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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
This is my first game either playing or observing where a mayor is involved. At first glance it seems a pretty bad thing for town (particularly day 1 as its easiest for scum to blend in) but I guess we don't have a choice (right?). What I hate about Day 1 (in all three games I've played -_-) is the tendency for town to get worked up over nothing. In the last game I played (SoaF) Day 1 bacame a pissing contest between two players, with scum and noobs sheeping either for fear of putting their heads out. A good mayor in my eyes would, though not discourage people from pressurising others (how else are we gonna get information on people's alignment) but keep it from devolving into the War of the Roses (note both players in my previous example were town). I also don't like how in my previous games Day 1 lynches have been foccussed (usually) on one player, or at least people are too scared to argue for there n°1 scum choice as the dominating town players are only foccussed on their own pick. It seems reasonable to have a policy 'vote who you believe is most likely to be scum, until the last X hours where, as a lynch is good for town, we need to compromise for the good of the town.' If you are wiling to do these things you have my vote. Are we voting in this thread for mayor or in voting thread? | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
Comparing campaigners content, I would like to vote for GM. He makes by far the most sense out of all those running for mayor. He isn't gimicky, he isnt super pro PM-ing (which admittedly has its uses late game, but seems to confuse the hell out of stuff early game), and his stance regarding 'enlightened despot' vs 'democrat' appeals to me. What I don't like is his vote on Sandroba. Similarlyto the premise 'push a lynch that you believe will most likely result in scum flip', our votes for Mayor should be 'who you think is most likely to summarily execute scum'. So my question to you (GM) is this: You don't know that Sandroba is town, if you are town then you know for sure that you are town, threrfore you are most likely to find scum. Therefore why vote for Sandroba unless he's your scumbuddy, I don't get it  . | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
PS: skype name: froggynoddy | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
On April 14 2012 08:59 grush57 wrote: ##Unvote Froggynoddy Only the chosen pmers know why. ##Vote GMarshal Think he will do the right thing, seems townie. Should I be worried? I think I'm going to vote Ace, simply because I don't like the Sandroba, GM voting for each other business. THIS IS A MATTER OF LIFE AND DEATH NOT COURTLY ETIQUETTE!!! But seriously I don't like Sandroba's stance on PM-ing and the Captaincy in general. I also don't like GM's response to my question: On April 14 2012 07:07 GMarshal wrote: Because sandro is my strongest town read ^_^ Also I hardly ever vote for myself in elections, its not respectable. Its not a matter of logic, its a simple matter of if I can vote for the guy running against me and he votes for me, its the same net result, but its much more elegant. Is it stupid? Probably. I'm going to do it anyway. I don't see the Sandroba town thing, plus surely at this early stage the only town read that could be described as in any way strong is yourself. Also we should vote for the person who least wants the captaincy, far more likely to be town imo. ##Vote Ace | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
On April 14 2012 09:13 layabout wrote: Having spent a rare day away from the computer due to frequent and annoying _____* I have had barely any time to read the thread. after a quick skim and a PM with sandro Part of me wants to vote GM for being a gentleman, and i would like to know if he intends to explain what he plans to do, and why he should be mayor. Will he try to enforce rules of proper conduct for instance? Will he lynch Kurumi who clearly does not care about catching scum? The rest of me wants to vote for sandro. If he really is committing all of this time to PM with so many players it should be very difficult for him to do so as scum. So in a sense voting for him is less risky because their is a reduced chance that he could remain alive and looking town if he is scum. He also has better than average early reads and is thus a good candidate by default. Is anybody else wondering why a town WBG would do this? + Show Spoiler [*] + I am not sure what the term is but i do know that all the lights dim and my PC turns itself off I'm really sorry if I'm being obtuse but can you explain to me the logic in your town read here? | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
If he really is committing all of this time to PM with so many players it should be very difficult for him to do so as scum. So in a sense voting for him is less risky because their is a reduced chance that he could remain alive and looking town if he is scum. He also has better than average early reads and is thus a good candidate by default. 4. You may not vote for yourself. You may not vote for anyone dead or outside the game Does this apply to all voting or just lynch voting i.e. can you not vote for yourself as captain: | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
The point about voting voting for the guy who doesn't want the captaincy was more of an afterthought and my logic goes along the lines that only scum or egocentric/aggressive/confident townies would actually ask for captaincy. Therefore I felt there was a higher chance of voting in townie if we went for someone who posted in a pro-town way, but didn't actually ask to be made captain. | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
On April 15 2012 00:34 talismania wrote: How long after captain is elected does the first lynch occur? The problem with this whole captain's election is that everyone is focusing on the generalities and theory rather than on the practical: the captain decides the lynch, and no one is talking about who to lynch. The discussion so far has allowed the scum team to live in an environment where there is no pressure to post their impressions of other players. This must change. In an effort to effect that change, I suggest that everyone post their impressions of everyone (why not?), and if you don't have an impression, then say so. My list is in the spoiler: + Show Spoiler + 1. talismania - town 2. Jackal58 - put some pressure on node earlier, otherwise nothing solid. If I had to pick, I'd lean town on him. 3. sandroba - lean town for reasons I already discussed. Is the type of player who could do what he's doing as scum though, so must be cautious. 4. l10f - hard to say because of only that one (maybe two?) post. He merely weighed in on the captaincy debate, which I don't like. Neutral for now, curious to see what comes next. 5. Sinensis - no info, no clue. 6. Ace - there is a lot of metagame built around ace. As a new player on TL not familiar with his history/rep, I have no idea what to make of it. His play is a bit withdrawn in the thread, but perhaps he is playing more in the PM world (as kurumi's logs indicate). 7. RayzorFlash - I read him as town playing at a superficial level, or at least posting at one. He asked if I wanted to be captain out of the blue, which I think would be a strange thing to even think about or propose as scum. 8. sinani206 - no info no clue 9. senjai - sinensis, sinani, and senjai: are they playing the ultralurk scum strategy??? Kind of doubt it. Possible one is scum, but I think it's generally true that most scum try to at least look active. 10. chaoser - I remember his posts in the beginning and then nothing since - acrofales pointed this out as well. No clue. 11. grush57 - playing almost pm only, and being a bit cagey about it. Dunno what to say about it. Most scum wouldn't want to appear deliberately cagey, but I guess a few like to try to go to the next level of Sicilian logic. 12. risk.nuke - From what I understand has been doing quite a bit of chatting. Other than that I don't know. 13. EchelonTee - I am a bit suspicious of his FoS on Rayzorflash, mainly because I couldn't really see Rayzor as scum. I don't think it necessarily indicts ET, but I'm curious about his reasoning, and have asked him to follow up further. 14. Maverick32x - sandro is suspicious of him, as a posted log now indicates. I don't entirely buy it, but I can see it. Interested to see what he does next. 15. froggynoddy - kind of read him in the same boat as rayzorflash, but less sure. 16. prplhz - lurking threadwise, did vote. No info no clue. 17. michaelthe - I really didn't like the post he made where he responded to three general issues in the thread. Reactive posting makes me think scum, because seeming protown is easier in a reactive setting than in a proactive setting. The problem is townies post reactively too. 18. coagulation - playing loose and relaxed. lean town because of how loose he's been. 19. Snarfs - playing cautiously, not sure why. Early to support sandroba. neutral. 20. wherebugsgo - he seems like he did in the only game I've read on tl (DFM2), so lean town. I don't see the move he made where he changed his vote to himself all of a sudden to make much sense as scum. 21. layabout - layabout I can see either way. I did not like the post that kurumi also did not like, because it only dealt with what was being talked about and didn't offer much new. But he has done other things to probe for information, like his questioning of froggynoddy. 22. erandorr - uh really no clue. His first post was "hi" and his second was him instadefending himself. I'm curious why he dodged risknuke's request for chat logs. 23. MrZentor - lean town because I don't see the way he went about applying and unapplying for captaincy as a scum move, or a sequence of actions that a scumteam would support. 24. Node - no clue on node. I can't really remember what he's done off the top of my head, except for pressure a player a little bit. 25. Kurumi - I take it kurumi plays a very unique style. gut says town, brain says "wtf?" 26. GMarshal - I have no idea. He seems to really enjoy making little feints in one on one interactions. I have a feeling he would play this way regardless of alignment. 27. marvellosity - has not stuck out to me. neutral. 28. strongandbig - I dislike the kind of reactive posts he makes, as reactive posts always seem scummy to me. I thought it was interesting that he noted that Vayesh played this way in his last game that was a long time ago. Did anyone else go looking up Vayesh's history? I sure am not playing that hard haha. 29. Acrofales - lean town, he's playing looser and less composed for now than he did as scum in DFM2, and as an observer of DFM2, I leaned scum on him there from the beginning. 30. VayeshMoru - lean town I guess but he would make an awesome puppet for someone in a scumteam because in character players are impossible to read. Also, I believe Ace mentioned that he disagreed with posting a lot of conversations and logs, that things should be kept simple. I disagree: just because a log is posted doesn't mean you have to click the spoiler tags and read it. When people make their cases, they will pull out the relevant info they need anyway. Having people share as much of their communication as possible (maybe once a day) means that all townies are able to see what other people are saying to other people, rather than just what they've said to people. More (safe!) information = better, even if only marginally. A list... So who would you lynch, or more accurately who do you want the captain to lynch, and who do you think is going to get you that lynch? | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
On April 15 2012 01:27 layabout wrote: Why so many questions guys? Gonna vote now in case i can't be here later. ##vote sandroba If we think there is too great a risk that one of Gm/Sandro?Ace is scum then i think we should vote for Acrofales. I take it you don't think theres a risk, otherwise you would have voted for him. | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
On April 15 2012 01:48 MrZentor wrote: We really should start discussing lynch victims. -.- I nominate Chaoser. Why? | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
On April 15 2012 02:04 Snarfs wrote: Couple of things: @froggynoddy: You're focusing on actions rather than motives: You don't like that GM is voting for sandroba because sandroba is GM's strongest town read? That doesn't make sense. Whether or not Doc answers you doesn't matter. GM never once said that he was voting for sandroba because of a mechanic that didn't permit him. He clearly said it was because sandroba was his biggest town read. Also, consider this: At this point, if either GM or sandroba were to switch their own vote to themselves, would that not be highly suspicious? As it is they cancel each other out which is what should happen in the first place. If one switches without the other, don't you think they'd be seen as padding their own vote totals? Everything you just said regarding GM I'd already considered, I was hoping to get a rection from him. But as I said in your quote, I don't bloody get this whole 'lets all claim to Sandroba day 1, he's gotta be town' read that everyone's got going. Plus, as you say, he didnt know that you couldnt vote for himself, therefore his best town read should be himself (I am simply repeating myself here). | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
On April 15 2012 02:54 GMarshal wrote: froggynoddy This guy has the strongest case against him tight now, he has a couple tell tale signs that point him out as newbie scum Two things in this post 1.) Apologizing for something that needs no apology. This is a sign of a guilty conscience much like what gave up Misder in Ver's XXX analysis. I did this all the time as the mole in PYP:Interesting, and Radfeild caught me out on it, so I'm always attentively looking for this kind of unnecessary apology. 2.) His issue with me trusting sandroba. This is typical of scum trying to subvert trust. "Why would you trust him OMG!" is the typical scum response to fast, uncontrollable circles of trust forming, and is basically how they express frustration while trying to discredit them in the thread. Again, we see him actively discrediting town reads, which are actually vitally important in PM games as well as an excellent tool for weeding out scum. Look at his posts, most are focused on discrediting sandroba, without once calling him scum, its basically "I don't see how people trust him" not "he could be scum guys". Subtley his wording gives away that he knows sandroba is town, and is both angry and clueless as to how others without privileged information have discovered the same thing. I wasnt discrediting so much as wondering why people thought he was town. After talking to Sandroba and Chaoser via Skype, I feel like I understand more, but because I wasnt apart of the PM circle I simply didnt understand what was happening. Regarding my apologising, I do that independent from alignment see this. I guess I hate lurkers and inactives as they tend to either waste town lynches if there town or just make it impossible to read if they're scum. | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
HIs lack of pro-active town play means I no longer think he is viable captain candidate (not that he ever entered the campaign...). As he hasn't caused confusion I dont think he necessarilly seems scum though. I see him as neutral. I would like to vote Acro as, though I am less wary of Sandroba than I was I'lm still not entirely confident. Are you running? If not I'd like to wait until candidates come out with cases, feels like that is the best way to place a vote at this stage. | ||
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froggynoddy
United Kingdom452 Posts
Now good night | ||
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