The Code S round of 32 delivered a twist ending as underdogs RagnaroK and Special advanced over their more illustrious peers sOs and TY. The pair of upsets concluded one of the more unpredictable Code S RO32s in recent memory, which has seen high profile players such as Maru, Zest, Rogue, and TY eliminated in the first round.
RagnaroK advanced in first place on the back of strong ZvT, surviving a barrage of Battlecruiser builds from both TY and SpeCial. Whether it was Nydus all-ins or defensive macro play, the often inconsistent RagnaroK was able to show off the skills that brought him to the playoffs of IEM Katowice earlier this year. Second place player SpeCial lived up to his reputation as a meticulous strategist as he took two victories over sOs, pulling out a variety of tricks including proxy factory-floats and even TvP mech.
The Code S RO16 groups will be determined via the group nomination ceremony on Wednesday, May 15 9:30am GMT (GMT+00:00), with Classic, Dark, Trap, and GuMiho participating as the top seeds.
JUANITO FIGHTING!! I was worried after he dropped games 2+3 against Ragnarok; especially the 2nd one seemed really winnable, but so happy he clutched against sOs!
On May 12 2019 02:37 Duckman wrote: JUANITO FIGHTING!! I was worried after he dropped games 2+3 against Ragnarok; especially the 2nd one seemed really winnable, but so happy he clutched against sOs!
He also held against the curse of coming from losing winners match.
On May 12 2019 02:37 Duckman wrote: JUANITO FIGHTING!! I was worried after he dropped games 2+3 against Ragnarok; especially the 2nd one seemed really winnable, but so happy he clutched against sOs!
He also held against the curse of coming from losing winners match.
On May 12 2019 05:04 Charoisaur wrote: so will people stop complaining about TvP now?
So because sOs lost, who is is way past his prime and plays weird games all the time, TvP is suddenly fine or protoss is not OP in general?
if a foreign toss beat a code S terran 4-0 we would have another 500 reply thread called welcome to zparcraft 2 by now lol
somehow it magically never counts when terrans win
it's pretty funny tbh
sos won multiple championships, is considered by the top of the community to be a genius of the game, and is usually at the top of the list when it comes to protoss players that terran players fear in the biggest tournaments.
but nah let's just lump him into "way past his prime protoss player" with MC
I will say this though, if there's one terran player aside from Maru who aint about that protoss cheese, it's special.
So many times when i catch special on streams, he's always breaking down the most brutal of protoss cheeses and is looking for ways to stop it. he hates it so badly lmao
On May 12 2019 05:04 Charoisaur wrote: so will people stop complaining about TvP now?
No they'll always complain every time a protoss wins because it's so deeply ingrained in them. This all started way back in BW.
Of course, Protoss absolutely deserves to have 8 spots in the Ro16. And 9 spots in the ST Ro16.
I can't possibly imagine why anyone would complain about that. I mean, this all started way back in BW.
You don't get it. It has never stopped. Every single year in this game it doesn't matter how well protoss is doing people are always relentlessly whining about protoss no matter what. It has nothing to do with them having a particularly strong showing right now, that just intensifies the whining.
Also if we want to focus on balance we should notice that the premier tournaments this year are perfectly spread with 2 taken by zerg, 2 taken by terran, and 2 taken by protoss so far. GSL super tournament Classic, WESG Innovation, IEM soO, GSL season 1 Maru, WCS America Neeb, WCS Europe Reynor. We'll see how the rest of the year plays out.
On May 12 2019 05:04 Charoisaur wrote: so will people stop complaining about TvP now?
No they'll always complain every time a protoss wins because it's so deeply ingrained in them. This all started way back in BW.
Of course, Protoss absolutely deserves to have 8 spots in the Ro16. And 9 spots in the ST Ro16.
I can't possibly imagine why anyone would complain about that. I mean, this all started way back in BW.
Also if we want to focus on balance we should notice that the premier tournaments this year are perfectly spread with 2 taken by zerg, 2 taken by terran, and 2 taken by protoss so far. GSL super tournament Classic, WESG Innovation, IEM soO, GSL season 1 Maru, WCS America Neeb, WCS Europe Reynor. We'll see how the rest of the year plays out.
So if Serral won exactly 1 more game against Inno, Zerg is suddenly insanely overpowered because it won half the tournaments in 2019, right? Just like how Zerg was OP as fuck during all of 2018 because Serral won more trophies than every Terran and Protoss combined, right? Not to mention how WCS America is obviously populated with the same racial distribution and skill level as GSL, right?
On May 12 2019 05:04 Charoisaur wrote: so will people stop complaining about TvP now?
No they'll always complain every time a protoss wins because it's so deeply ingrained in them. This all started way back in BW.
Of course, Protoss absolutely deserves to have 8 spots in the Ro16. And 9 spots in the ST Ro16.
I can't possibly imagine why anyone would complain about that. I mean, this all started way back in BW.
Also if we want to focus on balance we should notice that the premier tournaments this year are perfectly spread with 2 taken by zerg, 2 taken by terran, and 2 taken by protoss so far. GSL super tournament Classic, WESG Innovation, IEM soO, GSL season 1 Maru, WCS America Neeb, WCS Europe Reynor. We'll see how the rest of the year plays out.
So if Serral won exactly 1 more game against Inno, Zerg is suddenly insanely overpowered because it won half the tournaments in 2019, right? Just like how Zerg was OP as fuck during all of 2018 because Serral won more trophies than every Terran and Protoss combined, right? Not to mention how WCS America is obviously populated with the same racial distribution and skill level as GSL, right?
If you're going to defend imbalance, at least do it competently.
whine
whining
It has nothing to do with them having a particularly strong showing right now
You're just attempting to challenge the truth. I never even claimed the game is perfectly balanced, the only thing I said is it's important to look at the spread of premier tournament wins among the races this year. That's true, nothing wrong with it. I never said it's the be all end all. It does at least suggest it's not as bad as people like to make it out to be if there is any imbalance. The way people act all the time you'd expect protoss to be winning nearly every important tournament.
Again, you miss the point. I said the whining has nothing to do with the current success because the whining would still be present if things were normal and protoss wasn't having more success than the other races at the moment. It just intensifies the whining with more success. It's not like it wouldn't be there if protoss wasn't showing up in serious force.
Why does every single TL report thread evolve into some form of balance whining?
SpeCial played very well yesterday and could have beaten Ragnarok as well, if Artosis didn't curse him at that point he was close to holding off the Nydus.
it's really not about balance as much as it's about viewer experience. i'm not an active player anymore (used to play random), but i do watch the korean scene.
in the last super tournament i got bored with PvP and skipped some games. i'm very likely to do so again in the upcoming ro16 (unless somehow we'll escape a 3-4 protoss group).
On May 12 2019 05:04 Charoisaur wrote: so will people stop complaining about TvP now?
No they'll always complain every time a protoss wins because it's so deeply ingrained in them. This all started way back in BW.
Of course, Protoss absolutely deserves to have 8 spots in the Ro16. And 9 spots in the ST Ro16.
I can't possibly imagine why anyone would complain about that. I mean, this all started way back in BW.
Also if we want to focus on balance we should notice that the premier tournaments this year are perfectly spread with 2 taken by zerg, 2 taken by terran, and 2 taken by protoss so far. GSL super tournament Classic, WESG Innovation, IEM soO, GSL season 1 Maru, WCS America Neeb, WCS Europe Reynor. We'll see how the rest of the year plays out.
So if Serral won exactly 1 more game against Inno, Zerg is suddenly insanely overpowered because it won half the tournaments in 2019, right? Just like how Zerg was OP as fuck during all of 2018 because Serral won more trophies than every Terran and Protoss combined, right? Not to mention how WCS America is obviously populated with the same racial distribution and skill level as GSL, right?
If you're going to defend imbalance, at least do it competently.
whine
whining
It has nothing to do with them having a particularly strong showing right now
You're just attempting to challenge the truth. I never even claimed the game is perfectly balanced, the only thing I said is it's important to look at the spread of premier tournament wins among the races this year. That's true, nothing wrong with it. I never said it's the be all end all. It does at least suggest it's not as bad as people like to make it out to be if there is any imbalance. The way people act all the time you'd expect protoss to be winning nearly every important tournament.
Again, you miss the point. I said the whining has nothing to do with the current success because the whining would still be present if things were normal and protoss wasn't having more success than the other races at the moment. It just intensifies the whining with more success. It's not like it wouldn't be there if protoss wasn't showing up in serious force.
Protoss might be imbalanced, but what about tournament champions? The whining might be valid, but what about history?
Tournament winners have nothing to do with balance. Protoss could never win a tournament again and still be overpowered. Winning a tournament is determined in a single series. That is far too few games to look at balance. Looking at race distribution for all tournaments this year Protoss has had extremely good representation in every single event besides wesg which had no Korean toss. GSL and IEM were won by t/z but they were still very good events for protoss.
On May 12 2019 12:34 batatm wrote: it's really not about balance as much as it's about viewer experience. i'm not an active player anymore (used to play random), but i do watch the korean scene.
in the last super tournament i got bored with PvP and skipped some games. i'm very likely to do so again in the upcoming ro16 (unless somehow we'll escape a 3-4 protoss group).
I mean I don't play either and I don't like watching PvPs.
Yet every single thread somehow devolves into pseudo balance argument.
Can't we just appreciate the games, of which yesterday's games were 100% the best amongst Ro32 games.
On May 12 2019 05:04 Charoisaur wrote: so will people stop complaining about TvP now?
No they'll always complain every time a protoss wins because it's so deeply ingrained in them. This all started way back in BW.
Of course, Protoss absolutely deserves to have 8 spots in the Ro16. And 9 spots in the ST Ro16.
I can't possibly imagine why anyone would complain about that. I mean, this all started way back in BW.
Also if we want to focus on balance we should notice that the premier tournaments this year are perfectly spread with 2 taken by zerg, 2 taken by terran, and 2 taken by protoss so far. GSL super tournament Classic, WESG Innovation, IEM soO, GSL season 1 Maru, WCS America Neeb, WCS Europe Reynor. We'll see how the rest of the year plays out.
So if Serral won exactly 1 more game against Inno, Zerg is suddenly insanely overpowered because it won half the tournaments in 2019, right? Just like how Zerg was OP as fuck during all of 2018 because Serral won more trophies than every Terran and Protoss combined, right? Not to mention how WCS America is obviously populated with the same racial distribution and skill level as GSL, right?
If you're going to defend imbalance, at least do it competently.
whine
whining
It has nothing to do with them having a particularly strong showing right now
You're just attempting to challenge the truth. I never even claimed the game is perfectly balanced, the only thing I said is it's important to look at the spread of premier tournament wins among the races this year. That's true, nothing wrong with it. I never said it's the be all end all. It does at least suggest it's not as bad as people like to make it out to be if there is any imbalance. The way people act all the time you'd expect protoss to be winning nearly every important tournament.
Again, you miss the point. I said the whining has nothing to do with the current success because the whining would still be present if things were normal and protoss wasn't having more success than the other races at the moment. It just intensifies the whining with more success. It's not like it wouldn't be there if protoss wasn't showing up in serious force.
Protoss might be imbalanced, but what about tournament champions? The whining might be valid, but what about history?
Your point would seem to be whataboutism. A flawless strategy. Imbalance can never be examined if it's never discussed.
I'm not the one who was ever trying to prove something. I never said whether the game is completely balanced or not. I was just attempting to calm down the balance whine. You're the one who made it about proving the game is imbalanced. Very lame to bring that crap here when we're discussing the GSL results and this amazing group.
On May 12 2019 05:04 Charoisaur wrote: so will people stop complaining about TvP now?
No they'll always complain every time a protoss wins because it's so deeply ingrained in them. This all started way back in BW.
Of course, Protoss absolutely deserves to have 8 spots in the Ro16. And 9 spots in the ST Ro16.
I can't possibly imagine why anyone would complain about that. I mean, this all started way back in BW.
Also if we want to focus on balance we should notice that the premier tournaments this year are perfectly spread with 2 taken by zerg, 2 taken by terran, and 2 taken by protoss so far. GSL super tournament Classic, WESG Innovation, IEM soO, GSL season 1 Maru, WCS America Neeb, WCS Europe Reynor. We'll see how the rest of the year plays out.
So if Serral won exactly 1 more game against Inno, Zerg is suddenly insanely overpowered because it won half the tournaments in 2019, right? Just like how Zerg was OP as fuck during all of 2018 because Serral won more trophies than every Terran and Protoss combined, right? Not to mention how WCS America is obviously populated with the same racial distribution and skill level as GSL, right?
If you're going to defend imbalance, at least do it competently.
whine
whining
It has nothing to do with them having a particularly strong showing right now
You're just attempting to challenge the truth. I never even claimed the game is perfectly balanced, the only thing I said is it's important to look at the spread of premier tournament wins among the races this year. That's true, nothing wrong with it. I never said it's the be all end all. It does at least suggest it's not as bad as people like to make it out to be if there is any imbalance. The way people act all the time you'd expect protoss to be winning nearly every important tournament.
Again, you miss the point. I said the whining has nothing to do with the current success because the whining would still be present if things were normal and protoss wasn't having more success than the other races at the moment. It just intensifies the whining with more success. It's not like it wouldn't be there if protoss wasn't showing up in serious force.
Protoss might be imbalanced, but what about tournament champions? The whining might be valid, but what about history?
Your point would seem to be whataboutism. A flawless strategy. Imbalance can never be examined if it's never discussed.
I'm not the one who was ever trying to prove something. I never said whether the game is completely balanced or not. I was just attempting to calm down the balance whine. You're the one who made it about proving the game is imbalanced. Very lame to bring that crap here when we're discussing the GSL results and this amazing group.
Yes, of course. You were only discussing the GSL results and this amazing group.
On May 12 2019 05:04 Charoisaur wrote: so will people stop complaining about TvP now?
No they'll always complain every time a protoss wins because it's so deeply ingrained in them. This all started way back in BW.
Suuuure, also thsi started when multiple tournaments have so many good tosses who play so better than terrans. Or zergs. But that's just how it works, they just play better, we have to deal with it, nothing to do with maps, balance or the game at all.
On May 12 2019 05:04 Charoisaur wrote: so will people stop complaining about TvP now?
No they'll always complain every time a protoss wins because it's so deeply ingrained in them. This all started way back in BW.
Suuuure, also thsi started when multiple tournaments have so many good tosses who play so better than terrans. Or zergs. But that's just how it works, they just play better, we have to deal with it, nothing to do with maps, balance or the game at all.
It literally started years before! And Charoisaur is right, PvZ is the problem.
RagnaGOD could really become the next top Zerg in Korea if he works hard on his weakest matchup; Special did it again, after he defeated Classic last BlizzCon.
When I saw that sOs lost to SpeCial twice I just thought he was being dumb, because sOs has the best PvT right now, so how could he lose like that right? But then I went and watched all four games, and it was honestly epic. sOs played great in the losses, just SpeCial showed how absolutely amazing he can be sometimes. Congratulations to SpeCial on his first Ro16 appearance, and RagnaroK for beating TY and SpeCial.
On May 12 2019 05:04 Charoisaur wrote: so will people stop complaining about TvP now?
So because sOs lost, who is is way past his prime and plays weird games all the time, TvP is suddenly fine or protoss is not OP in general?
if a foreign toss beat a code S terran 4-0 we would have another 500 reply thread called welcome to zparcraft 2 by now lol
somehow it magically never counts when terrans win
special is best foreign terran ever, and btw rail beat innovation in macro game at wesg, can you imagine some low tier foreign terran beating top kr toss like that? at least one map, it's literally unimaginable lol
Really curious how the group selection and upcoming Ro16 are going to play out, now that so many fixtures and usually tier 1 players aren't even there. The fact that the Ro16 group selection won't be another Maru court makes it so much more interesting.
wow, only the sOs vs TY match went the way I've expected, CG to both. Were there any crazy innovative games by RagnaroK? I mean, I assume a lot of nydus, but anything especially creative that I should watch?
One of the most fun groups I've watched in a long time. Really happy for Special, and dead impressed from RagnaroK. His counter play against the battle cruisers was pretty cool and he's looking really strong macro wise
On May 12 2019 17:09 sneakyfox wrote: TY had advanced from nine straight Ro32's before this. Will be the first group nominations in LotV without TY present
I did not know that. Sad to hear that he was that close to get the Nestea award and the PartinG award the same season.
On May 15 2019 06:26 Alejandrisha wrote: special is my new favorite foreigner. loved the games but loved the interview even more. he is so likable and human
friendship ended with gumiho major is now my new goat
On May 12 2019 05:04 Charoisaur wrote: so will people stop complaining about TvP now?
So because sOs lost, who is is way past his prime and plays weird games all the time, TvP is suddenly fine or protoss is not OP in general?
if a foreign toss beat a code S terran 4-0 we would have another 500 reply thread called welcome to zparcraft 2 by now lol
somehow it magically never counts when terrans win
On May 12 2019 10:49 BerserkSword wrote:
it's pretty funny tbh
sos won multiple championships, is considered by the top of the community to be a genius of the game, and is usually at the top of the list when it comes to protoss players that terran players fear in the biggest tournaments.
but nah let's just lump him into "way past his prime protoss player" with MC
I will say this though, if there's one terran player aside from Maru who aint about that protoss cheese, it's special.
So many times when i catch special on streams, he's always breaking down the most brutal of protoss cheeses and is looking for ways to stop it. he hates it so badly lmao
really ??? when you see my new goat and my old goat and my old old old goat all of them complaining about protoss then you already have 1000 balance threads
On May 15 2019 06:26 Alejandrisha wrote: special is my new favorite foreigner. loved the games but loved the interview even more. he is so likable and human
friendship ended with gumiho major is now my new goat
srsly. i loved his games in ro32 and what he relayed to TY plus his interviews... juan is seriously my favorite to win this whole thing. edit: and remember his drawing :D:D:D:D:D:D:D
EPT
![[image loading]](/staff/Waxangel/GSL/2019/codes2/renaissancebanner.jpg)
Terran: INnoVation, GuMiho, FanTaSy, SpeCial
Protoss: Patience, Classic, Hurricane, Trap, Dear, Stats, herO, PartinG
Zerg: Impact, soO, Dark, RagnaroK
