EPTTL Mafia XXXIV: Pokemafia
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Insanious
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Insanious
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 Professor Oak was way better than Rowen, or the other Professors throughout the different lands, this is the saddest start to a mafia ever. | ||
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Insanious
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On December 10 2010 07:56 LSB wrote: Having a general system for how blues play is pretty important. We need to establish a good town environment where the most pro-town players won't find themselves dead. We need to establish a place where everyone is active. Sure, we could leave everything to RNG, but we could do so much more with the blues. I have to agree with this, having a general idea of how the town runs will help keep down the number of accidental lynchings. This is more or less pulled from one of the guides that DcH posted, but when you have a town that uses larger posts, filled with a lot of information, it makes it a lot easier to pick out those that want to give no new information and are simply regurgitating stuff that has already been said in the thread.If we start with a town that runs this way, it should carry through to the end of the game. The best way to keep a town that functions correctly functioning this way would be to keep the people that are running in a more administrative fashion (i guess i could say that) where they are trying to keep some semblance of order alive. I mean a town that runs all willy-nilly chaotic is a town that breeds scum, where a town that runs in a more ordered fashion has a higher chance of weeding out those that are trying to bring disorder to an already disorderly situation. On December 10 2010 08:01 Kenpachi wrote: how many people can Mafia target per night? It says that the mafia get 3kp, added to this mewtwo (although not part of the mafia, is still playing against the town) has 1kp. This means there can be 3 mafia targets, and 1 third party target a night. | ||
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On December 10 2010 08:11 Eiii wrote: There always seem to be posts about how we all need to establish a 'pro-town environment', which is obvious of course  I (and I'm sure lots of other newer players) have no clue what that *means* though, especially when we can't PM each other. (That might turn out to be more of a blessing than a curse though.)So... can someone enlighten me? I'm newer at this as well, but have been reading a few mafia games, but i think some of the things people want in a pro-town environment are: - Longer, well thought out posts. This way ideas don't get lost. If you post a million tiny posts people can get bored, or will skip over having to read like 5 pages when everything could have just been put into a single longer post and people will have less to read. This way the town can see people who are posting small posts that try to bury information. - Long, well thought out accusations of scum. If you have posts that have like 8 quotes in them, people can better see a pattern in someones behavior. This can also help stop bandwagoning onto an innocent, as with a long post someone has a lot of information to refute, and you can also then point out scum who are using selective posts. This way it is easier to spot people who are trying to mislead the town. - Less peer-pressure, in a more pro-town environment there is less calling out of people, this can result in less blues being forced to reveal, which not only makes the town more vulnerable but also forces a chancey (in this case) to protect the blue for fear that they die. As well, this can reduce the amount of greens that need to reveal, that make them vulnerable due to them no longer being able to be lynch bait. I think those are more or less the major points of a more pro-town environment rather than an anti-town environment, if I missed anything just add to the list. | ||
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On December 10 2010 08:53 jcarlsoniv wrote: You mean like this post is doing? From your two posts, I've noticed you haven't really added too much at all. Your first post was almost exclusively regurgitating previous posts. Your second one you seemed to be trying to add more, saying you've read guides, and it appears that you are trying hard to look like the poster child of "how to be a townie". Everyone pretty much knows the environment that is conducive to town progress. It is very apparent when scum tries to disrupt things if they are going smoothly. We just have to catch them as they are doing it before things spiral out of control. Townies don't need to try to look like townies, because they already are. Two newer mafia players asked two questions, I was simply answering them. Its not like I was just throwing that info out there as if it was anything new. Eiii asked what a pro-town environment entitled, while Kenpachi asked how many attacks the mafia can make in a night. Both of which they could of found by reading what DrH posted, but I thought it would be nice to answer both questions... I guess if you would rather I could of simply just not answered their questions and left them guessing. | ||
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Also to actually contribute to the thread somewhat, I really don't like either of the bandwagons we have going. Infun hasn't really done anything, especially not to garner the wrath of 10% of the people playing this game. On the other hand Gab came off a little rough and confrontational, but I really don't think he came off that scummy... | ||
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People are like "its only 6 out of 31" but really, once a bandwagon gets running its hard to stop unless you slow it down early... I don't think any more votes on Gab right now will help the town, all it will do is seal Gab's fate... | ||
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Look at every mafia game here, or on any other site and it always starts with the "do we lynch inactives or not", why? Because it gets people talking, and unless people talk then we will never ever find scum. Activity is counter productive to the mafia, as that means they have to participate more, and that gives them more chances to slip up. LSB started on the convo, but now we have found a few people acting scummy, and as such we are no longer talking about lynching inactives, but weather to lynch people who've actually said something. Do we lynch Kenpachi for his posting habbits, Gab for his out burst, Infun for his previous actions, LSB for trying to be the head of the town, or you for just angrily, randomly, accusing people of being scum. This is where the game should be focused, but we needed a start... and lynching inactives is a start. | ||
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1) Gabe accuses Kenpachi 2) Kenpachi tries to defend himself poorly 3) Kenpachi votes for Gabe 4) Jcarl jumps in and defends Ken, while trying to put a case against Gabe 5) People bandwagon Gabe 6) People start to look else where for scum 7) Kenpachi jumps in and makes us look back at Gabe 8) Gabe tries to ignore Ken, and tries to act like the rest of us (Eii, Chaos, tube, etc...) 9) Jcarl comes back and tries to get us to focus back on Gabe Kenpachi and Jcarl, why you two working so closely together to try and get us to hang Gabe when a large part of the town is like "... Gabe really doesn't look that scummy..." On December 11 2010 16:58 Eiii wrote: ...gabes posts are so blatantly bad I'm actually starting to have a hard time believing they could possibly be authored by scum. o_O On December 11 2010 08:30 KtheZ wrote: I'm not sure if we should really take Gabriel's actions that greatly into consideration. Considering that he is a relatively veteran player, I don't think the bandwagon against him is of great value. If he was mafia, isnt it common sense for them to talk about a game plan and think things out before posting, rather than actively arguing with people? On December 11 2010 04:28 LSB wrote: The problem is now, why the bandwagon the bandwagon against Gabriel took place. (i'll look into it later, right now I'm hard pressed for time) On December 11 2010 04:15 Hesmyrr wrote: There is one possible reason why I am willing to give Gabriel null-read for now, but I am going to wait for him to come and explain himself first to see if his argument agrees with mine. On December 11 2010 03:15 seRapH wrote: Oh come on guys, 5 people voting for Gabriel out of nowhere? He hasn't really been very scummy imo. I'm keeping an eye on this bandwagon for scum, it's very likely that someone amongst these 5 are poison-type pokemon, maybe even multiple of them. - - - - - - - - - - - - On December 11 2010 02:44 jcarlsoniv wrote: I agree with you, which is why I'm not convinced he's scum. He is making wild accusations though that is disrupting everything, and even if he's town, removing that isn't necessarily a bad thing. However, if we can find scum, I definitely want that, obviously. I just want Gabriel to have an eye kept on him. ^^^ huh? Isn't that contradictory to the two huge posts you made against Gabe? "I don't think he's scum... but let's vote him and then see what happens!" | ||
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On December 12 2010 02:30 Kenpachi wrote: asdf. even when i post, i get pointed scum Its not THAT you post, its WHAT you post... the problem is that all of your posts are spam and none of them offer anything. I actually also prepared a case against you, but tree.hugger got there before me so I didn't think I should post everything you wrote again, but really: + Show Spoiler + On December 10 2010 06:55 Kenpachi wrote: yes! got my pm and the games beginning~ Very excited over his role, that's not that unusual... On December 10 2010 07:11 Kenpachi wrote: oh shit.. i cant really imagine Professor Oak dead D: Until you see that he posts against 16 minutes later just to spam that he's in the game, wouldn't the post before hand of been enough? All this does is clutter up the thread with no additional content. Post could not have happened. On December 10 2010 07:47 Kenpachi wrote: Pikachu - Townie Raichu - Miller Chansey - Medic Cloyster - Veteran Alakazam - Detective Electrode - Mad Hatter Mew - Special Detective Gengar - God Father Koffing - Mafia Grunt Weezing - Mafia Shrink Mewtwo - 3rd Party Vigilante notice how our only way of killing at night is Mad Hatter and 3rd party.. 3rd party is technically against us and will probably kill town over mafia due to immunity and their goal is to be last alive. Then he continues with the spam. Here he posts a list of the pokemon roles to normal mafia roles. This is something that looks helpful, but isn't helpful at all. Everyone would of red the starting post to see what the roles do, equating them with other words isn't helpful in the least, but it does SEEM helpful. As well, he also points out that the reds have little to fear from the town besides lynching as there are no vig killers. Why does he point that out? Re-leaved? On December 10 2010 07:50 Kenpachi wrote: yea claiming is a no no. and i hate lynching inactives. doesnt work at all. Again, more spam... seems like he is posting every 10 minutes or less, just to rack up posts. He says it doesn't work, but doesn't explain why. He is simply shooting down an idea without adding to the conversation. This kills information flow, something a red would like to do. If he was green/blue, he could of posted more to his opinion,why he thought that. Something with more meat "Claiming is a no no because there are so many mafia that any lies will take forever for the DT to check out, as well it will make our blues more susceptible as then the mafia will know who exactly to hit every-night." Even that is less suspicious than what Ken posted. On December 10 2010 08:01 Kenpachi wrote: how many people can Mafia target per night? His last post previous showed that he read the starting post, as he pulled the names and roles of the different jobs from the starting post, but then why does he feign ignorance? If you read what all the roles did, do you expect me to believe that he didn't scroll down a few lines to see how many KP the mafia got? If he would of just read the OP, instead of posting this it would of been less suspicious. But this seems like another thing scum do, play the "I'm new card" this is a subtle one, that just says "look at me asking this noob question, i must not know much" it is a defense as people are less likely to lynch a new player than an experienced one. On December 10 2010 08:12 Kenpachi wrote: basically, where we can point out scum easily without confusing them as town.. i think Here he is answering a question, without actually answering the question. He posts something that looks like an answer but offers no real insight at all. He doesn't explain what a pro-town environment is, he just simply states what it should look like and then moves on. It is just clutter, that can also just act as a way to confuse a newer player. Not to mention, Eiii might of been less likely to ask the question against later even though it wasn't really responded to simply to avoid looking foolish after kenpachi, a more experienced player, "answered" it. If he was town, he should of just ignored this, or went to one of the links DocH posted and just copie-pasted the analysis of a pro-town environment, both would of done more good. Including this to include all his posts, answering a question where he simply copies from the OP... again. (note this is not scummy behaviour, but i wanted to include all posts) Pure spam... adds nothing to the conversation. Would have been better to actually refute the claims instead of spam here. He could of looked like a green/blue, but instead he continues to post like a red, more spam and more dismissal of arguments without any sound logic. On December 10 2010 11:34 Kenpachi wrote: + Show Spoiler + On December 10 2010 11:20 Gabriel wrote: Interesting: my half good "im new" shot is now voting for me. Kenpachi care to explain A) your vote B) your deep posts? + Show Spoiler + On December 10 2010 07:11 Kenpachi wrote: oh shit.. i cant really imagine Professor Oak dead D: On December 10 2010 07:47 Kenpachi wrote: Pikachu - Townie Raichu - Miller Chansey - Medic Cloyster - Veteran Alakazam - Detective Electrode - Mad Hatter Mew - Special Detective Gengar - God Father Koffing - Mafia Grunt Weezing - Mafia Shrink Mewtwo - 3rd Party Vigilante notice how our only way of killing at night is Mad Hatter and 3rd party.. 3rd party is technically against us and will probably kill town over mafia due to immunity and their goal is to be last alive. On December 10 2010 07:50 Kenpachi wrote: yea claiming is a no no. and i hate lynching inactives. doesnt work at all. On December 10 2010 08:01 Kenpachi wrote: how many people can Mafia target per night? On December 10 2010 08:12 Kenpachi wrote: basically, where we can point out scum easily without confusing them as town.. i think what would posting history 4 hours into the game show you? Posts two seconds later, more spam, and again... doesn't add anything. Doesn't refute the claim against him, does not try to argue against Gab at all, he simply just tries to dismiss any claim against him without even a logical argument. On December 10 2010 11:44 Kenpachi wrote: A) 4 hours does not judge that. what if i went on TL tomorrow for the first time in the past 3 days? B) Anyone who posts would want to look active.. Why would they post if they want to look inactive? C) Why are you assuming i read the rules? how do you know i didnt just assume the KP? D) It doesnt. shh E) ?? its enlightenment F) I dont agree with you voting for Infundibulum. Here, he doesn't even refute the arguments brought against him. A) Says 4 hours isn't enough time to judge activity, and then he says something that makes no sence B) He says posting = activity, but it doesn't... Kenpachi posts empty posts that make him look active without contributing... posting without content does not make you an active member of the comunity. C) He says he didn't read the rules here... even though he posted the roles as his 3rd post in the game. So he read the rules but didn't read the rules? D) Says lynching inactives doesn't work, but not why... E) K this one doesn't make sense... F) Ken voted Gab as soon as Gab voted Infini, even though Gab said he voted Infini for past actions... On December 10 2010 12:12 Kenpachi wrote: A) There isnt much to post in the beginning, due to low information and lack of suspicion. B) I am not what? I posted in the beginning to "look" active because i have a history of lurking. C) You are still assuming i read the rules. Did i read or skim it? Did i read it but pass the KP? I posted that in the thread for people who also didnt know to possibly take a burden off many people. D)Idk man. you found a bunch of posts in the beginning and call me inactive? Refer to B). Why am i posting to "look" active? E) "I think its 2." hey i only played 1 game with Double Lynch before. F) your logic is flawed. i can vote for anyone i want to and im defending Infundibulum by not voting for him. Why do you think youre gonna be the main bandwagon from 1 vote? A) Says there isn't much to post in the begining, but then why post at all? Ken has something like 1/4 of the posts in the thread up to this point... why spam if there is nothing to spam about? B) So he has a history of lurking, so he just suddenly decides to change his game? From lurker to spammer? C) So now he skimmed the rules, but posted part of the rules in this thread... so apparently when he skims he picks up 100% of some rules but 0% of others? D) K Gab makes stupid argument here E) Again, refering to posting part of the rules, but then claiming to not have read the OP F) Does not refute the "defending infun by voting for Gab" thing that Gab brings up... but he does say that Gab is flawed in believing he will become the main bandwagon... and then becomes the main bandwagon Basically all my arguments are in that spoiler, would just be huge since I quoted every single post that Kenpachi made. Just the major points that I think Kenpachi is scummy: 1) A gigantic amount of posts that add nothing to the game. 11 posts in under 5 hours all of which add nothing to the game. His spam was especially apparent at the start of the game. 2) He posts about the rules found in the OP, and then repeatedly claims he never read the OP. This just doesn't make sense, how can you quote the OP without reading it... this just seems very scummy to me. 3) Answering questions without answering the questions. He posts as if he is answering a question, but then offers no information. This makes it seem like he is helping players, but he is simply confusing them more. 4) No arguments when called out. Gab calls Kenpachi out, Kenpachi posts 2 posts that say nothing and then disappears for a day... 5) While disappeared, the person that called him out is suddenly the bandwagon of the day (started by Kenpachi), and no one is questioning Kenpachi anymore. (even though others were investigating Kenpachi as well when Gab was.) This just seems very scummy... comes on, spams a lot, posts contradictory statements, gets called out, gets the guy that calls him out bandwaggoned, then disappears. | ||
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On December 13 2010 03:34 BrownBear wrote: iiiinteresting. It seems like town decided (again) to bandwagon onto an "inactive" then all went AFK and didn't switch onto a far more scummy person. Oh well, fairly standard for TL day 1, I guess. I'm still torn as to whether an Alakazam should check zeks tonight, and report back. On one hand, we do want to be 100% sure. On the other, he's proven to be a decent lynch target already, and we really don't want to waste an Alakazam this early... Gah. Um did you even read the thread... Kenpachi was one of the most active players in the thread, but every single one of his posts seemed scummy, he didn't even defend himself once he was put into first place. There was also a very close race between him and Zeks where Zeks was also kind of active... we didn't go after an inactive at all, don't know where your information is coming from...\ Also if you look, there were like 6 - 7 vote switches near the end of the vote, as well numerous people were talking in the thread asking for kenpachi to defend himself... I'm lost as to where you came up with us voting an inactive and then going inactive at the end of the vote... | ||
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I don't even how we can win... Heck, even mewtwo can't win unless we start killing mafia... (mewtwo can only win if there is 1 or less mafia at end). So lets start the super analysis because we really need to find some reds... | ||
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Alright apparently I counted... there are 22 players (1 mewtwo, 6 mafia, 15 town) bright side, we have 2 cycles before we're screwed... | ||
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Amber[LighT] the Mew was found dead. FOS Shockeyy DarthThienAn the Alakazam was found dead.FOS Eiii, LSB, DCLXVI, dimsab, Oceanic, Brocket, Insanious (+3 people who died to make it a list of 9, not 6) Pandain the Cloyster was found dead. FOS Seraph, DCLXVI To me it looks like: DCLXVI was FOS'ed by two of the players that recently died and then was killed. Will go back through the rest of the people who were killed the night before and who they FOS'ed before they died... but might want to take a look at the people here (and yes I included everyone who didn't die, including my self) | ||
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BrownBear Eiii dinmsab DCLXVI Ghrur Node KtheZ tube chaoser Oceanic These people are now completely lurking, no posts, just voting... meaning they are either mafia or just town that are helping the mafia... as there are 11 i'm going to say that most of them are just town that are helping the mafia win... People that were active then stopped: Eiii Node tube Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeee | ||
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Ghrur: - Only votes - Posted to start the thread - I believe posted to defend himself once, then disappeared again Eiii: - Suspicious posting at start of thread - Once people started to notice him, he just disappeared into the shadows and stopped posting Will actually go through there posts once I have time, just doing laundry + studying but ya... maybe I can get in some nice analysis before bed. | ||
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