DHM Summer 2021/22 - Regionals - Page 15
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GumBa
United Kingdom31934 Posts
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nojok
France15837 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:46 Vindicare605 wrote: His TvT could use some work too, but I don't blame him for that. EU is not anywhere as good of a training ground for that match up as KR is. I agree with your argument but it does not apply to Serral and Reynor, which I can't explain. | ||
DBooN
Germany2701 Posts
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AzAlexZ
Australia3302 Posts
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Durnuu
13276 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:50 nojok wrote: I agree with your argument but it does not apply to Serral and Reynor, which I can't explain. The explanation is simple; Zerg is broken in ZvP | ||
nojok
France15837 Posts
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Sent.
Poland8967 Posts
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ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:47 Charoisaur wrote: Well, on EU he pretty much only has Showtime to get adequate practice and practicing vs him isn't really great preparation for facing Zest/Trap etc His record against Zest isn't bad actually. But yeah it's certainly not on the level of his TvZ. | ||
tigera6
2925 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:49 Charoisaur wrote: Maybe he'll throw the honorable macro game out of the window now and tries something new..... won't happen anyway What I dont understand is, ZvZ in EU is full of trickery and all-in, you can barely see a late game nowadays. But ZvT and ZvP are pretty much standard macro game all the time unless its Bly. Like that game on Beckett, I dont mind if Roach Warren or some weird build is used, but that never happened. | ||
Vindicare605
United States15731 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:50 GumBa wrote: I think Clem is the 2nd best terran on the planet right now. TY is going into the military and Innovation has been off his game for a while now, Byun's wrists are constantly a problem. Not a hot take at all. Clem and Maru are the two best Terrans in the world right now. Bunny, Cure and Dream are in the upper echelons as well but a pretty solid tier below them in my opinion. | ||
ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:52 tigera6 wrote: What I dont understand is, ZvZ in EU is full of trickery and all-in, you can barely see a late game nowadays. But ZvT and ZvP are pretty much standard macro game all the time unless its Bly. Like that game on Beckett, I dont mind if Roach Warren or some weird build is used, but that never happened. Does a ravager push ever work against banshees? It would have to be something quite strange like a baneling bust or something to even have a chance to work. | ||
Durnuu
13276 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:52 Vindicare605 wrote: TY is going into the military and Innovation has been off his game for a while now, Byun's wrists are constantly a problem. Not a hot take at all. Clem and Maru are the two best Terrans in the world right now. Bunny, Cure and Dream are in the upper echelons as well but a pretty solid tier below them in my opinion. You really went and answered seriously to GumBa, come on dude | ||
nojok
France15837 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:52 tigera6 wrote: What I dont understand is, ZvZ in EU is full of trickery and all-in, you can barely see a late game nowadays. But ZvT and ZvP are pretty much standard macro game all the time unless its Bly. Like that game on Beckett, I dont mind if Roach Warren or some weird build is used, but that never happened. EU is lacking a GSL like tournament where you can practice for a specific opponent for one week, honing your curveballs and defending against them. Koreans, even those who are confident in their macro game, are ready to throw those all the time. | ||
Charoisaur
Germany15617 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:52 tigera6 wrote: What I dont understand is, ZvZ in EU is full of trickery and all-in, you can barely see a late game nowadays. But ZvT and ZvP are pretty much standard macro game all the time unless its Bly. Like that game on Beckett, I dont mind if Roach Warren or some weird build is used, but that never happened. they have no balls. Those builds require balls | ||
tigera6
2925 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:51 ZigguratOfUr wrote: His record against Zest isn't bad actually. But yeah it's certainly not on the level of his TvZ. Well, overall record against Zest doesnt really matter, because the guy lost to a no-name Chinese Toss in EPT Cup a while back. But he usually show up in big tournament like IEM, if he make it past the qualifier. | ||
Charoisaur
Germany15617 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:53 ZigguratOfUr wrote: Does a ravager push ever work against banshees? It would have to be something quite strange like a baneling bust or something to even have a chance to work. Nydus, Ravager push with Ovi Queens all work fine against Banshees | ||
GumBa
United Kingdom31934 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:53 Durnuu wrote: You really went and answered seriously to GumBa, come on dude Excuse me? Clem being the second best is a legit opinion. He is one of the best terrans I have seen since lucifron. | ||
Vindicare605
United States15731 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:50 nojok wrote: I agree with your argument but it does not apply to Serral and Reynor, which I can't explain. I can explain that. KR is a weak region for Zerg. Only Dark, Solar, and Rogue are consistently successful, every other Zerg is a far gap below them and the region in general is weak on the ladder for Zerg players. EU on the other hand is a strong region for Zerg. Has been for many years. The best players to come from EU with a few exceptions have predominantly been Zerg players. Protoss is pretty much strong everywhere on the ladder while not so much in the pro scene. This one is the real mystery. So take the strongest race of the EU region and put them against KR players who are used to practicing against weaker Zerg players on Laddder (especially after the Jin Air break up) and that's how you get EU Zergs being so good vs KR players. For Terran it's a different story. KR is the only region where Terran is strong. It's far and away the best training ground for TvT practice. EU and NA can't come close. It all makes sense when you look at it from that point of view. Clem is a savant in TvZ. Why? Because he plays in a region where Zerg is very strong. He gets practice against the very best on the regular. His Protoss and Terran opponents are nowhere near as strong by comparison. | ||
Snakestyle11
191 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:52 tigera6 wrote: What I dont understand is, ZvZ in EU is full of trickery and all-in, you can barely see a late game nowadays. But ZvT and ZvP are pretty much standard macro game all the time unless its Bly. Like that game on Beckett, I dont mind if Roach Warren or some weird build is used, but that never happened. Hyper aggressive builds are relatively low % success rate relatively to passive greedy game in ZvT especially. Most terran openings can deal with roach rush or baneling bust. Hellion banshee played properly gets ahead against any attempt to do early zerg aggressions. | ||
ZigguratOfUr
Iraq16955 Posts
On June 07 2021 03:55 Charoisaur wrote: Nydus, Ravager push with Ovi Queens all work fine against Banshees At this point I don't like Nydus builds much against banshees tbh. You might be able to just walk queens across given that it's Beckett though. | ||
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