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On July 27 2011 01:46 Curu wrote:
You were the first to vote for Jackal BC. On a policy (lynch liars). You're up for lynch yourself now on a policy (lynch people refusing to get checked). You say that starting a bandwagon on you is stupid because none of us are sure you are scum, but you started the bandwagon on Jackal as well.
So do you feel strongly enough about lynching Jackal that you'll be a Vig hit or next lynch if he flips green? Because you think he lied about his role PM. That's your conviction for starting the wagon on him?
And to answer your own question, no one defended redFF in your own game and he turned out scum.
Re read the game. You will find that two mafia currently dead spent time attempting to redirect the lynch and push other points. He was being defended you just didn't see it. As for general stance. I clarified earlier that I would support a better lynch. I also voted based on something I feel is a lie. Ie its a policy lynch.
You can lynch me all you want for not submiting to an unconfirmed dt check, and when I flip you will not only facepalm but be held accountable for my lynch. It will be actually priceless to see your reaction then.
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BC will you rather die than submit to the check? I'm finding it increasingly difficult not to vote for you as every post contains, in my opinion, bizarre logic that is not compatible with pro-town play and you must know it. You'll rather martyr than submit to a check by a player that is almost certainly not mafia? The only thing that's giving me second thoughts is that I just can't see your scum play being this bad and there indeed is almost no resistance to your lynch
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I don't even...
So every game you play BC, do you always wait for every unconfirmed DT to be checked by another DT? Who was confirmed by what means? Supersoft KILLED SCUM, that's good enough for me and should be good enough for you.
I'm just going to vote for you until you let him check you.
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By the way, just for reference, Fishball claimed cop in CCM, and he was in no way confirmed, but in that game BC was willing to lie, because he was convinced that Fishball was telling the truth. He was willing to falsely confirm a cop claim he believed, because that's how much he trusted Fishball's claim.
I just have no idea how this does even fly, and the constant threats that anyone who votes for you will be held accountable. I'll be the first person to be held accountable for you, I want you checked, or dead.
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On July 27 2011 01:51 syllogism wrote:
BC will you rather die than submit to the check? I'm finding it increasingly difficult not to vote for you as every post contains, in my opinion, bizarre logic that is not compatible with pro-town play and you must know it. You'll rather martyr than submit to a check by a player that is almost certainly not mafia? The only thing that's giving me second thoughts is that I just can't see your scum play being this bad and there indeed is almost no resistance to your lynch
Let me ask you this. He was around last night to get the required quotes from kita and for a fact I know eiii the co host was online around this time. However, the results of the check on kita you wanted so badly were never returned. Also I have no issue submitting to a check, just not by a source that will mean next to dick all.
Seriously your saying hes almost certaintly not red? Perhaps your right, but that doesn't mean hes town. Why would you trust so much in a dt role that you don't know the alignment of. None of the checks are actually trustworthy. So say I submit, he says i'm town. Next logical step is what? Say "ok guess bc is town" or would it be "we have like 5 hours left in day, might as well lynch him anyway".
Instead, I flip town, everyone who votes for me is suspect and vigi's can clear them out. There are definitely mafia and third party on my vote and as such town will net themselves easy kills. me for 2-3 anti town is a good trade.
As for bizarre logic? My play is fairly standard me, just as how I operate. Anyone who has played multiple games with me knows my style as red and green are completely different so re reading any previous game I was town would have been the similarities.
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You have nothing to hide bc, if you are town and supersoft lies to town about the dt check, he will die soon after. If you are scum then i can see why you are afraid of the dt check 
He could be SK, but I feel like an SK would have saved his shot. Again the SK has no reason to lie about the alignment check and doing it would only ge him killed.
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Can people get behind this plan:
We check Jackal58. If he turns up green we pimp him up with items.
We lynch Drazerk who is useless and trolling.
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On July 27 2011 02:01 sandroba wrote:
Can people get behind this plan:
We check Jackal58. If he turns up green we pimp him up with items.
We lynch Drazerk who is useless and trolling.
Vote me.
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Well you have Amber, Foolishness, Lanaia subtly pushing the topic away from you then. Amber with a chainsaw too ("you're all retards for voting BC, vote Jackal").
The only doubt I have right now is I now see Jackal as equally as good of a lynch because he has been useless since coming in (and pulling the same martyr bullshit you are to get out of telling us anything if we lynch him) and his vote fell to you as the easy way to get himself out of a lynch. But unless this is some bizarre bus, that means you are both Town or one red one green.
Palmar, his reasoning is that supersoft did that to buy Town cred because Mafia acting against Mafia's best interests is the best way to hide that you're Mafia. I explained why supersoft is almost certainly Town but BC's counter was a convoluted WIFOM claim. And if he's 3rd he has no reason to lie, therefore his check is trustworthy unless he's insane/paranoid or something (which I highly doubt).
I can't get behind that plan sandroba. Drazerk is useless and trolling (Kurumi is too, what's to differentiate between the two?) but Jackal is equally useless and BC is scummier than both to me. If we want to consider Drazerk I want to do it next day.
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If you are town, it shouldn't even matter to you what supersoft's alignment is, if submitting to the check is the only thing that can save you from the lynch. Aside the unlikely scenario of there being a day framer (I consider this very unlikely as players tend to make roles that can be useful to town), there's really no downside for BC the townie, especially if we can keep people from blindly trusting Supersoft's checks in future. If there's no framer and supersoft lies, we can vigi or lynch him next.
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I dig that Sandroba.
if Jackal flips red, I want you checked tonight, actually. You created a policy where you said you'd lynch people for pushing weak cases, and then you posted "Just press filter" and voted for Kita. Half the lurkers in the game could've had the same push against them.
And even if you seem to have suddenly turned to liking checking Jackal, at first you were not only against lynching him... no no, you were SO MUCH against lynching him that you were willing to try to lynch me for simply wanting to lynch him, and now you've somehow turned to wanting him checked.
I think you're a great target for a DT.
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Curu, I agree with you, Occam's Razor says supersoft is town.
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On July 27 2011 01:57 Palmar wrote:
I don't even...
So every game you play BC, do you always wait for every unconfirmed DT to be checked by another DT? Who was confirmed by what means? Supersoft KILLED SCUM, that's good enough for me and should be good enough for you.
I'm just going to vote for you until you let him check you.
Well thats good then cause I will die.
As for unconfirmed dt to be checked by another? No. However this is a gamesetup where there are roles like dt, medic, vig, etc... that could be on all three teams. You say he killed a scum? Guess what, the consensus was YM was town, or at least town oriented and he died to Tim Roth. Supersoft didn't then claim it wasn't him and kill the person responsible. No, Drop bear risked a penalty to his own role (which is telling about his role), to force Supersoft into the open. If he had claimed he had taken that shot, he'd be getting lynched right now. Instead his only option to save himself was literally do what the town wants. So he revenge shot and we got a red killed.
He didn't do this himself, he was forced into it. He doesn't get credit for a dead red. If anyone in the situation did it would be drop bear. His play since then is kinda bleh but risking a penalty that would net a dead red seems odd play from a red.
Do you see the issue? here
On July 27 2011 01:59 Palmar wrote:
By the way, just for reference, Fishball claimed cop in CCM, and he was in no way confirmed, but in that game BC was willing to lie, because he was convinced that Fishball was telling the truth. He was willing to falsely confirm a cop claim he believed, because that's how much he trusted Fishball's claim.
I just have no idea how this does even fly, and the constant threats that anyone who votes for you will be held accountable. I'll be the first person to be held accountable for you, I want you checked, or dead.
You are right, I did do that. Perhaps if you played with fishball you would realize why. He has a meta whenever he has a gun. Its kill BC. First move he always does is kill me if he can. If he can't he will opt to do the next best thing, which is work with me. He posted check results clearing me? Why the hell wouldn't i try to make his claim legit, I knew it was. He pinned two alignments correctly and thus was the confirmation. That game was also a setup where mafia had near 0 chance of having a dt, as well as fishball would not have claimed dt at that point in time if he didnt think it was neccesary. Mafia fishball would have let town keep herp derping rather than try to organize it.
As for me dying. Sadly you don't get to be held accountable. You didn't start the bandwagon. Curu did, and then 4 people voted on within 15 minutes of eachother. All hours after the discussion finished, 3 of which used terrible and flawed reasoning. Mig gets a pass for at least debating. Redff/nisani/SS all dive in, dont post solid reasons and dive out. Yet no one comments on this?
Everyone should go back and read posts accusing me, and realize I am actually talking to you. Rather than pushing someone into my place im pushing accountability onto people who put me in mine. This is far more productive at this point in time than trying to force a bandwagon change in the last 5 hours.
Also keep in mind as you all said I wasted time with the argument yesterday, notice that once i stopped arguing you are no closer to doing any real work finding a lynch target. So the only point of time that the day has shown any progress or any situation posting has been heavy I was involved. Almost everyone else seems content to lurk.
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Bc sorry but I must vote on You ...
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Whatever, maybe I'm gulible, but the events from the beggining of the game led me to believe jackal is town. I'm still not convinced that kita isn't scum, but I'm not so sure anymore. Check on me would be a waste, but if you must go ahead. I think my actions this game speak for themselves.
Supersoft may be sk or town, but whatever aligment he is his check is harmless enough, so it's dumb to let it go to waste. I was hoping he would be more active in using his ability.
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On July 27 2011 02:06 syllogism wrote:
If you are town, it shouldn't even matter to you what supersoft's alignment is, if submitting to the check is the only thing that can save you from the lynch. Aside the unlikely scenario of there being a day framer (I consider this very unlikely as players tend to make roles that can be useful to town), there's really no downside for BC the townie, especially if we can keep people from blindly trusting Supersoft's checks in future. If there's no framer and supersoft lies, we can vigi or lynch him next.
Why would I submit to a check that I don't agree with just to save myself? If you guys won't see logic or at least take a step back and look at things from my perspective then there is no point. Also, as you don't know the nature of my role, you don't know if there is a downside or not. You are also basing this entire scenario off your magical dt being here? Guess what, he doesn't appear to be.
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On July 27 2011 02:15 Kurumi wrote:
Bc sorry but I must vote on You ...
Your role sounds horribly evil lol
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Yo, kurumi, let's have a non-troll convo for a bit. You need only 5 votes to activate your ability? Or do you want to be lynched? Pls explain exactly what you need and the advantages of providing it to you for town.
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Come on man, do you really think supersoft's role was useful enough for him to sacrifice Tackster instead of himself? An alignment check for Mafia and 1 KP the entire game.
And no, people were suspecting YM. supersoft could easily have cleared himself by saying he thought YM was scum, I doubt he would have been lynched for it. And in any case, 100% chance of losing a Mafia (Tackster) and still having the lynch open vs less than 100% chance of losing a Mafia (if supersoft was Mafia, and no guarantee supersoft would have been lynched) and tying up the lynch, it's obvious that supersoft acted with only Pro Town intentions. If you were so willing to believe Fishball was Town because of some Meta reasons (oh when he's not Town then he kills me) then I can't see any reason you can't believe supersoft is Town for much more solid reasons.
My vote's staying on BC. Your OMGUS (Vigs kill everyone who is voting for me) doesn't help.
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On July 27 2011 02:01 sandroba wrote:
Can people get behind this plan:
We check Jackal58. If he turns up green we pimp him up with items.
We lynch Drazerk who is useless and trolling.
Yah this needs to happen, or else Jackal should hang.
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EPT
