Shoutout to ESL for the current map pool.

On December 05 2023 17:34 Yoshi Kirishima wrote:


I don't mean slow down the start of the game, sorry if i was unclear.
When i talk about slower paced gameplay, i mean when the game doesn't end so quickly, when 1 decision doesn't lead to such a drastic change in the game. But rather you have to make many smaller decisions and many small victories to build an advantage, then close the game out. For example BW is slower paced than SC2, because in SC2 often a game is decided in 1 big fight. It's also not easy to take far bases out in lategame in SC2, because they're so open and hard to defend. Contrast this with BW, a big part of why it's easier to fortify positions and harder to attack is ofc because of things like limited unit selection and clunkier movement, but a big part is also because the far bases that you can choose to take often have features that make it easier to defend such as having chokes or ramps. It makes it less simple to dismantle a base because you can't just A move into it. For example you can put 3 lurkers at the top of a ramp, now the player trying to break in can try to counter the lurkers with some air units and detection or some marine splitting etc. Then the defender can try to counter that ahead of time, and this just goes on and on. This back and forth makes it take longer to dismantle a fortified position, and allows for more interactions on both sides.
So you can have very dynamic and frequent action with a slower paced game, but any one action or interaction doesn't easily lead to a big advantage.

And yes i did mean WC2 haha !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qhue-q543d8
It's common to see proxy production buildings because it allows you to produce units at those locations to harass or zone areas. It's very comparable to how Protoss can warp in HTs around the map and use them defensively later or to zone areas, interecept drops, etc.
This leads to lots more varied army movement on the map, and since there are so many more objectives and places to attack or harass, the gameplay becames exponentially more dynamic and deep.

And this was actually seen in SC2 maps, such as 4 player spawn maps in WoL. Especially Taldarim Alter. When the bases become so spread out, it starts to become a strategy to spread your production buildings across different bases. That makes it easier to produce an army to attack other areas of the map. Also, it means that if the opponent attacks your "main" base, you can actually give it up without losing the game. And you can counter by taking out some of your opponent's bases and production too. In this way, "base trades" don't become much of a thing anymore. You have to really choke your opponent out, rather than just racing to see who destroys the others' buildings first.

And also my bad i was unclear about the 3rd base thing. The 3rd base itself doesn't have to be in the corner of the map. It's just that in BW maps, the far off bases are options to take early on, such as for your 3rd or 4th base. In SC2, it's very rare to have more options for your 3rd than just the triangle 3rd or the linear 3rd, and the other one becomes your 4th. If you take a base in the corner of the map it's usually a secret base that gives you an advantage only if the opponent doesn't scout it for long enough. You can't make use of defense or static defense well enough to make taking that far base worth it, because maps make far away bases be very open and easy to attack into (low ground, no chokes, etc.).

I'm just advocating for allowing more expansion options than just the standard triangle 3rd and linear 3rd. One way we currently do that is by having far bases have rich resources. Another way still rarely if ever seen is having far bases with chokes, cliffs, etc. And that is a way to achieve more spread out action consisting of smaller skirmishes, and more dynamic gameplay.