GSL Mini Mafia III - Page 16

On October 22 2012 04:51 Hapahauli wrote:
Regarding Austin

Just like Marv, I'm really really good at wanting to mislynch town-austin every time we're in a game together. However unlike marv, I don't get townie vibes from his filter so far. This post especially is strange:



It's divided into three parts: 1) Meta-talk on Kei 2) stuff on v7/DP 3) Explanation of thought process to DP

1) He really doesn't say anything here. I think he's capable of doing this as town though, and he mentions that he's not very big on meta. This is fine.

2) This starts to get a bit weird, and I can't follow the logic at all. He says v7 is sticking out to him, and then talks about the DP situation for the entire paragraph.

3) This strikes me as a defensive impulse. I dont' understand why austin would get defensive here or really bother to explain his actions when no one was suspecting him for it.

Overall, austin's D1 play this game is more active, and I haven't seen it before and don't know what to make of it. However, I do find him slightly scummy because of the above post and want some answers.

On October 22 2012 04:51 Hapahauli wrote:


Uhh wat? Well of course I'll "expand" on what you've said, but you aren't at all in the least bit curious to hear my explanations for my actions when you are suspicious of me?

a) I am, but like I said, I am more interested in your reads. Now, however, you've successfully convinced me you need more looking into.

As for my "easy reads", I still stand by them. I like taking stances early in the game. Sometimes I'm wrong about them (actually I was really wrong about DP in mafia LVII while I was alive), but it's a nice way to get things going. Also, I really stand by my town read on DP this game (he has 5 pages of filter already FFS). Starting to waver on Draz a bit due to his recent inactivity.

b) I have no problems with your town read on DP. I agree with them. I don't understand why you felt the need to bring this up. I don't think I mentioned that I was troubled with you taking stances early on. My trouble was with the "easy reads on scum, and I think this was quite clear when I mentioned v7, the "easy read" I'm referring to.

As for the "reminding you of my scum newbie game"... in what regard? Can't respond to this if I have no idea wtf you're talking about.

c) The general feel of your posts. I'm not going to go through your old filters to prove what I mean, unless I really want you dead.

As for "fluffy" posts - I haven't had much substance to go on until today, but with some newfound posting, let's get to work on that:

kk

---

Regarding Kei

There's nothing in his filter that sets of scum alarms for me. His activity is normal for either alignment (therefore null), and I do like that he seems like he's actively thinking about Drazak's filter. He does a mini-180 on his stance on Drazak which seems pretty logical - first thinking that his vote is more likely town, then when Drazak doesn't post, he's willing to change his read due to the lack of pressure that Draz is putting on DP.

On top of that, having read through his scum meta in GSL I extensively, I find his scum play to be overall more cooperative. I'm definitely not lynching him on his filter, but I'd like to hear more from him. Null/leaning-town on Kei.

d) Cooperative as in looking more townie and seeming like he is trying to scumhunt more? I don't understand what you mean here.

---

Regarding Austin

Just like Marv, I'm really really good at wanting to mislynch town-austin every time we're in a game together. However unlike marv, I don't get townie vibes from his filter so far. This post especially is strange:



It's divided into three parts: 1) Meta-talk on Kei 2) stuff on v7/DP 3) Explanation of thought process to DP

1) He really doesn't say anything here. I think he's capable of doing this as town though, and he mentions that he's not very big on meta. This is fine.

2) This starts to get a bit weird, and I can't follow the logic at all. He says v7 is sticking out to him, and then talks about the DP situation for the entire paragraph.

3) This strikes me as a defensive impulse. I dont' understand why austin would get defensive here or really bother to explain his actions when no one was suspecting him for it.

Overall, austin's D1 play this game is more active, and I haven't seen it before and don't know what to make of it. However, I do find him slightly scummy because of the above post and want some answers.

On October 22 2012 05:18 austinmcc wrote:
See what happens when I don't explain my full thought process in spoilers!

On October 21 2012 21:03 marvellosity wrote:

vaderseven - for lack of content, firstly. But more tellingly for the manner of his posts. He mixes in the cute little posts - "what do you want to know about mes" and the little fun facts about his rolling mafia. In between those posts, though, are sarcastic and patronising posts that are really easy for scum to make because it makes them look like they know what's going on without actually have to contribute anything.

On October 22 2012 05:32 marvellosity wrote:


nuh uh sweetie, this is what happens when people don't read and process what's been written properly. In my longish post having read the thread for the first time I said:



which is basically what you were saying about the DP situation but worded slightly differently, and it's what I had taken from your posts. Maybe it was easier for me to understand as I'd read similar things from the DP affair as you had.

On October 22 2012 05:29 Hapahauli wrote:
Red stuff:

a) Cool.
b) Easy reads on scum? What's "easy" about my v7 read? It's straightforward yes, but I don't get why it's inappropriate for me to vote a guy for the reasons I've listed.
c) Uhhhh k.
d) Scum Kei in GSL I tried to be cooperative with other players IMO - he strayed away from confrontations with people he didn't have scumreads on.

Austin case stuff:
1) Yes you did, and that's why I said it was "fine" explicitly. I just broke it down for the sake of completeness.
2) Yeah I didn't get his logic on my first readthrough. Austin explained it quite thoroughly in his spoilers though, so yeah I changed my mind on this quite a bit.
3) Yes I'm suggesting a defensive impulse (or more specifically, defending yourself when you aren't suspicious) is scummy. However, I do think he's capable of this as town, and without #2 as valid, I'm no longer leaning scum on austin.

On October 22 2012 05:38 austinmcc wrote:

Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaan.

What do you make of keirathi's post in the middle of the DP stuff?

On October 22 2012 05:39 Z-BosoN wrote:
b) There's a ton of things going on. You've planted your vote and since then have only written semi-cases on austin and Keir, which concluded little. You are happy and comfy with your vote on v7 and haven't bothered answering any of my inquiries of his lynch.
Also, you are generally more investigative (i.e ask more quesitons, etc.), I use LVII as reference here. So far you've played quite differently than in LVII, in my opinion.

Your case on austin seemed extremely forged, and I'm seriously bugged by point no. 2).
It's like you were thinking: "hmmm... let's see, what looks scummy here that I can pounce on.." instead of "is this guy scum?".
This uncharacteristic error could have very well been just that, a misinterpretation. But coming from you I find it oddly suspicious.

His other main post contains a ton of fluff and doesn't really conclude anything:

On October 22 2012 05:50 marvellosity wrote:


I'm not exactly sure. A couple of posts later in his filter he explains he was just calling out bullshit and didn't read anything alignment-y from it. But then if that's the case, then the contributions were just pointless and not really contributions.

I think Kei is playing pretty scummily - but what gives me pause is in his recent post, he just told town he doesn't really have any reads. Given he's under some pressure, it makes little sense for a scum Kei to do that. But then I find myself going around in stupid little wifom circles. What do you think?

I don't have these little niggles about vader, so I'd quite like to hammer him. But we're still going places with discussion so I'm loathe to right now.

Z-bo, are you sure that part of your read on Hapa isn't that you're putting him on a pedestal and placing unreasonable expectation from his posting? I'm getting that vibe from what you're posting about him.

On October 22 2012 05:52 Hapahauli wrote:


What's there to answer? You haven't asked me anything about the v7 vote that I didn't answer already. You still also have not addressed why you don't think my rationale is insufficient.



Uncharacteristic for me? I am the king of forced D1 cases.

Also, do you realize how hypocritical you're sounding right now? Hypocritical to the point of scumminess. Take a gander of your post here:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=376602&currentpage=14#274
You explicitly reference austin's post (the one I initially objected to) and this is how you described it:


Huhwat? Whether you agree with it or not, I made an actual attempt to analyze austin's post. Instead, you dismissed the whole thing as fluff, and somehow my case is forced? Hell given your objections with austin's post, and given that you found him scummy then, it is really weird that you picked a fight over my analysis.

Explain yourself sir.

On October 22 2012 04:25 Z-BosoN wrote:


Because some elements of what they said I figured you would be immediately on their tail.
I've taken a look at looney, and well, fine lol. I'll make that a null read on you. You are also fairly active, so I don't think you'd make a good lynch today.

I'm seriously looking into Keir/v7. Since Keir is actually showing his face, I'm almost almost almost willing to plunge the hammer on v7. I can't think of a better lynch than him, and his absence is just dragging the game out.

The reason why I'm not wanting to push it is that he hasn't said shit yet in face of death. A scum, having 4 votes on him, if he could post, would definitely post and try to avoid it, no?

On October 22 2012 04:45 Z-BosoN wrote:
Well, as you yourself said, a lot of people jumped on DP for this. You removed blame on them because they continued to post and make contributions. So in a way, the fact that he isn't posting when ONLY having done that in this game is why people want him dead right now. Since he hasn't posted yet, I'm concluding that he's not reading the thread, and not really giving a damn.
Marv, what say you?

On October 22 2012 05:50 marvellosity wrote:


I'm not exactly sure. A couple of posts later in his filter he explains he was just calling out bullshit and didn't read anything alignment-y from it. But then if that's the case, then the contributions were just pointless and not really contributions.

I think Kei is playing pretty scummily - but what gives me pause is in his recent post, he just told town he doesn't really have any reads. Given he's under some pressure, it makes little sense for a scum Kei to do that. But then I find myself going around in stupid little wifom circles. What do you think?

On October 22 2012 05:50 marvellosity wrote:
I'm not exactly sure. A couple of posts later in his filter he explains he was just calling out bullshit and didn't read anything alignment-y from it. But then if that's the case, then the contributions were just pointless and not really contributions.

I think Kei is playing pretty scummily - but what gives me pause is in his recent post, he just told town he doesn't really have any reads. Given he's under some pressure, it makes little sense for a scum Kei to do that. But then I find myself going around in stupid little wifom circles. What do you think?

What the hell? I have like 4 posts contemplating v7's lynch, as I was, and still am, seriously considering dropping my hammer vote on him. If you really think he's scum, why aren't you pushing him when I'm showing doubt? Anyways, since you are really making me go through my filter and pick out what I mean, here are some things:

On October 22 2012 04:03 Hapahauli wrote:
Oh, and as for V7 - I put vote #3 on him yesterday, and I'm more than comfortable sending him to the grave if he continues not to contribute. I think the 12 hour mark someone said earlier is an appropriate benchmark for hammering him.

...
Regarding to the "forcedness" of your d1 cases, I'm pretty aware of that. I don't think this looked like a forced case, this looked like a fake case, there's a difference. #1 I don't remember if I used the word "forced", but anyways, that's what i meant.#2

Also, your traditional OMGUS of whoever is pressuring you is pretty unjust.#3 You've taken one specific part on a much bigger post I made and extrapolated it into stamping my whole case on him as fake. I was very clear on my main problem with austin: He was not as aggressive as he usually is and his posting is different than from both the games he's played against me.#4 Austin himself noticed this and convinced me otherwise.

On October 22 2012 06:18 Keirathi wrote:

What do you mean they were pointless? I wanted him to explain his rationale. I didn't make a snap judgement, so that's scummy?