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KeSPA Cup 2016 - Power Rank
September 27th, 2016 00:04 GMT
Welcome to KeSPA Cup—the first Global Event of 2016! It’s been a long buildup to the main event over the last couple of weeks, but we’re finally about to kick off the Korea vs the World rivalry we’ve been looking forward to all year. One group will be played per day from Tuesday to Friday, before a day off leads us into the playoffs on Sunday and Monday. Join us for a power rank of the sixteen players in attendance. As usual, the standard qualifiers apply—this is a PR collated from the votes of seven writers, ensuring that none of us are happy with the final result. For the first time though, we’re showing exactly how each of us voted, allowing all of you to abuse us personally in the comments instead of hiding under the TL Esports banner. Power Rank#16: MVP. Pet Pet ZvZ'd his way through the qualifier. Fortunately for the suspense here, that tells us next to nothing about his skill overall, especially because nothing was streamed. Pet's only other ventures have come online against mixed competition, with mixed results. HIs GSL Season 2 was cut short by Stork in Code A. The only thing that makes me think Pet has any chance of taking the odd map is that he beat SSL runner-up and Cross Finals Champion Dark in his final qualifying series. Regardless of what match-up you're playing, beating Dark is impressive. So good on you, Pet. Let's see what you've got. Until then, though, I'm putting you at #16. [E/N: So is everyone else] munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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16 | 16 | 16 | 16 | 16 | 16 | 16 |
#15: Millenium. MarineLorDLet’s not beat around the bush; it’s been a pretty disappointing year for MarineLorD. Sure, 2nd place at DH Valencia was impressive, albeit falling crushingly short after Nerchio’s dominant 4-0 win in the final, but results elsewhere have been lacking. Top 16 finishes at WCS Winter and Summer, a top 8 place at HSC, and assorted other low finishes aren’t really anything to be embarassed about, but after the hype train that was Nation Wars last December, it’s been a swift fall from grace. At the start of the year, MarineLorD stated that he wanted at least a $50,000 haul from the year to justify the progamer life; as we come to the end of 2016, it seems he’s likely to fall short. Nothing is expected of him here, and he’ll be the biggest underdog of the foreigner triple threat in this competition (especially given his tough group). Then again, we have to remember the run that kicked off his year; the run that announced him as a threat in Legacy of the Void. None of those players he demolished will be here—Hydra, PartinG and INnoVation—but Korea does not forget. They’ll be gunning for him, but with nothing to lose here, MarineLorD may well give them one more thing to remember. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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15 | 15 | 15 | 15 | 13 | 14 | 15 |
#14: PSISTORM. TRUEWith a WCS title under his belt, TRUE didn't need any additional WCS Points. Regardless, he qualified through the NA qualifier with flying colors. That's in stark contrast to his Open Qualifier performance, though, where he was quickly 2-0'd by Super. If that is anything to go by, then TRUE might face some trouble in KeSPA Cup. Nevertheless, he has done very well against any kind of competition in the foreign scene, of which some players are ranked higher than TRUE himself here, so I will cut him some slack. Inexperience in Korea will not be his downfall, as TRUE was a Code S player before relocating to the US. He's also in arguably the weakest group. But this ranking is not about who has the best chances to advance, it's about who we think are the best players overall. And although TRUE is good, we agreed that the players above him are better. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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13 | 12 | 14 | 14 | 14 | 15 | 14 |
#13 JinAir. TrapDespite Jin Air’s overwhelming success this year, Trap’s gone under the radar in 2016. A top 16 finish in GSL S1 was encouraging, looking particularly clean against Super, but poor performances in Season 2 contributed to early exits in both competitions. Usurped by Cure for Jin Air’s 4th spot, Trap’s had little to do in the back end of 2016. Then again, Trap’s never been a player who’s particularly impressed in the Korean starleagues, save for his breakout 5th place finish in WCS KR S3 2013. He’s always been a player who kicks it up a gear in his rare forays in foreign events with remarkable reliability—top 4 at the WCS S3 Finals in 2013, 1st and 4th at MLG Anaheim and Red Bull Washington respectively in 2014, and his silver medal at IEM Katowice last year. Shorn of those opportunities this year, this will be Trap’s final chance in 2016; can he conjure up some weekender magic once more? munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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14 | 14 | 13 | 13 | 11 | 13 | 13 |
#12: TING. NeebArguably the best American player, Neeb, is hard to rank. Summed up in short, it's because there are two different players wrapped in one Neeb. One that is good enough to 4-0 a GSL champion online and dominate foreign opposition, and another who, at the first sign of glory, lets himself be overcome by panic and nerves. These two play the game differently. Whereas regular Neeb approaches the game similarly to Zest, figuring out builds, refining them and executing them very well, nervous Neeb lets it fall apart. Execution requires a level of calmness, a view from above and cold blood, and nervousness directly opposes that. Neeb is his own worst enemy, because his personality almost directly opposes his style of play. If that were not the case, chances are Neeb would dominate the foreign scene entirely and, naturally, be ranked higher. How this translates to his performance at the offline KeSPA Cup is hard to say. He has had some time to get accustomed to Korea, having lived there for a few weeks now. He may have played against others in this event on ladder before. But Korea is a rough neighborhood, and competition will be harder than ever before. Neeb may come into the tournament with a 'nothing to lose' attitude, calming his mind and letting him perform well, but he may also crumble under the heavy weight of Korea's greatest players. A group with ByuN, Zest and Rogue could absolutely do both. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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12 | 13 | 12 | 11 | 15 | 11 | 8 |
#11 JinAir. RogueThere’s been no more confusing player to watch in Korea this year than Rogue. From the utter consistency of 2015—five top 8 finishes out of six in the starleagues—to the crazy ups and downs of 2016, Rogue’s definitely taken a backward step this year. Still, for every dispiriting defeat, there’s an equally uplifting reminder of Rogue at his creative best, not least in his multiple unorthodox victories over Zest during the year. His ZvZ has grown from strength to strength (7-0 in Proleague this year), and he’s arguably the best mirror matcher that the race has to offer right now. What we saw last year from Rogue was a player who’d crush through lesser opposition in the early rounds, before being unable to beat the best in the business when the pressure ramped up. Arguably, it’s been completely the opposite this year; clutch for Jin Air in ace matches, while having enough tools to take out unsuspecting opposition. It’s a formula that thwarted him in the starleagues, but the fast paced KeSPA Cup rounds, Rogue could spring an upset. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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10 | 10 | 10 | 12 | 10 | 12 | 12 |
#10: KT. ZestNever did I imagine that Zest would fall this hard after his dominant GSL winning run. It's taken only seven series to push him from what could still be the throne of this ranking down to tenth place. Those series are the last ones he has played. Every one of them he lost. But it isn't that he lost them, it's the manner he lost them in. While he was painting near perfect pictures previously, his strokes now seem blunt and rough. His execution appears especially questionable, his decisions sometimes off. Now, seven series is not much to write someone off completely. With three GSL trophies and a KeSPA Cup in Korea alone, Zest's ability to bounce back stronger than ever is immense. His recent form makes you wonder if #10 is even low enough, but the fact that he won a GSL this year and was the best player in the world for a long time lets him stay here. Class is permanent, and Zest most certainly has it, but his form does not appear to be there right now. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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11 | 11 | 11 | 9 | 8 | 10 | 10 |
#9 EURONICS. NerchioIs there really another choice right now for ‘Best Foreigner in SC2’? Nerchio’s relentless self-promotion, both on the message boards and in the server, has garnered him plenty of fans around the world. Not without reason; the EURONICS zerg has put together an awesomely consistent set of results since the release of Legacy of the Void. He’s reached the top 8 in eight of his ten competitive appearances since DH Winter 2015, including the runners up spot at WCS Spring and the gold at DH Valencia—a record that only Neeb comes close to matching. It’s not just foreigners that Nerchio is crushing though; in the past four months, his record against KR-based Koreans is 20-6, including six victims from his rampage through SHOUTcraft Kings September. The Polish zerg is a very real threat here, and if his motivation for success here isn’t already at an all-time high, certain comments from SKT Dark might push him over the edge. Nerchio notably shares a group with Dark’s teammate Classic, and success here could well mean an awkward night in the SKT house. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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9 | 9 | 8 | 8 | 12 | 9 | 7 |
#8: Afreeca. PatienceIt may be time to re-evaluate Patience as a player. Always talked about as someone who isn't good enough to hang with the very best, but occasionally take games off them, the Afreeca ace has finally hit his stride and it's become impossible to deny it. That's why, at the last event before BlizzCon, Patience is still fighting for a spot, and he isn't far off either. Had Classic failed to qualify for KeSPA Cup, Patience' ticket to Anaheim would already be booked. Patience is not your everyday cheesy Protoss anymore. He's now someone who easily 2-0'd INnoVation and sOs, despite the latter having everything to lose. He's the one who knocked GSL champion Zest out of Starleague in a Bo5. He beat TY and Cure to get there in the first place. Patience is now good enough to compete with the best, and to beat them. And right here, he can prove it by securing his place at the Global Finals. That's why, deservedly so, Patience ranks at #8 and may even deserve higher if his recent form is anything to go by. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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8 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 9 | 6 | 9 |
#7 CJ. herOherO was by far the most polarising player in the entire PR. Ranked as high as #4 by one writer, and as low as #11 by another, the CJ ace seems to be the one player that we can’t really agree on at all. That’s partly because he’s neither had the eyecatching starleague placements of some of those above him, nor the mindboggling Proleague results of others (Maru). Still, it bears repeating that while it’s been a step down from his stellar 2015, herO’s still had a great year. Two top 8 finishes in the GSL have been paired with a 20-9 record in Proleague—results all the more impressive given how disastrously the rest of CJ have performed this year. Let’s not forget too—herO still has an outside chance of stealing the 8th seed for BlizzCon. Sure, it’s unlikely—he’ll need to win the whole thing, while hoping Classic and Patience drop out early—but with one more target to aim at, 2016’s not quite over yet for herO. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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4 | 6 | 5 | 7 | 7 | 8 | 11 |
#6: JinAir. MaruA single Ro16. That's Maru's individual league achievements throughout the whole year. Despite all the talk that Korean competition is too rough, which may very well be the case, Maru just didn't show up in them. He failed to qualify for anything in Season 1, fell out of Starleague in S2 Challenger again. His GSL S2 run was ended by MyuNgSiK and Dear, just about summing up that chapter of his career. So why is he at #6? Well, Maru's Proleague record is absurd. 22-4 is good, no matter how you spin it. And despite being eliminated from every individual competition early, Maru rarely looked bad in defeat. He did, however, look absolutely dominant in victory. It's incredibly hard to rank Maru due to his lack of individual success, but we've decided to give him the benefit of the doubt and agreed that the way he played Proleague all year deserves a decent ranking. So welcome at rank 6, Maru. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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5 | 7 | 7 | 6 | 6 | 3 | 6 |
#5 KT. Stats“Anything that Stats can do, Zest can do better”. It’s a fact that Stats’ big brother on KT proved time and again in the first half of the year. It was Zest who won his starleague final; Zest who led KT to Proleague success. That’s the perceived wisdom though. Since his SSL loss to Dark, Stats went from strength to strength; winning the Cross Finals over Zest and Dark while embarking on a 15-1 winstreak in Proleague. Where Zest has struggled, Stats has made his case to be KT’s #1 player, even if a tight 2-3 loss to Classic kicked him out of the SSL and a rare bad day at the office led to 0-2s from Cure and MyuNgSiK in the GSL. Stats has always been the dark horse of the protoss pack. Zest, Classic, herO and sOs have all tasted success on multiple occasions, but Stats is still yet to stand on the stage as a champion—let’s be honest, the Cross Finals don’t really count. His consistency throughout the year has delivered him a guaranteed spot at BlizzCon; it’s time for him to add the KeSPA Cup cherry to the cake. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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7 | 5 | 6 | 4 | 5 | 7 | 5 |
#4: SKT. ClassicCurrently sitting very uncomfortably in #8 of the Korean WCS rankings, Classic has definitely stepped up from where he was earlier this year. To be honest with you, this writer (Olli) thinks that Legacy of the Void is absolutely not a game made for Classic, a player who previously excelled at no single thing in particular, but was the most versatile Protoss in the world. He can do absolutely everything at a very high level, and HotS simply had more strategies for him to use. The more Classic is allowed to do, the better he is. That's why I still don't think that he's as good as he was in the previous expansion. When he won his SSL and IEM titles, Classic was the best player in the world. Those heights he hasn't reached since. But he has definitely improved compared to his early days in the new game. His SSL semifinal series against Dark was one of the best series of the year, played at an immensely high level. Despite Dark barely edging out a win in the end, Classic did plenty to show that he is still very much one of the greats. His form is good, he looks good in every match-up, he's a championship caliber player. And, perhaps most importantly, Classic has everything to play for, with Patience on his heels in WCS. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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6 | 4 | 4 | 5 | 4 | 5 | 4 |
#3 KT. TYMuch like Stats, TY’s seemingly fated to be ‘that player who places highly but fails to win’. Denied GSL victory by his teammate Zest, he’s nonetheless been excellent throughout 2016. Following up his GSL silver with a pair of top 8 finishes gives him a consistency other players on this list can only dream of, and he was only denied further glory by some inspired PvT from Dear, and some world class ZvT from his traditional nemesis Dark. Still, it’s all added up to another year of ‘not quite’ for the KT terran—not quite good enough in TvP to beat Zest or Dear; not quite good enough in TvZ to beat Dark; not quite good enough in TvT to beat Maru. Much like Stats, TY’s always been good, but not the best. What better time to correct that status than the first Global Event of 2016? munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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3 | 3 | 3 | 2 | 2 | 4 | 3 |
#2: Samsung. SolarSolar has deserved to be the highest ranking Zerg in something for so long. This time, there's no soO to automatically rank above him, as it was in 2014. No Life, as in 2015. And with Dark not qualifying for KeSPA Cup, his current rival isn't here either. And thus, Solar is the best Zerg at this event. The reigning Starleague champion almost added another trophy to his growing stack, but was ultimately out-ZvZ-ed by Dark in a deciding fifth game of the Cross Finals. With top class ZvZ, arguably the best ZvP on the planet, and largely untested ZvT that we expect to be quite decent as well, Solar is one of the hottest contenders to take home KeSPA Cup as well. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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2 | 2 | 2 | 3 | 3 | 2 | 2 |
#1 ByuNBesides Pet, there was only one player that all seven of us agreed on. The reigning GSL champion is on a hot streak that rivals anything we’ve seen this year so far. ByuN shares Zest’s impenetrable aura in Season 1, and Maru’s irresistable force during his unbeaten proleague run. His TvP prowess is off the charts; since the start of July, ByuN is 80-8 in the matchup, with just one series loss to Classic in the SSL (having beaten Classic in their opening match). With 4-1 wins over both Dear and sOs en route to the GSL title, that particular streak doesn’t look like stopping anytime soon, with his transcendent micro control making mincemeat of protoss’ traditional adept-heavy armies. An 80% winrate in TvT in the same timeframe is hardly poor either, including a win over INnoVation (although it must be mentioned that he’s yet to face either TY or Maru this year). If he’s got one weakness, it’s that his TvZ is shaky sometimes, though his weakness against lategame zerg is more a generic terran concern than one attributable to him in particular. His 2-3 loss to Dark in the Cross-Finals demonstrated his inability to crack late game ultra-heavy compositions, although such a tight loss to the best ZvTer in the world is hardly a loss to be ashamed of. We’re in an age where none of the players we watch are perfect; there’s no 2011 Mvp to be found here. But in a set of players who all have their faults, ByuN shines as the star with the highest peaks. If he performs to his peak potential, with no Dark to stop him here, ByuN’s the clear favourite to take the tournament. munch | Olli | TheOneAboveU | hexhaven | Destructicon | banjoetheredskin | Soularion |
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1 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 1 |
Writer: Olli, munch Editor: Olli, munch Graphics: shiroiusagi
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United States97276 Posts
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Mute City2363 Posts
time to tell us who is the most biased
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THIS IS THE MOST HYPE TOURNAMENT IN 2016. Look at how many topic about it.
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Classic > Rogue Finals, ByuN gets second in his group
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United States33173 Posts
I don't know guys, are you sure you know StarCraft ?
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Nerchio ahead of Zest and Rogue is VERY generous lol.
I guess he does have a slightly easier group though so I guess it works out. Winners of Group A I think will be the heavy favorites to take the whole tournament.
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A foreigner in top10 power rank? on teamliquid? Dreams are made of this
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However this turns out it's a victory for me. I'm curious to see how these predictions pan out via groups.
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Everybody else in my group is higher than me, terrible power rank.
I can be #9, whatever, but patience/classic/maru need to be lower than #9
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Interesting list, seems decent enough Byun's mentioned winrates include a lot of online play i would imagine? While i think his skill atm is absolutely there he really plays a lot vs mediocre competition and thus the winrates are not really a good indicator. You have to put him at number one though so it's ok.
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pretty sure Pet will obliterate the Cup and this PR
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I'm pretty surprised that the foreigners didn't occupy the last four places (plus Pet), but I think I can understand Zest and Rogue's placing given Zest's recent form and Rogue's not-very-much that he has accomplished this year.
I do think that there are some very apt comparisons with Zest and Neeb. When they're on, they're really on, but when they're off, they're really off. Zest can go from winning GSLs to losing to TangTang. And Neeb has spectacularly failed at certain times in tournaments.
It should be a fun tournament.
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Very nice. You should have published the individual results years ago.
What I got from all this is that Soularion is the fool who likes foreigners, Destructicon is the KeSPA elitist, and everyone's overrating Maru.
On September 27 2016 09:42 Paljas wrote: pretty sure Pet will obliterate the Cup and this PR
Pet outZvZing TRUE would be best possible finals for this cup.
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On September 27 2016 09:48 ZigguratOfUr wrote: Very nice. You should have published the individual results years ago.
What I got from all this is that Soularion is the fool who likes foreigners, Destructicon is the KeSPA elitist, and everyone's overrating Maru. Yeah i also like Destruction's list the most
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Only Destruction makes sense. Nerchio could be rank 13, the highest of all foreigners and True
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Fiddler's Green42661 Posts
On September 27 2016 09:48 ZigguratOfUr wrote:Very nice. You should have published the individual results years ago. What I got from all this is that Soularion is the fool who likes foreigners, Destructicon is the KeSPA elitist, and everyone's overrating Maru. Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 09:42 Paljas wrote: pretty sure Pet will obliterate the Cup and this PR Pet outZvZing TRUE would be best possible finals for this cup.
pretty accurate. Funnily Ravi said Soul wasn't biased enough to NA players.
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Canada2764 Posts
I don't even like foreigners /that/ much, I just don't see that much from the koreans here
Pet is horrible, Trap is weak, Rogue and Zest have both had very very middling form recently, while herO/patience are totally arguable - I just haven't seen enough from herO, and his decisive losses in the Ro8 of both GSLs are the main thing I've seen from his year.
note neeb is floating super high in KR GM right now, which is pretty good, and Nerchio just ravaged a bunch of koreans in shoutcraft. I like foreigners, but not unreasonably
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Just did a search of the web and found NO information on who is commentating. Why is nobody asking this question!? Is it Tastosis?
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On September 27 2016 12:34 Xenharmonic wrote: Just did a search of the web and found NO information on who is commentating. Why is nobody asking this question!? Is it Tastosis? Im almost certain it'll be Wolf and Brenden
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Guys don't take it too seriously. You know, it's TL :p
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United States97276 Posts
On September 27 2016 12:42 Thouhastmail wrote: Guys don't take it too seriously. You know, it's TL :p rule 1 of power ranks is that you have to complain about it
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On September 27 2016 12:56 Shellshock wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 12:42 Thouhastmail wrote: Guys don't take it too seriously. You know, it's TL :p rule 1 of power ranks is that you have to complain about it
Then why the hell Maru is not #1?
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On September 27 2016 12:59 Thouhastmail wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 12:56 Shellshock wrote:On September 27 2016 12:42 Thouhastmail wrote: Guys don't take it too seriously. You know, it's TL :p rule 1 of power ranks is that you have to complain about it Then why the hell Maru is not #1?
TL writers are only willing to stretch our suspension of disbelief so far.
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On September 27 2016 13:09 ZigguratOfUr wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 12:59 Thouhastmail wrote:On September 27 2016 12:56 Shellshock wrote:On September 27 2016 12:42 Thouhastmail wrote: Guys don't take it too seriously. You know, it's TL :p rule 1 of power ranks is that you have to complain about it Then why the hell Maru is not #1? TL writers are only willing to stretch our suspension of disbelief so far.
Yet no Taeja in the ranking.
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Fiddler's Green42661 Posts
On September 27 2016 13:17 Phredxor wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 13:09 ZigguratOfUr wrote:On September 27 2016 12:59 Thouhastmail wrote:On September 27 2016 12:56 Shellshock wrote:On September 27 2016 12:42 Thouhastmail wrote: Guys don't take it too seriously. You know, it's TL :p rule 1 of power ranks is that you have to complain about it Then why the hell Maru is not #1? TL writers are only willing to stretch our suspension of disbelief so far. Yet no Taeja in the ranking.
He did beat Zest...
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On September 27 2016 09:42 Nerchio wrote: Everybody else in my group is higher than me, terrible power rank.
I can be #9, whatever, but patience/classic/maru need to be lower than #9
YOU need to be below Pet
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On September 27 2016 15:14 showstealer1829 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 09:42 Nerchio wrote: Everybody else in my group is higher than me, terrible power rank.
I can be #9, whatever, but patience/classic/maru need to be lower than #9 YOU need to be below Pet 
Hey, Pet beat Dark so he clearly can beat Nerchio, right?
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Pretty reasonable PR, I wouldn't put ByuN at #1 though, I'd put Solar instead (though as you said, we don't know much about his ZvT)
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Finland926 Posts
It's too late, we're all aboard the ByuN train.
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Austria24417 Posts
I think this is reasonable, get at me
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I thought herO finished top in PL wins? How can Maru have more wins than him then?
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Canada2764 Posts
On September 27 2016 09:42 Nerchio wrote: Everybody else in my group is higher than me, terrible power rank.
I can be #9, whatever, but patience/classic/maru need to be lower than #9 beat the protosses in your group and I'll rank you super high for blizzcon
like
maybe top 5
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Pet's going to fucking murder everybody.
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Germany3367 Posts
On September 27 2016 16:00 sharkie wrote: I thought herO finished top in PL wins? How can Maru have more wins than him then? The official PL ranking doesn't count playoff wins, but if you add these Maru has the edge I think.
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This is so exciting!
Go Nerchio! Go foreigners!
Of course I realize that Byun will win this But I'm fine with that.
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LOL@Maru being in the top 10
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I believe in Maru!
Pretty reasonable ranking, though I'll puto Rogue and Zest above Nerchio.
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On September 27 2016 15:56 Olli wrote: I think this is reasonable, get at me The power rank isn't just nerchio coming first 16 times, pretty illogical imo
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What is this with putting Zest so low XD I know he's been sucking recently but is it really that bad? I mean you put him lower than Nerch and herO? Both of them are playing at a lower level. If he's at his best he wins this cup easily whereas most the other guys have no chance.
Lowest is Pet, MLord, Nerch, True, herO, and Neeb. These are the only guys with 0 win chance
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1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
The writers aren't being insulted enough what is this
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On September 27 2016 16:31 lichter wrote: The writers aren't being insulted enough what is this Nerchio has a current monoply on internet hate points, maybe you could ask him to loan you some?
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Everyone saying Pet is a horrible player, but funny thing is Pet still qualified for GSL code A once while NA best zerg Scarlett and no other could not make ever. And HerO was the one who took down Pet 3-2 in season 2 code A, not Stork. And why Trap, Rogue, Zest are lower than foreigners who haven't even come to Korea and made GSL code S. Even mediocre code S player TRUE won WCS Circuit Summer by 16-2, and that is the fact so far. I know this is foreign community but it's bit biased I suppose to say
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Austria24417 Posts
Ah yes, now that we have no TL players to be biased in favor of, we have succumbed to preferring foreigners.
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no Dark no Party
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It's only like an opinion dude. Anyways I think this is a bit outdated with Zest and TY so high, also True should be higher. Rest is only nitpicking in comparison.
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I want to complain about something but none of the rankings are silly enough to be worth the effort. It's... disappointing.
On September 27 2016 17:10 ejozl wrote: It's only like an opinion dude. Anyways I think this is a bit outdated with Zest and TY so high, also True should be higher. Rest is only nitpicking in comparison. When you say "so high" you make it sound like Zest got a good spot, but he's pretty far down there. And I don't think you can really justify putting TY more than 2 spots lower than he is here.
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On September 27 2016 17:17 Elentos wrote:I want to complain about something but none of the rankings are silly enough to be worth the effort. It's... disappointing. Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 17:10 ejozl wrote: It's only like an opinion dude. Anyways I think this is a bit outdated with Zest and TY so high, also True should be higher. Rest is only nitpicking in comparison. When you say "so high" you make it sound like Zest got a good spot, but he's pretty far down there. And I don't think you can really justify putting TY more than 2 spots lower than he is here.
I think TY get bonus points for being in the easiest group.
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On September 27 2016 17:24 Fango wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 17:17 Elentos wrote:I want to complain about something but none of the rankings are silly enough to be worth the effort. It's... disappointing. On September 27 2016 17:10 ejozl wrote: It's only like an opinion dude. Anyways I think this is a bit outdated with Zest and TY so high, also True should be higher. Rest is only nitpicking in comparison. When you say "so high" you make it sound like Zest got a good spot, but he's pretty far down there. And I don't think you can really justify putting TY more than 2 spots lower than he is here. I think TY get bonus points for being in the easiest group.
But this ranking is not about who has the best chances to advance, it's about who we think are the best players overall. The reasoning for TRUE being at 14 even though he's also in the easiest group.
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On September 27 2016 16:30 Fango wrote: What is this with putting Zest so low XD I know he's been sucking recently but is it really that bad? I mean you put him lower than Nerch and herO? Both of them are playing at a lower level. If he's at his best he wins this cup easily whereas most the other guys have no chance.
Lowest is Pet, MLord, Nerch, True, herO, and Neeb. These are the only guys with 0 win chance
I love Zest, but based on his last bunch of games he deserves his ranking.
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On September 27 2016 17:27 Phredxor wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 16:30 Fango wrote: What is this with putting Zest so low XD I know he's been sucking recently but is it really that bad? I mean you put him lower than Nerch and herO? Both of them are playing at a lower level. If he's at his best he wins this cup easily whereas most the other guys have no chance.
Lowest is Pet, MLord, Nerch, True, herO, and Neeb. These are the only guys with 0 win chance I love Zest, but based on his last bunch of games he deserves his ranking.
Yh I know he's played awfully the past couple months but it's not like he's worse than herO or Nerchio by any means. He has a much better chance at winning than those guys. It's just a matter of time until his form bounces back again, once it does he'll probably win whatever we enters like before.
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On September 27 2016 17:43 Fango wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 17:27 Phredxor wrote:On September 27 2016 16:30 Fango wrote: What is this with putting Zest so low XD I know he's been sucking recently but is it really that bad? I mean you put him lower than Nerch and herO? Both of them are playing at a lower level. If he's at his best he wins this cup easily whereas most the other guys have no chance.
Lowest is Pet, MLord, Nerch, True, herO, and Neeb. These are the only guys with 0 win chance I love Zest, but based on his last bunch of games he deserves his ranking. Yh I know he's played awfully the past couple months but it's not like he's worse than herO or Nerchio by any means. He has a much better chance at winning than those guys. It's just a matter of time until his form bounces back again, once it does he'll probably win whatever we enters like before. He played worse than herO for sure. Remember how herO won the GSL group Zest was eliminated in?
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It is sad, Pet is not in one group with Nerchio when he was specifically preparing for a ZvZ for his group :-)
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Why is TRUE below Neeb and Nerchio when TRUE beasted through WCS and the NA qualifier both very easily? I mean Nerchio maybe, but Neeb?
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On September 27 2016 18:11 Die4Ever wrote: Why is TRUE below Neeb and Nerchio when TRUE beasted through WCS and the NA qualifier both very easily? I mean Nerchio maybe, but Neeb?
Didn't you hear? TRUE had bracket luck.
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On September 27 2016 17:46 Elentos wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 17:43 Fango wrote:On September 27 2016 17:27 Phredxor wrote:On September 27 2016 16:30 Fango wrote: What is this with putting Zest so low XD I know he's been sucking recently but is it really that bad? I mean you put him lower than Nerch and herO? Both of them are playing at a lower level. If he's at his best he wins this cup easily whereas most the other guys have no chance.
Lowest is Pet, MLord, Nerch, True, herO, and Neeb. These are the only guys with 0 win chance I love Zest, but based on his last bunch of games he deserves his ranking. Yh I know he's played awfully the past couple months but it's not like he's worse than herO or Nerchio by any means. He has a much better chance at winning than those guys. It's just a matter of time until his form bounces back again, once it does he'll probably win whatever we enters like before. He played worse than herO for sure. Remember how herO won the GSL group Zest was eliminated in?
Zest lost to 2 cheeses from Ryung, I wouldn't even say herO played better dispite beating Ryung afterwoods. In a more standard PvT Zest and herO are both miles ahead of Ryung. honestly herO got to ro8 GSL with nothing but average plays.
Can you really imagine Zest losing to herO in a series? Hell any decent Protoss right now beats herO.
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On September 27 2016 18:11 Die4Ever wrote: Why is TRUE below Neeb and Nerchio when TRUE beasted through WCS and the NA qualifier both very easily? I mean Nerchio maybe, but Neeb?
Maybe because TRUE has 2-6 map score vs Neeb in 2016. Or because TRUE lost to Pokebunny? He went through the qualifiers well, but he has also dropped a number of sets to people he probably shouldn't. He lost 2-0 to Super in the Kespa Cup qualifiers.
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On September 27 2016 09:20 Waxangel wrote:I don't know guys, are you sure you know StarCraft  ? Literally nothing,
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On September 27 2016 09:30 Vindicare605 wrote: Nerchio ahead of Zest and Rogue is VERY generous lol.
I guess he does have a slightly easier group though so I guess it works out. Winners of Group A I think will be the heavy favorites to take the whole tournament.
I mean. Nerchio has beaten neeb ;D
so are you saying Neeb will win the whole thing?
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Didn't you hear? TRUE had bracket luck.
Lmao Snute, Harstem, and Polt.... lucky indeed :D
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On September 27 2016 18:11 Die4Ever wrote: Why is TRUE below Neeb and Nerchio when TRUE beasted through WCS and the NA qualifier both very easily? I mean Nerchio maybe, but Neeb?
True failed to qualify for Copa over NA players and he hasn't really shown much of worth since Montreal. I'd say TRUE is good, but he isn't "Best foreigner" good by a long shot.
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On September 27 2016 22:06 RKC wrote: No love for Pet :/ No extra points for being cute.
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ByuN might be No. 1 here but he just got eliminated by Zest in Group A a few hours ago! Respect for Neeb for beating Rogue and Zest without dropping a map! =)
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who ever knows something about Gaussian normal distribution, sees that these powerrankings are arranged. that does not make them wrong, necessarily. just saying...
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Im so glad Zest was so happy again <3
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so Byun dieing counts as TL prediction curse doesn't it?
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If you approach it right anything can count as TL prediction curse.
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Byun is just overhyped The stats mentioned in the power rank are mainly due to easy competition in online cups. " His TvP prowess is off the charts; since the start of July, ByuN is 80-8 in the matchup" This looks like he is some sort of god, but then you realize that a lot of his opponents are nonames (who the fuck is "gyulzzing") or "bad" players like Billowy, Tails, Seed, etc So yeah Byun is good, but no he is not the god people think he is 
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On September 28 2016 04:22 The_Red_Viper wrote:Byun is just overhyped The stats mentioned in the power rank are mainly due to easy competition in online cups. " His TvP prowess is off the charts; since the start of July, ByuN is 80-8 in the matchup" This looks like he is some form of god, but then you realize that a lot of his opponents are nonames (who the fuck is "gyulzzing") or "bad" players like Billowy, Tails, Seed, etc So yeah Byun is good, but no he is not the god people think he is  To be fair, he 4-1'd Dear and with that alone he's had no competitor for best TvP player in the past few months (in the same time frame Dear is 3-2 against TY, 3-0 against Maru and 4-2 against GuMiho).
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Oh yeah sure not saying he isn't definitely up there. But the stats make it look way more impressive than it really is. I wonder what would have happened if Zest won the PvP tbh, that would have been an interesting match to watch :/
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On September 28 2016 04:31 The_Red_Viper wrote: Oh yeah sure not saying he isn't definitely up there. But the stats make it look way more impressive than it really is. I wonder what would have happened if Zest won the PvP tbh, that would have been an interesting match to watch :/ I think ByuN would have done a lot better against Neeb, at least from their most recent online matches. ByuN's style just seems to match well against Neeb's. But it would have been cool to see for sure. Not that what we got wasn't cool.
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I don't know whether to laugh or cry
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On September 28 2016 04:38 Noonius wrote: I don't know whether to laugh or cry
Maybe cry today, laugh tomorrow?
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On September 27 2016 15:22 Colouss wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2016 15:14 showstealer1829 wrote:On September 27 2016 09:42 Nerchio wrote: Everybody else in my group is higher than me, terrible power rank.
I can be #9, whatever, but patience/classic/maru need to be lower than #9 YOU need to be below Pet  Hey, Pet beat Dark so he clearly can beat Nerchio, right? 
Which is why Nerchio should be ranked below him
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On September 27 2016 16:30 Fango wrote: What is this with putting Zest so low XD I know he's been sucking recently but is it really that bad? I mean you put him lower than Nerch and herO? Both of them are playing at a lower level. If he's at his best he wins this cup easily whereas most the other guys have no chance.
Lowest is Pet, MLord, Nerch, True, herO, and Neeb. These are the only guys with 0 win chance
What was that about neeb? XD
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I love it when pros react to their placements in PowerRankings. I hope Nerchio shows up and make the TL writers feel embarrassed.
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Austria24417 Posts
Just to clarify this, we don't actually feel embarrassed if we're wrong. We laugh at people who claim to have known it better all along.
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Well to be fair, seeing as how foreigners make up 3/16 of the available spots, it's not too hard to be in the top ten of a power ranking (especially with players like Pet, True, and Trap ranked as they are).
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On September 28 2016 15:56 Olli wrote: Just to clarify this, we don't actually feel embarrassed if we're wrong. We laugh at people who claim to have known it better all along. Dammit.
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who said Pet is the worst? :D
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France12761 Posts
On September 28 2016 18:58 TheHumanLife wrote: who said Pet is the worst? :D Dark
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On September 28 2016 15:56 Olli wrote: Just to clarify this, we don't actually feel embarrassed if we're wrong. We laugh at people who claim to have known it better all along.
Sorry but this sentence sounds so much like when you're in elementary school and everybody laughs at you and, with tear-filled eyes, you shout whatever comeback you can think of at the crowd before running to your teacher to seek comfort...
Anyway that's the rule of power ranks : make biased predication, brag when you're right, be laughed at when you're wrong, just embrace it, and laugh with us
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Austria24417 Posts
What a silly argument. Any sort of player skill evaluation is, by definition, biased. Skill isn't something you can objectively measure. And it isn't like we all agreed on everything and rigged this ranking in favor of anyone. Each of us had their own ranking and we then put them together. This is the result.
So what if we're wrong? This is something to get the community interested in the event, and get people talking. That's the point. The point is not to be entirely correct and show that we know better. If it were, sure we'd be bragging about it. And we'd be embarrassed if we were wrong.
But there'll always be people commenting that don't get what this is about, you included. And that's laughable. Especially if those people show up afterwards. Knowing better in hindsight is not a skill.
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France12761 Posts
Is it possible to have an unofficial Power Rank on the general sc2 forum (reviewed beforehands) or it absolutely has to be put on blogs?
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Austria24417 Posts
There's a community PR in general I believe
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On September 28 2016 21:19 Olli wrote: What a silly argument. Any sort of player skill evaluation is, by definition, biased. Skill isn't something you can objectively measure. And it isn't like we all agreed on everything and rigged this ranking in favor of anyone. Each of us had their own ranking and we then put them together. This is the result.
So what if we're wrong? This is something to get the community interested in the event, and get people talking. That's the point. The point is not to be entirely correct and show that we know better. If it were, sure we'd be bragging about it. And we'd be embarrassed if we were wrong.
But there'll always be people commenting that don't get what this is about, you included. And that's laughable. Especially if those people show up afterwards. Knowing better in hindsight is not a skill.
ROFL, it's not an argument : we agree 
Ofc it's biased we all know it and that's why we love the power ranks, what are you even getting mad at? Every (e)sport discussion is biased, ever heard people talking about soccer???
Just chill out dude...
I mean if you can't relax and just take it easy, maybe it means you give more importance to this PR than you care to admit? I mean you can't be serious about a PR, can you???
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Austria24417 Posts
That's why the above "laughing at hindsight" was a joke. A jab back at people jabbing us. It's all good fun.
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+ Show Spoiler +On September 28 2016 18:58 TheHumanLife wrote: who said Pet is the worst? :D
Dark
Sorry bro, but it's foreigners who underestimated Pet
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I definitely feel more confident about Neeb's chances making the ro4. I don't know how Pet or Neeb will play, but I feel that Neeb's played harder zerg opponents over the last year than Pet has.
Also, depending on bracket luck, but I think that if Solar/Maru don't land on Neeb's side of the bracket, then he has a chance at getting ro4 and potentially even making the finals. Solar's looking really solid, and so I think he'll go out first in his group, but I don't know if Maru will make it out seeing as his performance against Protoss has been pretty lacklustre (53% winrate in LotV).
As for Protoss, I think Neeb has a decent chance against any of the Protoss left in the tournament. He may not win, but I don't think he's terribly disadvantaged against any of the remaining Protoss.
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Lets see if Solar can resist the curse.
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We can see if the TL power rank curse works on Neeb as he has been placed way too high compared to Pet.
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On September 28 2016 22:30 Diabolique wrote: We can see if the TL power rank curse works on Neeb as he has been placed way too high compared to Pet.
I thought the power rank was a predicted order of elimination thing :O Hehehehe
(This is joke. I too thought herO would get out )
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On September 28 2016 22:45 Ciaus237 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2016 22:30 Diabolique wrote: We can see if the TL power rank curse works on Neeb as he has been placed way too high compared to Pet. I thought the power rank was a predicted order of elimination thing :O Hehehehe (This is joke. I too thought herO would get out  ) We all thought herO would get out :-) And I am sad that after Pet's plays against herO, the TY's amazing OP Mech and True's neural parasited Mothership, we do not have three players progressing today ...
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pet at 16? seriously? aren't the editors supposed to catch stuff like this?
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I have a feeling Neeb might surprise and win his group.
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On September 28 2016 21:24 Olli wrote: There's a community PR in general I believe Yeah you are right i should do one of those again
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Funny how the undisputed #16 in the PR is in the RO8 but the undisputed #1 isn't
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On September 28 2016 15:56 Olli wrote: Just to clarify this, we don't actually feel embarrassed if we're wrong. We laugh at people who claim to have known it better all along. a tier list instead of a clear rank would be better imo and avoid the PR to be only a meme
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On September 29 2016 01:11 Makro wrote:Show nested quote +On September 28 2016 15:56 Olli wrote: Just to clarify this, we don't actually feel embarrassed if we're wrong. We laugh at people who claim to have known it better all along. a tier list instead of a clear rank would be better imo and avoid the PR to be only a meme No we need power ranks. Just because reality doesn't play out as the ranking doesn't mean the ranking wasn't good. This isn't about making it out of groups, it's about the "best player". Byun number one was the right choice, him losing against Zest doesn't change that
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On September 29 2016 01:15 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On September 29 2016 01:11 Makro wrote:On September 28 2016 15:56 Olli wrote: Just to clarify this, we don't actually feel embarrassed if we're wrong. We laugh at people who claim to have known it better all along. a tier list instead of a clear rank would be better imo and avoid the PR to be only a meme No we need power ranks. Just because reality doesn't play out as the ranking doesn't mean the ranking wasn't good. This isn't about making it out of groups, it's about the "best player". Byun number one was the right choice, him losing against Zest doesn't change that i agree, but was byun the most discussed one ?
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Well this is a true TL powerrank now that #16 moved forward
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On September 29 2016 01:15 The_Red_Viper wrote:Show nested quote +On September 29 2016 01:11 Makro wrote:On September 28 2016 15:56 Olli wrote: Just to clarify this, we don't actually feel embarrassed if we're wrong. We laugh at people who claim to have known it better all along. a tier list instead of a clear rank would be better imo and avoid the PR to be only a meme No we need power ranks. Just because reality doesn't play out as the ranking doesn't mean the ranking wasn't good. This isn't about making it out of groups, it's about the "best player". Byun number one was the right choice, him losing against Zest doesn't change that yea tiers wouldn't be nearly as fun, definitely enjoy the absolute rankings even if it only has a ~0.0001% chance of being "correct" fuck the haters
btw, Pet is winning the tournament and Byun is out, your power rank sucks!
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Canada2764 Posts
yeah I really don't understand why people rated herO so high
pet is lul
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On September 29 2016 05:26 Soularion wrote: yeah I really don't understand why people rated herO so high
pet is lul Because he's herO and he got a lot of wins in Proleague or something. I dunno. He'd still have been in my top 10 but definitely lower.
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I heard from Pet's interview that herO hasn't practicing a lot lately, don't know why..
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France12761 Posts
On September 29 2016 00:56 Clazziquai10 wrote: Funny how the undisputed #16 in the PR is in the RO8 but the undisputed #1 isn't Zest decided to have a good PvT again. He was playing badly this season but when you show such prowess (his PvT seemed reallyyy unbeatable in a series the first GSL), doing badly in GSL/SSL doesn't mean you'll perform equally as bad in things such as Kespa Cup. He was definitely hard to rank. Pet was a safe #16 but the favorites only win 2/3 of times, sometimes Pet have to win.
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On September 29 2016 06:10 TheHumanLife wrote: I heard from Pet's interview that herO hasn't practicing a lot lately, don't know why.. Maybe herO is 424
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Doesn't seem like Power Rankings to me, looks more like... uh, Powerless Rankings.
Don't worry, my trash talk will get better. Probably.
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ByuN top and Pet bottom.... hmmmm... something seems to have gone very very wrong already.
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well in sc2, there's no 100% guarantee such as best pro beat worst pro
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On September 29 2016 19:41 TheHumanLife wrote: well in sc2, there's no 100% guarantee such as best pro beat worst pro
nor should there be, that's the beauty of the game, right?
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On September 27 2016 11:42 Soularion wrote:
Pet is horrible, Trap is weak, Rogue and Zest have both had very very middling form recently, while herO/patience are totally arguable - I just haven't seen enough from herO, and his decisive losses in the Ro8 of both GSLs are the main thing I've seen from his year.
apparently only a current champion will impress you lmao
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On September 29 2016 06:10 TheHumanLife wrote: I heard from Pet's interview that herO hasn't practicing a lot lately, don't know why.. Well ... I guess why ...
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PR should be more based on 'results' (in the past year), rather than 'form' (in the past month or two). Especially since 'form' in SC2 fluctuates so much (Zest slumping in Season 2, and now Byun slumping too), and ' results' is based on a player's peak and consistency.
Zest is ranked too low in this PR. Terrible recent form? So what? That doesn't take away his strong performances and results in the first half of a year.
Djokovic has been slumping last few months. Doesn't mean he slides out of the Top 5 so abruptly.
(BTW, I mentioned this previously even before KeSPA Cup)
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On October 01 2016 23:11 RKC wrote: PR should be more based on 'results' (in the past year), rather than 'form' (in the past month or two). Especially since 'form' in SC2 fluctuates so much (Zest slumping in Season 2, and now Byun slumping too), and ' results' is based on a player's peak and consistency.
Why is everyone saying Byun is slumping? I really don't get it. The only loses he's had recently are to Dark and Zest. Both of whom have litterally been the best of their races in LoTV. Against any other Zerg or Protoss Byun would have won both series.
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Finals are Rank 12 vs Rank 13
Good jobs boys
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On October 03 2016 19:39 SetGuitarsToKill wrote: Finals are Rank 12 vs Rank 13
Good jobs boys TL Writers done us proud
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Austria24417 Posts
Can we use your practice house cameras for the next ranking?
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On October 03 2016 20:39 Olli wrote: Can we use your practice house cameras for the next ranking? Getting baited easily after realizing pvp isn't random at all
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So many people trolling the Power Rank... upsets happen.
I don't think anyone in their right mind would say during the Brood War Era that zerg player "Kwanro" was a top 5 zerg when he played... but he routinely made great runs in individual leagues because he loved cheese builds. Same thing with Pet. He was obviously the lowest rank player and cheesed his way into RO8. He almost cheesed Neeb OUT as well.
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United States97276 Posts
lamo nice power rank tl xDDDDDDD
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