• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EST 04:12
CET 10:12
KST 18:12
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview2TL.net Map Contest #21: Winners11Intel X Team Liquid Seoul event: Showmatches and Meet the Pros10[ASL20] Finals Preview: Arrival13TL.net Map Contest #21: Voting12
Community News
[TLMC] Fall/Winter 2025 Ladder Map Rotation10Weekly Cups (Nov 3-9): Clem Conquers in Canada4SC: Evo Complete - Ranked Ladder OPEN ALPHA8StarCraft, SC2, HotS, WC3, Returning to Blizzcon!45$5,000+ WardiTV 2025 Championship7
StarCraft 2
General
RSL Season 3 - RO16 Groups A & B Preview Mech is the composition that needs teleportation t [TLMC] Fall/Winter 2025 Ladder Map Rotation Weekly Cups (Nov 3-9): Clem Conquers in Canada Craziest Micro Moments Of All Time?
Tourneys
RSL Revival: Season 3 Constellation Cup - Main Event - Stellar Fest Tenacious Turtle Tussle Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament
Strategy
Custom Maps
Map Editor closed ?
External Content
Mutation # 499 Chilling Adaptation Mutation # 498 Wheel of Misfortune|Cradle of Death Mutation # 497 Battle Haredened Mutation # 496 Endless Infection
Brood War
General
FlaSh on: Biggest Problem With SnOw's Playstyle What happened to TvZ on Retro? Brood War web app to calculate unit interactions [ASL20] Ask the mapmakers — Drop your questions BW General Discussion
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL21] RO32 Group D - Sunday 21:00 CET [BSL21] RO32 Group C - Saturday 21:00 CET
Strategy
Current Meta Simple Questions, Simple Answers PvZ map balance How to stay on top of macro?
Other Games
General Games
Beyond All Reason Nintendo Switch Thread Should offensive tower rushing be viable in RTS games? Clair Obscur - Expedition 33 Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread SPIRED by.ASL Mafia {211640}
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Artificial Intelligence Thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
White-Ra Fan Club The herO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! Korean Music Discussion Series you have seen recently...
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion NBA General Discussion MLB/Baseball 2023 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
SC2 Client Relocalization [Change SC2 Language] Linksys AE2500 USB WIFI keeps disconnecting Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Dyadica Gospel – a Pulp No…
Hildegard
Coffee x Performance in Espo…
TrAiDoS
Saturation point
Uldridge
DnB/metal remix FFO Mick Go…
ImbaTosS
Reality "theory" prov…
perfectspheres
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1895 users

Fun Math Problem

Blogs > EtherealDeath
Post a Reply
1 2 Next All
EtherealDeath
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States8366 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-27 04:08:26
August 27 2009 02:46 GMT
#1
Yea... not sure of the solution to this.

We have a bounded interval, say [a,b]. The values of a and b are not particularly important. Let's say we are using [0,1000].

Within this bounded interval are some set number of other bounded intervals, which may or may not intersect with other bounded intervals. For example, one possible set of intervals is {[1,100],[2,36],[45,798]}.

From each bounded interval (not counting [0,1000]), you must pick exactly one point so that the least distance between two points is maximized.

What alogorithm would solve this?

EDIT: Attempt at clarification.

Basically he nth triangular number is the number of possible point pairs, each of which has a corresponding distance. For example, say we had [0,1] and [988,1000]. Then we would pick the points 0 and 1000, yielding a distance of 1000, because that choice of points means that the distance between the two closest points is maximized. We could have choise 1 and 988, but the distance would be decreased, so it's not the optimum choice.

Another way of putting it is that you want to choose the points so that the two closest ones are as far apart as possible.

*
Saracen
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
United States5139 Posts
August 27 2009 02:52 GMT
#2
That's not fun at all!
Crunchums
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States11144 Posts
August 27 2009 02:52 GMT
#3
I do not understand your english
brood war for life, brood war forever
prOxi.swAMi
Profile Blog Joined November 2004
Australia3091 Posts
August 27 2009 03:04 GMT
#4
You need to articulate this more clearly
Oh no
thoraxe
Profile Blog Joined March 2007
United States1449 Posts
August 27 2009 03:05 GMT
#5
Plz don't tell me this is 9th grade kiddie Math for you Chinese people?
Obama singing "Kick Ass" Song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yghFBt-fXmw&feature=player_embedde
illu
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Canada2531 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-27 03:32:31
August 27 2009 03:32 GMT
#6
I am not sure if it is even a math problem, since the word "algorithm" is used. Other than that, I do not understand the problem.

Might as well type it in Chinese. =P
:]
blue_arrow
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
1971 Posts
August 27 2009 03:33 GMT
#7
On August 27 2009 12:05 thoraxe wrote:
Plz don't tell me this is 9th grade kiddie Math for you Chinese people?


8th grade
| MLIA | the weather sucks dick here
Maero
Profile Joined December 2007
349 Posts
August 27 2009 03:35 GMT
#8
just take the average? (e.g. (b+a)/2)

i probably don't understand the problem though, like everyone else
MamiyaOtaru
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States1687 Posts
August 27 2009 03:40 GMT
#9
He must think homework is fun
Leg[end]
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States241 Posts
August 27 2009 04:02 GMT
#10
On August 27 2009 11:46 EtherealDeath wrote:
Yea... not sure of the solution to this.

We have a bounded interval, say [a,b]. The values of a and b are not particularly important. Let's say we are using [0,1000].

Within this bounded interval are some number of other bounded intervals, which may or may not intersect with other bounded intervals.

From each bounded interval (not counting [0,1000]), you must pick one point from each bounded interval so that the least distance between two points is maximized.

What alogorithm would solve this?


The contrast between this thread's topic and its actual contents is staggering oo;
Legends Never Die ;;
EtherealDeath
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States8366 Posts
August 27 2009 04:06 GMT
#11
attempted to clarify.
EtherealDeath
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States8366 Posts
August 27 2009 04:07 GMT
#12
On August 27 2009 12:35 Maero wrote:
just take the average? (e.g. (b+a)/2)

i probably don't understand the problem though, like everyone else



That I know is definitely not the solution. Among other things the taking of the average makes no sense in that you would be picking one point, but there could many many different intervals, which would mean more than one point.
brian
Profile Blog Joined August 2004
United States9629 Posts
August 27 2009 04:28 GMT
#13
shouldnt it always be b-a? assuming we have infinitely many intervals.
Severedevil
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States4839 Posts
August 27 2009 04:32 GMT
#14
Well, there's an obvious crappy algorithm.

It's easy to check whether you can pick points such that each pair is separated by a minimum distance of d. So you can do a binary search on d, and continue until you're as close to the exact answer as you're asked to get.

I'm looking for a better solution, but that will work.
My strategy is to fork people.
Muirhead
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States556 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-27 04:53:20
August 27 2009 04:49 GMT
#15
I do not know (or believe) that there is a terribly simple formula for the answer.

If I just had to write a computer program to find an exact answer, I would proceed inductively. Suppose that there are n intervals, and that I have a computer program that can find the answer given n-1 intervals.

The computer program (call it P) that solves for n-1 intervals would receive input of the form [a_1,b_1],[a_2,b_2],...,[a_{n-1},b_{n-1}] where the a_i are inputted in nondecreasing order.

Furthermore, suppose the computer program P would give me my answer as a function of a_1, assuming a_1 <= a_2 and that the other a_i and b_i are fixed. The function would be piecewise linear and therefore easy to express.

I claim that, given P, it is easy to construct a similar program which works with an input of n intervals. The new program Q would insert a test value of a_1. Then it would run P on [a_2,b_2],...,[a_n,b_n], spitting out a function of a_2. It would compute the value of a_2 such that the maximum minimum distance spit out by that function is as close to |a_1-a_2| as possible, thus solving the problem for the test value of a_1. Through judicious choices of test values of a_1, the full function of a_1 could be discovered. This is because Q knows the answer it should spit out is a piecewise linear function of a_1 with the number of distinct linear components a bounded function of n.
starleague.mit.edu
EtherealDeath
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States8366 Posts
August 27 2009 05:25 GMT
#16
On August 27 2009 13:49 Muirhead wrote:
I do not know (or believe) that there is a terribly simple formula for the answer.

If I just had to write a computer program to find an exact answer, I would proceed inductively. Suppose that there are n intervals, and that I have a computer program that can find the answer given n-1 intervals.

The computer program (call it P) that solves for n-1 intervals would receive input of the form [a_1,b_1],[a_2,b_2],...,[a_{n-1},b_{n-1}] where the a_i are inputted in nondecreasing order.

Furthermore, suppose the computer program P would give me my answer as a function of a_1, assuming a_1 <= a_2 and that the other a_i and b_i are fixed. The function would be piecewise linear and therefore easy to express.

I claim that, given P, it is easy to construct a similar program which works with an input of n intervals. The new program Q would insert a test value of a_1. Then it would run P on [a_2,b_2],...,[a_n,b_n], spitting out a function of a_2. It would compute the value of a_2 such that the maximum minimum distance spit out by that function is as close to |a_1-a_2| as possible, thus solving the problem for the test value of a_1. Through judicious choices of test values of a_1, the full function of a_1 could be discovered. This is because Q knows the answer it should spit out is a piecewise linear function of a_1 with the number of distinct linear components a bounded function of n.


Hm... I'm afraid I don't quite see the applicability of recursion on this problem. It seems that considering a_1 would not only change a_2 but also a_3, a_4,... which makes you recalculate everything, as the new minimum might not be between a_1 and a_2 but rather a_k and a_(k+t) for some k.
evanthebouncy!
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States12796 Posts
Last Edited: 2009-08-27 07:18:37
August 27 2009 07:18 GMT
#17
用中文说吧,我翻译
send me a pm to remind me to translate it.
Life is run, it is dance, it is fast, passionate and BAM!, you dance and sing and booze while you can for now is the time and time is mine. Smile and laugh when still can for now is the time and soon you die!
SiegeTanksandBlueGoo
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
China685 Posts
August 27 2009 07:26 GMT
#18
This is sort of like Euler's method in calculus, except you're trying to find a specific number instead of the slope....

Then again, the slope is a specific number so maybe you can think about using that.
What does the scouter say about his macro level? It's Over 9000 minerals!
Muirhead
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
United States556 Posts
August 27 2009 09:56 GMT
#19
My argument definitely works. I know a lot of people on this site spurt nonsense solutions to these kinds of questions, but I do actually have a math/IMO background . It's a little complicated, but if you think about it you'll understand it. I am well aware that changing a_1 can change every other a_i.

Alternatively, note that my argument proves that the coordinates of the solution points are rational linear combinations of the coordinates of the endpoints. Furthermore, the argument provides natural bounds on the denominators of the coefficients. Thus, we only need to check a finite number of d as in severedevil's argument.
starleague.mit.edu
ninjafetus
Profile Joined December 2008
United States231 Posts
August 27 2009 12:52 GMT
#20
Restating the problem more clearly for anyone still confused.

You are given an closed interval [a,b], and some number of closed subintervals S_i = [a_i, b_i].
For each S_i, choose a c_i contained in [a_i, b_i] such that min_{i,j} (c_i, c_j) is maximized.

Wait, that might not be any more clear at all, save for math people who already get it...

In other words, each subinterval gets a point. Choose the points so that the distance between the two closest points is maximized over all possible choices of points.
1 2 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 48m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
TKL 103
Nina 73
StarCraft: Brood War
Sea 2254
EffOrt 323
Killer 313
Rain 288
Hyun 170
Leta 150
Bale 86
Dewaltoss 63
ToSsGirL 38
JulyZerg 33
[ Show more ]
NaDa 14
Free 9
Rush 9
ivOry 7
Hm[arnc] 7
Terrorterran 1
Dota 2
XaKoH 536
League of Legends
JimRising 478
Counter-Strike
fl0m1596
shoxiejesuss440
allub123
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King62
Other Games
summit1g20776
FrodaN2009
crisheroes372
ceh9291
KnowMe101
NeuroSwarm49
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick532
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 14 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH207
• LUISG 17
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Lourlo1385
• Stunt517
Upcoming Events
RSL Revival
48m
Classic vs Creator
Cure vs TriGGeR
Kung Fu Cup
2h 48m
GuMiho vs MaNa
herO vs ShoWTimE
Classic vs TBD
WardiTV Korean Royale
2h 48m
CranKy Ducklings
1d
RSL Revival
1d
herO vs Gerald
ByuN vs SHIN
Kung Fu Cup
1d 2h
Cure vs Reynor
IPSL
1d 7h
ZZZero vs rasowy
Napoleon vs KameZerg
BSL 21
1d 10h
Tarson vs Julia
Doodle vs OldBoy
eOnzErG vs WolFix
StRyKeR vs Aeternum
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
Reynor vs sOs
Maru vs Ryung
[ Show More ]
Kung Fu Cup
2 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
2 days
BSL 21
2 days
JDConan vs Semih
Dragon vs Dienmax
Tech vs NewOcean
TerrOr vs Artosis
IPSL
2 days
Dewalt vs WolFix
eOnzErG vs Bonyth
Replay Cast
2 days
Wardi Open
3 days
Monday Night Weeklies
3 days
WardiTV Korean Royale
4 days
BSL: GosuLeague
4 days
The PondCast
5 days
Replay Cast
5 days
RSL Revival
6 days
BSL: GosuLeague
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-11-07
Stellar Fest: Constellation Cup
Eternal Conflict S1

Ongoing

C-Race Season 1
IPSL Winter 2025-26
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 4
SOOP Univ League 2025
YSL S2
BSL Season 21
CSCL: Masked Kings S3
RSL Revival: Season 3
BLAST Rivals Fall 2025
IEM Chengdu 2025
PGL Masters Bucharest 2025
Thunderpick World Champ.
CS Asia Championships 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual

Upcoming

SLON Tour Season 2
BSL 21 Non-Korean Championship
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
HSC XXVIII
RSL Offline Finals
WardiTV 2025
META Madness #9
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026: Closed Qualifier
eXTREMESLAND 2025
ESL Impact League Season 8
SL Budapest Major 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.