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TL Mafia XXXV - Page 16

Forum Index > TL Mafia
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Tevo
Profile Joined October 2010
Netherlands75 Posts
December 27 2010 20:09 GMT
#301
I'm going to have to disagree with you there, Barundar. LunarDestiny simply said that on day1, when we hardly have any information at all, we should be going for inactives. Never did he say he wanted to pursue inactives over mafia. I tend to agree with that, we don't have any decent clues IMO and shouldn't be too quick to jump the gun. The most sensible option to me seems to vote an inactive (unless someone of course is overly suspicious but I haven't seen that yet.)
RebirthOfLeGenD
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
USA5860 Posts
December 27 2010 20:12 GMT
#302
I got my defense wrong! I have a strange idea. I think both annul and LSB might be mafia, this little tiff is exactly what annul/KJ did in ExMiMa although this is a little different. I know LSB is a better player than to attack his attacker AS mafia, its kind of an odd tell. My first thought was that he is probably town and just thought the analysis was scummy. But the analysis seems fine to me. The arguments almost feel a little forced too if you read through it. This is definitely something to keep in mind.
Be a man, Become a Legend. TL Mafia Forum Ask for access!!
seRapH
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States9830 Posts
December 27 2010 20:17 GMT
#303
Having problems with my router, so I'm not going to as active as I'd like.

Voting DrH because he's almost always mafia If I can fix before the day ends I'll change it. Probably.
boomer hands
Meapak_Ziphh
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States6789 Posts
December 27 2010 20:17 GMT
#304
LSB; while Annul doesn't have a very strong case against you, your defense was pretty pathetic. I've had a bad gut feeling about you for a while, it's not something I was planning on voting on but Annul did bring out all of the problems I had been having with your posts. I'm not voting you quite yet but I would like you to give more than one line answers whenever someone puts a fos on you. Consider this post a +1 for Annul's case against LSB. I'd like to see you take some time in defending yourself and not just brush it off because there were some good points in annul's post.
Forti et Fideli ~ TL Mafia Forum: Come play with us! ~ Go Samsung KHAN, Stork, JangBi , Shine, Grape, and TurN Fighting!~ wat
LSB
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5171 Posts
December 27 2010 20:18 GMT
#305
On December 28 2010 05:17 Meapak_Ziphh wrote:
LSB; while Annul doesn't have a very strong case against you, your defense was pretty pathetic. I've had a bad gut feeling about you for a while, it's not something I was planning on voting on but Annul did bring out all of the problems I had been having with your posts. I'm not voting you quite yet but I would like you to give more than one line answers whenever someone puts a fos on you. Consider this post a +1 for Annul's case against LSB. I'd like to see you take some time in defending yourself and not just brush it off because there were some good points in annul's post.

Give me a point to address then.
Once is an accident. Twice is coincidence. Three times is an enemy action. Bus Driver can never target themselves I'm sorry
LunarDestiny
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States4177 Posts
December 27 2010 20:20 GMT
#306
Yes, my posts are general and are related to how should we play this game because of minor difference (framer) compared to other mafia games.

@1)I want to ask you how should we put pressure on specific player to contribute. It would be bad if a mafia is calling out inactive townie. Also, who should we choose? Go to a list of inactive and randomly pick one of them and say "xxxx, please contribute."

@2)If the list is short enough (less than 10 people?), then the list is convincing enough to pressure people to speak up.

@3)Again, I am not trying to post to make me look town. Heck, I could have lurked from the beginning and not attract attention to myself.
By my "plan", I assume you mean me saying "who should dts check" and "on day 1, we should pressure inactive to speak". Yes, both requires almost no work on my part. The first is advice to dts and the second is relating to generating discussions.

As of now, I do not have good point of why or why not anyone is mafia. I do not want to accuse anyone without good point.
LunarDestiny
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States4177 Posts
December 27 2010 20:23 GMT
#307
On December 28 2010 04:57 Barundar wrote:
I’m sorry to point it out, but I can’t help but notice how general and unproductive your posts are, LunarDestiny.

Show nested quote +
At some point on day1, we should come up with a list of possible lynch and that will encourage those people on the list to speak up

1) Lists are a good way to appear like you are contributing, without actually adding anything.
Show nested quote +
I want to put pressure on all inactives to speak up and maybe contribution.

2) Pressure is not done in general, pressure is specific to make the player unable to hide. Your list of pressuring “all” inactives is the same as pressuring none.

3) There is a fine line between a plan, and suggestions that make you appear to be active while sending the town on a goosechase. Your plan requires no work from yourself (“we” should do this and that), is very general (“at some point”), and it’s limited to inactives instead of scumhunting, making it mechanic, so even when we hit town, the mafia is not guilty.

In general, the player list is a little more stacked with active players than Pokemafia/HPmafia, so inactives shouldn’t be as much as a problem (even if I just replaced one…)

My respond is above. (Thought I could post right under without quoting)
Jackal58
Profile Joined November 2010
United States4264 Posts
December 27 2010 20:23 GMT
#308
+ Show Spoiler +
       I voted Jackal for the same reason, but actually am inclined now to vote for someone else with his excuse, but will actively be pressuring him in PM land to contribute more so. Jackal, that's why your being voted. Contribute more and I'll lay off you.

It's all good man. I don't feel like you're picking on me.
Like I already said day 1 lynch is a crap shoot.
Unless somebody really steps on their dick.

Life can only kill you once.
LSB
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5171 Posts
December 27 2010 20:23 GMT
#309
On December 28 2010 05:20 LunarDestiny wrote:
@1)I want to ask you how should we put pressure on specific player to contribute. It would be bad if a mafia is calling out inactive townie. Also, who should we choose? Go to a list of inactive and randomly pick one of them and say "xxxx, please contribute."

@2)If the list is short enough (less than 10 people?), then the list is convincing enough to pressure people to speak up.

What's the difference between the two scenarios?

In both we are putting pressure on people to contribute. In both we need to make a list of inactives.
Once is an accident. Twice is coincidence. Three times is an enemy action. Bus Driver can never target themselves I'm sorry
LSB
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5171 Posts
December 27 2010 20:25 GMT
#310
On December 28 2010 05:23 Jackal58 wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
       I voted Jackal for the same reason, but actually am inclined now to vote for someone else with his excuse, but will actively be pressuring him in PM land to contribute more so. Jackal, that's why your being voted. Contribute more and I'll lay off you.

It's all good man. I don't feel like you're picking on me.
Like I already said day 1 lynch is a crap shoot.
Unless somebody really steps on their dick.

I've seen it many times actually.

Kenpachi/Coagulation (Almost, but we switched)- Deconduo's Don't lose your village game
Me/Pyrr- TLMMM 2
Me- Harry Potter Mafia
Masq- Haunted Mafia
Bill Murray (Almost, but Ace made us switch x.x)- Penalty Mafia
And many others...
Once is an accident. Twice is coincidence. Three times is an enemy action. Bus Driver can never target themselves I'm sorry
LSB
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5171 Posts
December 27 2010 20:26 GMT
#311
On December 28 2010 05:23 LunarDestiny wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 28 2010 04:57 Barundar wrote:
I’m sorry to point it out, but I can’t help but notice how general and unproductive your posts are, LunarDestiny.

At some point on day1, we should come up with a list of possible lynch and that will encourage those people on the list to speak up

1) Lists are a good way to appear like you are contributing, without actually adding anything.
I want to put pressure on all inactives to speak up and maybe contribution.

2) Pressure is not done in general, pressure is specific to make the player unable to hide. Your list of pressuring “all” inactives is the same as pressuring none.

3) There is a fine line between a plan, and suggestions that make you appear to be active while sending the town on a goosechase. Your plan requires no work from yourself (“we” should do this and that), is very general (“at some point”), and it’s limited to inactives instead of scumhunting, making it mechanic, so even when we hit town, the mafia is not guilty.

In general, the player list is a little more stacked with active players than Pokemafia/HPmafia, so inactives shouldn’t be as much as a problem (even if I just replaced one…)

My respond is above. (Thought I could post right under without quoting)

Okay, now your post makes a bit more sense.
But the point still stands. Why is it so bad to put pressure on one person and then move? Why is this better than RNG?
Once is an accident. Twice is coincidence. Three times is an enemy action. Bus Driver can never target themselves I'm sorry
annul
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2841 Posts
December 27 2010 20:29 GMT
#312
On December 28 2010 04:40 DoctorHelvetica wrote:
The problem is when we focus too much on inactives we start calling people scum just because they didn't post enough when the far more disturbing trend is posting a lot/posting big posts and saying absolutely nothing helpful:


like LSB?
Jackal58
Profile Joined November 2010
United States4264 Posts
December 27 2010 20:33 GMT
#313
On December 28 2010 05:25 LSB wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 28 2010 05:23 Jackal58 wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
       I voted Jackal for the same reason, but actually am inclined now to vote for someone else with his excuse, but will actively be pressuring him in PM land to contribute more so. Jackal, that's why your being voted. Contribute more and I'll lay off you.

It's all good man. I don't feel like you're picking on me.
Like I already said day 1 lynch is a crap shoot.
Unless somebody really steps on their dick.

I've seen it many times actually.

Kenpachi/Coagulation (Almost, but we switched)- Deconduo's Don't lose your village game
Me/Pyrr- TLMMM 2
Me- Harry Potter Mafia
Masq- Haunted Mafia
Bill Murray (Almost, but Ace made us switch x.x)- Penalty Mafia
And many others...

And the closest I've seen to that is TheMango. Yet he is not getting any love.
Life can only kill you once.
LunarDestiny
Profile Blog Joined August 2008
United States4177 Posts
December 27 2010 20:34 GMT
#314
On December 28 2010 05:23 LSB wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 28 2010 05:20 LunarDestiny wrote:
@1)I want to ask you how should we put pressure on specific player to contribute. It would be bad if a mafia is calling out inactive townie. Also, who should we choose? Go to a list of inactive and randomly pick one of them and say "xxxx, please contribute."

@2)If the list is short enough (less than 10 people?), then the list is convincing enough to pressure people to speak up.

What's the difference between the two scenarios?

In both we are putting pressure on people to contribute. In both we need to make a list of inactives.

Because if we do something like "xxxx you have not been contributing and that makes you look mafia, please contribute."
We get contribution like Mr.Wiggle which is good. But if the mafia is the one pointing fingers, then other mafia will be left alone. Also, we are targeting a smaller group of people compared to having a list of people.

I also like to say that I am not discouraging pointing fingers at non-inactive. Having debates between active players especially useful since it is the best way to find mafia because a mafia dt checks on these people are less convincing than other mafia games.
annul
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2841 Posts
December 27 2010 20:39 GMT
#315
On December 28 2010 04:49 Pandain wrote:
1.I do not think we should vote LSB. Plainly, he has been contributing alot so far, more than most of the people already. Plainly, if he is mafia, then we'll most likely catch him anyway. We should not be lynching actives, even if we have a slight suspicion that he's mafia. Obviously if we have a good inkling I suppose we should go for it(as in team melee mafia 2 incog fingered lsb day 1) but right now there's really nothing on LSB, and I wouldn't want to lynch an expierenced player. Plus there are some problems with your analysis, but I'll just name a few.
       1. If you are hit, then u should claim. LSB was right. Becuase mafia can't tell if ur vet or just protected or what.
       2.You're mistaking jokes for real content. (aka when lsb said coag got banned so dr. h could join)
       3.The only real suspicious thing about him is his somewhat spammy nature.
The most important of which being number 3, but that is certainly not a reason to lynch him when he's already contributed alot.


this worries me

i already highlighted LSB's defense of pandain. now pandain is defending LSB on my FOS. in and of itself that is fine but his rationale is "if hes mafia, we'll catch him anyway" ... whaaaaaat?

basically pandain is saying "so what if he acts scummy day 1, if hes mafia he will act scummy days 2-X and we can lynch him then" <--- am i missing something here when i call this horrible logic?

on point: i am not so sure public claiming of being hit is 100% the smart play, but am willing to be persuaded on this strategy debate. note that even if LSB turns out correct and this is the proper strategy, it does not acquit him of scumminess.

second, "mistaking jokes for real content" makes me scratch my head. can anyone just out and say "JUST KIDDING LOL" if someone calls them up on something?

i think a big part of my case against him is in the spammy nature, as you call it. he posts a lot without actually posting a lot, you know what i mean? its that plus his case against inactives that bothers me.
LSB
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5171 Posts
December 27 2010 20:40 GMT
#316
On December 28 2010 05:34 LunarDestiny wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 28 2010 05:23 LSB wrote:
On December 28 2010 05:20 LunarDestiny wrote:
@1)I want to ask you how should we put pressure on specific player to contribute. It would be bad if a mafia is calling out inactive townie. Also, who should we choose? Go to a list of inactive and randomly pick one of them and say "xxxx, please contribute."

@2)If the list is short enough (less than 10 people?), then the list is convincing enough to pressure people to speak up.

What's the difference between the two scenarios?

In both we are putting pressure on people to contribute. In both we need to make a list of inactives.

Because if we do something like "xxxx you have not been contributing and that makes you look mafia, please contribute."
We get contribution like Mr.Wiggle which is good. But if the mafia is the one pointing fingers, then other mafia will be left alone. Also, we are targeting a smaller group of people compared to having a list of people.

Yes but we would be pointing fingers at every single inactive. We wouldn't just focus on one (Like how a lynch would work), we would just take notice of people and ask them questions.

On a somewhat related note...

On December 28 2010 05:33 Jackal58 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 28 2010 05:25 LSB wrote:
On December 28 2010 05:23 Jackal58 wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
       I voted Jackal for the same reason, but actually am inclined now to vote for someone else with his excuse, but will actively be pressuring him in PM land to contribute more so. Jackal, that's why your being voted. Contribute more and I'll lay off you.

It's all good man. I don't feel like you're picking on me.
Like I already said day 1 lynch is a crap shoot.
Unless somebody really steps on their dick.

I've seen it many times actually.

Kenpachi/Coagulation (Almost, but we switched)- Deconduo's Don't lose your village game
Me/Pyrr- TLMMM 2
Me- Harry Potter Mafia
Masq- Haunted Mafia
Bill Murray (Almost, but Ace made us switch x.x)- Penalty Mafia
And many others...

And the closest I've seen to that is TheMango. Yet he is not getting any love.

Well, there's a few good discussion points right now.
Like what do you think of me?

As for TheMango, I'll PM him then
Once is an accident. Twice is coincidence. Three times is an enemy action. Bus Driver can never target themselves I'm sorry
LSB
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5171 Posts
December 27 2010 20:42 GMT
#317
On December 28 2010 05:39 annul wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 28 2010 04:49 Pandain wrote:
1.I do not think we should vote LSB. Plainly, he has been contributing alot so far, more than most of the people already. Plainly, if he is mafia, then we'll most likely catch him anyway. We should not be lynching actives, even if we have a slight suspicion that he's mafia. Obviously if we have a good inkling I suppose we should go for it(as in team melee mafia 2 incog fingered lsb day 1) but right now there's really nothing on LSB, and I wouldn't want to lynch an expierenced player. Plus there are some problems with your analysis, but I'll just name a few.
       1. If you are hit, then u should claim. LSB was right. Becuase mafia can't tell if ur vet or just protected or what.
       2.You're mistaking jokes for real content. (aka when lsb said coag got banned so dr. h could join)
       3.The only real suspicious thing about him is his somewhat spammy nature.
The most important of which being number 3, but that is certainly not a reason to lynch him when he's already contributed alot.


this worries me

i already highlighted LSB's defense of pandain. now pandain is defending LSB on my FOS. in and of itself that is fine but his rationale is "if hes mafia, we'll catch him anyway" ... whaaaaaat?

Just wondering. What do you mean that "highlight"?
Once is an accident. Twice is coincidence. Three times is an enemy action. Bus Driver can never target themselves I'm sorry
annul
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2841 Posts
December 27 2010 20:43 GMT
#318
by "highlight" i mean illuminated it in my initial analysis of you
LSB
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
United States5171 Posts
December 27 2010 20:44 GMT
#319
Like state what happened?
Once is an accident. Twice is coincidence. Three times is an enemy action. Bus Driver can never target themselves I'm sorry
annul
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States2841 Posts
December 27 2010 20:45 GMT
#320
yes, point out, draw attention to, etc.

you know when you highlight text in a book? to draw your eyes to important things later when you study? like that
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