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meathook
1289 Posts
On December 15 2009 19:33 lazz wrote: yeah pretty obvious he fixed those last wins Ban all players who have won against their countrymen during odd hours of the day. Get some more self-proclaimed internet sleuths on it. Come on, guys, lets do this! | ||
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Robinsa
Japan1333 Posts
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PhilGood2DaY
Germany7424 Posts
except if the games were obviously thrown.. replays will show it if it should be the case | ||
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Kizlyk
Ukraine84 Posts
On December 15 2009 19:33 lazz wrote: yeah pretty obvious he fixed those last wins He also played Dimaga only one hour before that (4:30) and lost, and also HappyZerg was contender for top48 - so that fact alone does not mean cheating. | ||
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BlueStar
Bulgaria1168 Posts
look at last game - started @ 5:52 MSK - duration 05:31 min (ended 3 minutes before closing the TSL2 ladder). If it's not a thrown game he has to be the luckiest man from all those 48 players who qualied ^^ | ||
Carnac
Germany / USA16648 Posts
On December 15 2009 23:12 BlueStar wrote: http://www.iccup.com/matchlist/891177/1x1.html look at last game - started @ 5:52 MSK - duration 05:31 min (ended 3 minutes before closing the TSL2 ladder). If it's not a thrown game he has to be the luckiest man from all those 48 players who qualied ^^ The fact that it ended 3 minutes before closing doesn't mean anything, they could have played a 1 hr game and it would still have counted. It's only the starting time (must have started before Dec 13 06:00:00 MSK) that matters. I dunno if they were thrown or not, just saying the end time of a game doesn't matter | ||
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BlueStar
Bulgaria1168 Posts
Imho Marwin is really good and nice player just the circumstances are really questionable. | ||
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HwangjaeTerran
Finland5967 Posts
On December 16 2009 00:36 BlueStar wrote: I just mention that it's very suspicious nothing more. Everybody will agree with me. Imho Marwin is really good and nice player just the circumstances are really questionable. I don´t agree with you. Everything starts to look suspicious when you think they do. I mean probably 95% of the players on the verge played faster games towards the end. If you need fast points there´s not much reason in going for hour long macro game everytime. | ||
tree.hugger
Philadelphia, PA10406 Posts
On December 16 2009 00:36 BlueStar wrote: I just mention that it's very suspicious nothing more. Everybody will agree with me. Imho Marwin is really good and nice player just the circumstances are really questionable. I'm not saying Marwin is a cheating low-lying piece of filth. I'm just asking questions. Me? I don't believe that Marwin is cheating by stealing wins at strange hours off of his countrymen. No, I don't know if that's true or not, and maybe it isn't. But don't you think it's a little odd? Don't you think it's a little suspicious? Hey, don't look at me. I like Marwin personally. Good guy, nice kids. I have nothing against him personally. But, I'm just raising questions. That's all. Don't look at me, I didn't play a series of highly suspect matches against someone I may know because they reside in my country. I'm not an admin. No, I'm just a concerned citizen of TL. And I see this tournament, and... and I... I... I fear for it. + Show Spoiler + Man up, cut the stupid "questionable" argument and come out and say what you mean. | ||
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BlueStar
Bulgaria1168 Posts
On December 16 2009 00:46 HwangjaeTerran wrote: I don´t agree with you. Everything starts to look suspicious when you think they do. I mean probably 95% of the players on the verge played faster games towards the end. If you need fast points there´s not much reason in going for hour long macro game everytime. Probably u r right. I hope u are, cause we already saw many ppl disqualified. Nobody else looked strange to me except marw, and i'm really curious if everything is okay or not ;s P.S. tree.hugger - eh? | ||
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Funnytoss
Taiwan1471 Posts
On December 16 2009 00:54 tree.hugger wrote: I'm not saying Marwin is a cheating low-lying piece of filth. I'm just asking questions. Me? I don't believe that Marwin is cheating by stealing wins at strange hours off of his countrymen. No, I don't know if that's true or not, and maybe it isn't. But don't you think it's a little odd? Don't you think it's a little suspicious? Hey, don't look at me. I like Marwin personally. Good guy, nice kids. I have nothing against him personally. But, I'm just raising questions. That's all. Don't look at me, I didn't play a series of highly suspect matches against someone I may know because they reside in my country. I'm not an admin. No, I'm just a concerned citizen of TL. And I see this tournament, and... and I... I... I fear for it. + Show Spoiler + Man up, cut the stupid "questionable" argument and come out and say what you mean. lol. I wonder how many people catch the reference... | ||
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WhuazGoodJaggah
Lesotho777 Posts
On December 16 2009 00:54 tree.hugger wrote: I'm not saying Marwin is a cheating low-lying piece of filth. I'm just asking questions. Me? I don't believe that Marwin is cheating by stealing wins at strange hours off of his countrymen. No, I don't know if that's true or not, and maybe it isn't. But don't you think it's a little odd? Don't you think it's a little suspicious? Hey, don't look at me. I like Marwin personally. Good guy, nice kids. I have nothing against him personally. But, I'm just raising questions. That's all. Don't look at me, I didn't play a series of highly suspect matches against someone I may know because they reside in my country. I'm not an admin. No, I'm just a concerned citizen of TL. And I see this tournament, and... and I... I... I fear for it. + Show Spoiler + Man up, cut the stupid "questionable" argument and come out and say what you mean. exactly that! fuck those gay ass suggestiv questions. | ||
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NoNameLoser
United States1508 Posts
On December 16 2009 00:54 tree.hugger wrote: I'm not saying Marwin is a cheating low-lying piece of filth. I'm just asking questions. Me? I don't believe that Marwin is cheating by stealing wins at strange hours off of his countrymen. No, I don't know if that's true or not, and maybe it isn't. But don't you think it's a little odd? Don't you think it's a little suspicious? Hey, don't look at me. I like Marwin personally. Good guy, nice kids. I have nothing against him personally. But, I'm just raising questions. That's all. Don't look at me, I didn't play a series of highly suspect matches against someone I may know because they reside in my country. I'm not an admin. No, I'm just a concerned citizen of TL. And I see this tournament, and... and I... I... I fear for it. + Show Spoiler + Man up, cut the stupid "questionable" argument and come out and say what you mean. South Park? | ||
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antiq
Slovakia191 Posts
On December 16 2009 01:32 Funnytoss wrote: lol. I wonder how many people catch the reference... Glenn Beck, my dear fellow, is a poet. As he would've put it, I think that the dq'd players are abusers. I'm not saying that they abused... On a more serious note though - to all the other posters who said that the system is flawed: The system would've been just fine if people had some backbone. The externality of hyping up the event should've been to promote such patriot-ish moral standards.. like that this is a fine event organized by a super dedicated community and I will give my best win it by fair means. How can there be so many abusers then? Is it the money? Or do they do it always like this, because "it's just the internetz"? Maybe I'm an idealist but I didn't see it coming on such scale :/ and I guess the staff didn't either. Maybe we thought that the best players we know and love for teh skill are some sorta moral superbeings. | ||
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AstraBoy
Peru363 Posts
Any explanation about this case will be great, Thanks | ||
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Liquid`Nazgul
22427 Posts
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scwizard
United States1195 Posts
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hiro protagonist
1294 Posts
On December 16 2009 00:54 tree.hugger wrote: I'm not saying Marwin is a cheating low-lying piece of filth. I'm just asking questions. Me? I don't believe that Marwin is cheating by stealing wins at strange hours off of his countrymen. No, I don't know if that's true or not, and maybe it isn't. But don't you think it's a little odd? Don't you think it's a little suspicious? Hey, don't look at me. I like Marwin personally. Good guy, nice kids. I have nothing against him personally. But, I'm just raising questions. That's all. Don't look at me, I didn't play a series of highly suspect matches against someone I may know because they reside in my country. I'm not an admin. No, I'm just a concerned citizen of TL. And I see this tournament, and... and I... I... I fear for it. + Show Spoiler + Man up, cut the stupid "questionable" argument and come out and say what you mean. glen beck, am I right? | ||
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rei
United States3594 Posts
On December 14 2009 13:16 Liquid`Nazgul wrote: F91 didn't get caught, he admitted when asked about it. F91 is truly the only one who has a legit complaints of being dodged as all of TSL avoided him because of lag and maybe skill as well. A deadly combo that no one is to blame for. It made it a very hard ladder for him, harder than for the others, but F91 and Ash were well aware and informed about this in advance of the ladder. We all knew this was going to be the case for him before he joined so there was nothing new there. When offered half-way to use a smurf he declined because it wasn't needed. They said it would be no problem getting top 12 playing vs Koreans and it seemed like that was going to hold true till F91 stopped playing. Near the end they requested to smurf but with so little time left we denied the request because this close to the deadline we felt it wouldn't be fair to opponents not to be aware of who they were facing, as losing 1 or 2 games could make a huge difference on the final 2 days. None of this should ever be an excuse to abuse. The only people who really get dodged are the ones good enough to beat all the Koreans (F91, Ret, Idra, White-ra). Not TSL-Reason don't make me laugh. Being good enough to be dodged means you are good enough to make it regardless, unless you refuse to put sufficient time in. Plz don't ban F91 from future TL events facts: 1) F91 needed top 12 because of timing of Q3 is near the official TLSL2 event. 2) F91 made it to top 12 by playing all koreans 3) F91 stop playing because he thought he is already secured top 12 4) Others in top 12 abused the ladder very late in the ladder stage to inflate the Top 12 cut off rating 5) F91 needed to get back into top12, but time is now a huge factor. 6) F91 is being dodged by all foreigners in the latter stage of the ladder. ( they requested a smurf account as a result, but was denied) 7) F91 asked friend to help him with abusing the ladder, as it was impossible to get back to top 12 with the inflated rating and the time that was left. 8) F91 straight up replied "yes I abused" when asked about this situation, And he didn't attempt to explain himself with the above 7 other facts. Based on these facts, I would consider F91 as a victim of unforeseen events, he was forced into this situation. He didn't create the situation, but he made the wrong decision to deal with the situation. Logically we should consider all these facts before we decide his right in future participation of TL events. Now ending of facts, my personal opinion is F91 should be allow to participate in future TL events, with promise that he will never abuse again. Put yourself in his situation, what can you do with so little time left at the end of the ladder, and the Smurf option was retracted without prior notice about its availability at end of the ladder. There are 2 choices, play more koreans or abuse. I feel that the right choice is to keep playing koreans from 3am for the rest of the day regardless how tired he was, and hope for the best. I suspect F91 also aware of this option, and the reason he didn't choose might be because he tried, lost, due to the fact of being too tired and lacking concentration. He realized any more games will drop his rating instead of increasing it. The time was running out, he had no more option available to him other than cheat. If TL acted sooner, or notice him the possibility of his below top12 ranking might not be final due to others' abuse, he would not have cheated, The responsibility of choosing to cheat is on F91 alone, but the scenario is not created by F91 base on these facts. So please do not deny F91's right in future TL events, we love to see him in foreigner events. | ||
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Liquid`Nazgul
22427 Posts
If TL acted sooner, or notice him the possibility of his below top12 ranking might not be final due to others' abuse, he would not have cheated, The responsibility of choosing to cheat is on F91 alone, but the scenario is not created by F91 base on these facts. I don't think it's appropriate to assume things like this. There was contact about F91s rank with Ash and he was very aware F91 was not playing enough to make it to the end with his current rank, and harassed F91 to play more. Other than that I'm not going to respond here about future punishment. It is a very sensitive subject which needs a lot of staff discussion before we come out with verdicts. | ||
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