EPTTL Mafia XXXI - Page 43
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drag_
England425 Posts
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Pandain
United States12984 Posts
On October 09 2010 01:40 CynanMachae wrote: I voted for Pandain because I believed him to be suspect at that point. I didn't vote for Crisis_ to save myself either because I didn't think the votes against me were that threatening, since they all happened earlier on and most of the later discussion were on other suspects. As for my yesterday's inactivity (which people pointed out), I already said that I didn't post because of BM's crap and there was only a bunch of useless posts for pretty much the last 5-6 pages when I last caught up. If anyone is going to blame me for not taking part in that then go ahead. I'm not convinced we are going to have that much information for double lynches tomorrow. I'm going through the posts of each player one at a time, so far in my pro-town players I have LSB, Amber[Light], kingjames and on my red suspects I have BM, Pandain and Crisis_ The thing is, there were less than three hours to go. And instead of saving yourself, you voted a person who was sure not to get lynched. In fact, you even suspect Crisis now and yet you didn't vote for him. So, here's what we can deduce from that 1.You didn't feel threatened. Commentary: But why is this? There were less than three hours to go. So I think it's a viable assumption to say you felt that another person would spring up. And in fact, in the last 3 hours Proctat got 5 votes. Suspicious, much? It's suspicious enough that I declare a Panda Investigative Decree that enables me to look through your posts without a warrant. On October 04 2010 15:13 CynanMachae wrote: Well if random pick is chosen, how would you suggest doing it so that it's fair and objective? And Misder, there isn't really much red hunting possible on the first day... Small post, doesn't really say anything. All this says is "I don't know what to do. You tell me." While that's okay for newer players to an extent, Cynan has played several games before. This isn't neccesarily bad, sprouting ideas, but it isn't that good either. On October 06 2010 02:13 CynanMachae wrote: At least you could get my name right  (but I would blame it on that list <<)And whoever said that I haven't posted, I did. It wasn't anytihng much useful but still. I didn't say you can't do anything, but yes, one the first day it's very hard to find much because if red play somewhat semi-decently there isn't enough speculation around to have enough hints that someone is red. But sure if you have any suspisions share them. I'm going to vote for an inactive as well, I don't like the random method, cause it does seems to me that its kinda hard to achieve anything with that. And like DrH said, saying that we are voting for an inactive force them to post, and force them to put stuff around that can be analyzed if they are indeed red. Voting agaisnt random doesn't accomplish anything cause it doesn't force them to do anything, just wait. Several things wrong with this. First, he doesn't do what he says. "1.I'm going to vote for an inactive." 8 hours later he votes for me. Now, he's already said that he doesn't think theres going to be enough speculation. And it's not too far a stretch to say that he may have found enough evidence on me to indicate I might be mafia. Really the only thign he contributes here is "Voting against random doesn't accomplish anything cause it doesn't force them to do anything." Anything else he doesn't do, repeats what others said, or states the obvious. On October 06 2010 10:22 CynanMachae wrote: Wow, am I really leading in votes so far? Lynching me would really be a bad idea. I agree with all of you that Padain's posting is a bit weird on defending me, since he can't know that I'm not mafia from my 2 posts and saying I'm playing the same as usual is really not much cause I don't think I've even changed my playstyle much in games were I was mafia, and these two posts really don't say anything right now. So, since Padain can't know I'm not mafia (no detective play yet), the only way that he can be sure that I'm town is if he's mafia himself. He's probably hoping I do get lynched and can play the "told you so" card then. Not that I think it's a wise decision for a mafia but else I don't see why he would be defending me. The only reason I would see is if he believed we should lynch people that are more inactive, but he didn't seem to suggest that. This is perhaps one of the most interesting posts. Now, let's analyze some stuff. Lynching me would be a really bad idea. Woah... was that a soft blue claim? Or was it just saying "im townie so don't lynch me. " This is something that must be noted. However, if he's blue, and he's on the lynch, then why is he voting for me? Him and crisis are tied at 3 votes, and if he's blue why doesn't he saeve himself? He's already noted he's tied for leading in votes. That doesn't make sense.Also in this post he leaps to several conclusions that do not spring from the facts. Let's see what he says 1. "Pandain knows I'm town, therefore he must be mafia. " Whats wrong: First off, I don't know your town. I was merely stating that you have been playing along with your normal behavior in previous games. On October 06 2010 05:56 Pandain wrote:. However, I should point out that I did not say Cynan was innocent, rather that we don't have enough evidence to lynch him. On October 06 2010 05:27 Pandain wrote: I don't count Cynan as inactive and Nobody should vote for him because his actions thus far are in accordance with his previous play. That's not to say I'm not watching him(I am) but he's not that suspicious to me. I clearly state my reasons for stating them, and it is because he was consistent with his previous play. Second off, does analysis play no role in determining if someone is mafia? You seem to have left that out. Cynan's post here does not make sense from a self serving perspective or a logical perspective and really only comes to light if he's mafia. 2."Pandain wants to get me lynched so he can build town cred." He's probably hoping I do get lynched and can play the "told you so" card then. Not that I think it's a wise decision for a mafia but else I don't see why he would be defending me. Whats wrong: How would defending you when you only had two votes at the time help get you lynched? That doesn't make any sense. On October 07 2010 17:02 CynanMachae wrote: God, what the hell is this, this isn't gonna go anywhere, guys you should just ignore BM -_- *yawn* On October 09 2010 01:40 CynanMachae wrote: I voted for Pandain because I believed him to be suspect at that point. I didn't vote for Crisis_ to save myself either because I didn't think the votes against me were that threatening, since they all happened earlier on and most of the later discussion were on other suspects. As for my yesterday's inactivity (which people pointed out), I already said that I didn't post because of BM's crap and there was only a bunch of useless posts for pretty much the last 5-6 pages when I last caught up. If anyone is going to blame me for not taking part in that then go ahead. I'm not convinced we are going to have that much information for double lynches tomorrow. I'm going through the posts of each player one at a time, so far in my pro-town players I have LSB, Amber[Light], kingjames and on my red suspects I have BM, Pandain and Crisis_ Alright last non-spam post by him. First off, you didn't say you didn't post because of BM's waste, don't make that up. And due to the soft claim blue it seems, I'm suprised you didn't find it that threatening WITH ONLY 3 HOURS TO GO! Also now he's not votin gdouble lynch, which is extremely anti town because 1.It allows BM the VI/ BM the Mafia to possibly live through the night if no vigi. 2. We WILL have enough info already, look at all this debate we have. Cynan is Mafia | ||
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Pandain
United States12984 Posts
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kingjames01
Canada1603 Posts
+ Show Spoiler + On October 02 2010 01:59 kingjames01 wrote: Nice, I think Sunday night will be okay for me. I'm going to be doing a lot of travelling these upcoming two weeks... I'll be flying out to Germany tomorrow, then to Denmark on Monday, back to Germany on Thursday and finally back to Canada on the 13th. Looking through a bunch of previous games it seems like there's a lot of work involved but I'll be as active as possible around my work. Hopefully, I won't get put on the ban list! =) On October 02 2010 06:28 Divinek wrote: oh dear i hope that's not an inactivity excuse waiting to happen On October 02 2010 06:43 kingjames01 wrote: What do you think I should do? I'm not going to use it as an excuse and I will accept any punishment I earn. I really will try my best but if you think I'm going to hamper the game, then please let me know and I will sit this one out. I've never played before and it seemed like something I would really enjoy but at the same time I understand team games and the importance of contributions from every single player so at this point I will follow any advice anyone cares to give. On October 02 2010 07:05 Divinek wrote: it's all if you think you can be active enough lol. Really you would probably only need to dedicate maybe an hour a day, during day cycles, to the game to be perfectly active enough. On October 02 2010 07:43 BrownBear wrote: If you can show up every cycle, read the posts, make an informed decision, and vote, it shouldn't be a problem. If you can't do that, you might want to consider waiting until the next game. On October 02 2010 08:18 kingjames01 wrote: Well, I definitely can make time for at least an hour each day since I'm really enthusiastic about trying out this game. =) The day cycles are going to be 48 hours in length so that will give me plenty of opportunity to stay current with the progress of the game. Now, these are two posts that I made in-game. Note that for emphasis, I bolded some of the text. + Show Spoiler + On October 06 2010 07:43 kingjames01 wrote: Honestly, what we're doing here casts suspicion on both of us. You're accusing me of accusing you of accusing me of... =) I already explained my actions/intentions/decision above and I have a presentation to give to the community early in the morning so I can't really stick around. I'll leave you with one question though. With my actions, I've generated discussion and content. This increases the chance to flush out any mafia. What have you done? On October 08 2010 18:51 kingjames01 wrote: Okay, I've been in the air travelling for the past day and I just caught up on the thread. Holy crap there's a lot going on. First off, I want to remind everyone to RELAX! It is totally in our best interest to be calm, methodical and analytical. It's clear to me that the first day has really rattled people and the more we add to it, the more chances mafia has to manipulate us. Especially if they can get people to bandwagon a non-red and then hide in the confusion. At this moment, since I only know what I am, I suspect everyone. I think this is my best strategy to survive long enough to make good decisions. Anyway, I'd like to sum up the voting from the first day and what information I can glean out of it. Please add to, refute, expand or whatever to this discussion: - The first day we lynched the Village Idiot, Protactinium. What can we learn? - There were 5 mafia and 20 non-mafia to begin the game - Protactinium was the Village Idiot and thus non-mafia - Mafia knew that he was non-mafia but not which role and thus a candidate to vote for the lynch - 6 votes went to Protactinium so at most 5 votes came from the mafia Now, I'd like to suggest that we look really closely at Crisis_, CynanMachae, ghrur and infinitestory. I will show why in the following discussion. To further my case I present the order of voting: + Show Spoiler + Bill Murray October 05 2010 12:12. ##vote: protactinium Cumulative Votes: (24:48 remaining) Protactinium 1 ~OpZ~ October 05 2010 12:51. ##Vote Crisis_ Cumulative Votes: (24:09 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 1 Amber[LighT] October 05 2010 22:29. ##vote: Bill Murray Cumulative Votes: (14:31 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 1 Bill Murray - 1 BrownBear October 06 2010 01:33. Vote count has been updated. 11.5 hours remaining in this day cycle. Divinek October 06 2010 01:59. ##vote cynanmachine Cumulative Votes: (11:01 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 1 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 1 NukeTheBunnys October 06 2010 02:08. ##vote cynanmachine Cumulative Votes: (10:52 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 1 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 2 SouthRawrea October 06 2010 05:07. ##vote Divinek Cumulative Votes: (7:53 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 1 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 2 Divinek - 1 Pandain October 06 2010 05:31. ##Vote Xelin Cumulative Votes: (7:29 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 1 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 2 Divinek - 1 XeliN - 1 kingjames01 October 06 2010 05:34. ##Vote Crisis_ Cumulative Votes: (7:26 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 2 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 2 Divinek - 1 XeliN - 1 meeple October 06 2010 05:42. ##Vote Cynanmachae Cumulative Votes: (7:18 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 2 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 XeliN - 1 drag_ October 06 2010 05:57. ##Vote: kingjames01 Cumulative Votes: (7:03 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 2 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 XeliN - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Pandain October 06 2010 05:57. ##Unvote (XeliN) ##Vote Infunidibulum Cumulative Votes: (7:03 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 2 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 DoctorHelvetica October 06 2010 06:00. ##Vote JeeJee Cumulative Votes: (7:00 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 2 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 JeeJee - 1 DoctorHelvetica October 06 2010 09:08. I'm changing my vote: (##Unvote JeeJee) ##Vote Crisis_ Cumulative Votes: (3:52 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 Misder October 06 2010 09:20. ##Vote ~Opz~ Cumulative Votes: (3:40 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Bill Murray October 06 2010 09:35. ##confirm vote: protactinium (No change) Cumulative Votes: (3:25 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 CynanMachae October 06 2010 10:18. ##Vote Padain Cumulative Votes: (2:42 remaining) Protactinium - 1 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 ghrur October 06 2010 10:36. ##vote protactinium Cumulative Votes: (2:24 remaining) Protactinium - 2 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 infinitestory October 06 2010 10:49. ##vote proactinium Cumulative Votes: (2:11 remaining) Protactinium - 3 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 Protactinium October 06 2010 10:59. ##Vote: XeliN Cumulative Votes: (2:01 remaining) Protactinium - 3 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 XeliN - 1 BrownBear October 06 2010 11:04. Vote Count Updated. 2 hours to go. Lot of you haven't voted yet. cSc October 06 2010 11:07. ##vote bumatlarge Cumulative Votes: (1:53 remaining) Protactinium - 3 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 XeliN - 1 bumatlarge - 1 SiNiquity October 06 2010 11:14. ##vote protactinium Cumulative Votes: (1:46 remaining) Protactinium - 4 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 XeliN - 1 bumatlarge - 1 Pandain October 06 2010 11:25. ##Unvote (XeliN) (##)Vote Sinquity Cumulative Votes: (1:35 remaining) Protactinium - 4 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 3 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 bumatlarge - 1 SINiquity - 1 BrownBear October 06 2010 11:25. VOTE UPDATED. YOU HAVE ONE HOUR NukeTheBunnys October 06 2010 12:07. changing vote (##Unvote CynanMachae) ##vote Protactinium Cumulative Votes: (0:53 remaining) Protactinium - 5 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 2 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 bumatlarge - 1 SINiquity - 1 Infundibulum October 06 2010 12:11. ##vote ghrur Cumulative Votes: (0:49 remaining) Protactinium - 5 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 2 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 bumatlarge - 1 SINiquity - 1 ghrur - 1 Crisis_ October 06 2010 12:16. ##Vote Protactinium Cumulative Votes: (0:44 remaining) Protactinium - 6 Crisis_ - 3 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 2 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 bumatlarge - 1 SINiquity - 1 ghrur - 1 Protactinium October 06 2010 12:29. ##Vote: Crisis_ Cumulative Votes: (0:31 remaining) Protactinium - 6 Crisis_ - 4 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 2 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 bumatlarge - 1 SINiquity - 1 ghrur - 1 infinitestory October 06 2010 12:34. ##Unvote (Protactinium) ##Vote: JeeJee Cumulative Votes: (0:26 remaining) Protactinium - 5 Crisis_ - 4 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 2 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 bumatlarge - 1 SINiquity - 1 ghrur - 1 JeeJee - 1 BrownBear October 06 2010 12:40. Votes updated for the last time before the end of the day. If you haven't voted yet, you need to do so IMMEDIATELY or risk modkill. bumatlarge October 06 2010 12:57. ##vote protactinium Cumulative Votes: (0:03 remaining) Protactinium - 6 Crisis_ - 4 Bill Murray - 1 CynanMachae - 2 Divinek - 1 kingjames01 - 1 Infundibulum - 1 ~OpZ~ - 1 Pandain - 1 bumatlarge - 1 SINiquity - 1 ghrur - 1 JeeJee - 1 BrownBear October 06 2010 13:00. DAY HAS ENDED. Protactinium is to be lynched. Night post coming soon. What I have noticed while summarizing this information: - Protactinium only had 1 vote until less than 3 hours remaining - Bill Murray voted first for Protactinium with almost 25 hours remaining - When the votes started coming in for Protactinium, two players were at-risk of being lynched: Crisis_ and CynanMachae with 3 votes each - CynanMachae had received his 3rd vote first thus placing him on the chopping block according to the rule clarified by Artanis[Xp] mid-game After this point, the order of voting was: - CynanMachae ##Vote Padain (2:42 remaining) Comment: You were in the lead and headed to the gallows. With only 2:42 left before nightfall, why did you not vote for Crisis_ so that you were not in the lead??? Is it possible that you DON'T want Crisis_ to be lynched? - ghrur ##vote protactinium (2:24 remaining) - infinitestory ##vote proactinium (2:11 remaining) Comment: Twenty minutes apart, two votes come in to make 3 players tied in votes. Interesting. Coincidence or not? I will continue and see if a pattern emerges. Protactinium ##Vote: XeliN (2:01 remaining) Comment: Protactinium has to opportunity to push either Crisis_ or CynanMachae further to the front of the line but declines. We understand this action afterwards when it is revealed that Protactinium is indeed the Village Idiot. (Well played, you cunning bastard.) cSc ##vote bumatlarge (1:53 remaining) Comment: Voted for a Green (which we only find out the next day) SiNiquity ##vote protactinium (1:46 remaining) Comment: New leader in the votes Pandain ##Unvote (XeliN) (##)Vote Sinquity (1:35 remaining) NukeTheBunnys changing vote (##Unvote CynanMachae) ##vote Protactinium (0:53 remaining) Comment: NukeTheBunnys removes CynanMachae out of the running to be lynched and moves Protactinium ahead of Crisis_. Now, even if Crisis_ receives an extra vote, Protactinium will still be lynched since he reached 4 votes first. This seems to be in line with CynanMachae's earlier play. Infundibulum ##vote ghrur (0:49 remaining) Comment: Infundibulum turns out to be a Green and so there is no malice in this vote. Crisis_ ##Vote Protactinium (0:44 remaining) Comment: This vote could be made to save himself even though he is behind at this point. Again, this seems to be along the same thought process as CynanMachae's earlier vote. Protactinium ##Vote: Crisis_ (0:31 remaining) Comment: It seems as though Protactinium got away with voting twice. infinitestory ##Unvote (Protactinium) ##Vote: JeeJee (0:26 remaining) Comment: If I were to analyze this vote in terms of what has been written above, then it seems now that Protactinium is ahead in the voting and neither CynanMachae nor Crisis_ are at risk, infinitestory retracts his earlier vote and votes for someone who can not be lynched with only 1 vote. Why waste your vote with less than half an hour left? Is this coincidence or is this a purposeful move to cover your earlier vote? bumatlarge ##vote protactinium (0:03 remaining) Comment: bumatlarge turns out to be a Green and so there is no malice in this vote. I haven't had time to fully go through the thread to find more connections between the suspicious voters yet so I'm asking for help. If anyone finds clues linking these players, post them. We don't have much time left in this day. If we can double-lynch 2 Reds before the night they will only have 1 kill. Good luck to us all. =) Finally, I urge again for everyone to not vote in the heat of the moment but to apply reasoning so that your vote is not wasted. Now take another look at my periods of inactivity and let these posts speak for themselves. | ||
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CynanMachae
Canada1459 Posts
On October 09 2010 03:22 Pandain wrote: The thing is, there were less than three hours to go. And instead of saving yourself, you voted a person who was sure not to get lynched. In fact, you even suspect Crisis now and yet you didn't vote for him. So, here's what we can deduce from that 1.You didn't feel threatened. Commentary: But why is this? There were less than three hours to go. So I think it's a viable assumption to say you felt that another person would spring up. And in fact, in the last 3 hours Proctat got 5 votes. Suspicious, much? So you are basically saying that out of the 4 mafias leftover (since i would be the 5th one), I knew that they would swing it over by all voting for someone else and saving me? Seems a pretty dumb mafia move right there with the 6 voters on Protactanium and bumatlarge being a confirmed green. I didn't feel threatened cause the 3 votes I had happened very early on with quite bad reasons and the rest of the thread was about others suspects/inactives pretty much. 3 hours is quite a lot of time if I come back and see I'm getting the rest of the votes. On October 09 2010 03:22 Pandain wrote: Small post, doesn't really say anything. All this says is "I don't know what to do. You tell me." While that's okay for newer players to an extent, Cynan has played several games before. This isn't neccesarily bad, sprouting ideas, but it isn't that good either. Lol it looks like that to you? kay On October 09 2010 03:22 Pandain wrote: Several things wrong with this. First, he doesn't do what he says. "1.I'm going to vote for an inactive." 8 hours later he votes for me. Now, he's already said that he doesn't think theres going to be enough speculation. And it's not too far a stretch to say that he may have found enough evidence on me to indicate I might be mafia. Really the only thign he contributes here is "Voting against random doesn't accomplish anything cause it doesn't force them to do anything." Anything else he doesn't do, repeats what others said, or states the obvious. So, basically, when someones change his mind, he's mafia right? You might want to look at the vote history again and see who talked about voting for an inactive at some point and then who they voted for. On October 09 2010 03:22 Pandain wrote: This is perhaps one of the most interesting posts. Now, let's analyze some stuff. Woah... was that a soft blue claim? Or was it just saying "im townie so don't lynch me. " This is something that must be noted. However, if he's blue, and he's on the lynch, then why is he voting for me? Him and crisis are tied at 3 votes, and if he's blue why doesn't he saeve himself? He's already noted he's tied for leading in votes. That doesn't make sense. See earlier in my post. On October 09 2010 03:22 Pandain wrote: Also in this post he leaps to several conclusions that do not spring from the facts. Let's see what he says 1. "Pandain knows I'm town, therefore he must be mafia. " Whats wrong: First off, I don't know your town. I was merely stating that you have been playing along with your normal behavior in previous games. I clearly state my reasons for stating them, and it is because he was consistent with his previous play. Second off, does analysis play no role in determining if someone is mafia? You seem to have left that out. Cynan's post here does not make sense from a self serving perspective or a logical perspective and really only comes to light if he's mafia. 2."Pandain wants to get me lynched so he can build town cred." Whats wrong: How would defending you when you only had two votes at the time help get you lynched? That doesn't make any sense. Yup, that's exactly what my conclusion were, that you MUST be mafia cause you KNOW I'm town Yup you got me, scummy post right there. On October 09 2010 03:22 Pandain wrote: Alright last non-spam post by him. First off, you didn't say you didn't post because of BM's waste, don't make that up. And due to the soft claim blue it seems, I'm suprised you didn't find it that threatening WITH ONLY 3 HOURS TO GO! Lol, you just quoted my post about that, just look it up. Let's word it up better tho: I said that there was only BM's crap around when I came to post, so I didn't post. | ||
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CynanMachae
Canada1459 Posts
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NukeTheBunnys
United States1004 Posts
On October 09 2010 03:19 XeliN wrote: Ok, This hypocrisy is rlly irritating me right now. You cannot get away with calling me out as being suspicious in this way. The only way I can respond to your post is by using a line of argument and subject matter that has been forbidden me. What Nuke is doing here IS continuing the banned subject matter in just the same way as I am alleged to be doing so. Surely I am not the only one that recognises this. To try to illustrate why, the response to this might show it better Nuke, explain fully what I am suspicious based on the reasons you stated, outline explicitely what you mean, the logical reasons why and the deductions you have drawn. First off its not hypocrisy. If I was making arguments about the syntax of PMs after brown bear banned it It would be hypocritical, but I am not. What I am making an argument about is how you continued to make a big deal about the syntax of PMs after brown bear banned it. In any case I will not make anymore arguments relating to anything about PMs for the rest of the game. The one biggest piece of evidence remaining after you disregard anything involving PM is this. On October 08 2010 05:22 XeliN wrote: I'll make a concise post addressing all of you wonderful people questioning me in a little bit, currently I am waiting on a piece of information. To briefly outline a few things however. I believe Bill to be 100% Green Town I am suspicious of the assertion that both Brown and Artanis sent out role PM's, my inclination is to think only Brown did My vote on Bloody was initially a more sincere one, now it is a placeholder whilst I evaluate, if it makes any of you feel more comfortable I'll change it to myself Divinek likes to say fuck Now if you agree, and think bill is just an annoying green then there is nothing really noteworthy about this post. If you disagree, like many players do, then it is quite interesting. First off everyone should always be suspicious of everyone else, and yet you are not. you are 100% sure that he is green. Even if you were the DT, you would not have investigated yet so you couldn't be sure. The only group of people that are sure about identities is the mafia are 100% sure who their allies are, so to me throwing your lots in with someone that strongly is quite suspicious. Now this alone is not enough to really get me hounding after your blood, and accusing you of being red. It is enough to get me to keep a very close eye on you and to try and get others to do so as well. | ||
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BrownBear
United States6894 Posts
On October 09 2010 03:58 CynanMachae wrote: Just a quick note Brownbear, I appear twice in the votes list in the Vote thread Lies! | ||
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On October 09 2010 03:22 Pandain wrote: The thing is, there were less than three hours to go. And instead of saving yourself, you voted a person who was sure not to get lynched. In fact, you even suspect Crisis now and yet you didn't vote for him. So, here's what we can deduce from that 1.You didn't feel threatened. Commentary: But why is this? There were less than three hours to go. So I think it's a viable assumption to say you felt that another person would spring up. And in fact, in the last 3 hours Proctat got 5 votes. Suspicious, much? It's suspicious enough that I declare a Panda Investigative Decree that enables me to look through your posts without a warrant. Small post, doesn't really say anything. All this says is "I don't know what to do. You tell me." While that's okay for newer players to an extent, Cynan has played several games before. This isn't neccesarily bad, sprouting ideas, but it isn't that good either. Several things wrong with this. First, he doesn't do what he says. "1.I'm going to vote for an inactive." 8 hours later he votes for me. Now, he's already said that he doesn't think theres going to be enough speculation. And it's not too far a stretch to say that he may have found enough evidence on me to indicate I might be mafia. Really the only thign he contributes here is "Voting against random doesn't accomplish anything cause it doesn't force them to do anything." Anything else he doesn't do, repeats what others said, or states the obvious. This is perhaps one of the most interesting posts. Now, let's analyze some stuff. Woah... was that a soft blue claim? Or was it just saying "im townie so don't lynch me. " This is something that must be noted. However, if he's blue, and he's on the lynch, then why is he voting for me? Him and crisis are tied at 3 votes, and if he's blue why doesn't he saeve himself? He's already noted he's tied for leading in votes. That doesn't make sense. Also in this post he leaps to several conclusions that do not spring from the facts. Let's see what he says 1. "Pandain knows I'm town, therefore he must be mafia. " Whats wrong: First off, I don't know your town. I was merely stating that you have been playing along with your normal behavior in previous games. I clearly state my reasons for stating them, and it is because he was consistent with his previous play. Second off, does analysis play no role in determining if someone is mafia? You seem to have left that out. Cynan's post here does not make sense from a self serving perspective or a logical perspective and really only comes to light if he's mafia. 2."Pandain wants to get me lynched so he can build town cred." Whats wrong: How would defending you when you only had two votes at the time help get you lynched? That doesn't make any sense. *yawn* Alright last non-spam post by him. First off, you didn't say you didn't post because of BM's waste, don't make that up. And due to the soft claim blue it seems, I'm suprised you didn't find it that threatening WITH ONLY 3 HOURS TO GO! Also now he's not votin gdouble lynch, which is extremely anti town because 1.It allows BM the VI/ BM the Mafia to possibly live through the night if no vigi. 2. We WILL have enough info already, look at all this debate we have. Cynan is Mafia What I find to be the most interesting aspect of this, is that although you defended him from a lynch he immediately jumped to attack you, this doesn't seem very reasonable to me. I'd rather vote for infinitestory or SINiquity right now. infinitestory started this game with bad arguments, admitted he cracked under pressure, admitted his arguments were bad, then continued the rest of the game contributing nothing and riding on the coattails of other peoples arguments. That's pretty scummy if you ask me. I'm going over SINiquitys posts right now. He hasn't argued even a single original thought but he did manage to spam the shit out of the thread for a while. Then he comes back with a huge long post trying to deflect attention back to Bill Murrays failed arguments, except he twisted the conclusions around to incriminate me and other players BM never accused in the first place. | ||
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Pandain
United States12984 Posts
On October 09 2010 03:56 CynanMachae wrote: So you are basically saying that out of the 4 mafias leftover (since i would be the 5th one), I knew that they would swing it over by all voting for someone else and saving me? Seems a pretty dumb mafia move right there with the 6 voters on Protactanium and bumatlarge being a confirmed green. I didn't feel threatened cause the 3 votes I had happened very early on with quite bad reasons and the rest of the thread was about others suspects/inactives pretty much. 3 hours is quite a lot of time if I come back and see I'm getting the rest of the votes. Actually, you voted for me less than an hour after BM started his crusade against Proctat. then one hour after your vote 3 people voted for Proctat. And I didn't say they had to all vote for them, that would be pretty dumb. Keeping in mind most of the votes were new players, its not suprising a late minute bandwagon could happen. On October 09 2010 03:56 CynanMachae wrote: So, basically, when someones change his mind, he's mafia right? You might want to look at the vote history again and see who talked about voting for an inactive at some point and then who they voted for. When I said that, I actually did that. Then a couple hours later I changed it with reasons why. You, however, never voted for an inactive. On October 09 2010 03:56 CynanMachae wrote: Lol, you just quoted my post about that, just look it up. Let's word it up better tho: I said that there was only BM's crap around when I came to post, so I didn't post. You say "guys wtf is happening just ignore him." You didn't say "I'm not going to talk until he stops." However, this is sufficient defense and enough of a response for me to withdraw my vote for the time being. I think the results of BM will help determine your alignment especially. | ||
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Pandain
United States12984 Posts
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On October 09 2010 04:13 Pandain wrote: Alright, I'll go over Infinitestory's posts too check out SINiquity as well, he's a pretty big blip on my radar right now | ||
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Pandain
United States12984 Posts
Summary: Infinitestory has been mostly pro town this game. He makes analysis, contributes to discussion, and offers his thoughts on certain things. While some posts in particular are suspect, overall they can be discounted as of now because of his other posts.I am uncertain about infinite story, but leaning towards green. With that, I do not think Infinitestory is a viable day 2 lynch. His posts this game: On October 06 2010 11:10 infinitestory wrote: I say in order to neutralize the village idiot, village makes a "deal" with mafia. Once the VI is made obvious, the villagers will announce that they will all vote to lynch VI if he is not mafia-killed overnight. Since the mafia aren't going to sit back and watch themselves lose, VI will be neutralized. If VI is NOT neutralized, either mafia lose, OR the "VI" is actually Godfather posing as VI; in the latter case, the villagers stand to gain a huge amount. Now that this plan has been announced, VI must try get himself lynched subtly or risk the above plan being put into action. Be cautious, guys. EDIT: i voted for proactinium because BrownBear did too  its the cool thing to doHis first post. Note the edit. He's new, so this can be okay though. Still suscipcious though. I don't like this plan, but that's because this plan revolves all around wifom. But that isn't bad in itself, but the wifom I see makes it bad to me. To me, mafia would just not kill the VI, and let the town try to lynch the VI. Would they actually do it? Still, it's not that bad. However, the edit is! Look at his reasoning, because "brownbear did too". It's someone other than brownbear, but the point is that that reason is just so horrible it stinks of za scum. On October 06 2010 11:19 infinitestory wrote: I stated the exact reason. If village threatens to kill village idiot, mafia's only option to stay in the game is to kill the village idiot at night. I know full well the win condition of the village idiot, and it is the EXACT reason the mafia should feel compelled to carry out the dirty work of removing him. oh, and i meant Bill Murray voted for you :/ I was feeling sad about having to vote on day 1 without evidence, but your reply which is a blatant invective rather than an attempt to cooperate/defend self has caused me to lose sympathy. I apologize if this is unfounded or wrong, but making personal attacks on each other in the beginning is one of the hallmarks of a player who is unhelpful in the long run, from my experience. This is what I dont like. Now he's changing his reason to he "blatantly attacked him." He's voting for him because he's mean. That's not a good reason. Also note that the supposed "invective" occured after he voted for him. Meaning that was not his original reason. DUN DUN DUN(can you tell I'm slightly hyper) On October 06 2010 11:38 infinitestory wrote: As long as the mafia are still in the game, they stand to lose by not night-killing the VI, regardless of whether it's also "the town's game to lose." To win, the mafia must remove both the VI and the town. A 1% chance to win the game is still preferable to simply losing. I know I've seen games where 1 mafia took out several town by himself with some clever lynch voting. :/ We should also try to start figuring out (if we've already done this, sorry, I just jumped in :/) what role Godfather is posing as, to help the DT do his job with the utmost accuracy. My first thought was that Godfather would pose as VI, and after that I can't decide which of the blue roles (barring DT of course) would be the most viable to pose as. Posing as bulletproof or veteran would cause the DT to defend him heavily against lynch kills, but I think the same probably applies for medic, mad hatter, and vigilante. Any other opinions? this is a pretty good post. what strikes me is he's continuing to try to push this plan, asking for opinions, which seems to me he wants to make it better. That strikes me as prot own. Also, he's trying to help by solving vital things, which while speculative, isn't scum like. This is pro town. On October 06 2010 11:45 infinitestory wrote: I guess my entire plan is based around the assumption that mafia doesn't want to lose, which isn't such a safe assumption at all apparently. I guess equally viable would be that the Vigilante nightkill the VI as soon as VI is revealed. Town really can't lose from killing VI at night, because either VI will go or Godfather will go, and they should both be priorities IMO. Starts to retract his idea, offers up that vigi kill VI(which is true.) Good so far. On October 06 2010 11:59 infinitestory wrote: I want to say that sacks a very valuable DT, but especially to reveal poisoner that's definitely worth it. I'm not so sure about revealing roleblocker, because roleblocker's own ability is far more situational to the reds. @Divinek: The primary reason is that the mafia do not win if town dies. If town loses by VI, mafia also loses by VI. Don't say you didn't consider that. Your counterargument was stated at least twice previously, and better ones have been suggested. Offers opinions and when/if DT shoudl reveal. I think it is some valid opinons. Right now I don't really see anything so bad about infinitestory. On October 06 2010 12:09 infinitestory wrote: Alright. I give up on my argument. I relent. I crack under pressure. Does that please you? What I intended was simply to get people thinking hard about how to get rid of VI, as he is a problem that must be solved through the cooperation of multiple roles. I guess you have an excellent reason for showing me up here, though. Shall we discuss something else now? gives up plan, its alright. I don't see why not following through on a plan is bad if its proven the plan is fundamentally flawed in some aspect. On October 06 2010 12:14 infinitestory wrote: He's worried that if Protact is mafia, the mafia will pull some shenanigans and change the leader away from him before lynch. Explains something. On October 06 2010 12:33 infinitestory wrote: I've been considering it, and I'm going to change my vote to make it as inconsequential as possible (voting for someone with few votes who is likely to be modkilled). I think I jumped the gun on this vote. I don't like this. changes his vote, and while he says he thinks he jumped the gun, voting for someone with few votes who will be modkilled just does not seem good to me. Maybe he's unconfident? Nonetheless, suspicious. On October 07 2010 12:09 infinitestory wrote: I think we should be careful of reading too much into who BrownBear subbed for. I don't know if we could confirm that BrownBear meant "role" as in actual blue/red, bar having a DT check some of the subs and Xelin. Drawing a conclusion like this might lead us down the wrong path with future lynches based on nonexistent evidence. I'm not saying throw this out, I'm saying be careful of putting too much stock into this. This will be a helpful event to keep in the back of our minds if future DT checks do seem to corroborate the theory, but for now, a DT check that turns up green and some questionable evidence isn't good enough for a Godfather confirmation, at least in my mind. Also, in response to LSB's (1) scenario, I have a question. This is my first game here, so those of you with extensive experience: If anything like the Godfather has been in previous games, has the Godfather-equivalent masqueraded as VI, Blue, or Green? If there hasn't been a Godfather equivalent in previous games, what do you all think the Godfather would pose as? Getting some solid ideas about Godfather's role will better equip our DT, in my opinion. I like this post. He does discount the possibility that BB's (slip?) means Xelin has a role, but he says we shouldn't take it as fact(aka, follow that "evidence" for a while.) Also, he's asking whether the GF has masqueraded as what before. On October 07 2010 13:40 infinitestory wrote: cSc's only got two posts in the thread since the game began, and judging from his activity and the content of his posts, I don't expect him to explain his vote for bumatlarge insightfully, if at all. His two posts: Yeah where is cSc? On October 07 2010 14:35 infinitestory wrote: my suspects HFT/BC - Probably top of my suspect list. The contradiction BM found in HFT's posts is pretty good evidence, although I'm less convinced about BC's "rolefishing." For new players, that honestly is pretty good advice. BM - I'm torn. He did "lose" us on the first day, but he also found an anti-town. He has been acting like a village idiot with his plan to weed out greens (which I believe doesn't make any sense), but he has also provided us with a solid lead for a suspect. I think his analysis for who's anti-town is valuable, so I wouldn't vote to leech him for now. Ghrur - He did vote for Protact, but he had a reasoned post, and I think he was simply duped by Protact. I don't think he was very scummy from what I saw. cSc - He's not so much a suspect as an inactive or a newbie; I don't know if he will post his logic for bumatlarge (if he had any) or if we will get anything out of it. Crisis - his "stuck between a rock and a hard place" is pretty odd, and this post: which was made AFTER he voted protact to put himself out of the lead is also questionable. My #2 suspect, and as OpZ said, definitely needs to be in a higher light. Dr. H - Looks like he really doesn't like Misder, but I can definitely see why. I wouldn't suspect him so much because his arguments have been pretty focused and reasonable. OpZ - Narrow your suspect list. It's obvious you're good at picking out odd posts, but I want to see your top few. This post is good. He makes analysis of people, with reasons backing it up. Don't see anything blaringly wrong with this analysis either. Then he hasn't posted for a while. I'd like him to do that more. | ||
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XeliN
United Kingdom1755 Posts
First off its not hypocrisy. If I was making arguments about the syntax of PMs after brown bear banned it It would be hypocritical, but I am not. What I am making an argument about is how you continued to make a big deal about the syntax of PMs after brown bear banned it. In any case I will not make anymore arguments relating to anything about PMs for the rest of the game. The one biggest piece of evidence remaining after you disregard anything involving PM is this. No you are not making any type of argument in the slightest. You are simply saying "this is suspicious" there is no argument there whatsoever. "What I am making is an argument about how you continued to...." where is the argument your making? the idea is that you are trying to establish that my involvement in the PM stuff somehow makes me suspicious in your eyes but in no way at all have you outlined an argument as to why this is On October 08 2010 05:22 XeliN wrote: I'll make a concise post addressing all of you wonderful people questioning me in a little bit, currently I am waiting on a piece of information. To briefly outline a few things however. I believe Bill to be 100% Green Town I am suspicious of the assertion that both Brown and Artanis sent out role PM's, my inclination is to think only Brown did My vote on Bloody was initially a more sincere one, now it is a placeholder whilst I evaluate, if it makes any of you feel more comfortable I'll change it to myself Divinek likes to say fuck Now if you agree, and think bill is just an annoying green then there is nothing really noteworthy about this post. If you disagree, like many players do, then it is quite interesting. First off everyone should always be suspicious of everyone else, and yet you are not. you are 100% sure that he is green. Even if you were the DT, you would not have investigated yet so you couldn't be sure. The only group of people that are sure about identities is the mafia are 100% sure who their allies are, so to me throwing your lots in with someone that strongly is quite suspicious. Now this alone is not enough to really get me hounding after your blood, and accusing you of being red. It is enough to get me to keep a very close eye on you and to try and get others to do so as well. [/QUOTE] I have already mentioned why I consider bill to be town aligned. If you disagree with my reasoning where I outlined why then respond to it. Don't just state "Considering anyone town is suspicious, you should be suspicious of everyone" and ignore the reasons I have given as to how I arrived at this position. (ofc you should be ignoring the reasons why I arrived at this position due to them being outlawed but therin lies my point that you are, perhaps inadvertantly, continuing the banned stuff by posting what you have) | ||
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XeliN
United Kingdom1755 Posts
First off its not hypocrisy. If I was making arguments about the syntax of PMs after brown bear banned it It would be hypocritical, but I am not. What I am making an argument about is how you continued to make a big deal about the syntax of PMs after brown bear banned it. In any case I will not make anymore arguments relating to anything about PMs for the rest of the game. The one biggest piece of evidence remaining after you disregard anything involving PM is this. No you are not making any type of argument in the slightest. You are simply saying "this is suspicious" there is no argument there whatsoever. "What I am making is an argument about how you continued to...." where is the argument your making? the idea is that you are trying to establish that my involvement in the PM stuff somehow makes me suspicious in your eyes but in no way at all have you outlined an argument as to why this is Now if you agree, and think bill is just an annoying green then there is nothing really noteworthy about this post. If you disagree, like many players do, then it is quite interesting. First off everyone should always be suspicious of everyone else, and yet you are not. you are 100% sure that he is green. Even if you were the DT, you would not have investigated yet so you couldn't be sure. The only group of people that are sure about identities is the mafia are 100% sure who their allies are, so to me throwing your lots in with someone that strongly is quite suspicious. Now this alone is not enough to really get me hounding after your blood, and accusing you of being red. It is enough to get me to keep a very close eye on you and to try and get others to do so as well. I have already mentioned why I consider bill to be town aligned. If you disagree with my reasoning where I outlined why then respond to it. Don't just state "Considering anyone town is suspicious, you should be suspicious of everyone" and ignore the reasons I have given as to how I arrived at this position. (ofc you should be ignoring the reasons why I arrived at this position due to them being outlawed but therin lies my point that you are, perhaps inadvertantly, continuing the banned stuff by posting what you have) | ||
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Pandain
United States12984 Posts
I'd like to get some posts outside that controversy | ||
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Protactinium
Canada550 Posts
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XeliN
United Kingdom1755 Posts
At best you've outlined inconsistency in what he's posted, but going from that to the claim he is definately mafia is quite a stretch to me and I'm abit suprised you've jumped to the assumption. This is purely in response to your analysis on him, I'm not saying I consider to be, or not to be mafia. | ||
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Pandain
United States12984 Posts
On October 09 2010 05:00 XeliN wrote: Well one thing I will say is that I do not think the arguments, or perhaps analysis is a better term, you have layed out is enough to warrant the conclusion Cynan is mafia At best you've outlined inconsistency in what he's posted, but going from that to the claim he is definately mafia is quite a stretch to me and I'm abit suprised you've jumped to the assumption. This is purely in response to your analysis on him, I'm not saying I consider to be, or not to be mafia. Yeah I get quite worked up when I write analysis. One of my faults, I may become blind to certani aspects. He layed out some good defenses so I'm going to vote someone else, as I've said. | ||
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Pandain
United States12984 Posts
On October 09 2010 04:24 DoctorHelvetica wrote: check out SINiquity as well, he's a pretty big blip on my radar right now I won't do any hardcore analysis since they are quite tiring and he has alot of posts. Most of them are short however. Things I do notice are he hasn't really contributed that much, most of his posts are 2-3 sentences, and the only big post was his last one which was disproved. The one thing that struck out to me was he voted for Protact because he wouldn't reveal who he was smurfing as. Lynching a person that had made pro town posts(in my opinion) and was obviously going to be an active contributor because of such a reason stuck out to me. Really I'd like to see him post more before making a decision. Right now I think we need to make a choice between Xelin and Misder, and everyone needs to vote double lynch. Also where did south go? | ||
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