• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 19:56
CEST 01:56
KST 08:56
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall10HomeStory Cup 27 - Info & Preview18Classic wins Code S Season 2 (2025)16Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0TL Team Map Contest #5: Presented by Monster Energy6
Community News
Weekly Cups (June 30 - July 6): Classic Doubles2[BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China9Flash Announces Hiatus From ASL66Weekly Cups (June 23-29): Reynor in world title form?14FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event22
StarCraft 2
General
The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings The SCII GOAT: A statistical Evaluation Weekly Cups (June 23-29): Reynor in world title form? Weekly Cups (June 30 - July 6): Classic Doubles Program: SC2 / XSplit / OBS Scene Switcher
Tourneys
RSL: Revival, a new crowdfunded tournament series FEL Cracov 2025 (July 27) - $8000 live event Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament WardiTV Mondays Korean Starcraft League Week 77
Strategy
How did i lose this ZvP, whats the proper response Simple Questions Simple Answers
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 481 Fear and Lava Mutation # 480 Moths to the Flame Mutation # 479 Worn Out Welcome Mutation # 478 Instant Karma
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ ASL20 Preliminary Maps [ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall SC uni coach streams logging into betting site Flash Announces Hiatus From ASL
Tourneys
[BSL20] Non-Korean Championship 4x BSL + 4x China [BSL20] Grand Finals - Sunday 20:00 CET CSL Xiamen International Invitational The Casual Games of the Week Thread
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers I am doing this better than progamers do.
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile What do you want from future RTS games? Beyond All Reason
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Stop Killing Games - European Citizens Initiative Summer Games Done Quick 2024! Summer Games Done Quick 2025!
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Manga] One Piece [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread NBA General Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 NHL Playoffs 2024
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Culture Clash in Video Games…
TrAiDoS
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
Blog #2
tankgirl
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 525 users

[D] Current PvZ - Metagame?

Forum Index > Closed
Post a Reply
Felo
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Germany392 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-17 07:34:13
June 17 2011 07:33 GMT
#1
Greetings,

I just came back from a 5 week long break due to the fact that I was in the hospital. I was placed at ~700 points when that still was something noteworthy so I get enemies around ~1,5k right now.

Obviously my mechanics aren't 100% what they used to be, multitasking is a bit lackluster but its okay - I can hold my ground in PvT and PvP with okay win-rates but PvZ gives me headaches - I also watched the bunch of LiquidTyler-Replays that got released a few days ago but I don't like the double-gateway-style hes using in this.

My problems with that Match-up aren't specific or anything that I could nail with a replay, its more the fact that I missed 5 weeks of Metagame: 5 weeks ago I used to open up 3Gate-Sentry-Expand into Colossi with reasonably quick upgrades, third and Blink Stalkers afterwards.

But when I try to do that right now I just get Fungal'd, Baneling Bombed into the stone age and whatnot, so I feel rather old fashioned for still trying that stuff out.

Because of that I have a multitude of questions:

The Opening

Whats standard right now? Most of the time I go for FFE on Shakuras/Tal'Darim (I have no map vetoed) and 3Gate-Sentry-Expand on the other maps. Is that still viable or have other standard openings for Non-FFE-Maps arosen?

(I get my expansion at ~6 minutes, add a forge and my 4th Gate after the Nexus has gone down and go from there. I don't have any problems holding Roach/Ling-Attacks Losirastyle, but my problem is rather that Zergs have started to get their thirds up even qiucker than they used to five weeks ago, so they're working on their advantage while I'm still busy going up to 8 Sentries and Stalkers afterwards - is it still doable to kill those expansions with a 10-Minute-~100-supply-push or do I need some sort of tech?)

The Follow-ups

Forge-FE

Regularly I'm getting a quick SG for convenience and safety while trying to be as obnoxious with my Void Ray and adding 2-3 Phoenixes depending on how things work out.

But after that ... I'm lost. I know the Ace-Phoenix-Zealot-"All-In", but most of the time I'm more a fan of building up to a solid lategame with a quick third - is there currently a build around that aims for that?

And if not is there any way to decide which 2base-push would be the most fitting? (i.E. Blinkstalkers, double-stargate, quick colossi, etc).

3Gate-Sentry-Expand

This is where I'm in trouble right now. Are colossi first still viable and I just need to tech switch out of them quicker than I used to? (Like only getting 2-3 colossi to secure the third and eventually push a bit)

Or is there something else thats know standard like ... uh ... Blinkstalkers with quick upgrades, Air, DTs, whatever ^^

Lategame Composition

I used to stick with my composition Colossi/Stalker till the late game, adding Stargates while the 4th got up to mix in more and more void rays to be T3-Proof. As of now I mostly run into a lot of infestors, so I guess I should mix in HTs? Would a Lategamecomposition of the current metagame then more look like Archon/VR/HT + Whatever I can afford out of my Gateways?

(Of course its always situational but I just have no fix Idea what I should strive for and that makes my game very shaky)

Conclusion

Well, thats my bunch of questions - is the metagame still the same in the sense of 3Gate-Sentry-Expand into Colossi or has the standard changed and I need to pick up something new?
EU GML P | Check my Stream (with commentary!) -> www.twitch.tv/xFelo
zatic
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
Zurich15325 Posts
June 17 2011 07:41 GMT
#2
This is not a proper discussion thread. If you need help with your gameplay create a [H] thread. Avoid the term "current metagame" though please it makes my head hurt.
ModeratorI know Teamliquid is known as a massive building
Chill
Profile Blog Joined January 2005
Calgary25979 Posts
July 20 2011 04:17 GMT
#3
FUCK
Moderator
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 4m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft347
UpATreeSC 173
Livibee 112
ROOTCatZ 108
JuggernautJason74
ProTech60
StarCraft: Brood War
MaD[AoV]44
Dota 2
NeuroSwarm128
League of Legends
JimRising 354
Counter-Strike
summit1g9912
tarik_tv3775
Fnx 2100
taco 753
sgares194
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King152
Other Games
Grubby1968
shahzam944
Maynarde139
ZombieGrub55
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick49821
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 17 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta39
• Kozan
• sooper7s
• Migwel
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• intothetv
• IndyKCrew
StarCraft: Brood War
• Eskiya23 26
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1436
• TFBlade942
• Stunt303
Other Games
• Shiphtur941
• WagamamaTV215
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
4m
CranKy Ducklings10
Sparkling Tuna Cup
10h 4m
WardiTV European League
16h 4m
MaNa vs sebesdes
Mixu vs Fjant
ByuN vs HeRoMaRinE
ShoWTimE vs goblin
Gerald vs Babymarine
Krystianer vs YoungYakov
PiGosaur Monday
1d
The PondCast
1d 10h
WardiTV European League
1d 12h
Jumy vs NightPhoenix
Percival vs Nicoract
ArT vs HiGhDrA
MaxPax vs Harstem
Scarlett vs Shameless
SKillous vs uThermal
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 16h
Replay Cast
2 days
RSL Revival
2 days
ByuN vs SHIN
Clem vs Reynor
Replay Cast
3 days
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
3 days
Classic vs Cure
FEL
3 days
RSL Revival
4 days
FEL
4 days
FEL
4 days
CSO Cup
4 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
4 days
Bonyth vs QiaoGege
Dewalt vs Fengzi
Hawk vs Zhanhun
Sziky vs Mihu
Mihu vs QiaoGege
Zhanhun vs Sziky
Fengzi vs Hawk
Sparkling Tuna Cup
5 days
RSL Revival
5 days
FEL
5 days
BSL20 Non-Korean Champi…
5 days
Bonyth vs Dewalt
QiaoGege vs Dewalt
Hawk vs Bonyth
Sziky vs Fengzi
Mihu vs Zhanhun
QiaoGege vs Zhanhun
Fengzi vs Mihu
Liquipedia Results

Completed

BSL Season 20
HSC XXVII
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
Acropolis #3
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
Championship of Russia 2025
RSL Revival: Season 1
Murky Cup #2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025

Upcoming

2025 ACS Season 2: Qualifier
CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSL Xiamen Invitational
2025 ACS Season 2
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
SEL Season 2 Championship
FEL Cracov 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.