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Northern Ireland25159 Posts
On March 13 2024 01:08 Mizenhauer wrote:Show nested quote +On March 13 2024 00:36 Nasigil wrote:On March 12 2024 23:10 matju wrote:
Maybe Dark is 2 and Maru/Serral both 1? Just cant believe that Dark did not squeeze in to top10 Miz has implied on multiple occasions Dark is out. But he will make a lengthy blog explaining his reasonings after the list is finished, so there's that to look forward to. Thanks for telling me how long the blog will be. I'll have to add a bunch of filler to meet your requirements 
I think it’s a reasonable assumption given how thorough your entries have been in this series, and you publicising that you’re going to do some kind of blog post covering near-misses and rationales that said posts can assumed to be somewhat in-depth.
Maybe my vibe detection is off today, that felt a bit snippy a response to what I read as ‘don’t give Miz shit, he’s got some supplementary stuff coming’
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United States1852 Posts
On March 13 2024 01:41 WombaT wrote:Show nested quote +On March 13 2024 01:08 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 13 2024 00:36 Nasigil wrote:On March 12 2024 23:10 matju wrote:
Maybe Dark is 2 and Maru/Serral both 1? Just cant believe that Dark did not squeeze in to top10 Miz has implied on multiple occasions Dark is out. But he will make a lengthy blog explaining his reasonings after the list is finished, so there's that to look forward to. Thanks for telling me how long the blog will be. I'll have to add a bunch of filler to meet your requirements I think it’s a reasonable assumption given how thorough your entries have been in this series, and you publicising that you’re going to do some kind of blog post covering near-misses and rationales that said posts can assumed to be somewhat in-depth. Maybe my vibe detection is off today, that felt a bit snippy a response to what I read as ‘don’t give Miz shit, he’s got some supplementary stuff coming’
I think there's a two sentence answer that will appease most people.
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Northern Ireland25159 Posts
On March 13 2024 01:52 Mizenhauer wrote:Show nested quote +On March 13 2024 01:41 WombaT wrote:On March 13 2024 01:08 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 13 2024 00:36 Nasigil wrote:On March 12 2024 23:10 matju wrote:
Maybe Dark is 2 and Maru/Serral both 1? Just cant believe that Dark did not squeeze in to top10 Miz has implied on multiple occasions Dark is out. But he will make a lengthy blog explaining his reasonings after the list is finished, so there's that to look forward to. Thanks for telling me how long the blog will be. I'll have to add a bunch of filler to meet your requirements I think it’s a reasonable assumption given how thorough your entries have been in this series, and you publicising that you’re going to do some kind of blog post covering near-misses and rationales that said posts can assumed to be somewhat in-depth. Maybe my vibe detection is off today, that felt a bit snippy a response to what I read as ‘don’t give Miz shit, he’s got some supplementary stuff coming’ I think there's a two sentence answer that will appease most people.
You’ve already precluded ‘After careful and multi-faceted consideration… We hereby anoint Mvp as the GOAT’ alas
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United States1852 Posts
On March 13 2024 02:10 WombaT wrote:Show nested quote +On March 13 2024 01:52 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 13 2024 01:41 WombaT wrote:On March 13 2024 01:08 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 13 2024 00:36 Nasigil wrote:On March 12 2024 23:10 matju wrote:
Maybe Dark is 2 and Maru/Serral both 1? Just cant believe that Dark did not squeeze in to top10 Miz has implied on multiple occasions Dark is out. But he will make a lengthy blog explaining his reasonings after the list is finished, so there's that to look forward to. Thanks for telling me how long the blog will be. I'll have to add a bunch of filler to meet your requirements I think it’s a reasonable assumption given how thorough your entries have been in this series, and you publicising that you’re going to do some kind of blog post covering near-misses and rationales that said posts can assumed to be somewhat in-depth. Maybe my vibe detection is off today, that felt a bit snippy a response to what I read as ‘don’t give Miz shit, he’s got some supplementary stuff coming’ I think there's a two sentence answer that will appease most people. You’ve already precluded ‘After careful and multi-faceted consideration… We hereby anoint Mvp as the GOAT’ alas
Believe it or not, but the first question I was asked during my interview way back in 2016 was "is mvp the goat?".
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Northern Ireland25159 Posts
On March 13 2024 02:15 Mizenhauer wrote:Show nested quote +On March 13 2024 02:10 WombaT wrote:On March 13 2024 01:52 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 13 2024 01:41 WombaT wrote:On March 13 2024 01:08 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 13 2024 00:36 Nasigil wrote:On March 12 2024 23:10 matju wrote:
Maybe Dark is 2 and Maru/Serral both 1? Just cant believe that Dark did not squeeze in to top10 Miz has implied on multiple occasions Dark is out. But he will make a lengthy blog explaining his reasonings after the list is finished, so there's that to look forward to. Thanks for telling me how long the blog will be. I'll have to add a bunch of filler to meet your requirements I think it’s a reasonable assumption given how thorough your entries have been in this series, and you publicising that you’re going to do some kind of blog post covering near-misses and rationales that said posts can assumed to be somewhat in-depth. Maybe my vibe detection is off today, that felt a bit snippy a response to what I read as ‘don’t give Miz shit, he’s got some supplementary stuff coming’ I think there's a two sentence answer that will appease most people. You’ve already precluded ‘After careful and multi-faceted consideration… We hereby anoint Mvp as the GOAT’ alas Believe it or not, but the first question I was asked during my interview way back in 2016 was "is mvp the goat?".
Interview for the writing gig I’m presuming?
Whatever your answer was I’m glad you answered correctly, joshing aside this is a fantastic series and it’s not your sole fine work either
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United States1852 Posts
On March 13 2024 02:19 WombaT wrote:Show nested quote +On March 13 2024 02:15 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 13 2024 02:10 WombaT wrote:On March 13 2024 01:52 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 13 2024 01:41 WombaT wrote:On March 13 2024 01:08 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 13 2024 00:36 Nasigil wrote:On March 12 2024 23:10 matju wrote:
Maybe Dark is 2 and Maru/Serral both 1? Just cant believe that Dark did not squeeze in to top10 Miz has implied on multiple occasions Dark is out. But he will make a lengthy blog explaining his reasonings after the list is finished, so there's that to look forward to. Thanks for telling me how long the blog will be. I'll have to add a bunch of filler to meet your requirements I think it’s a reasonable assumption given how thorough your entries have been in this series, and you publicising that you’re going to do some kind of blog post covering near-misses and rationales that said posts can assumed to be somewhat in-depth. Maybe my vibe detection is off today, that felt a bit snippy a response to what I read as ‘don’t give Miz shit, he’s got some supplementary stuff coming’ I think there's a two sentence answer that will appease most people. You’ve already precluded ‘After careful and multi-faceted consideration… We hereby anoint Mvp as the GOAT’ alas Believe it or not, but the first question I was asked during my interview way back in 2016 was "is mvp the goat?". Interview for the writing gig I’m presuming? Whatever your answer was I’m glad you answered correctly, joshing aside this is a fantastic series and it’s not your sole fine work either
It's been a journey. That's for sure.
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I think everyone is assuming that it's going to be Maru at #2 and Serral at #1. It's not obvious to me that the positions won't be reversed based on 1) the criteria selected; and 2) Miz's willingness to take controversial positions that he believes are correct irrespective of community backlash. Not saying it's going to happen, just saying it's an interesting and real possibility.
One thing I didn't see in the criteria that is highly relevant in GOAT convos in other sports and games is the power of narratives and movements and stories, which have a very stubborn quality to them in the way they can overpower numbers and statistics. In the case of Maru, MVP, and Serral, they all have amazing narrative arcs: the child prodigy, the rags-to-riches story, and the foreigner who made the unthinkable feel inevitable. Rogue also has a zero to hero quality to him given the original run that propelled him to sustained greatness, but some of the ways in which he would win were so unappealing that in the end he feels like at best an anti-hero. Maru has the "choking" thing and MVP has the "injury-during-his-prime" thing that disrupt their narratives, whereas Serral's storyline is only really disrupted by never having won a GSL, which seems increasingly not very relevant.
Magnus Carlsen--arguably the Chess GOAT--abdicated the throne for a variety of reasons, but in particular he felt the classical chess format and the championship tournament structure doesn't do a very good job of determining the greatest player. I feel that way about SC2 for a lot of the same reasons. If Chess can evolve in how it's played after centuries, maybe SC2 can do so after a decade
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United States1852 Posts
On March 13 2024 03:25 rwala wrote:I think everyone is assuming that it's going to be Maru at #2 and Serral at #1. It's not obvious to me that the positions won't be reversed based on 1) the criteria selected; and 2) Miz's willingness to take controversial positions that he believes are correct irrespective of community backlash. Not saying it's going to happen, just saying it's an interesting and real possibility. One thing I didn't see in the criteria that is highly relevant in GOAT convos in other sports and games is the power of narratives and movements and stories, which have a very stubborn quality to them in the way they can overpower numbers and statistics. In the case of Maru, MVP, and Serral, they all have amazing narrative arcs: the child prodigy, the rags-to-riches story, and the foreigner who made the unthinkable feel inevitable. Rogue also has a zero to hero quality to him given the original run that propelled him to sustained greatness, but some of the ways in which he would win were so unappealing that in the end he feels like at best an anti-hero. Maru has the "choking" thing and MVP has the "injury-during-his-prime" thing that disrupt their narratives, whereas Serral's storyline is only really disrupted by never having won a GSL, which seems increasingly not very relevant. Magnus Carlsen--arguably the Chess GOAT--abdicated the throne for a variety of reasons, but in particular he felt the classical chess format and the championship tournament structure doesn't do a very good job of determining the greatest player. I feel that way about SC2 for a lot of the same reasons. If Chess can evolve in how it's played after centuries, maybe SC2 can do so after a decade
Narratives > Facts lost out on this one I suppose.
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Poland3748 Posts
I wonder when will we get #2. It is over two weeks. Mvp and Rogue were separate by 8 days.
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United States1852 Posts
On March 14 2024 20:10 nimdil wrote:
I wonder when will we get #2. It is over two weeks. Mvp and Rogue were separate by 8 days.
Which would make total sense for a simultaneous release.
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Poland3748 Posts
On March 14 2024 20:24 Mizenhauer wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2024 20:10 nimdil wrote:
I wonder when will we get #2. It is over two weeks. Mvp and Rogue were separate by 8 days. Which would make total sense for a simultaneous release.
If the interest is focused on order more than actual writing.
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United States1852 Posts
On March 14 2024 21:29 nimdil wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2024 20:24 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 14 2024 20:10 nimdil wrote:
I wonder when will we get #2. It is over two weeks. Mvp and Rogue were separate by 8 days. Which would make total sense for a simultaneous release. If the interest is focused on order more than actual writing.
Well 8+8=16.
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On March 14 2024 20:10 nimdil wrote:
I wonder when will we get #2. It is over two weeks. Mvp and Rogue were separate by 8 days.
He's certainly taking his time with the final 2 isn't he..
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Poland3748 Posts
On March 14 2024 21:44 Mizenhauer wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2024 21:29 nimdil wrote:On March 14 2024 20:24 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 14 2024 20:10 nimdil wrote:
I wonder when will we get #2. It is over two weeks. Mvp and Rogue were separate by 8 days. Which would make total sense for a simultaneous release. If the interest is focused on order more than actual writing. Well 8+8=16.
Rogue was published 16 days ago. So any moment now?
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United States1852 Posts
On March 14 2024 22:27 nimdil wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2024 21:44 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 14 2024 21:29 nimdil wrote:On March 14 2024 20:24 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 14 2024 20:10 nimdil wrote:
I wonder when will we get #2. It is over two weeks. Mvp and Rogue were separate by 8 days. Which would make total sense for a simultaneous release. If the interest is focused on order more than actual writing. Well 8+8=16. Rogue was published 16 days ago. So any moment now?
More than one moment, but less than a few thousand moments.
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Makes sense to me that the two greatest players would take more time to describe than others, but perhaps I should be more French and complain anyway
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Poland3748 Posts
On March 14 2024 22:35 Mizenhauer wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2024 22:27 nimdil wrote:On March 14 2024 21:44 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 14 2024 21:29 nimdil wrote:On March 14 2024 20:24 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 14 2024 20:10 nimdil wrote:
I wonder when will we get #2. It is over two weeks. Mvp and Rogue were separate by 8 days. Which would make total sense for a simultaneous release. If the interest is focused on order more than actual writing. Well 8+8=16. Rogue was published 16 days ago. So any moment now? More than one moment, but less than a few thousand moments.
How very zen of you
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On March 14 2024 22:35 Mizenhauer wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2024 22:27 nimdil wrote:On March 14 2024 21:44 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 14 2024 21:29 nimdil wrote:On March 14 2024 20:24 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 14 2024 20:10 nimdil wrote:
I wonder when will we get #2. It is over two weeks. Mvp and Rogue were separate by 8 days. Which would make total sense for a simultaneous release. If the interest is focused on order more than actual writing. Well 8+8=16. Rogue was published 16 days ago. So any moment now? More than one moment, but less than a few thousand moments.
Let's break this up:
Few thousand is less than five thousand, otherwise it would be many thousand (obviously).
So somewhere between 1000 - 5000. Lets take the middle
A moment can be mere seconds or a small amount of minutes. Lets take a minute as a an average.
3000 minutes. An hour has passed already. A day has 1440 minutes.
So has to be somewhere between now and 2940 minutes or about two days
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It's more than 16 days cus we gotta get that simultaneous Dark blog release !
Also calling it again: Maru is going to be #1
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On March 14 2024 23:43 Harris1st wrote:Show nested quote +On March 14 2024 22:35 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 14 2024 22:27 nimdil wrote:On March 14 2024 21:44 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 14 2024 21:29 nimdil wrote:On March 14 2024 20:24 Mizenhauer wrote:On March 14 2024 20:10 nimdil wrote:
I wonder when will we get #2. It is over two weeks. Mvp and Rogue were separate by 8 days. Which would make total sense for a simultaneous release. If the interest is focused on order more than actual writing. Well 8+8=16. Rogue was published 16 days ago. So any moment now? More than one moment, but less than a few thousand moments. Let's break this up: Few thousand is less than five thousand, otherwise it would be many thousand (obviously). So somewhere between 1000 - 5000. Lets take the middle A moment can be mere seconds or a small amount of minutes. Lets take a minute as a an average. 3000 minutes. An hour has passed already. A day has 1440 minutes. So has to be somewhere between now and 2940 minutes or about two days
I'm holding Miz to this
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EPT
