Redeye Steps Down From esports

On June 30 2020 01:33 algue wrote:
Did he do something bad or is he just simply retiring? I don't follow e-celebs drama

On June 30 2020 01:33 algue wrote:
Did he do something bad or is he just simply retiring? I don't follow e-celebs drama

On June 30 2020 01:40 freelifeffs wrote:
disgusting times we live in where keyboard social justice warriors are mass ruining peoples lives via twitter.

On June 30 2020 01:40 freelifeffs wrote:
disgusting times we live in where keyboard social justice warriors are mass ruining peoples lives via twitter.

On June 30 2020 02:17 Big-t wrote:
Noooo, what have the social justice warriors done now?? What is happening lately? Has none been taught on how to solve problems like an adult? Why are we bringing drama more and more to social media? This has to stop...

On June 30 2020 02:17 Big-t wrote:
Noooo, what have the social justice warriors done now?? What is happening lately? Has none been taught on how to solve problems like an adult? Why are we bringing drama more and more to social media? This has to stop...

On June 30 2020 02:13 sharkie wrote:


So his kids needs to suffer for his actions?

On June 30 2020 02:32 Big-t wrote:


Ah, I didn't mean punching someone is an adult way of problem solving. I think it is very good that he lost his job for this behavior. What I meant was the way on how this happend. Involving his family and even kids (how old are they? If they are underaged this is beyond not OK) is too much imo. Pointing out that he did something wrong was the right move, but I think if the people who got him into nearly suicide and harassed his famaily get away with this, it would send the wrong message to further similar situations. However I have no suggestion on what to do...

On June 30 2020 02:39 raff100 wrote:


From what I understand, noone harassed his family. It was his family that brought him to court for phisical abuses. This is what Banks reported at least.

On June 30 2020 02:42 Kitai wrote:


Even so, it's hard to say if the family would want to be thrust in the public spotlight like this - they may just want to live their lives in peace and leave the past in the past. Hard to say what they want without actually knowing them or them telling us what they want.

On June 30 2020 02:48 ploguidice wrote:


Are they being thrust into the public spotlight about this? Like yes the story of alleged abuse is being shared, but afaik no one is sharing their names, ages, whereabouts, or basically any information beyond their relationship to Redeye and the crime he committed against them.

On June 30 2020 02:22 Nakajin wrote:
I think we can all agree a twitter shitstorm is not the best way for this to have gone down, but considering it seems to have gone on for years without repercussion, maybe it was the only way.

On June 30 2020 02:39 dbRic1203 wrote:
I think stepping down is probably the best thing he could do at this point to prevent further damage against himselfe, his family, the company and the community.

On June 30 2020 03:50 desuduesdeus wrote:
I think this was handled exactly as cases like this should be handled. How can you agree that abuse of power-like behaviour should be stopped but feel bad when it's done via the victims speaking out about it? There's some kind of mental disconnect that I can't wrap my mind around. Feel free to help me understand if you will.

On June 30 2020 04:08 sparklyresidue wrote:
Never understood fully why people were so enamored with the man, but that's irrelevant to what's happened here. Although concrete evidence may not exist, why suddenly retire if these allegations have no backing? Most people are able to work and not have allegations of assault made against them, so his reactions definitely make him seem guilty.

On June 30 2020 04:00 aringadingding wrote:

Veery good question.
Good point.

On June 30 2020 04:19 kramvti wrote:


Things that happen at a place of business should be handled by the business, and an authorities needed to resolve it.
It sure as hell shouldn't be spewn everywhere where there is effectively no discourse to even be had. Twitter is a mob, they will not stop until whomever is brought down they want, rightly or wrongly.
Talking about court cases that have to do with family is just pathetic. It is none of any of your gd business what happens in his home life. none. zero. zilch. nada.
If the allegations turn out to hold water then, yes he needs to step away.

I know someone that punched a guy at work...does that mean he should be banished from life as well? Oh does it matter that the guy spewed shit in his face for 5 min before he finally lost his temper, or is belligerently instigating a fight, then getting one enough to shitcan the one that threw the punch?

I bring this up because the context of the alleged altercation is very sketchy, and not qualified in the least.

On June 30 2020 01:40 freelifeffs wrote:
disgusting times we live in where keyboard social justice warriors are mass ruining peoples lives via twitter.

On June 30 2020 04:52 ZergX wrote:


Amen to that man ! : / so fcking sadly true

On June 30 2020 04:19 kramvti wrote:


Things that happen at a place of business should be handled by the business, and an authorities needed to resolve it.
It sure as hell shouldn't be spewn everywhere where there is effectively no discourse to even be had. Twitter is a mob, they will not stop until whomever is brought down they want, rightly or wrongly.
Talking about court cases that have to do with family is just pathetic. It is none of any of your gd business what happens in his home life. none. zero. zilch. nada.
If the allegations turn out to hold water then, yes he needs to step away.

I know someone that punched a guy at work...does that mean he should be banished from life as well? Oh does it matter that the guy spewed shit in his face for 5 min before he finally lost his temper, or is belligerently instigating a fight, then getting one enough to shitcan the one that threw the punch?

I bring this up because the context of the alleged altercation is very sketchy, and not qualified in the least.

On June 30 2020 06:15 capu wrote:
Did Redeye face battery charges from the 2015 incident?

edit: I mean I can't believe stuff like that not being reported to the authorities right away. This is not to say that I doubt the overall story portrayed here if there really are multiple people speaking out against Redeye.

On June 30 2020 01:40 freelifeffs wrote:
disgusting times we live in where keyboard social justice warriors are mass ruining peoples lives via twitter.

On June 30 2020 03:56 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:
Good. Physically assaulting and continuously harassing and belittling people should not be taken lightly, and we definitely shouldn't keep these people in our community.

There's more information about him and the people who have spoken out against him and corroborated the allegations in the appropriate harassment/abuse thread.

On June 30 2020 07:37 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
The only real thing we know about this is that several people have spoken up that Redeye is an asshole to work with. And he's admitted this himself as a flaw. But there's also a lot of people who hes helped in their work and who did have good experience with him.

There's the punching thing of which we know zero details on how, what, or why.

There's a closed court case of which we know zero details except some anonymous internet post claiming he hit his wife. He was also found not guilty in the case....

And there is a work dispute where James Banks got demoted from caster to interviewer by Redeye and he developed mental health issues from this. Banks claims Redeye made an effort to 'destroy his career' but I've yet to see any proof for that.

I really don't like how 'public opinion' has now decided Redeye is a horrible person.

On June 30 2020 08:05 raff100 wrote:


So :
1. His wife accuses him of shameful physical abuses.
2. His coworker accuses him of physical abuse in workplace, with probably a lot of witnesses of the event
3. Banks accuses him of various illegal actions like blackmailing and abuse of power, with more stuff from different witnesses to be unleashed
4. Pyrion , one of the chillest dota2 guys who has never been evolved in anything, says that he knew that all this shitstorm was coming because of the stories he heard and watched in first person
For me is enough to define him as a bully, abusive with the weak and coward with the strong.

On June 30 2020 08:33 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:

Did his wife actually speak out? Afaik there's only there's only the anonymous reddit post about a court case

I only now read that the 'punched guy' spoke up few hours ago and yeah this is not a good look for Redeye at all, agreed. We still don't know circumstances though.

The 'blackmailing' stuff (which was 'if you say something bad, I'll say something bad too') was between Banks and this Luke Cotton who seem to have some history, not Redeye. I don't really know what this is, I read that conversation and it's just weird from both sides.

What actual abuse of power is he accused of? Banks claimed he stopped journalists from publishing his story but I don't see how Redeye would have power over journalists. It's more than Banks is not a good writer and his story had some unverifiable claims.

Pyrion said Redeye has been very rude to people and I believe that. It's sad but not enough to remove someone from the scene like this.

I just feel like we really dont know much but a verdict has been made already. I don't like it in that sense.

On June 30 2020 06:40 Starecat wrote:
So in the current reality the guy at the SC2 IEM insulting him was right?

Dude... This year is going from bad to worse.

On June 30 2020 08:18 Circumstance wrote:
I'm not going to miss Redeye. But you know who I will miss a whole lot? The person I thought Redeye was. The person everybody who didn't work in the industry thought Redeye was. Ironically, he was known for bringing an air of class to large events. His ability to command a stage or an analysis desk was both formal and entertaining in times when both were needed - now we know what that command actually involved.

Good riddance to Paul, and may he find a way to reintegrate himself into offline society in a non-violent manner where he is incapable of abusing others. But goodbye to the fictional character known as Redeye, who did right by the fans and made esports moments absolute classics.

On June 30 2020 02:03 Thaniri wrote:


These onesided Twitter shitstorms need to stop.

If I want to look at a court case, I can find public record of all proceedings and make up my own mind.

This is the first time I've noticed that people are accusing redeye of something. Put yourself in my shoes and re-read this Twitter post. What was he accused of? Who accused him? What defence has he put up? There is NO information here, it is strictly an appeal to emotion.

On June 30 2020 06:15 capu wrote:
Did Redeye face battery charges from the 2015 incident?

edit: I mean I can't believe stuff like that not being reported to the authorities right away. This is not to say that I doubt the overall story portrayed here if there really are multiple people speaking out against Redeye.

On June 30 2020 10:27 fastr wrote:
5. This being the most important point to me. James Banks decided to come up with his statement at a very specific time, when numerous women in the esport scene came up with their own stories of sexual harassment/abuse. He obviously thought that by posting this now, his story would gain more traction (which it did), caught in the wind of all those other stories. I have a big problem with that. Like I said before, Redeye may deserve to get kicked out of esports, but that's beside the point. The reason Banks started this whole smear campaign wasn't due to any form of personal harassment or abuse. Mr Bank took revenge on Redeye because Redeye was his superior at the time and denied him an opportunity to host an undisclosed number of events.

Redeye lost his career because of a personal vendetta. It doesn't mean that he didn't deserve to go down. I just find it disgusting how this Banks fella used the #MeToo movement for his own little revenge. If being denied a promotion by your boss is enough ground to start a grand smear campaign on Twitter and end this person's career, what a sad, sad era we are entering upon.

On June 30 2020 13:34 Blargh wrote:

I think it's rather unfair to say Jimmy is doing this purely out of revenge, and even if he was, what should matter are the actions of Redeye. James' motives here are not particularly relevant unless we're doubting his complete credibility. And there are plenty of reasons outside of purely revenge for this. How about there being actual consequences in the industry? I wouldn't want someone who is totally abusive and tries to shit on your work in the industry if I had a choice.

Are you saying he should've just never said anything? Or that he should've said something sooner? Because it sounds like the latter has been done and has failed.

On June 30 2020 09:54 BronzeKnee wrote:
Sticks and stone break bones, words never hurt.

Anyone equating Twitter attacks to physical violence is someone who has never been abused. Those who resort to violence deserve to be called out and have no place in civil society.



It is a lot better than it used to be, where bullies would say... become President because people would be afraid to speak out.

The downfall is great to watch, both of the bullies and those that silently enable them.

On June 30 2020 10:27 fastr wrote:
My two cents on the matter:

1. I'm happy to see most people remaining prudent and critical in the face of a mostly he-said/she-said situation, because things are never black and white in this kind of stories, and none of the statements made from either party should be taken at face value without actual proof.

2. It is almost certain that, based on the numbers of corroborating statements and comments, Redeye was, to put it lightly, "difficult to work with", or as I would call it, a cunt. Now, is being a cunt to your coworkers and subordinates enough of a reason to lose your career? That is not for me to answer, and I honestly don't know.

3. Redeye choosing to walk away from Esport does not equate to him admitting guilt NOR does it absolves him from any of the accusations if they were proven to be true.

4. Punching a coworker is obviously very serious, and I think if any of us did that at our respective jobs, we'd be sending resumes soon after. The thing is, nobody knows who or what started this argument, and I honestly believe some people deserve to be punched in the ribs. It was still an incredibly stupid things to do and Redeye was lucky he wasn't just fired on the spot.

5. This being the most important point to me. James Banks decided to come up with his statement at a very specific time, when numerous women in the esport scene came up with their own stories of sexual harassment/abuse. He obviously thought that by posting this now, his story would gain more traction (which it did), caught in the wind of all those other stories. I have a big problem with that. Like I said before, Redeye may deserve to get kicked out of esports, but that's beside the point. The reason Banks started this whole smear campaign wasn't due to any form of personal harassment or abuse. Mr Bank took revenge on Redeye because Redeye was his superior at the time and denied him an opportunity to host an undisclosed number of events.

Redeye lost his career because of a personal vendetta. It doesn't mean that he didn't deserve to go down. I just find it disgusting how this Banks fella used the #MeToo movement for his own little revenge. If being denied a promotion by your boss is enough ground to start a grand smear campaign on Twitter and end this person's career, what a sad, sad era we are entering upon.

On June 30 2020 10:27 fastr wrote:
My two cents on the matter:

1. I'm happy to see most people remaining prudent and critical in the face of a mostly he-said/she-said situation, because things are never black and white in this kind of stories, and none of the statements made from either party should be taken at face value without actual proof.

2. It is almost certain that, based on the numbers of corroborating statements and comments, Redeye was, to put it lightly, "difficult to work with", or as I would call it, a cunt. Now, is being a cunt to your coworkers and subordinates enough of a reason to lose your career? That is not for me to answer, and I honestly don't know.

3. Redeye choosing to walk away from Esport does not equate to him admitting guilt NOR does it absolves him from any of the accusations if they were proven to be true.

4. Punching a coworker is obviously very serious, and I think if any of us did that at our respective jobs, we'd be sending resumes soon after. The thing is, nobody knows who or what started this argument, and I honestly believe some people deserve to be punched in the ribs. It was still an incredibly stupid things to do and Redeye was lucky he wasn't just fired on the spot.

5. This being the most important point to me. James Banks decided to come up with his statement at a very specific time, when numerous women in the esport scene came up with their own stories of sexual harassment/abuse. He obviously thought that by posting this now, his story would gain more traction (which it did), caught in the wind of all those other stories. I have a big problem with that. Like I said before, Redeye may deserve to get kicked out of esports, but that's beside the point. The reason Banks started this whole smear campaign wasn't due to any form of personal harassment or abuse. Mr Bank took revenge on Redeye because Redeye was his superior at the time and denied him an opportunity to host an undisclosed number of events.

Redeye lost his career because of a personal vendetta. It doesn't mean that he didn't deserve to go down. I just find it disgusting how this Banks fella used the #MeToo movement for his own little revenge. If being denied a promotion by your boss is enough ground to start a grand smear campaign on Twitter and end this person's career, what a sad, sad era we are entering upon.

On June 30 2020 18:14 Zealously wrote:


The allegations in this case are rather more severe than Redeye just being "an asshole on multiple occasions". Physically assaulting someone in the workplace should be more than enough to result in expulsion from that workplace and line of business.

Besides, why is social justice a bad thing? Seems like a pretty good goal to fight for, to me.

On June 30 2020 21:20 Heartland wrote:
SJW:s are ruining esports by criticizing a guy who went to court for assaulting his disabled wife and children, and who punched a colleague and bullied others! When will it stop?!? When you get basic human decency for all people?!?!??

On June 30 2020 21:20 Heartland wrote:
SJW:s are ruining esports by criticizing a guy who went to court for assaulting his disabled wife and children, and who punched a colleague and bullied others! When will it stop?!? When you get basic human decency for all people?!?!??

On June 30 2020 22:26 Penev wrote:
That wasn't me, that was a quote from status quo.

I've edited my post.

On June 30 2020 21:20 Heartland wrote:
SJW:s are ruining esports by criticizing a guy who went to court for assaulting his disabled wife and children, and who punched a colleague and bullied others! When will it stop?!? When you get basic human decency for all people?!?!??

On June 30 2020 21:28 StarStruck wrote:


Rhetorical question? That is exactly what people started to question based off the examples you said in the first sentence. Did you not just answer your own question.

Morale of the story be a good human being to others to avoid shit hitting the fan.

Everyone should be following the golden rule.

On June 30 2020 22:53 Mverdo wrote:


If Heartland wasn't being sarcastic/ironic I will play protoss the rest of this season.

On June 30 2020 08:18 Circumstance wrote:
I'm not going to miss Redeye. But you know who I will miss a whole lot? The person I thought Redeye was. The person everybody who didn't work in the industry thought Redeye was. Ironically, he was known for bringing an air of class to large events. His ability to command a stage or an analysis desk was both formal and entertaining in times when both were needed - now we know what that command actually involved.

Good riddance to Paul, and may he find a way to reintegrate himself into offline society in a non-violent manner where he is incapable of abusing others. But goodbye to the fictional character known as Redeye, who did right by the fans and made esports moments absolute classics.

On July 01 2020 00:14 Heartland wrote:


I was really sarcastic

On July 01 2020 00:15 Heartland wrote:


I think the thread has been through the whole discussion on court rulings in cases like abuse before, so I'll just refer back to that.

On June 30 2020 17:40 spookey1 wrote:
Calling someone out for being an asshole on multiple occasions due their anger management issues, fine.

Slandering them, pushing to cancel their careers and bringing their family into it.. fuck off social justice warriors.

Sometimes I wish twitter had never existed.

On June 30 2020 04:00 aringadingding wrote:

Veery good question.
Good point.

On June 30 2020 08:18 Circumstance wrote:
I'm not going to miss Redeye. But you know who I will miss a whole lot? The person I thought Redeye was. The person everybody who didn't work in the industry thought Redeye was. Ironically, he was known for bringing an air of class to large events. His ability to command a stage or an analysis desk was both formal and entertaining in times when both were needed - now we know what that command actually involved.

Good riddance to Paul, and may he find a way to reintegrate himself into offline society in a non-violent manner where he is incapable of abusing others. But goodbye to the fictional character known as Redeye, who did right by the fans and made esports moments absolute classics.

On July 01 2020 12:11 JuanDi wrote:


He has ON-STREAM, recorded altercations with staff members. Remember the whole "what a fucking idiot" thing everyone memed about? That attitude is indicative of someone who doesn't control his temper and it isn't hard to imagine his getting angry and punching someone, as he is being accused of.

On June 30 2020 22:41 deacon.frost wrote:
Uh, what was the verdict of the court? Just being curious.

On July 01 2020 14:59 fededevi wrote:


We went from "innocent until proven guilty" to "guilty until proven innocent" to "guilty even if proven innocent" in a week, this is what happens when you abandon reason and follow the internet mob justice.

On July 01 2020 15:21 Heartland wrote:


If you look back in the thread, you can find a number of sources for how abuse is far more prevalent than court sentencings suggest and the huge difficulties that are posed by saying that we need a court to sentence someone in order to do that. So it's rather the opposite than the lack of reason, it is the use of scientific investigations.

On July 01 2020 18:14 Shuffleblade wrote:

Ignore a court ruling is dangerous, in what context? If I read the material of a sentence and disagree with it that is dangerous? I have to (like good little sheep) think "Alright the court decided he is innocent, therefore I know too in my mind must think he is innocent".

That is total BS, if the alternative to respect a court judgement is to take power in your own hands and go harass the guy then of course you are right. However we as individuals have the right of independant thought, I am allowed to believe the court was totalt shit and made the wrong decision and I am allowed to say that openly because this is part of the free world with free speech. I am not allowed to harass a person (for any reason) and if a person I believe is innocent is found guilty I am not allowed to break them out of jail but I strongly doubt anyone here is arguing for anything like that.

On July 01 2020 21:43 Timebon3s wrote:
You have absolutely no way of knowing why he is stepping down.

He mentioned his mental health and family as reason.
Maby thats all there is to it.
Maby he doesnt want to be a pulic figure when a part of his viewers thinks hes been beating hos wheelchair bound wife and terrorising his family.

Maby we have no idea whats going on inside his head, so please be carefull in looking for proof and facts in your own projections.

On July 01 2020 21:47 Shuffleblade wrote:

I don't think many people care if he leaves the industry or not. What matters is him changing, not because he wants to "reform" or "improve" but simply because everyone knows he is a bully and since his career is already hanging by a thread he would have to behave. Maybe its easier to just leave than to actually make an effort to not harass people.

The punching incident is the smallest issue in my opinion, being actually violent is something that is openly seen, easily proven and therefore the easiest thing to look to. Bullying and harassment in work enviorment is worse because many times there is noting the victim can do if the perpetrator does it smoothly or/and has support from upper management.

On July 01 2020 22:34 Wombat_NI wrote:

I do agree 100%, I’ve said quite a lot in the now 60+ pages or whatever in the other thread.

I would personally rather be punched in a hot-blooded exchange than be subject to sustained harassment and bullying in the workplace. Being constantly on edge with stress has far more detrimental effects than people realise, in general, plus I have a mental health condition that is greatly exacerbated by prolonged stress and I’d have to remove myself from such an environment for my mental and physical health.

It’s a smaller part of a bigger issue, on the other hand it’s the smoking gun to convince people who would otherwise dismiss these claims as ‘stuff that happens in workplaces and the real world, people should man up’ or variants thereof.

On July 01 2020 10:39 joon wrote:
tasteless and artosis, yall better not have done anything (except verbally abuse GuyInTheChat--im looking at you artosis)

On July 02 2020 05:27 Danglars wrote:

More and more, I hope nobody they've come in contact with accuses them for any reason whatsoever. They can still have not done anything, but get chased out of the scene.

Unless I missed something, Redeye maintains that he never punched anyone? Just words delivered angrily into someone's face?

On July 01 2020 14:36 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:

??? You can't be serious, this is completely wrong

The 'what an idiot' incident was a random person who also had a stand in the convention hall IEM was at. He thought the SC2 tournaments volume was too loud and complained to Redeye who said he should take it up with production in the back. He was told not to walk through the set but he ignored this several times, and after they went live he walked through the set again in front of the camera, so Redeye called him an idiot. Random guy loses his shit and gets threatening, Redeye deescalates..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yRFOnGM8-I

https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/2f079r/what_happened_on_iem_with_that_guy_shouting_at/

On July 02 2020 05:27 Danglars wrote:

More and more, I hope nobody they've come in contact with accuses them for any reason whatsoever. They can still have not done anything, but get chased out of the scene.

Unless I missed something, Redeye maintains that he never punched anyone? Just words delivered angrily into someone's face?

On July 02 2020 06:46 Wombat_NI wrote:

Tastosis? No way. They are beloved as few are in this scene, they’re not getting chased out unless they do some seriously wrong things.

Redeye has joked about ‘the incident’ on stream (I believe, I tried to find the vid but can’t remember where it was linked), and has conceded he’s ‘hard to work with’.

Which isn’t really a million miles from ‘I punched that guy’ and ‘I’m a bully on the job’.

My position is that Redeye’s behaviour is known by those around him, like his business partner, and an open secret amongst those who work around the industry.

Whether it’s pressure from those around him, or Redeye himself (regardless of anyone’s views on his alleged conduct, it’s pretty unarguable that he has a huge passion for the industry he helped elevate), I feel Redeye stepped away from the entire scene to prevent any further damage, notably to people and orgs that may have been exposed as enabling his alleged behaviour if he chose to fight the accusations and more came out.

This isn’t to say that false accusations aren’t also a pitfall to be avoided, I can’t recall from what game but I do recall the name Henry G as to the danger of internet mobs jumping on things.

It’s certainly a pitfall to be avoided, I think TLers have been reasonably judicious both with the Redeye accusations and the Rapid ones.

On July 02 2020 06:57 StarStruck wrote:


It doesn't sound like you read what was wrote at all. I get it there are a bunch of pages expecially in the harassment/abuse thread let alone reddit.

If people are behaving poorly eventually these type of things get out. If I were to do something bad at work there are precautions no different than this industry. The fact, that this happened ages ago and is only coming out now is pretty sad. I get Banks feared he would never be able to find another job in this industry so he had to bite his lip.

No different than it is hard for people to talk about being raped because then people start to question their character and shit. It is a shitty ass situation and no one really wins.

I should add something here because this kind of bothers me. If... if other people have actively worked with Redeye before and seen other shit. I wonder did anyone ever try to address it? I mean this guy has been in the scene for eons (well over 20 years) yet no one chose to really speak up or at least address this directly with Redeye? Let alone other people behaving badly.

I find it extremely hard to believe and if other people did see other shit go down then all you really done is be enabler and let shit like this happen. That is not cool. -_- Shame on you.

On July 01 2020 16:49 Heartland wrote:


I'm advocating nothing of the sort. I'm saying that some crimes, particularly abuse, are extremely hard to get anyone sentenced to. There is a very well documented international academic literature on how rape, abuse in the family, etc, rarely go to court, and that the court systems rarely sentence people. Yet, these things are alarmingly common and the idea that women lie, etc, is very rare.

I am not sure what "Western society stands for" both has to do with it, and what Western society really stands for.

On July 01 2020 18:14 Shuffleblade wrote:

Ignore a court ruling is dangerous, in what context? If I read the material of a sentence and disagree with it that is dangerous? I have to (like good little sheep) think "Alright the court decided he is innocent, therefore I know too in my mind must think he is innocent".

That is total BS, if the alternative to respect a court judgement is to take power in your own hands and go harass the guy then of course you are right. However we as individuals have the right of independant thought, I am allowed to believe the court was totalt shit and made the wrong decision and I am allowed to say that openly because this is part of the free world with free speech. I am not allowed to harass a person (for any reason) and if a person I believe is innocent is found guilty I am not allowed to break them out of jail but I strongly doubt anyone here is arguing for anything like that.

On July 02 2020 21:37 deacon.frost wrote:

If you don't like the system call out the system, not the man who was found innocent.

Western society in my environment is used basically for NATO more or less. The EU and their partners + Canada & US. Unless somthing changed these countries have similar moral grounds
1) If your punishment is done, you're supposed to be looked at as a clean person(aka your debt to the society has been payed) (doesn't work mostly in the land of freedom, e.g. voting rights)
2) If the court says you're innocent you're innocent and this should be respected. (more on the bottom, if you don't like the system, blame the system(or Canada))
3) The judicial system is based on the fact that the majority can be redeemed and only the not redeemable are taken out of life(or those who did some horendous crimes) . (again my objection to this goes primarily to the US system)

Basically the 3 points mean(1-3), that person can redeem themselves by using the unbiased system the country prepared for. Therefore calling out people for being at the court while being found innocent is simply wrong. It's like using - hey, you've been investigated for a murder therefore you're a murderer.

At least that's how I see the system and the western society.

Simple version can be found bellow.



Again, people are calling out RE for the innocent court ruling. If you don't like the ruling, calling out RE is stupid, call out the judge, call out the system to re-work the stuff. But calling out the person is just plainly wrong. RE was found innocent therefore he's innocent. Unless you believe he bribed the justice system then it's not his fault the justice system works that way and he shouldn't be called out for this. There are multiple things you can callout RE for but the court is the least sensible thing.

I don't know, it seems you missed what I was reacting to. I was against calling out RE for the court thing. I don't mind calling out the RULING itself, but the last time I checked Redeye wasn't the ruling, is he?

And yes, if a person found guilty is in jail, you're not supposed to break them free. That's a crime, isn't it? But you can use every power you have to open the case and make new hearing(?) at the court so the person can be set free. Which means - you. call. out. the. system.

Edit> also one of the major things we have in common is the belief that the judicial system is independent and isn't biased. Doesn't work that way all the time because people make mistakes. But then we return to the fact you should try to change the judicial system and call out the system. That was the #4 and that's why it says (1-3) in the upper reaction.

+TL, DR - don't call out RE for ruling, call out the system. It's not like you need the court ruling to call out RE.

On July 02 2020 23:42 ploguidice wrote:


Just to be super clear, courts do not find people "innocent". The standard is beyond all reasonable doubt. If you have good lawyers (which most people do not and is a huge injustice) this is an incredibly high bar to clear. Courts find defendants "not guilty" if a jury believes that there is a 0-97% the chance the person committed the crime they are supposed to vote "not guilty". It's not uncommon for someones actions to fail to meet the incredibly high bar of criminal liability and also easily meet the lower bar of civil liability.

On July 06 2020 08:57 JimmyJRaynor wrote:

Do you have a source for that 0 to97% number range? As far as I know criminal law doesn't deal with probability #s.

On July 06 2020 09:43 nath wrote:

its the 'guideline' for jurors to follow, its not the actual law. if they have even 3% doubt they are told by selection committee to vote not guilty

On July 01 2020 12:11 JuanDi wrote:


This isn't a "social justice warrior" thing. He punched someone and abused his power. He has ON-STREAM, recorded altercations with staff members. Remember the whole "what a fucking idiot" thing everyone memed about? That attitude is indicative of someone who doesn't control his temper and it isn't hard to imagine his getting angry and punching someone, as he is being accused of.

On July 01 2020 14:36 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:

??? You can't be serious, this is completely wrong

The 'what an idiot' incident was a random person who also had a stand in the convention hall IEM was at. He thought the SC2 tournaments volume was too loud and complained to Redeye who said he should take it up with production in the back. He was told not to walk through the set but he ignored this several times, and after they went live he walked through the set again in front of the camera, so Redeye called him an idiot. Random guy loses his shit and gets threatening, Redeye deescalates..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yRFOnGM8-I

https://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/2f079r/what_happened_on_iem_with_that_guy_shouting_at/

On July 06 2020 12:03 Za7oX wrote:

Thank you. Fake fans or maybe people who are now full blown crazy SJW's trying to change reality. Did we get a statement from SC2 people on RedEye? Apollo?