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GrandTerran
Profile Blog Joined January 2018
71 Posts
March 19 2018 17:26 GMT
#101
On March 20 2018 01:22 Soularion wrote:
1. (T)Mvp (The GOAT. Faced the most adversity, had one of the highest peaks, influenced the meta game beyond belief, smartest player of all time, most clutch player of all time, took prime INnoVation to five games after injury.)

2. (Z)Life (Amazing player, despite all that he's done, which unfortunately stopped him from ever taking #1 on this list. Best instincts of all time. One of the best mechanical players. Amazing playstyle. Just a phenomenal talent, the likes of which we won't ever see in sc2.)

3. (Z)soO (It's a stunning feat to go on a run of GSL finals appearances, and he's done it twice. One of the most consistent players of all time. Arguably the most accomplished player of all time. However, I value consistency slightly less than others might, or else he'd be #2 on this list.)

4. (T)TaeJa (Similarly to soO, except with foreign domination and championships instead of korean domination and finals. Great player. He looked less good in GSL, which stops him from being #2, but you cannot look at this guy's resume and tell me he doesn't deserve a high spot on this list. One of the best 'hit lists' of players he's beaten of all time.)

5. (T)INnoVation (One of the most consistent mechanical players of all time, one of the few terrans to not battle injury his entire career. Still has many horrible, embarrassing moments (blowing a 3-0 lead, blowing that lead vs Mvp, losing to NaNiwa, often vanishing after winning a championship, etc.) which stop him from being higher.

6. (P)MC (Hilarious personality, and one of the great innovators of the early stages of the game as well. However, unlike NesTea, he showed that he could continue to compete at a high level well after his prime, and continued to both show great domestic results and incredibly good international results for years after.)

7. (P)Zest (One of the most underrated players of all time. One of the great innovators of the HotS era. He has the highest peak of any protoss ever. However, he makes befuddling mistakes which keep him from really being in the GOAT conversation - TANGTANG, really?)

8. (T)Polt (Arguably the most ever-lasting player, Polt was a domestic success and then went on to be the most internationally successful player of all time, and his ability to continue his career in WCS long after his mechanics started to fail him speaks to his mentality. One of the great minds of our game.)

9. (T)Maru (Unfortunately without a GSL title, but Maru is arguably the greatest mechanical player of all time, the greatest mechanical terran of all time, one of the greatest proleague players in SC2 history, one of the higher peaks in SC2 history, and a player who has repeatedly made runs after his prime and when his race was in poor balance. Slight inconsistency and inability to win a GSL - yet - stops him from being higher.)

10. (P)Rain (Incredibly consistent player who added a lot to his game with age. Began as one of the most dominant protosses we've ever seen and left as an OSL champion, a GSL champion, a proleague all-star, and one of the best protosses of all time.)

Honorable Mentions : MMA, NesTea, MarineKing, sOs (NesTea/MarineKing have great peaks but get moved down to their inability to make continued runs after their prime; MMA could probably get a spot in this list, but I felt like his results took a harsh dip after ~2012 - no, his Blizzcon run is not that impressive to me; sOs could probably sneak in with continued success, and is the ultimate counter-argument to anyone putting Rogue on their list. He did IEM WC + Blizzcon first, after all.)


Great post!
seopthi
Profile Blog Joined December 2014
395 Posts
March 19 2018 17:26 GMT
#102
1. (Z)Life
2. (P)MC
3. (T)TaeJa
4. (Z)Rogue
5. (T)TY
6. (T)INnoVation
7. (Z)NesTea
8. (P)Rain
9. (T)Polt
10. (P)Zest
SAFenix
Profile Joined July 2011
Canada439 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-19 17:32:59
March 19 2018 17:31 GMT
#103
1. (T)Mvp
2. (Z)soO
3. (T)INnoVation
4. (P)Zest
5. (Z)Life
6. (T)MMA
7. (P)Zest
8. (P)Rain
9. (T)Maru
10. (Z)Dark

My list is definitely weighted towards active players, as I believe longevity is important in success. Mvp is GOAT solely on the fact that he was the first 'Best in the World' and history counts (similar to how BoxeR is considered a GOAT). soO at #2 is due to his ridiculous consistency to compete at a high level.
mYi.Rain | SKT1.soO
Elentos
Profile Blog Joined February 2015
55570 Posts
March 19 2018 17:49 GMT
#104
On March 20 2018 02:31 SAFenix wrote:
1. (T)Mvp
2. (Z)soO
3. (T)INnoVation
4. (P)Zest
5. (Z)Life
6. (T)MMA
7. (P)Zest
8. (P)Rain
9. (T)Maru
10. (Z)Dark

My list is definitely weighted towards active players, as I believe longevity is important in success. Mvp is GOAT solely on the fact that he was the first 'Best in the World' and history counts (similar to how BoxeR is considered a GOAT). soO at #2 is due to his ridiculous consistency to compete at a high level.

So weighted towards active players you have Zest twice.
Every 60 seconds in Africa, a minute passes.
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24422 Posts
March 19 2018 18:28 GMT
#105
On March 20 2018 02:49 Elentos wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 20 2018 02:31 SAFenix wrote:
1. (T)Mvp
2. (Z)soO
3. (T)INnoVation
4. (P)Zest
5. (Z)Life
6. (T)MMA
7. (P)Zest
8. (P)Rain
9. (T)Maru
10. (Z)Dark

My list is definitely weighted towards active players, as I believe longevity is important in success. Mvp is GOAT solely on the fact that he was the first 'Best in the World' and history counts (similar to how BoxeR is considered a GOAT). soO at #2 is due to his ridiculous consistency to compete at a high level.

So weighted towards active players you have Zest twice.


As opposed to a lot of people who don't even have him in once, which is just as absurd.
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
Fango
Profile Joined July 2016
United Kingdom8987 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-19 19:03:42
March 19 2018 19:02 GMT
#106
On March 20 2018 03:28 Olli wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 20 2018 02:49 Elentos wrote:
On March 20 2018 02:31 SAFenix wrote:
1. (T)Mvp
2. (Z)soO
3. (T)INnoVation
4. (P)Zest
5. (Z)Life
6. (T)MMA
7. (P)Zest
8. (P)Rain
9. (T)Maru
10. (Z)Dark

My list is definitely weighted towards active players, as I believe longevity is important in success. Mvp is GOAT solely on the fact that he was the first 'Best in the World' and history counts (similar to how BoxeR is considered a GOAT). soO at #2 is due to his ridiculous consistency to compete at a high level.

So weighted towards active players you have Zest twice.


As opposed to a lot of people who don't even have him in once, which is just as absurd.

Obviously it's all subjective. But I do think Zest is the obvious pick as #1 protoss. I don't see any reason to put another above him, or have him missing on a top 10 list. His 2014 might be the best year of any player to date, except Mvp's 2011 depending on how you look at it.
Zest, sOs, PartinG, Dark, and Maru are the real champs. ROOT_herO is overrated. Snute, Serral, and Scarlett are the foreigner GOATs
IshinShishi
Profile Joined April 2012
Japan6156 Posts
March 19 2018 19:12 GMT
#107
people that put (Z)Life first whilst (T)Mvp isn't even on their list should be ignored as they are clearly salty about Mvp's goatness.
So... what that make you? Good? You're not good. You just know how to hide, how to lie
alukarD
Profile Joined July 2012
Mexico396 Posts
March 19 2018 19:15 GMT
#108
As much as I agree that Life should be up there, his actions should not make him worthy of being part of this list.

A player's career is defined from beginning to end.

If we overlook what he did, we as a community are tolerating his wrong doings.
Die Trying
Charoisaur
Profile Joined August 2014
Germany16062 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-19 19:19:56
March 19 2018 19:19 GMT
#109
Another player who seems to be criminally underrated is herO.
3 korean tournament wins, won 3 stacked IEMs, Proleague monster + a couple more final appearances.
I feel like he HAS to be in a Top 10 list.
Many of the coolest moments in sc2 happen due to worker harassment
StarscreamG1
Profile Joined February 2011
Portugal1653 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-19 19:34:44
March 19 2018 19:33 GMT
#110
I'm not voting, bu I'll say this. If mechanics could have keep track of the brain, NesTea would be the GOAT. He was doing things no one could have imagined that could work.
And can't forget that InCa final \m/
usopsama
Profile Joined April 2008
6502 Posts
March 19 2018 19:34 GMT
#111
Greatest players of all times:
- All former Kespa

Worst players of all times:
- All foreigners, half-breeds, mixed-bloods, and traitors.
KelsierSC
Profile Blog Joined March 2013
United Kingdom10443 Posts
March 19 2018 19:38 GMT
#112
On March 20 2018 04:34 usopsama wrote:
Greatest players of all times:
- All former Kespa

Worst players of all times:
- All foreigners, half-breeds, mixed-bloods, and traitors.


Calm down marvolo
Zerg for Life
Justinian
Profile Joined August 2012
United Kingdom158 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-19 21:27:34
March 19 2018 19:39 GMT
#113
1. (T)Mvp
2. (Z)Life
3. (T)INnoVation
4. (P)MC
5. (P)Zest
6. (P)sOs
7. (T)TaeJa
8. (Z)soO
9. (T)MMA
10. (T)Maru

There's a big drop off after the top 3. Polt, herO and Rain just miss out.
Luolis
Profile Blog Joined May 2012
Finland7164 Posts
March 19 2018 20:27 GMT
#114
On March 19 2018 01:43 KalWarkov wrote:
1. (T)INnoVation
2. (Z)Life
3. (T)Mvp
4. (Z)soO
5. (T)Maru
6. (P)MC
7. (Z)Rogue
8. (P)sOs
9. (T)TaeJa
10. (T)Polt
11. (P)PartinG
12. (T)MMA
13. (Z)NesTea
14. (Z)Dark
15. (P)Rain
16. (P)Zest
17. (T)ByuN
18. (P)Classic
19. (T)TY
20. (P)Stats
21. (T)MarineKingPrime
22. (Z)Stephano
23. (T)Bomber
24. (P)herO
25. (Z)Soulkey
26. (T)GuMiho
27. (P)herO (HerO)
28. (Z)Snute
29. (P)HuK
30. (P)Dear
31. (T)jjakji
32. (P)NaNiwa


Not putting Jaedong/Flash out of respect for them, as they couldve been top 10 if they played long enough, and ranking them lower is breaking my heart


Western Foreigners (no chinese, taiwanese):

1. (Z)Stephano
2. (Z)Snute
3. (P)HuK
4. (P)NaNiwa
5. (Z)Nerchio
6. (Z)Scarlett
7. (P)Neeb
8. (T)ThorZaIN
9. (T)Jinro
10. (Z)IdrA
11. (T)Bunny
12. (Z)Elazer
13. (P)Lilbow
14. (Z)Serral
15. (T)MajOr/Special
15. (Z)VortiX
16. (P)MaNa
17. (Z)TLO
18. (T)LucifroN
19. (T)SjoW
20. (Z)Ret
21. (T)MarineLorD
22. (P)ShoWTimE
23. (T)uThermal
24. (P)Harstem
25. (P)PtitDrogo
26. (Z)DIMAGA
27. (P)MorroW
28. (T)qxc
29. (Z)Bly
30. (P)Socke
31. (P)HasuObs
32. (Z)Suppy
33. (P)White-Ra
34. (T)Kas
35. (T)Happy
36. (Z)Kane
37. (T)DeMusliM
38. (Z)Sheth
39. (P)Feast
40. (T)Kelazhur
41. (P)elfi
42. (T)Strelok
42. (T)BRAT_OK
43. (Z)Goswser
44. (P)SaSe
45. (Z)PiG
46. (T)Dayshi
47. (T)MaSa
48. (P)KiWiKaKi
49. (P)TitaN
50. (T)iaguz
51. (Z)ViBE
52. (P)puCK
53. (T)Dayshi
54. (T)Naama
55. (Z)Namshar
56. (Z)HayprO
57. (Z)SortOf
58. (T)HeRoMaRinE
59. (Z)Lambo
60. (Z)Reynor
61. (P)monchi
62. (Z)Starbuck
63. (P)DnS
64. (T)Semper
65. (Z)Cham
66. (Z)JonSnow
67. (Z)CatZ
68. (Z)NoRegreT
69. (T)souL

Not putting Grubby/ToD out of respect for them, as they couldve maybe possibly been top 10 if they played long enough, and ranking them lower is breaking my heart


This list is 100% accurate don't @ me





I won't comment on much but a few things. Naama and elfi under Feast, Sheth, Kane and Suppy? :D Also where is Welmu. :DD
pro cheese woman / Its never Sunny in Finland. Perkele / FinnishStarcraftTrivia
[PkF] Wire
Profile Joined March 2013
France24238 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-19 20:55:47
March 19 2018 20:51 GMT
#115
Too tough...

1. (T)INnoVation
2. (Z)Life
3. (T)Mvp
4. (P)sOs
5. (Z)soO
6. (Z)Rogue
7. (P)Zest
8. (T)TaeJa
9. (T)TY
10. (T)Polt

Yeah I know, where are Maru, Rain, MC and so many others... Too tough, like I said...
KalWarkov
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
Germany4126 Posts
March 19 2018 21:39 GMT
#116
On March 20 2018 04:12 IshinShishi wrote:
people that put (Z)Life first whilst (T)Mvp isn't even on their list should be ignored as they are clearly salty about Mvp's goatness.


and vice versa. betting scandal doesn't take away from his success - in my mind, it acutally ADDS to his success - he lost some touranments on PURPOSE ffs.
DiaBoLuS ** Sc2 - Protoss: 16x GM | Dota2 - Offlane Immortal | Wc3 - Undead decent level | Diablo nerd | Chess / Magnus fanboy | BVB | Agnostic***
NinjaToss
Profile Blog Joined October 2015
Austria1383 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-19 21:41:53
March 19 2018 21:40 GMT
#117
On March 20 2018 06:39 KalWarkov wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 20 2018 04:12 IshinShishi wrote:
people that put (Z)Life first whilst (T)Mvp isn't even on their list should be ignored as they are clearly salty about Mvp's goatness.


and vice versa. betting scandal doesn't take away from his success - in my mind, it acutally ADDS to his success - he lost some touranments on PURPOSE ffs.


He didn't lost a tournament on purpose, he only lost some games in different series on purpose, in A tournament (singular form).

Read more here: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/starcraft-2/507933-life-and-bbyong-charged-with-match-fixing
I'm sorry for all those that got their hearts broken by Zest | Zest, Bisu, soO, herO, MC, Maru, TY, Rogue, Trap, TaeJa", Favourite foreigners: ShoWTimE, Snute, Serral and Nerchio| KT BEST KT |
FrostedMiniWheats
Profile Joined August 2010
United States30730 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-19 21:48:25
March 19 2018 21:47 GMT
#118
On March 20 2018 04:02 Fango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 20 2018 03:28 Olli wrote:
On March 20 2018 02:49 Elentos wrote:
On March 20 2018 02:31 SAFenix wrote:
1. (T)Mvp
2. (Z)soO
3. (T)INnoVation
4. (P)Zest
5. (Z)Life
6. (T)MMA
7. (P)Zest
8. (P)Rain
9. (T)Maru
10. (Z)Dark

My list is definitely weighted towards active players, as I believe longevity is important in success. Mvp is GOAT solely on the fact that he was the first 'Best in the World' and history counts (similar to how BoxeR is considered a GOAT). soO at #2 is due to his ridiculous consistency to compete at a high level.

So weighted towards active players you have Zest twice.


As opposed to a lot of people who don't even have him in once, which is just as absurd.

Obviously it's all subjective. But I do think Zest is the obvious pick as #1 protoss. I don't see any reason to put another above him, or have him missing on a top 10 list. His 2014 might be the best year of any player to date, except Mvp's 2011 depending on how you look at it.


Prior to 2017 I'd of given Zest #1 Protoss, but I think sOs has definitely overtaken him now with getting another 2nd place in GSL.

It's close but it amounts to this:

- They tie on IEM WC wins of similar competition
- Zest has x2 GSL wins, but sOs has x2 Blizzcon wins and x2 GSL silvers
- They're about the same in ro8+ starleague runs
- In Weekend tournaments they're also pretty close

the distinguishing factor is that despite how much people rag on sOs for his inconsistency (overblown tbh) he has never hit the same lows that Zest sometimes has and he's usually competitive enough to be around ro8 GSL level. Zest strikes me as a very dominant player when things are stable or favorable for Protoss, sOs just seems to have that magic aura where you always need to be afraid of him like with Mvp, Life, and Taeja. Additionally, sOs has another edge in longevity. Zest didn't explode out the gate until 2014.
NesTea | Mvp | MC | Leenock | Losira | Gumiho | DRG | Taeja | Jinro | Stephano | Thorzain | Sen | Idra |Polt | Bomber | Symbol | Squirtle | Fantasy | Jaedong | Maru | sOs | Seed | ByuN | ByuL | Neeb| Scarlett | Rogue | IM forever
EvilTeletubby
Profile Blog Joined January 2004
Baltimore, USA22259 Posts
Last Edited: 2018-03-19 21:49:05
March 19 2018 21:48 GMT
#119
(T)boxer
iloveOOv
(T)NaDa
(T)Flash
(P)Bisu
(Z)Jaedong
(Z)JulyZerg
(Z)Savior
(Z)YellOw
Nal_Ra


I don't recognize any of these other names being posted.
Moderatorhttp://carbonleaf.yuku.com/topic/408/t/So-I-proposed-at-a-Carbon-Leaf-concert.html ***** RIP Geoff
usopsama
Profile Joined April 2008
6502 Posts
March 19 2018 22:13 GMT
#120
On March 20 2018 06:48 EvilTeletubby wrote:
(T)boxer
iloveOOv
(T)NaDa
(T)Flash
(P)Bisu
(Z)Jaedong
(Z)JulyZerg
(Z)Savior
(Z)YellOw
Nal_Ra


I don't recognize any of these other names being posted.

I approve of this list.
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