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Question for you guys, what's up with Annul claiming someone broke the rule?
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Annuls Accusation of ROL.
1) Rol pmed annul violating rule 6
6. PMing people you are not suppose to
On March 27 2011 15:30 annul wrote:
also i GREATLY do not appreciate your cheating.
sending me an AIM message with a :-) after posting that is a great implication that you actually are night vig and that i am dead, since the only way you can communicate with me in a legal way is if i am dead.
An AIM message with a :-) is no where near the threshold for a 'pm'. In addition, since you have indeed posted in thread, it is no longer private.
Next time, please bring this information to me. Posting in thread is what you do if it was a mistake and you don't want someone modkilled off of it. For example, Tackster has done this in this game, posting info that he shouldn't have discussed in quicktopic in thread.
2) Rol would have been cheating anyways since Annul should have been dead, and you can't talk with dead players violating rule one
1. Posting after death. You may have one polite goodbye post, but it may not contain any potentially game-changing information.
First of all, annul was never dead so the point in moot.
Second of all, to clear up for people. You are not dead until I flip your role. As Rol explained it
On March 27 2011 16:03 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:
You obviously knew that you weren't dead yet or you wouldn't of posted 900 things. You aren't dead until the host updates your death.
Rol took advantage of the timing where the hosts went to sleep. So even his role involved a public vig that killed Annul, he could still talk with Annul.
In addition, annul knew this going in
On March 27 2011 15:29 annul wrote:
are you actually public night vig?
if so, i need to dump info quickly
Here he assumes that he is dead, so he would need to dump info.
Annul shows that he is well aware of the rules involving, so point two is moot.
Conclusion, RoL did not cheat.
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On March 27 2011 16:06 annul wrote:
LSB: please replace me with barundar, or blow my potato up, either way, i am done playing this game.
Please note: strategic modkills a Not Allowed
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On March 28 2011 01:08 LSB wrote:
Question for you guys, what's up with Annul claiming someone broke the rule?
Basically RoL ##shoot annul in thread and then on AIM messaged him a smiley face. So annul thought that the hit went through cause obviously PMs aren't allowed between the two of them I assume. So he figured it was a real hit and he dumped all his info. And then RoL said it was a bluff. Technically the smiley face was cheating.
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cos i'm new i want to ask - does the shot count as cheating?
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On March 28 2011 01:14 Tackster wrote:
cos i'm new i want to ask - does the shot count as cheating?
Typing ##shoot isn't cheating. Sending smily's over AIM to people you don't have PM rights with is a capital crime however.
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##Kamikaze: All
My item allows me to at any time force all scum players to reveal their roles to me via PMs. I implement it now...
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On March 28 2011 01:12 chaoser wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2011 01:08 LSB wrote:
Question for you guys, what's up with Annul claiming someone broke the rule? Basically RoL ##shoot annul in thread and then on AIM messaged him a smiley face. So annul thought that the hit went through cause obviously PMs aren't allowed between the two of them I assume. So he figured it was a real hit and he dumped all his info. And then RoL said it was a bluff. Technically the smiley face was cheating.
Kk, I have made a rules decision here
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=200702¤tpage=96#1901
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I dunno...I disagree, the smiley face is pretty rule breaking in my opinion. If someone did a ##shoot and then IMed me a smiley I'd assume I was dead. The whole "you shared it in thread so it's not private" is kinda bullshitty to me. So we can't share breaking the rules with PM since then it's "public"? So you're saying I can PM someone and talk about shit but as long as I post the convo at a later time it's public?
But it's your game so up to you. Either way I don't think annul is going to play anymore so good job RoL.
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annul is a big boy he will be ok.
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If nobody else noticed, he actually posted /out in the next mafia game... 
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On March 28 2011 01:06 Tackster wrote:Ok: I confirm I haven't broken any rules....yet 
Because you're scum.
You claim to be new.
You're not new. You're a smurf. Who are you Tack? Ver again???
LSB made if fairly clear in the OP he wanted some smurfs. He wanted smurfs that told him who they were. You're one of them. You are most assuredly no noob.
It's also interesting you so easily dismiss your item. A mood ring. Used to check alignments Funny how the black team got a similar item. Who needs DT's if there is only one scum faction? Town. Who needs DTs if there are 2 scum factions? Everybody.
Interesting how darm was the CEO of the black faction. Interesting he had a DT item.
You're the GF aren't you Tack? You are certainly no noob. You most assuredly didn't get confused because you don't know anybody's names.
Who are you Tack? Foolishness? Ver? Qatol? Because you aren't a noob..
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On March 28 2011 01:32 Coagulation wrote:
annul is a big boy he will be ok.
I don't think it's about whether he's a big boy or not. Personally I'd be ok with it since, whatever, I can shrug things off.
But I would still think it's wrong for RoL to smiley face me. I don't care if its only a smiley face. In the situation where you said you shot me and then PM/communicated to me outside of thread. No matter how slight, I'd view it as a legit PM and that I was dead. Bluffing a shot is ok but smiley facing outside the thread to make it seem "more real" is not in my opinion. RoL did the smiley on purpose to make annul think he was really dead so he started dumping info. Obviously you can question, well, why did annul post all his shit then? he's dead, he should stop talking. But I think it's cause the PM rule is actually written in the rules as "NO PMs IN GAME UNLESS YOU'RE IN A GROUP." while the "YOU ARE NOT DEAD UNTIL I UPDATE" rule isn't. Fuzzy rules in my opinion. Should be more clear next time on it.
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On March 28 2011 01:44 Jackal58 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2011 01:06 Tackster wrote:Ok: I confirm I haven't broken any rules....yet Because you're scum. You claim to be new. You're not new. You're a smurf. Who are you Tack? Ver again??? LSB made if fairly clear in the OP he wanted some smurfs. He wanted smurfs that told him who they were. You're one of them. You are most assuredly no noob. It's also interesting you so easily dismiss your item. A mood ring. Used to check alignments Funny how the black team got a similar item. Who needs DT's if there is only one scum faction? Town. Who needs DTs if there are 2 scum factions? Everybody. Interesting how darm was the CEO of the black faction. Interesting he had a DT item. You're the GF aren't you Tack? You are certainly no noob. You most assuredly didn't get confused because you don't know anybody's names. Who are you Tack? Foolishness? Ver? Qatol? Because you aren't a noob..
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL
You just made me laugh harder than I have in so long.
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On March 28 2011 01:44 Jackal58 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2011 01:06 Tackster wrote:Ok: I confirm I haven't broken any rules....yet Because you're scum. You claim to be new. You're not new. You're a smurf. Who are you Tack? Ver again??? LSB made if fairly clear in the OP he wanted some smurfs. He wanted smurfs that told him who they were. You're one of them. You are most assuredly no noob. It's also interesting you so easily dismiss your item. A mood ring. Used to check alignments Funny how the black team got a similar item. Who needs DT's if there is only one scum faction? Town. Who needs DTs if there are 2 scum factions? Everybody. Interesting how darm was the CEO of the black faction. Interesting he had a DT item. You're the GF aren't you Tack? You are certainly no noob. You most assuredly didn't get confused because you don't know anybody's names. Who are you Tack? Foolishness? Ver? Qatol? Because you aren't a noob..
I doubt he's the godfather dude...what kind of retarded mafia would put their GF in the item game, the one place where it's 100% sure that he'll be found and lynched>?
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On March 28 2011 01:26 chaoser wrote:
I dunno...I disagree, the smiley face is pretty rule breaking in my opinion. If someone did a ##shoot and then IMed me a smiley I'd assume I was dead. The whole "you shared it in thread so it's not private" is kinda bullshitty to me. So we can't share breaking the rules with PM since then it's "public"? So you're saying I can PM someone and talk about shit but as long as I post the convo at a later time it's public?
But it's your game so up to you. Either way I don't think annul is going to play anymore so good job RoL.
This is stupid logic. If you think you are dead then you are knowingly breaking the rules of posting when you are dead. Any half experienced player knows you aren't dead until the mod says so, even if it looks like you are probably going to die. This is entirely what my "##Shoot" command hinged off of, putting a player on extreme tilt for a short period of time and making him slip up so I could determine his alignment as a definite fact. I knew annul was online because I have him on AIM and he also just recently posted. He is just using my smiley face to justify acting dumber than I expected. I was expecting a rage quit mafia or a somber helpful townie. I got the worst of both all in 10 minutes.
The point being, my smiley didn't mean he was dead, and if he really believed that he would of went to sleep instead of posting all his info before he actually died.
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LSB MADE HIS FUCKING DECISION DONT DERAIL THE THREAD
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Jackal, I am never going to let you live that post down. EVER.
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On March 28 2011 01:44 Jackal58 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 28 2011 01:06 Tackster wrote:Ok: I confirm I haven't broken any rules....yet Because you're scum. You claim to be new. You're not new. You're a smurf. Who are you Tack? Ver again??? LSB made if fairly clear in the OP he wanted some smurfs. He wanted smurfs that told him who they were. You're one of them. You are most assuredly no noob. It's also interesting you so easily dismiss your item. A mood ring. Used to check alignments Funny how the black team got a similar item. Who needs DT's if there is only one scum faction? Town. Who needs DTs if there are 2 scum factions? Everybody. Interesting how darm was the CEO of the black faction. Interesting he had a DT item. You're the GF aren't you Tack? You are certainly no noob. You most assuredly didn't get confused because you don't know anybody's names. Who are you Tack? Foolishness? Ver? Qatol? Because you aren't a noob..
ROFL - you got me. I'm the most experienced mafia player to ever grace this fair forum. Im a smurf of a hugely powerful player so immense you can't begin to imagine him. I am in fact TL incarnate. I am JaeDong playing mafia on the forums...
I've also confirmed myself to be deconduo's room mate which he went along with... Deconduo lives with these amazing mafia players and has never ever said...
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Everything in this post is blue
On March 28 2011 01:26 chaoser wrote:
I dunno...I disagree, the smiley face is pretty rule breaking in my opinion. If someone did a ##shoot and then IMed me a smiley I'd assume I was dead. The whole "you shared it in thread so it's not private" is kinda bullshitty to me. So we can't share breaking the rules with PM since then it's "public"? So you're saying I can PM someone and talk about shit but as long as I post the convo at a later time it's public?
First I'll get into my hosting philosophy.
I try to allow freedom of what to do, posting restrictions are pretty lame in my ideas. If you got a good plan, you should be allowed to run with it. Of course, if you only do it in thread.
For example, the day 1 alignment hints. In many games this would be regarded as "cheating".
I've had mafia/third party complaints of this + Show Spoiler +Original Message From darmousseh:
They are saying something about alignment pms. Could I get a copy of the alignment PM that was sent out. It kinda seems unfair that they are using text from an alignment PM to try to determine black/red.
However I after evaluating it, it is only game ruining if they did it via PMs so it was allowed in thread.
Now to look at Rol's situation.
Trying to convince someone they are dead is pretty sleezy, but it is an interesting play. I don't see any reason why it shouldn't happen.
I've talked to Rol about why he sent the smiley.
[11:32 AM] LSB: Why did you send the smiley?
[11:32 AM] RebirthOfLeGenD: I knew he was still online
[11:32 AM] RebirthOfLeGenD: and watching the thread because he had posted recently
[11:33 AM] RebirthOfLeGenD: and I wanted him to check the thread quicker.
[11:33 AM] RebirthOfLeGenD: all I did was speed up the end result
[11:33 AM] RebirthOfLeGenD: he made it out to be way more than it was
[11:33 AM] RebirthOfLeGenD: I AIMed him a smiley
I will take RoL's word for it. His message was not trying to promote any message, it was not a "PM" per say, it was a poke.
Now onto your question on whether sending a PM is mod killable. Remember, there is a big difference from just sending a PM and actually PMing someone.
Now. Lets say you were mafia along with Kitaman, and you sent a message to the townie, me LSB.
LSB has two actions he could take
1. Reply back and start pming you. This is considered cheating and would get both of us modkilled
2. Ignore it and report it to the mod / the game
Should option 2 be taken, this does not necessarily mean that someone will be killed. If the information is posted in thread, there would be no reason why it helps the town. Sure there are a few exceptions, but that will be evaluated on a case by case basis.
Now lets say RoL was trying to break the rules. Lets evaluate what happened.
Annul posted in thread immediately, so there was no PMing at all. All implications of what happened are known. There is no reason why there is an unfair advantage derived from two players because everyone knows all information that passed.
Most importantly, what annul is doing is not trying to cite a rule infraction, he is trying to use the rules to kill someone he doesn't like a strategic modkill. Strategic modkills are not allowed, are strictly discouraged, and will not be carried out
If you want to kill someone, do it via lynch. Don't try to cite a rules infraction.
In addition, please note, using this message to try to figure out other player's alignments is a bad idea
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On March 28 2011 01:44 chaoser wrote:I don't think it's about whether he's a big boy or not. Personally I'd be ok with it since, whatever, I can shrug things off. But I would still think it's wrong for RoL to smiley face me. I don't care if its only a smiley face. In the situation where you said you shot me and then PM/communicated to me outside of thread. No matter how slight, I'd view it as a legit PM and that I was dead. Bluffing a shot is ok but smiley facing outside the thread to make it seem "more real" is not in my opinion. RoL did the smiley on purpose to make annul think he was really dead so he started dumping info. Obviously you can question, well, why did annul post all his shit then? he's dead, he should stop talking. But I think it's cause the PM rule is actually written in the rules as "NO PMs IN GAME UNLESS YOU'RE IN A GROUP." while the "YOU ARE NOT DEAD UNTIL I UPDATE" rule isn't. Fuzzy rules in my opinion. Should be more clear next time on it.
The reason this is stupid is because in no PM games this happens all the time. We aren't talking or planning about how to act in game, we taunt each other about shit jokingly. The smiley, however ambiguous it may have been could at most have been viewed as a challenge as if to say "Your move." which is common place in mafia games regardless of the PM rules.
For example, I talk to LSB, Kav, BC, Foolishness, Meapak, you, and quite a few other players on AIM regularly. If we are in a game am I not allowed to talk to them until it's over?
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EPT
