EPTNewbie Mini Mafia XLIV - Page 25
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Koshi
Belgium38797 Posts
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Rainbows
Germany1217 Posts
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Rainbows
Germany1217 Posts
On July 14 2013 01:51 StiMaDDict wrote: *sigh I fucked up. @Chromatically: You let me down and I let you down. I don't really know. I had a shitty day. I was pissed off at other things and I tried to let my stresses go away by posting on here. Then you blew it. Your nitpicking on whether I was angry or not and whether I was lying or not was really under my expectation. I think I gave you WAY TOO much credit from last game. Also you keep saying that I can't explain my so-called lie, but I did, god damn it. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 12:19 StiMaDDict wrote: This. Pretty much repeating what Xzavier did in the last game, calling everyone retard, was from me being genuinely mad. Overall attitude in my posts and impolite words in them were for the purpose I have stated. Do note: I'm not a good actor and I am not sure whether there was a clear boundary between me being mad because of quotes and spoilers and pretending to be mad at Rainbow. I was not bothered by Rainbow's pressure to put it simply and it is not in my best interest to lie about this. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 12:24 StiMaDDict wrote: My previous post looks confusing. 1) I was mad at messing up posts but not at Rainbow 2) My anger reflected on my posts 3) Later when I realized that my posts were angry sounding I gave them purposes and maintain similar style. I hope this explains it better. Not sure if this is a relevant topic though. First one wasn't clear enough so I wrote the second. I had a shitty day, alright, so I wrote some cuss words on the Internet. It wasn't something that I was proud of but it happened. So I tried to cover it up as if it was intentional with purposes and purposes they did accomplished. If you want to argue about when I came up with the idea, well, why don't dissect my brain and see. Gosh, you pissed me off. @jkirby: What you doing? + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 07:41 jrkirby wrote: Ok. I've been studying this long and hard, and I think I have enough evidence to make a clear case. hzflank is scum Clearly, hzflank is lying about this compliment. Liars are always scum. And look who he's talking to: the scum coach. Obviously he's in league with them. He goes on, still talking to the scum: This is an obvious admission that he wants town to die. Anyone who wants town to die is scum, end of story. I will. Right here, right now. And for his first post: He's trying to get us to sheep together and follow a Bandwagon instead of looking for evidence and finding scum. Finally: Trying to defend one of the scum who is planning to lurk. You can't ignore all this evidence guys. hzflank is scum. ##Vote: hzflank He makes a pressure vote on hzflank and he never followed up on it at all. Yes, it did create a discussion between Rainbow and I, but not much from hzflank. He never provided his motive, explanation, or response after he made that one post. We know he was around when Rainbow and I were duking it out. Am I the only crazy one here and it's a normal thing to do with a pressure vote? If the purpose of the pressure vote is create a discussion why didn't he take a part? He takes it down couple of pages later basic saying that it didn't do much except getting some discussion. jkirby on Hurricane is basically this in my eyes: Your first post makes you look town. I think you post this AS A SCUM. If you are not, then show us your other post. Darn, it's too late now. I follow the thought process but it doesn't do much. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 09:35 jrkirby wrote: "For all we know, THIS could be his scum post." That's exactly what I was trying to get information on. Here was my reasoning: if this is his scum post, then he won't HAVE a real scum post. But it's been long enough that he could've written another one by now, so no point in pushing it anymore. No, this is my second game, kinda. This starts jkirby's trend of hedging. He drops the pressure as soon as he feels as it has been too long and Sponge could've written a copy. He doesn't say Sponge is a town or scum because of this, which I find disturbing. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 09:46 jrkirby wrote: Me - "It's been long enough that he could've written another one by now." If he had posted one immediately after I had asked it means something different than if he posts one an hour or two after I asked. Superfluous's post & lurk is bad, but give him a bit, he might show back up. Umasi feels the same way it seems. Another excuse and nothing to indicate how he feels about Sponge as a result. The bold part is another hedging. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 09:58 jrkirby wrote: I think it's foolish to PLAN to not lynch day one. But if I have a choice of lynching someone that I townread, and lynching no one, I will try to lynch no one. I hope other people would follow suit. This is his opinion. I don't agree with persay but it isn't really alignment indicative. It isn't a strong expression of opinion to be honest, just a "wish" (I added this because I didn't want to only pick out scummy things jkirby said and ignore rest of his filter) + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 10:13 jrkirby wrote: Koshi Xzavier Nightcat99 Gotard cloud-9 These players haven't posted anything/enough in my opinion. It's only been a couple hours, so you might be asleep/ at work. But just a PSA, these are currently "lurkers". Doesn't reveal his view on lurkers but just "throw" the topic of lurkers out on the table. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 10:22 jrkirby wrote: Well, this game is majority lynch, so voting for the "scummiest" person could be what causes a lynch not to happen. I'm pretty sure scum wouldn't mind lynching town either. General common sense. It's just me but I don't like this semi-joking statement. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 10:32 jrkirby wrote: Honestly? I have real trouble seeing scum until I see voting patterns. I'm slightly more suspicious of Sponge, Umasi, and Rainbows than the rest. Sponge I've stated my reasons for. I don't really trust my read on Rainbows because [meta here] I thought he was scum last time I played with him and he wasn't. Umasi just reads a bit ornery, so that could be the reason for my weak read. My vote on hzflank was kinda a combo of joke/pressure as you guys pointed out. It got a bit of discussion, but didn't get much of a rise out of hzflank, who I currently have null read on. I guess I should unvote him now, since the pressure obviously didn't do too much. ##unvote: hzflank A list of suspicion list that doesn't have "legitimate" reasons or evidence. So he does feel suspicious about Sponge afterall about him not sharing his opening post in time, I'm assuming. About Rainbow, I am not sure. He words in a confusing way. In last game, jkirby thought Rainbow was scum but he was a town. So in this game he thinks Rainbow is a town but he could be a scum or vise versa? Concerning Umasi, his reasoning it not satisfying either. Also he doubts his ability to read other people. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 11:03 Chromatically wrote: Why are you suspicious of Rainbows? What do you think about Super? Chromatically followed up asking why jkirby is suspicious of Rainbow and what he thinks of Super. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 11:56 StiMaDDict wrote: Waiting on jkirby's response to Chromatically's question. I had same question as Chromatically and brought it back up. At the end, he still hasn't answered it at the time of me posting this. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 10:47 jrkirby wrote: Anyone think this could be a scumslip? He seems the kind that might want to subtly brag about it if he were scum. I can never figure out when people are joking and not. This is just really fucking weak and gets on my nerve. If it is a joke, then fuck me. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 10:58 jrkirby wrote: He said he couldn't be in here at the beginning before the game started, right? No real reason to have suspicion on the lurkers yet, just note that they're lurking. This is pretty fucking bad. Protecting a lurker when he was the one to bring up the topic at all. I don't know what he is trying to do, but then again, I'm fucked up pretty hard with my playstyle.. Anyway, protecting not just one lurker but pretty much all of them and making an excuse for them makes me think he is a scum. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 13:21 jrkirby wrote: Cool it dude. For all you know, the people voting for you could be scum trying to get you riled up. Just calm down, post reads, question things, and have a good game. You won't play your best when you're tilting. You're in no way doomed right now. I guess I should thanks for his kind words (?) but as Chromatically has pointed out, he is trying to pat me on the head as if he is saying, "Chromatically and Umasi could scum you know. Come here, you poor baby." + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 13:31 jrkirby wrote: 2 votes land on a guy is quick succession, I'd be stupid if I weren't at least a BIT suspicious. As far as I can tell, stim is just acting like a bit of an idiot, is flustered, and frustrated. Doesn't seem like scumtell to me. You're free to have your vote, and I don't have a solid scumread on either of you, but I will be looking a bit more closely at your filters. No stand or point whatsoever. I'm not a scum. Chromatically and Umasi are not scum, but they are "bit" suspicious. What is your stance man? Stop hedging. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 13:38 jrkirby wrote: I don't think he's town. I think he's stupid, and have a nullread. Well thanks, I think I'm stupid too. I'm not a town but you have a nullread on me? What was the purpose of writing above two posts then? Confused and scummy. I am not liking how he is dealing with me blowing up. He seems to be neither or both defending and pressuring in this situation. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 13:42 jrkirby wrote: I don't think he's thinking through what he's saying. His actions don't seem town because they're foolish from every way you look at them. But that doesn't make him clearly scum. Hedging. Period. Conclusion: jkirby is my biggest scumread atm. He seems to be Onegue from XLII. Acting as if he is contributing but without actual content. He is not really expressing his reads and tend much more to hedge. He has not established a strong stance as a town and hasn't given clear reasons for his suspicion. ##Vote: jkirby Mmmm greetings stranger. I'm not surprised to see your kind around here... I like the case, esp the hedging point. +1 | ||
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Xzavier
United States393 Posts
Chromatically: Tunnels the fuck out of him quite uncharacteristically, brought up a few nice points but a lot of them can be countered by why in the hell would scum do this. Yes his play is bad altogether, but i see it as a townie giving up, not as a mafia trying to prove his innocence in the worst way possible. it just doesn't seem logical to me. I feel like day1 last game he was poking and prodding a lot more and at different people, trying to get reads all around. this game i see him set his sights on somebody who has RQ the thread at a very strange time and place. His arguement isnt something i could support at the moment, it just doesnt seem to have decent logic. while stim certainly isnt pro town, he has done nothing to appear to me that he is any scummier than the person who is blindly tunneling him. Superfluous: shockingly enough hasnt mentioned stim once in his filter, that seems strange. his original point was one that i think most of us disagree with and i already posted my thoughts on it. But he hasnt said anything about stim which i think should be noted, idk what it means yet, but this piqued my interest. Usami: null, never try to get a read on usami. appeal to his cocaine dealer first, tell him were going to have an intervention for Usami, then a week later we can all get together and parse something of a read on him. :D No seriously heres my actual read on Usami: he votes stim with good reason, as if he was saying "your most likely scum on my list, but if not your a counterproductive town so you can still die and ill be happy" i like that, because it makes the town much stronger as time goes on, obviously i would prefer scum lynches but if you see no clear scum to lynch, this thought process is best thought process imo. jrkirby: claims he has a null read on stim- after doing sensible things when you have a null read, like trying to calm him down to remove emotion from his posts (because an angry poster is a bad poster), his entire take on stim can be summed up by his last post: On July 13 2013 13:42 jrkirby wrote: I don't think he's thinking through what he's saying. His actions don't seem town because they're foolish from every way you look at them. But that doesn't make him clearly scum. But on the road to getting there he seemed to tunnel him the least of all and keep his options around on everybody, i like how he didnt just total tunnel vision him like chrom, because he helps the town far more by simply looking at others. I like that. he pressured hurricane and has spoken to half the thread, that much i like. He may be hedging as stim just said, but i think its early enough that it might not be the worst of things to do early day1, but if he keeps it up it will look might suspicious. Right now i feel like hes town still. i am happy that somebody brought up the hedging point, because before i saw that i had him pegged as one of my stronger town reads, now i can see a smart ruse that i might have totally fallen for. Hurricane Sponge: Started the day off with his 'if i roll town heres my first post of the day thats obviously pre-written cuz its so damn long" and gets slightly pressured for it. He started the day by saying everything he knows about everybody, this is actually useful to town, its alot like knowing if somebody is EURO or american timezone. it doesnt mean very much as to their alignment, but it helps you know that they arnt lurking, they are sleeping. i hope you get what im saying. Anyway after his opening post he provides the most in depth post as to the stim ordeal, and its seriously pro-town and hopefully shoved logic down alot of these guys throats. i really liked his massive post about it, and at the moment its convinced me hes town. This is my strongest town read at the moment and i like this thoughts about the situtation. He asks alot of good questions that i cant find an answer for, Like wouldnt his scumbuddies tell him to slow down and breathe, or claim it was a joke or something. i cant see a scum just lone wolfing it and responding to THAT much pressure without consulting his scumbuddies/coach. i get why he wouldnt want to die, nobody wants to die. but it was his massive case that made me think that he really isnt all that scummy at the moment, is he pro-town, most certianly not, but he isnt scummy to me, it just reminds me of my friend i duo queue with for LoL, the moment anybody calls him a noob i spend the next 10 minutes over skype saying "it doesnt matter" "calm down" "your fucking 9/1/5 this game, you arnt a god damn noob" but he still spams the all-chat while totally ignoring me. But in a game like this i cant see that happening. or if it did and he was scum, the other scum would have no choice but the buss the shit out of him if he REALLY cant control his emotions THAT poorly. Hzflank: he has two short and sweet posts and that get to the point about him, i really like this one in particular: On July 13 2013 23:59 hzflank wrote: Stim was caught lying about the motivation behind his posts. In my opinion, lying about motivation is one of the scummiest things a person could do on day 1. Stim's defence was to martyr, and I am not willing to give anyone credit for martyring. As far as I am concerned that is a red mark against Stim. During the course of the game everyone gets red marks against them. The important thing is to look at each red mark and ask 'Could that have come from a town position?'. In this case I think it could of come from a town position, based on my earlier assumption that Stim took the original post too seriously and later tried to invent justification for his posts based on a less serious early position. A red mark, but not enough to make me highly confident that he is scum. The other important thing about red marks is to get a feel for how many there are compared to green marks and posts in general. This is where the martyring is a problem, as we need Stim to continue to contribute. @Stim, I suggest that you move on. Instead of discussing what has already happened, dive some filters and form the best reads that you can. Then post your reads, showing as much of your reasoning as you can. This will give us new things to discuss with you, so that you do not have to keep talking about that happened yesterday. If you do not post again then the red mark will still be there but there will not be any green marks to balance it. and it would appear as if stim took his reasonable advice and did so, making him far more useful as town and created a few green marks to start to balance it out. I basically agree with everything said here. he tries to slow things down and give stim a chance to respond, this is something that very few people did, and its something that more people should have done. im glad he didn't ragequit the game and that he did take the time to make a massively informative post, because now he has made one massively pro-town post, and if this continues most of my doubts about him will continue to falter. | ||
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Koshi
Belgium38797 Posts
On July 14 2013 02:09 Rainbows wrote: Why are Chrom and Umasi super scummy to you? They just seem to be scumhunting to me, and the only reason you have for them being scum, is you don't like their choice of scum candidates. Super scummy is putting words in my mouth. I don't like that. Somebody asked me to give my 2 scum reads and my 2 town reads. I replied. | ||
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Rainbows
Germany1217 Posts
On July 14 2013 02:42 Koshi wrote: Super scummy is putting words in my mouth. I don't like that. Somebody asked me to give my 2 scum reads and my 2 town reads. I replied. Well you obviously think they are scummy, sans the super. Don't avoid the question. Why are chrom/umasi scummier than other dudes like superfluous / lurkers? | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 13 2013 21:54 Koshi wrote: Reading Umasi his filter after the Chroma filter makes me want to lynch one of these 2 guys. Umasi and Chroma are either bromancing it up on the stimaddict lynch, or they are both scum. Here is Umasi his game till now: --> Defend Sponge while pushing lynch on Superfluous. --> Argue with Sponge about Chroma while pusing a lynch on StiMaDDict. Try to stay away from day 1 associations. I have some prior with this and I can tell you that you cannot read anything into it until you see a flip. I have been looking into Umasi. He has posted a lot of fluff and there seem to be some inconsistencies with his scum-hunting where he provides good reasoning for some reads but not for others. He also seems a little too sure that certain other players are town. My conclusion on Umasi was that I do not want him to be lynched at this time. Notice that is not me saying that I have a strong town read on him. I think it is unlikely that scum would of posted as much as Umasi has. I think it is unlikely that scum would be so willing to sheep at this early stage of day 1. Mostly, I think that Umasi will continue to be active and certainly has the capacity to post some good analysis in the near future. I think that there are at least 2 players who are more likely to be scum than Umasi, not counting the lurkers or people who I have not yet fully read into. Therefore, I do not want Umasi to be lynched at this time. As for Chrom, I think his interactions with Stim seemed to come from a town point of view. He pushed a little and then when he voted he did so with a genuine reason. Chrom pushed his read for a while which I think is standard. Koshi, what do you think of Super? | ||
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Hurricane Sponge
868 Posts
On July 13 2013 17:01 Umasi wrote: why is me thinking he's slightly towny a big deal though? I wouldn't say it's a big deal. I just wanted to see what evidence you had gathered to make your read, because it's useful for the town if you can help us identify Chrom as town. @Chrom: + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 19:17 Chromatically wrote: Several people suddenly posted to tell Stim that I could be scum, and then didn't actually give an opinion on Stim. It was really wierd. You've brought up this same idea a few times about Stim trying to "act cool", but I don't see any particular reason to believe it. Why do you? As I've said before, there will always be a possibility of a town explanation, it's just less likely. If Stim is town, he'll return with a clear explanation. If you want to bring up meta, town should have lynched Stim in XLII. He could have easily been scum, and I said as much in the obs. A more convincing point is that Stim never reacted this way to pressure in XLIII, even though several votes were thrown on him over the course (if I remember). Hypothetical: If Stim doesn't return, what will you do? If Stim hadn't have returned, I'd probably drop the issue entirely and focus my efforts elsewhere, anticipating a /replacement or mod action. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 19:28 Chromatically wrote: These are some wierd-ass wierd reads (formatted in a list, might I add...). You give town reads to a large number of people based on almost nothing? You say that me and Umasi are actively scumhunting, and then say we're null? All followed by a sheep on Super while waiting to commit to Stim. It all feels really odd. Why is xzavier more townie then Umasi/me? Why did you post town reads in the first place? I'm surprised you do not agree with my reads. I shall re-evaluate them. You are Neutral to me for the reasons I mentioned: while you and Umasi are scumhunting (+), I believe you're doing it in an anti-town manner (-). That is: making logical leaps, confirmation bias, poor analysis. Scum can scumhunt too, and that's exactly how I imagine they'd do it. I also don't feel like I'm sheeping Superfluous. I raised some independent analysis regarding him in my earlier post (centering on the fact that our reads are very different, signifying a disconnect from my own POV that is significant enough to be Town-Scum). Are there any other glaring mistakes in particular you'd like to hear my thoughts on? On July 13 2013 19:37 Chromatically wrote: 1) You seem confident that Stim's blowup was alignment independent, can you address my earlier posts about why it's more likely from scum? I think it's pretty hard to overblow the importance of someone lying about their motivation without being able to explain it. You disagree? 2) The apologetic tone is the entire reason why Super looks bad. He's trying not to draw attention to himself and not to incite anyone (scummy). The Nolynch thing is totally non alignment indicative, which you should know. Explain your scumread on Super more. On July 13 2013 12:24 Superfluous wrote: As I said I just skimmed over after returning. Cloud 9 was a name I didn't see when comparing the posts I saw to the player list, so I pointed it out. And I have been trying to get something to talk about other than what seem to be mini discussions between certain people. I also don't get why you're attacking me saying "I'm not trying to find scum". In my own post I said that I was going to look it over again and get reads, obviously meaning that I hadn't looked that hard for scum yet. Right now my biggest scum read is HZflank, because I still think Umasi is doing mostly pro town moves yet hz says its scummy. If it pushes to me actually being lynched I think that I'd still feel this way. He also had an early post or two that distracted somewhat from the discussion, which I'm always suspicious of. I'll give nightcat benefit of the doubt. It's a bit weird he showed up once his name came up but eh. I realize thats not really a great reason but seems like we're in semi-similar situations. Xzavier I'm more suspicious of, he didnt have many posts then in his first one he shows up saying he'll consider lynching me. It's really scummy play to lurk then show up ready to lynch imo. I really don't like that last part where he gives one lurker the FoS, but a second one a free pass in the same post. I don't like that his reads seem diametrically opposed to mine, which implies a significant difference in frame-of-reference. I don't like his case on HZ (which is a case in name only). I don't like that he's suspicious of townies who enter the thread willing to lynch. On July 13 2013 21:48 Chromatically wrote: Sponge, could you also elaborate on you Umasi read? As I told Umasi late last night when we were the only two in the thread, I love his scumhunting, but I cringe at his methods. He's got a big problem with confirmation bias and attacking his target when he should just be poking, bringing the level of discourse down into the mud too soon. Like I said in the earlier post, I think he's Green-Black: Bad Town, Good Scum, or Good Town That I Just Can't Read. The early game aggression is much preferred to the alternative (lurking), but if he keeps some of these traits up into the late game, I'm worried for town. Moving on: On July 13 2013 21:54 Koshi wrote: I am from Belgium guys, This game started at 12PM and I was tired after a working week. I read the thread once now and my initial (this is without using filters, just reading all the posts) is that H.Sponge build enough town kred to not get lynched day 1 no matter what. I loved his opening post, and I loved his defense on that post. Even if he is scum, he has been very helpful to town, and every town should go and read that opening post. Scum reads are on Umasi and Chroma. Umasi because his entire early posts were just sucking up to H.Sponge, which is just not useful at all, H. Sponge clearly doesn't need to be defended like this. Another thing I dont like about Umasi is him trying to redirect the thread twice for a Superfluous train on a rather useless moment. Superfluous entered the thread with a bad post, but went afk after, which is not a clear scumread. Not enough the get a train going, and make the rest of the day useless. Chroma is currently tunneling so heavily on StiMaDDict. The guy is afk, treat him as an afk bad town till he comes back. It is a good thing to spark some conversation around StiMaDDict, but at this point I feel that Chroma is derailing more than necessarily. It's just tunneling into oblivion. I start filtering now: Reading Chroma his filter I get a serious scum vibe. Post like this: This is just being a jack-ass, at least it would be if you say things like this in real life. In mafia it is trying to put suspicion onto somebody without saying anything. I haven't crosschecked this message with the referring Sponge message but it feels dirty. What was your intention while typing this down Chromo? @ Chromo, Do you agree that this is a very suspicious post? And explain to me why it is "interesting" that Sponge likes to have interaction on his scumreads while playing this game? Reading Umasi his filter after the Chroma filter makes me want to lynch one of these 2 guys. Umasi and Chroma are either bromancing it up on the stimaddict lynch, or they are both scum. Here is Umasi his game till now: --> Defend Sponge while pushing lynch on Superfluous. --> Argue with Sponge about Chroma while pusing a lynch on StiMaDDict. I hate Umasi and Chrom as lynch targets for Day 1. Town does not want to lynch guys this active and scumhunting this hard. Regardless of the fact that I think Superfluous is scummier at this point, I'd push for a Lurker lynch over one of either of Umasi or Chrom. ---------------- Current Events: I think StiM's case on Kirby is weak. Lots of fallacies in there. Everything quoted is interpreted single-mindedly as scum, and even the stuff that's pro town is justified as 'this is clearly scum trying to look town'. | ||
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Hurricane Sponge
868 Posts
On July 14 2013 02:14 Rainbows wrote: + Show Spoiler + On July 14 2013 01:51 StiMaDDict wrote: *sigh I fucked up. @Chromatically: You let me down and I let you down. I don't really know. I had a shitty day. I was pissed off at other things and I tried to let my stresses go away by posting on here. Then you blew it. Your nitpicking on whether I was angry or not and whether I was lying or not was really under my expectation. I think I gave you WAY TOO much credit from last game. Also you keep saying that I can't explain my so-called lie, but I did, god damn it. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 12:19 StiMaDDict wrote: This. Pretty much repeating what Xzavier did in the last game, calling everyone retard, was from me being genuinely mad. Overall attitude in my posts and impolite words in them were for the purpose I have stated. Do note: I'm not a good actor and I am not sure whether there was a clear boundary between me being mad because of quotes and spoilers and pretending to be mad at Rainbow. I was not bothered by Rainbow's pressure to put it simply and it is not in my best interest to lie about this. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 12:24 StiMaDDict wrote: My previous post looks confusing. 1) I was mad at messing up posts but not at Rainbow 2) My anger reflected on my posts 3) Later when I realized that my posts were angry sounding I gave them purposes and maintain similar style. I hope this explains it better. Not sure if this is a relevant topic though. First one wasn't clear enough so I wrote the second. I had a shitty day, alright, so I wrote some cuss words on the Internet. It wasn't something that I was proud of but it happened. So I tried to cover it up as if it was intentional with purposes and purposes they did accomplished. If you want to argue about when I came up with the idea, well, why don't dissect my brain and see. Gosh, you pissed me off. @jkirby: What you doing? + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 07:41 jrkirby wrote: Ok. I've been studying this long and hard, and I think I have enough evidence to make a clear case. hzflank is scum Clearly, hzflank is lying about this compliment. Liars are always scum. And look who he's talking to: the scum coach. Obviously he's in league with them. He goes on, still talking to the scum: This is an obvious admission that he wants town to die. Anyone who wants town to die is scum, end of story. I will. Right here, right now. And for his first post: He's trying to get us to sheep together and follow a Bandwagon instead of looking for evidence and finding scum. Finally: Trying to defend one of the scum who is planning to lurk. You can't ignore all this evidence guys. hzflank is scum. ##Vote: hzflank He makes a pressure vote on hzflank and he never followed up on it at all. Yes, it did create a discussion between Rainbow and I, but not much from hzflank. He never provided his motive, explanation, or response after he made that one post. We know he was around when Rainbow and I were duking it out. Am I the only crazy one here and it's a normal thing to do with a pressure vote? If the purpose of the pressure vote is create a discussion why didn't he take a part? He takes it down couple of pages later basic saying that it didn't do much except getting some discussion. jkirby on Hurricane is basically this in my eyes: Your first post makes you look town. I think you post this AS A SCUM. If you are not, then show us your other post. Darn, it's too late now. I follow the thought process but it doesn't do much. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 09:35 jrkirby wrote: "For all we know, THIS could be his scum post." That's exactly what I was trying to get information on. Here was my reasoning: if this is his scum post, then he won't HAVE a real scum post. But it's been long enough that he could've written another one by now, so no point in pushing it anymore. No, this is my second game, kinda. This starts jkirby's trend of hedging. He drops the pressure as soon as he feels as it has been too long and Sponge could've written a copy. He doesn't say Sponge is a town or scum because of this, which I find disturbing. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 09:46 jrkirby wrote: Me - "It's been long enough that he could've written another one by now." If he had posted one immediately after I had asked it means something different than if he posts one an hour or two after I asked. Superfluous's post & lurk is bad, but give him a bit, he might show back up. Umasi feels the same way it seems. Another excuse and nothing to indicate how he feels about Sponge as a result. The bold part is another hedging. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 09:58 jrkirby wrote: I think it's foolish to PLAN to not lynch day one. But if I have a choice of lynching someone that I townread, and lynching no one, I will try to lynch no one. I hope other people would follow suit. This is his opinion. I don't agree with persay but it isn't really alignment indicative. It isn't a strong expression of opinion to be honest, just a "wish" (I added this because I didn't want to only pick out scummy things jkirby said and ignore rest of his filter) + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 10:13 jrkirby wrote: Koshi Xzavier Nightcat99 Gotard cloud-9 These players haven't posted anything/enough in my opinion. It's only been a couple hours, so you might be asleep/ at work. But just a PSA, these are currently "lurkers". Doesn't reveal his view on lurkers but just "throw" the topic of lurkers out on the table. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 10:22 jrkirby wrote: Well, this game is majority lynch, so voting for the "scummiest" person could be what causes a lynch not to happen. I'm pretty sure scum wouldn't mind lynching town either. General common sense. It's just me but I don't like this semi-joking statement. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 10:32 jrkirby wrote: Honestly? I have real trouble seeing scum until I see voting patterns. I'm slightly more suspicious of Sponge, Umasi, and Rainbows than the rest. Sponge I've stated my reasons for. I don't really trust my read on Rainbows because [meta here] I thought he was scum last time I played with him and he wasn't. Umasi just reads a bit ornery, so that could be the reason for my weak read. My vote on hzflank was kinda a combo of joke/pressure as you guys pointed out. It got a bit of discussion, but didn't get much of a rise out of hzflank, who I currently have null read on. I guess I should unvote him now, since the pressure obviously didn't do too much. ##unvote: hzflank A list of suspicion list that doesn't have "legitimate" reasons or evidence. So he does feel suspicious about Sponge afterall about him not sharing his opening post in time, I'm assuming. About Rainbow, I am not sure. He words in a confusing way. In last game, jkirby thought Rainbow was scum but he was a town. So in this game he thinks Rainbow is a town but he could be a scum or vise versa? Concerning Umasi, his reasoning it not satisfying either. Also he doubts his ability to read other people. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 11:03 Chromatically wrote: Why are you suspicious of Rainbows? What do you think about Super? Chromatically followed up asking why jkirby is suspicious of Rainbow and what he thinks of Super. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 11:56 StiMaDDict wrote: Waiting on jkirby's response to Chromatically's question. I had same question as Chromatically and brought it back up. At the end, he still hasn't answered it at the time of me posting this. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 10:47 jrkirby wrote: Anyone think this could be a scumslip? He seems the kind that might want to subtly brag about it if he were scum. I can never figure out when people are joking and not. This is just really fucking weak and gets on my nerve. If it is a joke, then fuck me. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 10:58 jrkirby wrote: He said he couldn't be in here at the beginning before the game started, right? No real reason to have suspicion on the lurkers yet, just note that they're lurking. This is pretty fucking bad. Protecting a lurker when he was the one to bring up the topic at all. I don't know what he is trying to do, but then again, I'm fucked up pretty hard with my playstyle.. Anyway, protecting not just one lurker but pretty much all of them and making an excuse for them makes me think he is a scum. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 13:21 jrkirby wrote: Cool it dude. For all you know, the people voting for you could be scum trying to get you riled up. Just calm down, post reads, question things, and have a good game. You won't play your best when you're tilting. You're in no way doomed right now. I guess I should thanks for his kind words (?) but as Chromatically has pointed out, he is trying to pat me on the head as if he is saying, "Chromatically and Umasi could scum you know. Come here, you poor baby." + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 13:31 jrkirby wrote: 2 votes land on a guy is quick succession, I'd be stupid if I weren't at least a BIT suspicious. As far as I can tell, stim is just acting like a bit of an idiot, is flustered, and frustrated. Doesn't seem like scumtell to me. You're free to have your vote, and I don't have a solid scumread on either of you, but I will be looking a bit more closely at your filters. No stand or point whatsoever. I'm not a scum. Chromatically and Umasi are not scum, but they are "bit" suspicious. What is your stance man? Stop hedging. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 13:38 jrkirby wrote: I don't think he's town. I think he's stupid, and have a nullread. Well thanks, I think I'm stupid too. I'm not a town but you have a nullread on me? What was the purpose of writing above two posts then? Confused and scummy. I am not liking how he is dealing with me blowing up. He seems to be neither or both defending and pressuring in this situation. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 13:42 jrkirby wrote: I don't think he's thinking through what he's saying. His actions don't seem town because they're foolish from every way you look at them. But that doesn't make him clearly scum. Hedging. Period. Conclusion: jkirby is my biggest scumread atm. He seems to be Onegue from XLII. Acting as if he is contributing but without actual content. He is not really expressing his reads and tend much more to hedge. He has not established a strong stance as a town and hasn't given clear reasons for his suspicion. ##Vote: jkirby Mmmm greetings stranger. I'm not surprised to see your kind around here... I like the case, esp the hedging point. +1 Can you explain which parts of the case are most compelling to you? I disagree with this case, and I'd like to hear from someone who buys into it. | ||
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hzflank
United Kingdom2991 Posts
On July 14 2013 01:51 StiMaDDict wrote: + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 10:32 jrkirby wrote: Honestly? I have real trouble seeing scum until I see voting patterns. I'm slightly more suspicious of Sponge, Umasi, and Rainbows than the rest. Sponge I've stated my reasons for. I don't really trust my read on Rainbows because [meta here] I thought he was scum last time I played with him and he wasn't. Umasi just reads a bit ornery, so that could be the reason for my weak read. My vote on hzflank was kinda a combo of joke/pressure as you guys pointed out. It got a bit of discussion, but didn't get much of a rise out of hzflank, who I currently have null read on. I guess I should unvote him now, since the pressure obviously didn't do too much. ##unvote: hzflank A list of suspicion list that doesn't have "legitimate" reasons or evidence. So he does feel suspicious about Sponge afterall about him not sharing his opening post in time, I'm assuming. About Rainbow, I am not sure. He words in a confusing way. In last game, jkirby thought Rainbow was scum but he was a town. So in this game he thinks Rainbow is a town but he could be a scum or vise versa? Concerning Umasi, his reasoning it not satisfying either. Also he doubts his ability to read other people. This is a point in Stim's case that I think deserves extra attention. Kirby says he suspects three people and provides a weak reason for one of them and no reason for the others. If I had three scum reads then I would know why I thought them to be scummy, or at the very least I would investigate further to see whether my read held up to analysis. Kirby, can you tell us why you had a scum read on Rainbows and Umasi? Do you still have scum reads on them (or Sponge)? | ||
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Rainbows
Germany1217 Posts
His first post is a giant list that accomplishes next to nothing and provides little original. Lists are generally an easy way to feign contribution while doing jack. + Show Spoiler + On July 13 2013 19:53 Gotard wrote: Hello! After some lurking (jk I was sleeping) i'd like to share my thoughts: 1) hzflank - cold, calculated. Null read. 2) StiMaDDict - bad town. It would be too easy if he's mafia. 3) Chromatically - I think he's pushing stim too hard (he's agressive in general) but at the same time it's good for town to see some bandwagons going 4) jrkirby - confuses me a little.But he has a similar view on StiMaDDict as i do. 5) Koshi - inexperienced or lurking hard. 6) Xzavier - one good post No wait, that one was good. Need to see some more activity from him to have a read. I don't agree that lynching lurker is better than no lynch (9v3 > 8v3) 7) Rainbows - A lot of posts with minimum impact seems more townie than mafia. wtf? 8) Nightcat99 - lurking newbie. 9) Umasi - Very aggressive same as last game I played with him (He was town). 11) Hurricane Sponge - biggest town read. Really liked this post. 12) Superfluous - Town vibe. 13) cloud-9 - US timezone and 0 posts. He also seems apprehensive about making decisions. In the following he notes that he is "confused. . . not sure of anything", as if he doesn't want to take responsibility for his scum reads. His jokes (see below and above) are also punctuated with (jk) like he really doesn't want to be taken seriously. "Just incase you guys were wondering, that's a joke post" -MLuneth, scum. On July 13 2013 20:12 Gotard wrote: Easy question. Umasi and Xzavier!!! (jk) I'm really confused because my biggest (biggest doesn't mean that i'm really sure of anything) scum reads don't think that Stim is mafia. Maybe they don't want to vote on him because they know that this is too easy and don't want to jump on him that early. He looks like a bad town not like mafia. The rest of Gotard's filter is calling Stim not mafia. He's obviously bad town guise and not mafia.. he knows? Anyway, Gotard has a low post count, does lists, and seems nervous about things when he really shouldn't be if town. I think he's scum. Discuss. ##Vote: Gotard | ||
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StiMaDDict
Korea (South)313 Posts
I hate Umasi and Chrom as lynch targets for Day 1. Town does not want to lynch guys this active and scumhunting this hard. Regardless of the fact that I think Superfluous is scummier at this point, I'd push for a Lurker lynch over one of either of Umasi or Chrom. Elaboration on this please. Specifically who do you consider Lurker at this point? Note: I agree that Umasi and Chromatically are bad lynch candidates | ||
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Ange777
Germany1164 Posts
hzlank (0): Superfluous (0): StiMaDDict (2): Chromatically, Umasi, jrkirby (1): StiMaDDict Reminder: Voting is mandatory. Only votes in the voting thread will be counted! The voting thread can be found here. Deadline is in ~ 27,5 hours. | ||
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Koshi
Belgium38797 Posts
Koshi, what do you think of Super? Super is not putting enough effort into this game, the annoying part is that his posts make that blatantly obvious. I would lynch him over 9-cloud. My policy on 0 posters is that they are mathematically town. Let them get modkilled or replaced, but never lynch. | ||
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Hurricane Sponge
868 Posts
On July 14 2013 03:37 StiMaDDict wrote: Elaboration on this please. Specifically who do you consider Lurker at this point? Note: I agree that Umasi and Chromatically are bad lynch candidates I consider Superfluous and Nightcat the most dangerous kind of 'lurkers' at this point. They've checked into the thread but haven't offered anything without being directly questioned first. Koshi and Gotard could have also fit this bill, but their activity is trending upwards. It seemed silly to call people out on activity level when the game opened on a Friday night, and now we're in the weekend, but since the deadline is going to come Sunday night, I guess it's starting to become relevant. On July 14 2013 03:39 Koshi wrote: Super is not putting enough effort into this game, the annoying part is that his posts make that blatantly obvious. I would lynch him over 9-cloud. My policy on 0 posters is that they are mathematically town. Let them get modkilled or replaced, but never lynch. Who would be your primary lynch candidtate at this time? | ||
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Koshi
Belgium38797 Posts
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Rainbows
Germany1217 Posts
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Superfluous
United States70 Posts
As for Stim I think he's more likely bad town then mafia. Then again everyone else is saying the same thing, so could be mafia excuse for not lynching him. | ||
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Hurricane Sponge
868 Posts
On July 14 2013 04:20 Rainbows wrote: Consider Gotard, he is mafia. Fairly inactive and scummy. Good lynch. Just went filter diving on Gotard. Even in his list post he has yet to actually call anyone scummy. All he's done is confirm town reads. Mathematically, he thinks more people are town than is possible: On July 13 2013 19:53 Gotard wrote: Hello! After some lurking (jk I was sleeping) i'd like to share my thoughts: 1) hzflank - cold, calculated. Null read. 2) StiMaDDict - bad town. It would be too easy if he's mafia. 3) Chromatically - I think he's pushing stim too hard (he's agressive in general) but at the same time it's good for town to see some bandwagons going 4) jrkirby - confuses me a little.But he has a similar view on StiMaDDict as i do. 5) Koshi - inexperienced or lurking hard. 6) Xzavier - one good post No wait, that one was good. Need to see some more activity from him to have a read. I don't agree that lynching lurker is better than no lynch (9v3 > 8v3) 7) Rainbows - A lot of posts with minimum impact seems more townie than mafia. wtf? 8) Nightcat99 - lurking newbie. 9) Umasi - Very aggressive same as last game I played with him (He was town). 11) Hurricane Sponge - biggest town read. Really liked this post. 12) Superfluous - Town vibe. 13) cloud-9 - US timezone and 0 posts. @Gotard You mention that your biggest scum reads thought StiM was town. Who are these 'biggest scum reads' you're referring to? | ||
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Hurricane Sponge
868 Posts
On July 14 2013 04:29 Superfluous wrote: Going back through the posts, I'm a little alarmed at Hurricane Sponge's change of tone.In this post he disagrees with my opinion and says it casts suspicion on me, but doesnt state that I'm a huge scumread or anything. Here I interpreted his post as acknowledging that while we disagree, I was still trying to state my opinion and reasons for having that view. He then says some weird things here though. For instance, he says that he agrees with others' view of me who had semi-defended me, and in the same list puts me as the only scum read. I realize his view may have changed, but it strikes me especially considering in the second post I listed he acknowledged the possibility of a bandwagon on me just because of differing opinions. We also have a mutual disagreement on reads as well. I don't see how hzflank and xzavier have contributed substantially more than me. While knowing everyone's scum reads is good, I don't like it when people show up, say their scum reads, then expect other people to act on them. As for Stim I think he's more likely bad town then mafia. Then again everyone else is saying the same thing, so could be mafia excuse for not lynching him. You still haven't shared any of your scumhunting with us. You're showing massive weakness to relationship / association theory (i.e. your suspicion of hz because he's suspicious of Umasi, your claim that because I agree with some of the views of people who happened to semi-defend you that I must think you're town, etc.) I much prefer people who show up and share their scumreads than people not sharing scumreads (and reasoning for them) at all as I've seen from you so far. The only scumhunting I've seen from you is a weak FoS on hzflank, the reasoning being that he was suspicious of Umasi. I think you can agree this is not particularly compelling. | ||
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