The WCS Circuit Spring Championship final is just around the corner, being hosted live at DreamHack Tours, from May 14-16th! The top 32 competitors from the WCS Circuit will fight over their share of $150,000, WCS points and the all important seed to the WCS Global Playoffs, for their chance to play at BlizzCon this upcoming November!
Today we are extremely excited to release the bracket. The bracket has been seeded using the WCS Circuit points the players have accumulated since the beginning of the year. Top seed Polt will be looking to defend his title from the WCS Circuit Winter Championship which was held at IEM Katowice in March.
Neeb is for me the kind of guy who I see as a full onliner at the moment.
Dont get me wrong, he is very talented and maybe the best talent NA has to offer. But yet his results come only from online games, he has to show it on LAN, he has now the 2 Dreamhacks to do so, but up to now I see a Hydra on an offline event as the much stronger player. But maybe Neeb proofs me wrong.
And yeah, the french meme Lilbow will have a hard time.
Neeb is for me the kind of guy who I see as a full onliner at the moment.
Dont get me wrong, he is very talented and maybe the best talent NA has to offer. But yet his results come only from online games, he has to show it on LAN, he has now the 2 Dreamhacks to do so, but up to now I see a Hydra on an offline event as the much stronger player. But maybe Neeb proofs me wrong.
And yeah, the french meme Lilbow will have a hard time.
Yeah, but Neeb is slowly getting experience. And he did not flop completely offline, he still played 2-3 vs Hydra.
Neeb is for me the kind of guy who I see as a full onliner at the moment.
Dont get me wrong, he is very talented and maybe the best talent NA has to offer. But yet his results come only from online games, he has to show it on LAN, he has now the 2 Dreamhacks to do so, but up to now I see a Hydra on an offline event as the much stronger player. But maybe Neeb proofs me wrong.
And yeah, the french meme Lilbow will have a hard time.
He is incredibly solid, he reminds me of Polt back in the day, you pretty much know what his build is going to be but there is not a lot you can do about it. Players like Bly have given Neeb a good fight because of the unpredictability, something that is way more prevalent at an offline event . We'll have to see, but if he goes into Tours with the same builds and strategies I feel like Lilbow or Hydra could knock him out rather easily.
The prize pool in Liquipedia differs from the WCS rules and from the previous Winter Championship. Has it changed? I'd prefer the new one because in Winter the ro32 match was the most crucial one albeit the final.
On May 05 2016 02:13 Azhrak wrote: The prize pool in Liquipedia differs from the WCS rules and from the previous Winter Championship. Has it changed? I'd prefer the new one because in Winter the ro32 match was the most crucial one albeit the final.
It has changed, since everybody complained about how bad the distribution was before. Qualifying and flying to the tournament only to go home with zero, if you lost to Polt in the first round, really sucked.
On May 05 2016 02:38 chipmonklord17 wrote: Is there seeding? I find it hard to believe Nerchio/Scarlett/Polt/Hydra/Neeb would all end up on the same side of the bracket if there was
EDIT: I can't read it says seeding was based on points. Also why do we get the Tours bracket now with Austin being in 2 days
tbh scarlett is one of the weakest players in the tournament currently and if seeding was a thing she would probably be in the lower 20ies at the moment.
On May 05 2016 02:13 Azhrak wrote: The prize pool in Liquipedia differs from the WCS rules and from the previous Winter Championship. Has it changed? I'd prefer the new one because in Winter the ro32 match was the most crucial one albeit the final.
It has changed, since everybody complained about how bad the distribution was before. Qualifying and flying to the tournament only to go home with zero, if you lost to Polt in the first round, really sucked.
Sorry, but this is the core of why WCS gets named as we all know. You get a free flight + hotel and you even have to win a game to get money? That sucks for real
On May 05 2016 02:13 Azhrak wrote: The prize pool in Liquipedia differs from the WCS rules and from the previous Winter Championship. Has it changed? I'd prefer the new one because in Winter the ro32 match was the most crucial one albeit the final.
It has changed, since everybody complained about how bad the distribution was before. Qualifying and flying to the tournament only to go home with zero, if you lost to Polt in the first round, really sucked.
Sorry, but this is the core of why WCS gets named as we all know. You get a free flight + hotel and you even have to win a game to get money? That sucks for real
Yes only the top 16 getting paid sucks for real. They won plenty of games in the qualifers and callenger.
In the GSL the top 62 gets paid, why is the top 32 getting paid welfare?
For example JD got paid 1,7k for winning a single bo3 against a player called BMW in the GSL qualifiers. Every player that gets top 32 in WCS Championships won way more series than that and absolutely deserves some cash for it.
Uhg, why to do we have to have this terrible bracket format for such an important tournament? It feels like bracket luck plays a far too large role in who will go far. Also I always find it funny when NA players like masa and puck travel half way around the world just to play against a player they have faced locally so many times XD.
It's pretty funny how long you profit from 1 lucky tournament bracket in this fucked up system, same goes for ptitdrogo. This is almost some old MLG level stuff
At least the round 1 matchups are more balanced than last time, only Nerchio vs VortiX / Neeb vs Lilbow stand out as "why the fuck could this ever happen?" Too bad the Top 4 players in my mind (Polt, Hydra, Neeb, Nerchio) are on the same half of the bracket. Oh, and HuK got a freewin in round 1 AGAIN. #LuK
I assume it's single elim? good god, WCS point are NOT an indicator of how good a player is, as 95% of the points are accumlated from SINGLE ELIM BRACKETS in the first place.
blizzard never fails to impress me with their fuck ups with sc2 since late WoL, may it be tournament structure, fixing their game, interacting with the community. the only good thing they did since that time was the LotV developing stage.
On May 05 2016 04:30 KalWarkov wrote: Harstem --> Tier 1 seed Neeb --> Tier 2 seed
It's pretty funny how long you profit from 1 lucky tournament bracket in this fucked up system, same goes for ptitdrogo. This is almost some old MLG level stuff
At least the round 1 matchups are more balanced than last time, only Nerchio vs VortiX / Neeb vs Lilbow stand out as "why the fuck could this ever happen?" Too bad the Top 4 players in my mind (Polt, Hydra, Neeb, Nerchio) are on the same half of the bracket. Oh, and HuK got a freewin in round 1 AGAIN. #LuK
I assume it's single elim? good god, WCS point are NOT an indicator of how good a player is, as 95% of the points are accumlated from SINGLE ELIM BRACKETS in the first place.
blizzard never fails to impress me with their fuck ups with sc2 since late WoL, may it be tournament structure, fixing their game, interacting with the community. the only good thing they did since that time was the LotV developing stage.
On May 05 2016 02:13 Azhrak wrote: The prize pool in Liquipedia differs from the WCS rules and from the previous Winter Championship. Has it changed? I'd prefer the new one because in Winter the ro32 match was the most crucial one albeit the final.
It has changed, since everybody complained about how bad the distribution was before. Qualifying and flying to the tournament only to go home with zero, if you lost to Polt in the first round, really sucked.
Sorry, but this is the core of why WCS gets named as we all know. You get a free flight + hotel and you even have to win a game to get money? That sucks for real
Yes only the top 16 getting paid sucks for real. They won plenty of games in the qualifers and callenger.
In the GSL the top 62 gets paid, why is the top 32 getting paid welfare?
For example JD got paid 1,7k for winning a single bo3 against a player called BMW in the GSL qualifiers. Every player that gets top 32 in WCS Championships won way more series than that and absolutely deserves some cash for it.
But this is not a league, it is just a 32 man 3 days weekendevent.
On May 05 2016 02:38 chipmonklord17 wrote: Is there seeding? I find it hard to believe Nerchio/Scarlett/Polt/Hydra/Neeb would all end up on the same side of the bracket if there was
EDIT: I can't read it says seeding was based on points. Also why do we get the Tours bracket now with Austin being in 2 days
tbh scarlett is one of the weakest players in the tournament currently and if seeding was a thing she would probably be in the lower 20ies at the moment.
Definitely disagree. Scarlett was top 5 (if not higher) on KR ladder just a few weeks ago and she was attempting to get signed to a kespa team. She has a great chance to do well here.
Side note I think bunny got a really tough draw against drogo.
On May 05 2016 04:30 KalWarkov wrote: Harstem --> Tier 1 seed Neeb --> Tier 2 seed
It's pretty funny how long you profit from 1 lucky tournament bracket in this fucked up system, same goes for ptitdrogo. This is almost some old MLG level stuff
At least the round 1 matchups are more balanced than last time, only Nerchio vs VortiX / Neeb vs Lilbow stand out as "why the fuck could this ever happen?" Too bad the Top 4 players in my mind (Polt, Hydra, Neeb, Nerchio) are on the same half of the bracket. Oh, and HuK got a freewin in round 1 AGAIN. #LuK
I assume it's single elim? good god, WCS point are NOT an indicator of how good a player is, as 95% of the points are accumlated from SINGLE ELIM BRACKETS in the first place.
blizzard never fails to impress me with their fuck ups with sc2 since late WoL, may it be tournament structure, fixing their game, interacting with the community. the only good thing they did since that time was the LotV developing stage.
But you are very biased here since Ptitdrogo had already 2 good results in like 4 tournaments he participated unlike Vortix who had 0. I am not a 100% fan of the system as well but it's not as bad as you make it to be. I got used to getting shit brackets (Showtime/vortix) first round when people like Huk get free wins almost :D
On May 05 2016 05:34 HelpMeGetBetter wrote: I thought there was a group stage? Could someone explain, im a little lost now. im at work cant view many pages...
no it's just a single elimination bracket at this event
On May 05 2016 02:38 chipmonklord17 wrote: Is there seeding? I find it hard to believe Nerchio/Scarlett/Polt/Hydra/Neeb would all end up on the same side of the bracket if there was
EDIT: I can't read it says seeding was based on points. Also why do we get the Tours bracket now with Austin being in 2 days
tbh scarlett is one of the weakest players in the tournament currently and if seeding was a thing she would probably be in the lower 20ies at the moment.
Definitely disagree. Scarlett was top 5 (if not higher) on KR ladder just a few weeks ago and she was attempting to get signed to a kespa team. She has a great chance to do well here.
Side note I think bunny got a really tough draw against drogo.
KR ladder isn't as competitive anymore because most KR pros don't ladder anymore because proleague uses other maps. Not saying scarlett is bad though.
Closest Match : PtitDrogo vs Bunny Upset I'd Bet On : puCK/MaSa reaching Ro8, maybe even Ro4 Easiest Bracket : Harstem Hardest Bracket : Nerchio (Seriously, who the fuck are you pissing off?) [Neeb is basically tied, but I feel like Neeb vs Hydra is a pretty good matchup for Neeb all things considered. If he's in form, he'll make Ro8 without many problems. Same could be said for Nerchio, though.] Weirdest Possible Upset : Guru > Snute (Bails > Hydra is weirder, but basically impossible) Most Likely to Disappoint : Neeb :c
On May 05 2016 06:02 Soularion wrote: Just some random thoughts and things.
Closest Match : PtitDrogo vs Bunny Upset I'd Bet On : puCK/MaSa reaching Ro8, maybe even Ro4 Easiest Bracket : Harstem Hardest Bracket : Nerchio (Seriously, who the fuck are you pissing off?) [Neeb is basically tied, but I feel like Neeb vs Hydra is a pretty good matchup for Neeb all things considered. If he's in form, he'll make Ro8 without many problems. Same could be said for Nerchio, though.] Weirdest Possible Upset : Guru > Snute (Bails > Hydra is weirder, but basically impossible) Most Likely to Disappoint : Neeb :c
Well I must piss off God since the brackets are random, they are random RIGHT?
On May 05 2016 06:02 Soularion wrote: Just some random thoughts and things.
Closest Match : PtitDrogo vs Bunny Upset I'd Bet On : puCK/MaSa reaching Ro8, maybe even Ro4 Easiest Bracket : Harstem Hardest Bracket : Nerchio (Seriously, who the fuck are you pissing off?) [Neeb is basically tied, but I feel like Neeb vs Hydra is a pretty good matchup for Neeb all things considered. If he's in form, he'll make Ro8 without many problems. Same could be said for Nerchio, though.] Weirdest Possible Upset : Guru > Snute (Bails > Hydra is weirder, but basically impossible) Most Likely to Disappoint : Neeb :c
Well I must piss off God since the brackets are random, they are random RIGHT?
On May 05 2016 06:02 Soularion wrote: Just some random thoughts and things.
Closest Match : PtitDrogo vs Bunny Upset I'd Bet On : puCK/MaSa reaching Ro8, maybe even Ro4 Easiest Bracket : Harstem Hardest Bracket : Nerchio (Seriously, who the fuck are you pissing off?) [Neeb is basically tied, but I feel like Neeb vs Hydra is a pretty good matchup for Neeb all things considered. If he's in form, he'll make Ro8 without many problems. Same could be said for Nerchio, though.] Weirdest Possible Upset : Guru > Snute (Bails > Hydra is weirder, but basically impossible) Most Likely to Disappoint : Neeb :c
Well I must piss off God since the brackets are random, they are random RIGHT?
I'm glad that there is only one more of there WCS Championship type of events planned (Summer Champ) because this plain single elimination tournament is not a good way to award the biggest prizes in the foreign SC2 scene.
Single elimination is meant to find a single winner, and all placements below it are unclear. The winner might have knocked the 2nd best out in Ro32 but we never know. The same can also happen in any of the match-ups (2nd place defeats true 3rd in ro16, etc). So the prize money and WCS points below the winner are distributed rather randomly dictated by bracket-luck and seeding based largely on these very same random results. With enough events the randomness would even out but there are only three Championships in a year.
The single elimination has its pros too: it's fast, every match counts, the luck factor creates surprising results (or stories as the production calls them). But these benefits don't overweight the cons when it's the format of the most important event in the foreign scene.
Of course the most fair way would be a full round-robin (all vs all) but there is no time for that and it's very anti-hype and thus unfit for a show-type event. So let us use the GSL format (two double elim. groups followed by a single elim. bracket) which is superior in terms of defining the true placements of the competitors even though it also can suffer from bad seeding. Please?
On May 05 2016 19:28 Azhrak wrote: I'm glad that there is only one more of there WCS Championship type of events planned (Summer Champ) because this plain single elimination tournament is not a good way to award the biggest prizes in the foreign SC2 scene.
Single elimination is meant to find a single winner, and all placements below it are unclear. The winner might have knocked the 2nd best out in Ro32 but we never know. The same can also happen in any of the match-ups (2nd place defeats true 3rd in ro16, etc). So the prize money and WCS points below the winner are distributed rather randomly dictated by bracket-luck and seeding based largely on these very same random results. With enough events the randomness would even out but there are only three Championships in a year.
The single elimination has its pros too: it's fast, every match counts, the luck factor creates surprising results (or stories as the production calls them). But these benefits don't overweight the cons when it's the format of the most important event in the foreign scene.
Of course the most fair way would be a full round-robin (all vs all) but there is no time for that and it's very anti-hype and thus unfit for a show-type event. So let us use the GSL format (two double elim. groups followed by a single elim. bracket) which is superior in terms of defining the true placements of the competitors even though it also can suffer from bad seeding. Please?
On May 05 2016 19:28 Azhrak wrote: Single elimination is meant to find a single winner, and all placements below it are unclear. The winner might have knocked the 2nd best out in Ro32 but we never know
i dont like the bracket either the seeding is kinda messed up poor showtime in 2nd round vs snute i was hoping to see him go far he had quite a lot of bracket misfortune the last tourneys but if he beats snute he has a really good shot at the finals so we will see overall i'd say top half >> lower half
On May 05 2016 02:38 chipmonklord17 wrote: Is there seeding? I find it hard to believe Nerchio/Scarlett/Polt/Hydra/Neeb would all end up on the same side of the bracket if there was
EDIT: I can't read it says seeding was based on points. Also why do we get the Tours bracket now with Austin being in 2 days
tbh scarlett is one of the weakest players in the tournament currently and if seeding was a thing she would probably be in the lower 20ies at the moment.
Definitely disagree. Scarlett was top 5 (if not higher) on KR ladder just a few weeks ago and she was attempting to get signed to a kespa team. She has a great chance to do well here.
Side note I think bunny got a really tough draw against drogo.
KR ladder isn't as competitive anymore because most KR pros don't ladder anymore because proleague uses other maps. Not saying scarlett is bad though.
Yup. KR ladder is utterly meaningless to the top players. Whereas everyone here routinely cites it as proof that certain foreigners can compete at the highest levels. The following is being directed to Mier19891 and others who repeatedly employ the usual fallacies.
The only ladder rank that matters to the top tier are the Proleague Winners Rankings. Where Maru (11-0) and herO (11-4) are tied for first. Followed by Zest (10-3), Dear (9-4), Dark (9-5), soO (8-2), Stats (7-3), TY 7-6), Reality (6-3), and Rogue (6-4).
Followed in importance by the PL internal team practice-house ones. Where you have to prove each week that you deserve to be fielded in one of only four available slots in the regular season BO5 team-league format.
This is also ignoring the basic fact that PL and GSL use different map pools than the ladder ones.
I'm all for foreigners continuing to improve and would like to see them one day able to hold their own against the best in the world (although this would require free and open competition which currently is impossible). But citing KR ladder ranks as so many here do as evidence, is almost as absurd as referencing Aligulac as proof that foreigners are competitive.
Aligulac is a useful tool for trends and historical context, but it's always been tragically flawed when ranking foreigners and in comparing cross-region hypothetical matchups.
Nerchio is ranked #8 overall, above the likes of Classic, Maru, Dear, Solar, TY, Rogue, Stats, and Polt. The latter whom we last saw moping the floor of Nerchio on his home turf in the semis at WCC.
Showtime is next at #19. One spot above Dream.
Then Neeb at #21. Above Byul and GuMiho. And so on.
My biggest takeaway from watching the games thus far from the new WCS system compared to Proleague and both Starleagues, is that the skill gap between foreigners and Koreans has never been further apart and continues to grow exponentially. Which is the exact opposite (I hope) of what everyone wants.
Single-elim again is pathetic... Viewers and players hated it before, though obviously they knew that would be the case from the beginning. Feels like DH want to do WCS tournaments with the least effort possible.
soooo, anyone know when this is gonna start? (i mean it IS a dreamhack so i dont expect to see more than 5 games per day but still.. since there is never any SC2 on to watch id like to see as much as possible) It says 5hours from now since this morning.. but since its in france i cant imagine that it starts at 22.00 local time
On May 05 2016 02:08 Nakajin wrote: Nerchio vs Vortix is an unfortunate draw for both of them.
And Scarlett and Firecake in there too. Zerg hopefuls destroying eachother for a chance at glory. Rooting for Scarlett but I think Nerchio makes it out of those four.
EPT
Team EnVyUs Polt vs. 
Cascade Strange
Invictus Gaming iAsonu
