• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 06:31
CEST 12:31
KST 19:31
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection2Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO8 Preview5[ASL21] Finals Preview: Two Legacies21Code S Season 2 (2026) - RO12 Preview2herO wins GSL Code S Season 1 (2026)7
Community News
[BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June0Weekly Cups (May 25-31): Clem doubles, 2v2 circuit heads toward finale0StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th149Weekly Cups (May 18-24): MaxPax wins doubles0Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League5
StarCraft 2
General
StarCraft II 5.0.16 PTR Patch Notes may 26th The Death of Cheese: From a Professional Cheeser My starcraft 2 changes Oliveira Would Have Returned If EWC Continued SC2 Parody - "Somebody That I Used to Troll"
Tourneys
Maestros of The Game 2 announcement and schedule ! GSL Code S Season 2 (2026) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event Crank Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 528 Infection Detected Welcome to the External Content forum Mutation # 527 Hell Train
Brood War
General
Tesagi Viewer - A new era of replay watching Data analysis on 70 million replays BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ FlaShFTW vs A.Alm Grudge Match Event [BSL22] Non-Korean Championship from 13 to 28 June
Tourneys
[ASL21] Grand Finals [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [BSL22] WB Final & LB Semis - Saturday 21:00 CEST
Strategy
Why doesn't anyone use restoration? Any training maps people recommend? Muta micro map competition [G] Hydra ZvZ: An Introduction
Other Games
General Games
Path of Exile Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread ZeroSpace Megathread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread How cold is too cold to be outdoors? Dating: How's your luck? Trading/Investing Thread
Fan Clubs
The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread Facing Challenges in Mobile App Development
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Esportsmanship: How to NOT B…
TrAiDoS
Why RTS gamers make better f…
gosubay
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 5977 users

Protoss To Zerg: My Progress

Blogs > Salv
Post a Reply
Salv
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Canada3083 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-09-18 22:59:05
September 18 2009 21:44 GMT
#1
Update # 3

iCCup Profile: http://www.iccup.com/gamingprofile/Salv.html
Stats: 11-10 / D / 1950

If I had an easy time with opponents last update, I more then made up for it this time. Last time I went 5-1, today I went 3-7; not good ya'll. However it's not all bad news. Ironically enough, in the day where I went 5-1, I didn't really learn much. My opponents weren't that good and I just walked through them. Today was completely different as my opponents just walked right through me, save for three. So what's going on? Why did I wind up losing 7? Six of those being in a row? Let's get down to it:

Z v P

Alright ya'll, I'm just going to start with Z v P from now on, it's my format now I guess. Any way, damn, today was rough. I did much better versus Terran's today then I did against Protoss, but I'll talk about the former in the Z v T section, that don't belong in here. Running into some problems with my neo-sauron build, and they are:

  • First things first, making two lings is a bad idea ya'll. I just realized today that I am bad, baaaad at keeping track of my opponents choke. I usually do not see when my opponent moves out, when he sneaks a probe, sneaks a zealot, it's all surprises to me. That really sucks because if I open two lings, the entire point is that I need to be able to respond really quick. Either I have to get those zerglings out to take care of business, or I have to delay a bit. Either way that's a problem that needs correcting.

    I am thinking I just need to realize when I need to make more zerglings. I have been spoiled by Protoss' who don't do jack until I have hydralisks out, and apparently that doesn't fly at D+ at this point in the season. I need to really keep on top of things and make sure that if he is gradually producing zealots, that I gradually produce lings and just keep up with him. Also I need to look up when I add the sunken colonies, I can't remember when it is and I keep thinking it's after I had my den, but that is way too late I think. I'll find out.

  • Corsairs. I hate corsairs. It's funny when you play Protoss and you comment on how it's difficult to manage corsairs, or that they are easy to counter, but damn once you play Zerg, it's not easy to defend. If you have scourge it's easy, you simply clone a pair and there you go, but if you got hydralisk, it's hard. There are have been many games where I just can't do much about his corsairs and it fucks me up. My overlord at his natural dies, my overlord in his base dies and then he snipes some more and then he attacks with a +1 timing and I die.

    The good news is that this is all correctable. I think partially the problem are the zerglings. Once I have that under control, I will be able to focus on my build more and make sure I have my spire coming ASAP, as well as my overlord speed, both of which should help remedy this annoying situation.


It's really those two things, but when you think about it, having those problems can really compound. Having to keep maynard away drones, split up my zergling forces and keep track of my BO is hard. Then having to follow-up with dealing with corsairs is even harder if your spire or overlord speed is even the slightest bit late. I suppose it's just practice I need, I'll find out more this weekend I am sure.

One last thing is that most of my ZvP losses came from trying out various builds. I tried a three hat mutalisk build twice, one of which was a closer game then usual, and a four hat build, both of which I need to have explained to me because I am clueless what I am doing. Ahzz told me about a neo-sauron lurker build and I tried it twice, I think I am 1-1 with it, but I really cannot judge builds until I fix the problems I stated above.

Z v T

What a turn around. If you don't know, Ahzz's TvZ is around C+ or B- level and I was practicing with him. I got rolled in all the games, but I learned quite a bit and finally decided to cut the foolishness and just go standard mutalisk. I lost some games today to just much superior players, and one game where I had no idea what to harass with my mutalisk [both games Ahzz will check for me] but overall I am feeling pretty good against an opponent that doesn't completely outclass me. I think those games I win.

So what turned this match up around for me? Read on:

  • Make six lings ya'll. Do it. Once again like ZvP, theorycrafting, it sounds good to just make enough lings to take care of the scout and then make them when you need them, but that don't work. I regularly need those zerglings and it helps me get rid of his scout. It's not a big deal, but a little something.

  • I benefited a lot from some standard rules & timings that Ahzz helped me with. I worked on my gas timing, making sure I would have 900/900 min/gas by the time the spire popped, which is a huge deal, as well as splitting my time between harass and management. There has only been one case where I was completely stumped on what to do with my mutalisk, and I think that was also just a bad game, but overall I can do damage while teching lurkers in an effective manner now.

  • Scourge. Those pesky dropships were doing a number on me before, but now that I have been owned by them multiple times, I always make sure I have a sunken in my base to by time in case he does drop, but more importantly, I have patrolling scourge that have nabbed multiple vessels already.


I can easily and honestly say that practice is what helped most here. After a while I just seem to remember what I need to do next, whereas before I would be scratching my head wondering what else to do. There are still some things I suck at, like keeping up my macro and hotkeying all my units, but that should come with time. I have pretty much decided that I will just use three hat muta into quick hive like all other Zergs, which is cool, but I am still terrible versus unorthodox builds.

In all games versus strange builds, I usually wind up massing and trying to win in a giant attack because I'm not sure how to transition or how to make sure I tech while staving off harassment. It's a pain in the ass and I now hate wraiths nearly as much as I do corsairs.

With any luck, I can correct these mistakes I listed and move on to C- this weekend. I'm rather confident I'll be able to do that, because even the players I played all had good stats and were all C- or C last season, so it wasn't even like I was playing actual D+ players. Here is the latest rep-pack. Not much to see and there are some pretty embarassing games in there, but whatever, I'm putting in all the games I played. Whether it was some lame mass ling counter to a build I didn't know, or just playing bad and ragequitting [with the gg still], it's all here!

Replay Package

*****
Pokebunny
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
United States10654 Posts
September 18 2009 21:45 GMT
#2
Fix the code.... doesn't work on TL.
Semipro Terran player | Pokebunny#1710 | twitter.com/Pokebunny | twitch.tv/Pokebunny | facebook.com/PokebunnySC
Salv
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Canada3083 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-09-18 21:48:41
September 18 2009 21:45 GMT
#3
Done.

I have the Introduction, Update #1 and Update#2 at this link: http://sc2gg.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=9474 I thought it would be lame to post three or four blogs in a row, so I'll just continue here with this one and update here and there from now on.
micronesia
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States24776 Posts
September 18 2009 22:02 GMT
#4
Salv first you were protoss. But then when it failed you you beat me with your terran. Then you became much better than me at protoss. Now you are going to rape it up with zerg. Wtf man!
ModeratorThere are animal crackers for people and there are people crackers for animals.
Neivler
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Norway911 Posts
September 18 2009 22:18 GMT
#5
The thing to do vs P is to go 3 hatch spire and then add 2 hatches so u have 5 in total. Use scourge to stop the corsairs and go w/e tech you want. Then it is pwn pwn time
I pwn noobs
Salv
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Canada3083 Posts
September 18 2009 22:24 GMT
#6
On September 19 2009 07:02 micronesia wrote:
Salv first you were protoss. But then when it failed you you beat me with your terran. Then you became much better than me at protoss. Now you are going to rape it up with zerg. Wtf man!


Micro, if I have ever beaten you with my Terran, either you were not trying, or I was extremely lucky haha.

On September 19 2009 07:18 Neivler wrote:
The thing to do vs P is to go 3 hatch spire and then add 2 hatches so u have 5 in total. Use scourge to stop the corsairs and go w/e tech you want. Then it is pwn pwn time


That's the build I have been using, with the follow-up being hydralisk and then lurker. I talk about this in the first two updates, but I've been experimenting as I haven't liked the results I have received thus far.
andiCR
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Costa Rica2273 Posts
September 18 2009 22:35 GMT
#7
Salv, what happened to your kick ass battle reports? T-T
Nightmare1795 wrote: I played a guy in bronze who said he was Japanese. That was the only game I ever dropped a nuke, which was purely coincidental.
micronesia
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
United States24776 Posts
September 18 2009 22:43 GMT
#8
On September 19 2009 07:24 Salv wrote:
Show nested quote +
On September 19 2009 07:02 micronesia wrote:
Salv first you were protoss. But then when it failed you you beat me with your terran. Then you became much better than me at protoss. Now you are going to rape it up with zerg. Wtf man!


Micro, if I have ever beaten you with my Terran, either you were not trying, or I was extremely lucky haha.

IIRC it was simply that you kept beating me with this all-in build that I was failing to adapt to... but whenever it failed I ended up ahead/winning.
ModeratorThere are animal crackers for people and there are people crackers for animals.
LordWeird
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
United States3411 Posts
September 18 2009 22:44 GMT
#9
I have faith in you, my dear sweet brothar! You've got the macro/micro for sure, just to nail down those stupid intricacies that made me despise Zerg and switch to Terran.

You got da powa
Chains none
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
September 18 2009 22:55 GMT
#10
good luck
d(O.o)a
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Canada5066 Posts
September 18 2009 23:04 GMT
#11
awe saw a salv P to Z blog and expected many pictures with writing on them but good luck and I expect the next blog to be more like the old ones
Hi.
food
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States1951 Posts
September 18 2009 23:20 GMT
#12
can i join the school? ahzz teaching now?
Can someone ban this guy please? FA?
Zapdos_Smithh
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
Canada2620 Posts
September 18 2009 23:34 GMT
#13
Eh better off to make 4 lings or 8 lings ZvT. I find 6 a number that won't pressure but is a bit more than necessary to defend (unless he is bbsing or something).

Pretty cool though. I switched from P to Z and the process was very fun haha.
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Replay Cast
09:00
WardiTV Mondays #81
CranKy Ducklings103
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 9183
Jaedong 489
Shuttle 460
actioN 438
Zeus 410
BeSt 221
Mini 216
Soma 200
EffOrt 135
Pusan 116
[ Show more ]
hero 112
Leta 90
Dewaltoss 79
ToSsGirL 76
Hyun 72
scan(afreeca) 69
Sharp 69
ZerO 53
Liquid`Ret 48
ggaemo 39
Sea.KH 34
sSak 32
sorry 32
Aegong 31
Shinee 31
JYJ 30
Mong 28
Backho 25
Sacsri 14
yabsab 14
Shine 10
IntoTheRainbow 9
soO 9
Noble 8
Movie 7
GoRush 3
Terrorterran 3
Dota 2
Gorgc4383
Fuzer 107
XcaliburYe99
League of Legends
JimRising 368
Counter-Strike
olofmeister2439
shoxiejesuss1056
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King123
Other Games
B2W.Neo549
Lowko311
crisheroes277
Sick145
RuFF_SC217
ZerO(Twitch)10
Organizations
StarCraft: Brood War
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 911
Other Games
gamesdonequick664
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 58
lovetv 9
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH305
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP63
• musti20045 18
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Nemesis1926
Other Games
• WagamamaTV236
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Spring Champion…
29m
OSC
2h 29m
Maestros of the Game
4h 59m
Serral vs Percival
SHIN vs ShoWTimE
Replay Cast
13h 29m
Replay Cast
22h 29m
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 4h
Maestros of the Game
1d 4h
Clem vs Lambo
Zoun vs SKillous
Replay Cast
1d 13h
Replay Cast
1d 22h
Solar vs Classic
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
[ Show More ]
Grudge Match
2 days
FlaShFTW vs A.Alm
OSC
2 days
GSL
2 days
herO vs Rogue
Maru vs Cure
Patches Events
3 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
BSL
3 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
Replay Cast
4 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Kung Fu Cup
6 days
Maestros of the Game
6 days
Replay Cast
6 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

KK 2v2 League Season 1
RSL Revival: Season 5
Heroes Pulsing #1

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
Acropolis #4
CSCL: Masked Kings S4
YSL S3
SCTL 2026 Spring
WardiTV Spring 2026
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
Murky Cup 2026
Heroes Pulsing #2
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026

Upcoming

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Heroes Pulsing #3
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.