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On January 27 2014 09:47 Froadac wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2014 08:23 skyR wrote:
Unless you're streaming, encoding, or doing something requiring four or more cores, I really don't think FX6300 is a good choice. Fair enough. I do a fair bit of encoding but nothing ridiculous. I have a 955BE right now, and there is a bit of a stupid reaction when you go from 4 cores to 2. What would you consider to be the superior choice? Is the dual core i3 simply superior at that price point? I was reading benchmarks that seemed to indicate that in terms of overall power the AMD is superior but of course per core is oftentimes the more important metric.
Yes it's strange going from four to two but I think you'd be surprised at how powerful a Core i3 or even Pentium is. A Core i3 Haswell would be on par or better than a Phenom II X4 955 (at stock) in most tasks despite it having two less physical cores.
The upsides to the FX6300 is that it can be overclocked if you wish to dabble into that domain and it would be better suited than a Core i3 for well threaded tasks such as encoding. Its downsides is that it consumes a lot more power, it lags significantly behind a Core i3 Haswell in lightly threaded tasks (eg. gaming), and it doesn't have an IGP.
I don't know about you but I rather take a small hit on encoding performance to have an IGP so I at least still have a functional computer if the GPU dies. IGP also comes in handy for more monitors.
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United Kingdom20318 Posts
For encoding with all available cores:
OC 4770k
OC 4670k / OC 8350
~stock 4670 / 8350
further down list
OC fx6300
OC (like mid to high 4ghz range) kaveri
stock i3/kaveri
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Looks reasonable. Would the change in cost to hte i5 make it more noticeable? My budget is flexible. I Could really spend up to 1k but I'm looking for maximum performance/$, and I don't need much more performance than what I had.
I'm almost sure I'll pick up a ssd now though.
How goes IGP help with more monitors?
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United Kingdom20318 Posts
i5 is significantly better than i3, but if you're comparing lower end i5's (instead of a 4670) against ~3.4-3.6ghz i3, you can lose a bit of frequency. Turbo boost and probably cache makes up for it a bit, but it wouldn't surprise me if a cheap i5 benched worse than expensive i3 in a few cases (when the extra cores/cache were not utilized) though it should be very close or better all the time, sometimes a lot better
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/aHbpOP1.png)
iGPU helps with more monitors because it gives more slots to plug in. Belial always goes on about how Haswell iGPU lets you run like three screens without a gpu. Not sure if it's relevant if you have spare slots on GPU already - i have mine disabled right now because i like laughing at 4 watt idle power readings on cpu in c6/c7
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What is your current build?
Mobo: ASRock G41M-VS2 (repair guy says this one needs to be replaced)
RAM: maybe 1 or 2GB, can't decipher the label
CPU: Intel Pentium e5300 Dual-core 2.6GHz (don't know if CPU is still working, repair guy says Mobo is the only one that needs to be repaired/replaced)
HDD: Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 (250GB)
PSU: Powerlogic 500W
Case: generic
What is your monitor's native resolution?
1366 x 768
Why do you want to upgrade? What do you want to achieve with the upgrade?
1. Mother wants to revive this old PC gathering dust at the corner of our house; siblings have to make their own projects, documents, etc.
2. Gaming on low settings.
3. Learn a thing or two by upgrading this old PC before I build a PC of my own. 
What is your budget?
~$130-$150 (est Php6000 ~ Php8000)
What country will you be buying your parts in?
Philippines
If you have any brand or retailer preferences, please specify.
( http://enigma-phil.com.ph/ )
( pricelist )
(pricing might differ by about +$2~4 here in the province(+Php100~Php200))
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What I came up with, so far:
+ Show Spoiler +Build A (AMD):
Php2,815 AMD TRINITY A6 5400K 3.8GHZ (DUAL CORE)
Php2,600 MSI FM2-A75MA-P33 DDR3,DVI,8CH,GLAN
Php2,045 KINGSTON 4GB DDR3 PC10600/1333
Build B (Intel):
Php2,555 INTEL PENTIUM G2020 2.9GHZ LGA 1155 IVY BRIDGE
Php2,265 ASUS H61M-E LGA1155, DDR3,VGA,LAN,USB
Php2,045 KINGSTON 4GB DDR3 PC10600/1333
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Thanks for checking guys.
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On January 06 2014 21:13 cSc.Dav1oN wrote:
Okay final build:
MSI H81M-E33 Socket 1150 (~44 Euro)
Intel Core i3 4130 3.4GHz (3mb, Haswell, 54W, S1150) (~99 Euro)
GF GTX650 1Gb GDDR5 MSI (N650-1GD5/OC v1) (~85 Euro)
DDR3 2x4GB 1600MHz Goodram 1,5v (~63 Euro)
Case + PSU ProLogix A05B/5026 Black PSS-460W-12cm (~45 Euro)
Monitor Acer 23" TFT G236HLBbd (ET.VG6HE.B03) Black (~119 Euro)
HDD SATA 1.0Tb WD, 6Gb/s, 64Mb, Caviar Blue (~50 Euro)
Total: 505 Euro
P.S. Strange to have a monitor as the most expensive part O_o
Am quoting my previous post and pc build a bit changed, u guys, please tell me if something not worth istelf
MSI H81M-E33 Socket 1150
Intel Core i5 4440 3.1GHz (6mb, Haswell, 84W, S1150) Box
GF GTX650 1Gb GDDR5 ASUS (GTX650-DC-1GD5)
DDR3 2x4GB 1600MHz Team Xtreem Vulcan Orange, 9-9-9-24
Aerocool Strike X 500 500W 80+ (PSU)
HDD SATA 500Gb WD, 16Mb Caviar Blue
Case - ProLogix A11/11713 Black
Monitor - Acer 23" TFT G236HLBbd (ET.VG6HE.B03) Black
Summary is 610 Euro
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United Kingdom20318 Posts
On January 27 2014 19:46 cSc.Dav1oN wrote:Show nested quote +On January 06 2014 21:13 cSc.Dav1oN wrote:
Okay final build:
MSI H81M-E33 Socket 1150 (~44 Euro)
Intel Core i3 4130 3.4GHz (3mb, Haswell, 54W, S1150) (~99 Euro)
GF GTX650 1Gb GDDR5 MSI (N650-1GD5/OC v1) (~85 Euro)
DDR3 2x4GB 1600MHz Goodram 1,5v (~63 Euro)
Case + PSU ProLogix A05B/5026 Black PSS-460W-12cm (~45 Euro)
Monitor Acer 23" TFT G236HLBbd (ET.VG6HE.B03) Black (~119 Euro)
HDD SATA 1.0Tb WD, 6Gb/s, 64Mb, Caviar Blue (~50 Euro)
Total: 505 Euro
P.S. Strange to have a monitor as the most expensive part O_o
Am quoting my previous post and pc build a bit changed, u guys, please tell me if something not worth istelf MSI H81M-E33 Socket 1150 Intel Core i5 4440 3.1GHz (6mb, Haswell, 84W, S1150) Box GF GTX650 1Gb GDDR5 ASUS (GTX650-DC-1GD5) DDR3 2x4GB 1600MHz Team Xtreem Vulcan Orange, 9-9-9-24 Aerocool Strike X 500 500W 80+ (PSU) HDD SATA 500Gb WD, 16Mb Caviar Blue Case - ProLogix A11/11713 Black Monitor - Acer 23" TFT G236HLBbd (ET.VG6HE.B03) Black Summary is 610 Euro
HD 7790 and GTX 650 Ti are (afaik) very close in terms of both price and performance so go with either one.
650 and 650ti are not even close - and i5+650 is kind of pushing it too hard on cpu front
650ti is 768 cuda core, 650 is 384 cuda core (2.0x..)
I was surprised that nvidia made two gpu's with such a performance difference by adding a "ti" on the name, but they did similar things in a few cases, don't get caught out on it
Also, i5 4440 is 300mhz slower than 4570, 500mhz slower than 4670 so best option depends a lot on what tier of CPU you want and on pricing
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I said 7790 though, not 7770.
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United Kingdom20318 Posts
On January 27 2014 20:15 Incognoto wrote:
I said 7790 though, not 7770.
I was saying he picked a 650, and not a 650ti
650ti is way more powerful than 650 is - in ideal loads, 2x as powerful, in a variety of games, over 1.5x
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On January 27 2014 20:06 Cyro wrote:Show nested quote +On January 27 2014 19:46 cSc.Dav1oN wrote:On January 06 2014 21:13 cSc.Dav1oN wrote:
Okay final build:
MSI H81M-E33 Socket 1150 (~44 Euro)
Intel Core i3 4130 3.4GHz (3mb, Haswell, 54W, S1150) (~99 Euro)
GF GTX650 1Gb GDDR5 MSI (N650-1GD5/OC v1) (~85 Euro)
DDR3 2x4GB 1600MHz Goodram 1,5v (~63 Euro)
Case + PSU ProLogix A05B/5026 Black PSS-460W-12cm (~45 Euro)
Monitor Acer 23" TFT G236HLBbd (ET.VG6HE.B03) Black (~119 Euro)
HDD SATA 1.0Tb WD, 6Gb/s, 64Mb, Caviar Blue (~50 Euro)
Total: 505 Euro
P.S. Strange to have a monitor as the most expensive part O_o
Am quoting my previous post and pc build a bit changed, u guys, please tell me if something not worth istelf MSI H81M-E33 Socket 1150 Intel Core i5 4440 3.1GHz (6mb, Haswell, 84W, S1150) Box GF GTX650 1Gb GDDR5 ASUS (GTX650-DC-1GD5) DDR3 2x4GB 1600MHz Team Xtreem Vulcan Orange, 9-9-9-24 Aerocool Strike X 500 500W 80+ (PSU) HDD SATA 500Gb WD, 16Mb Caviar Blue Case - ProLogix A11/11713 Black Monitor - Acer 23" TFT G236HLBbd (ET.VG6HE.B03) Black Summary is 610 Euro Show nested quote +HD 7790 and GTX 650 Ti are (afaik) very close in terms of both price and performance so go with either one. 650 and 650ti are not even close - and i5+650 is kind of pushing it too hard on cpu front 650ti is 768 cuda core, 650 is 384 cuda core (2.0x..) I was surprised that nvidia made two gpu's with such a performance difference by adding a "ti" on the name, but they did similar things in a few cases, don't get caught out on it Also, i5 4440 is 300mhz slower than 4570, 500mhz slower than 4670 so best option depends a lot on what tier of CPU you want and on pricing
Mid-tier CPU, but it seems to be possible to stream starcraft2 on middle setting with that kind of build. With i3 it is not possible.
650 and 650ti got very close numbers in core clock and memory clock with price difference like 20 euros
GF GTX650 1Gb GDDR5 ASUS (GTX650-DC-1GD5) - Memory Clock (MHz): 5000 Core Clock (MHz): 1058
GF GTX650Ti 1Gb GDDR5 ASUS (GTX650TI-1GD5) - Memory Clock (MHz): 5400 Core Clock (MHz): 928
Difference in actual chipset is that big?
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I'm considering buying this setup for laptop.
GTX780m 4GB
Intel Core i7-4700MQ 4x2,40GHz
Kingston 8GB DDR3-1600 RAM
Samsung 840 250GB SSD Solid State disk
What would you guys consider a fair price for this. Currently I've found it to around 1600€ with windows 8.1.
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United Kingdom20318 Posts
Mid-tier CPU, but it seems to be possible to stream starcraft2 on middle setting with that kind of build. With i3 it is not possible.
i3 and 7850k are rivals at stock. They're better than many older cpu's, like stock first gen i5 and phenom II x4. You can stream sc2 on i3/7850k.
Remember, Haswell i3 is clocked like 15% higher than ivy bridge and also has about a 15% lead clock-for-clock in x264, which is the encoder that OBS and Xsplit use for streaming. Those two added together make it ~1.3225x as powerful
650 and 650ti got very close numbers in core clock and memory clock with price difference like 20 euros
GF GTX650 1Gb GDDR5 ASUS (GTX650-DC-1GD5) - Memory Clock (MHz): 5000 Core Clock (MHz): 1058
GF GTX650Ti 1Gb GDDR5 ASUS (GTX650TI-1GD5) - Memory Clock (MHz): 5400 Core Clock (MHz): 928
Memory clock at stock is almost irrelevant - they're both on 128 bit bus, will probably use the same VRAM anyway. You can probably clock them the same - not guaranteed, but it's close enough to not >really< matter.
Core clock you can probably manually set. 650 might have higher settable voltage, so it might clock a bit higher, but not much.
650ti has twice as many cores as 650. Even if both memory clock and core clock advantages hold up for the 650, a Haswell CPU @5ghz with two cores enabled does not beat the same CPU @4.5ghz with all four cores enabled. Simple numbers game, 384 cudas (2smx) vs 768 cudas (4smx).
650ti has 2x as many cores and TMU's, but the same amount of ROP's, and basically the same memory bandwidth. If those last two things did not hold it back, it would be literally twice as fast - as it stands, it's not nearly 2x, but it's over 1.5x as fast as the 650 (depends on the game how much more than that) - that's a big difference to accidentally take when buying
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United Kingdom20318 Posts
On January 27 2014 20:37 Ota Solgryn wrote:
I'm considering buying this setup for laptop.
GTX780m 4GB
Intel Core i7-4700MQ 4x2,40GHz
Kingston 8GB DDR3-1600 RAM
Samsung 840 250GB SSD Solid State disk
What would you guys consider a fair price for this. Currently I've found it to around 1600€ with windows 8.1.
Seems ok, depends on other stuff on laptop like chassis+cooling quality, keyboard, screen, warranty etc
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On January 27 2014 21:09 Cyro wrote:Show nested quote +Mid-tier CPU, but it seems to be possible to stream starcraft2 on middle setting with that kind of build. With i3 it is not possible. i3 and 7850k are rivals at stock. They're better than many older cpu's, like stock first gen i5 and phenom II x4. You can stream sc2 on i3/7850k. Remember, Haswell i3 is clocked like 15% higher than ivy bridge and also has about a 15% lead clock-for-clock in x264, which is the encoder that OBS and Xsplit use for streaming. Those two added together make it ~1.3225x as powerful Show nested quote +650 and 650ti got very close numbers in core clock and memory clock with price difference like 20 euros
GF GTX650 1Gb GDDR5 ASUS (GTX650-DC-1GD5) - Memory Clock (MHz): 5000 Core Clock (MHz): 1058
GF GTX650Ti 1Gb GDDR5 ASUS (GTX650TI-1GD5) - Memory Clock (MHz): 5400 Core Clock (MHz): 928 Memory clock at stock is almost irrelevant - they're both on 128 bit bus, will probably use the same VRAM anyway. You can probably clock them the same - not guaranteed, but it's close enough to not >really< matter. Core clock you can probably manually set. 650 might have higher settable voltage, so it might clock a bit higher, but not much. 650ti has twice as many cores as 650. Even if both memory clock and core clock advantages hold up for the 650, a Haswell CPU @5ghz with two cores enabled does not beat the same CPU @4.5ghz with all four cores enabled. Simple numbers game, 384 cudas (2smx) vs 768 cudas (4smx). 650ti has 2x as many cores and TMU's, but the same amount of ROP's, and basically the same memory bandwidth. If those last two things did not hold it back, it would be literally twice as fast - as it stands, it's not nearly 2x, but it's over 1.5x as fast as the 650 (depends on the game how much more than that) - that's a big difference to accidentally take when buying
I'm completely lost now, talking about CPU and GPU and if I have to choose for streaming also, we have:
CPU's
Intel Core i3 4130 3.4GHz (3mb, Haswell, 54W, S1150) or Intel Core i5 4440 3.1GHz (6mb, Haswell, 84W, S1150) Box
GPU's
GF GTX650 1Gb GDDR5 ASUS (GTX650-DC-1GD5) or ATI Radeon HD7770 1Gb GDDR5 Asus (HD7770-DC-1GD5-V2)
and GF GTX650Ti 1Gb GDDR5 ASUS (GTX650TI-1GD5)
My choice for comfortable gaming and streaming will be? Price/quality also matters. Maybe some chart for this combinations?
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United Kingdom20318 Posts
Can do a lot of things, but i5 + 650 is kinda silly
i5 + 650ti is far more powerful
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And i3 with 650 is streamable comfortably?
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United Kingdom20318 Posts
Depends what standards you have
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Resolution 1680x1050 as for 21 inches monitor, as for 23' it would be slightly higher number i guess, graphic settings - let's say all medium, shaders and light might be even low.
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United Kingdom20318 Posts
What's your upload and would you be trying to stream like 1:1 native resolution at max possible stream fps, or are you happy with like half resolution (840x525) @30fps? (sorry if you went over this before, i can't easily check previous posts in thread any more)
1680x1050@60fps is ~4x as much load as 840x525@60fps - and ~8x as much load as 840x525@30fps, so there's definitely room to adjust stream settings to accommodate a cpu that's only "pretty good" rather than "great" or "amazing"
I'd still take 650ti as minimum discrete for nvidia imo - i3+650, i3+650ti, i5+650ti, though it depends on game and how much of a priority streaming is (and at what output settings you want)
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Upload is about 10-12 Mbits, it would be wonderful to stream 1:1 native of a big lesser resolution, cause we're having some ideas in streaming, and it's obvious that it won't be comfortable with 1680x1050@60 fps :/
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EPT
