra
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States644 Posts
October 20 2009 01:24 GMT
#11
That example isn't an example of jumping on a bandwagon, unless everyone else was rooting for LA due to a resemblance between Kobe and Tupac. That's just your roommate liking the Lakers for a weird reason. If he had rooted for LA because they were the popular team to win, then it would be bandwagon-jumping. But according to you, that's not why. So it isn't.
"fuck mech...I could 4pool and as long as he's simply PLANNING on going mech, I'll lose"
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-10-20 01:37:05
October 20 2009 01:36 GMT
#12
On October 20 2009 10:19 mahnini wrote:
stop bandwagoning on bandwagon threads

The way to do that is to keep making bandwagon threads after no one else cares anymore.
Moderator
John49ers
Profile Joined May 2009
United States237 Posts
October 20 2009 01:41 GMT
#13
Too bad Broodwar isn't decades old then we could be born into rooting for a team by default because of where you live/grew up.

I'm a third generation San Francisco 49ers fan. When I was a child I remember rooting for my team with my grandparents and parents at Candlestick Park. Even following them now during these bad years still hoping for a playoff run. I could never hop on a Patriots Bandwagon just because they break breaks records left and right.

Being born and raised into a Niner fanbase is something i'm proud of.

I hope the SC esports scene lasts long enough to have that kind of impact on some family's life.
“The beauty of Bill's system was that there was always a place to go with the ball, ... I was the mailman, just delivering people's mail, and there were all kinds of houses to go to.”-Joe Montana
disciple
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
9070 Posts
October 20 2009 01:43 GMT
#14
On October 20 2009 10:23 Djabanete wrote:
"Boxer currently sucks."
"I have lasting respect for Boxer."

These sentences are not mutually exclusive. What's there to debate?

the point is , why should ppl care if boxer currently sucks. his quality of play is completely irrelevant outside the meaningless artosis style "best of all time" debate, which is all that matter.

Great blog btw and I'm not even bandwagoning
Administrator"I'm a big deal." - ixmike88
GGQ
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Canada2653 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-10-20 01:52:46
October 20 2009 01:48 GMT
#15
1) click Quote
2) type 'this'
3) click Post

edit- well not quite. your example of band-wagon with Kobe Bryant is just not right. Also, I think you were too hard on Hot_Bid's saying that BoxeR sucks. Even though I wouldn't say that about him (or any progamer), I think it's a legitimate thing to say, even for a BoxeR fan.
Mikilatov
Profile Blog Joined May 2008
United States3897 Posts
October 20 2009 01:51 GMT
#16
Great post. Very interesting response to HotBid's article, and although both of your writeups were great, I'd have to say I more agree with you. I too didn't quite understand how 'everyone' was a bandwagon fan.
♥ I used to lasso the shit out of your tournaments =( ♥ | Much is my hero. | zizi yO~ | Be Nice, TL.
NSANE.hydra
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States644 Posts
October 20 2009 01:51 GMT
#17
On October 20 2009 10:48 GGQ wrote:
1) click Quote
2) type 'this'
3) click Post


this.
"fuck mech...I could 4pool and as long as he's simply PLANNING on going mech, I'll lose"
LordWeird
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
United States3411 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-10-20 02:14:03
October 20 2009 02:08 GMT
#18
Diggity you are so awesome, thanks for writing this I really enjoyed it. I'm glad Hot_Bid wrote that because it's made some really nice threads pop up.

edit:
On October 20 2009 10:51 NSANE.hydra wrote:
Show nested quote +
On October 20 2009 10:48 GGQ wrote:
1) click Quote
2) type 'this'
3) click Post


this.


fuck off
Chains none
BachHo
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States170 Posts
October 20 2009 02:36 GMT
#19
Giving the smackdown, repping BoxeR, and promoting English Commentary. What a baller.

<3 Diggity.
BanZu
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States3329 Posts
October 20 2009 02:47 GMT
#20
I love BoxeR and I think he sucks.

What disrespect is does not depend on just what you think it is. If I don't think it's disrespectful, then obviously I don't mean to be disrespectful. Why flame me when my intentions aren't what YOU interpret them to be?
Sun Tzu once said, "Defiler becomes useless at the presences of a vessel."
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