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NaNiwa vs The World: The Icon and the Pariah - Page 13

Forum Index > SC2 General
686 CommentsPost a Reply
Prev 1 11 12 13 14 15 35 Next All
OtherWorld
Profile Blog Joined October 2013
France17333 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-18 11:46:39
January 18 2015 11:45 GMT
#241
On January 18 2015 20:37 cSc.Dav1oN wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 20:23 OtherWorld wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:16 cSc.Dav1oN wrote:
got a theory why ppl hates Nani

simply, cause he's talented and able to show high results, the highest in Europe I would say.

a person that our scene needs, the evil genius, but I like it :D he's a very special guy, u don't have to bash him, simply enjoy him playing

I have a theory on this too. It's because he often shows disrespect towards his opponents, towards casters, towards the community, towards the game itself, because he constantly whines about everything.
Edit : oh yeah, and the behavior of some/most of his fans probably plays a part in that too.


He had a real point in everything he ever started to complain. Is it so hard to accept behind the wall of hate?

He had a real point? Funny how no one else complained about ESL's PCs, then. Funny how he was still saying how Protoss was UP back in the Golden Era of Protoss. Oh yeah, too, how is insulting Stephano (the "you already made 200K$ building only infestors" tweet), or Kane ("you know SC2 is dead when Kane is number one on ladder"), or other progamers, making a good point?
I'm sorry but no. Some of his concerns/complaints were legit. Most of them were not.
edit : funnily enough I've never seen him complain after a win lol.
Used Sigs - New Sigs - Cheap Sigs - Buy the Best Cheap Sig near You at www.cheapsigforsale.com
MavivaM
Profile Joined November 2011
1535 Posts
January 18 2015 11:47 GMT
#242
Expectancy theory at its finest.
Sigh.
Your Opinion has been counted. Only 3 more Opinions needed for a reddit thread.
BEARDiaguz
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Australia2362 Posts
January 18 2015 11:49 GMT
#243
On January 18 2015 20:39 OtherWorld wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 20:34 ROOTiaguz wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:32 SuperHofmann wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:28 ROOTiaguz wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:18 SuperHofmann wrote:
On January 18 2015 14:09 The_Templar wrote:
[image loading]

Naniwa proving this article right already

I hope he will be DQ from WCS.


He won't and he shouldn't.

but deserve it.


True but we give skilled players more leeway and that's ok considering the spotlight on them.

Is that really OK? That's double standard. A rule being a rule, it should be applied without double standards.


Eh, progamers are special.
ProgamerAustralian alcohol user follow @iaguzSC2
Cascade
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
Australia5405 Posts
January 18 2015 11:49 GMT
#244
On January 18 2015 20:39 OtherWorld wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 20:34 ROOTiaguz wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:32 SuperHofmann wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:28 ROOTiaguz wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:18 SuperHofmann wrote:
On January 18 2015 14:09 The_Templar wrote:
[image loading]

Naniwa proving this article right already

I hope he will be DQ from WCS.


He won't and he shouldn't.

but deserve it.


True but we give skilled players more leeway and that's ok considering the spotlight on them.

Is that really OK? That's double standard. A rule being a rule, it should be applied without double standards.

I think he meant that any misstep someone does as top player is blown up a lot more than a misstep from a no-name player. Also, top players will be provoced more. So I can see the point of being more forgiving with top player, without being "double standard".

Also, even if top players are treated differently, so what? They want the best players for the best tournaments to get as many views as possible. If that requires being a bit unfair to some players, I don't see what would stop them.
Saechiis
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Netherlands4989 Posts
January 18 2015 11:51 GMT
#245
On January 18 2015 20:39 OtherWorld wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 20:34 ROOTiaguz wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:32 SuperHofmann wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:28 ROOTiaguz wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:18 SuperHofmann wrote:
On January 18 2015 14:09 The_Templar wrote:
[image loading]

Naniwa proving this article right already

I hope he will be DQ from WCS.


He won't and he shouldn't.

but deserve it.


True but we give skilled players more leeway and that's ok considering the spotlight on them.

Is that really OK? That's double standard. A rule being a rule, it should be applied without double standards.


http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/tl-community/17883-tlnet-ten-commandments

Rule 6.
I think esports is pretty nice.
Cascade
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
Australia5405 Posts
January 18 2015 11:51 GMT
#246
On January 18 2015 20:45 OtherWorld wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 20:37 cSc.Dav1oN wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:23 OtherWorld wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:16 cSc.Dav1oN wrote:
got a theory why ppl hates Nani

simply, cause he's talented and able to show high results, the highest in Europe I would say.

a person that our scene needs, the evil genius, but I like it :D he's a very special guy, u don't have to bash him, simply enjoy him playing

I have a theory on this too. It's because he often shows disrespect towards his opponents, towards casters, towards the community, towards the game itself, because he constantly whines about everything.
Edit : oh yeah, and the behavior of some/most of his fans probably plays a part in that too.


He had a real point in everything he ever started to complain. Is it so hard to accept behind the wall of hate?

He had a real point? Funny how no one else complained about ESL's PCs, then. Funny how he was still saying how Protoss was UP back in the Golden Era of Protoss. Oh yeah, too, how is insulting Stephano (the "you already made 200K$ building only infestors" tweet), or Kane ("you know SC2 is dead when Kane is number one on ladder"), or other progamers, making a good point?
I'm sorry but no. Some of his concerns/complaints were legit. Most of them were not.
edit : funnily enough I've never seen him complain after a win lol.

Proven: Naniwa winning is a sign of good, fair conditions!
pichoo
Profile Joined May 2014
Australia123 Posts
January 18 2015 11:54 GMT
#247
aligulac appears to be down but something tells me Stephano is way ahead in that regard.

Naniwa's only real advantage over him and most foreigners is that he was successful against Koreans in the gsl. Back to back ro8s in 2012 (when the competition had really ramped up) is quite a feat but still I'd firmly rank Stephano ahead of him as the undisputed #1 foreigner. After his big IPL3 win Stephano began to win so much against Koreans it almost stopped being noteworthy. He really felt indistinguishable from the average Korean zerg.

Hell, even in Stephano's nadir, he was still the only foreigner to ever make a WCS final during the Korean invasion of 2013-2014.


On winning tournament, is no doubt Stephano is the best foreigner, however I'm comparing a different era, when Kespa players stepping in to the scene. Naniwa was the only foreigner who can go far in major tournaments full of Koreans and Kespa players. I guess you can say Scarlett was also doing really good in 2013 and early 2014.

OtherWorld: No I'm not Nani fanboy, i'm not even protoss fan. I'm just like everyone else hungry for foreigners doing well in tournaments. With the new WCS system, more chance for foreigners to participate which means more experience and motivations for them, and hopefully we'll see them doing well in other tourneys like IEM or Dreamhack.
Gothic
Profile Joined September 2010
Sweden122 Posts
January 18 2015 11:55 GMT
#248
On January 18 2015 18:53 Nerchio wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 18:51 Legio wrote:
On January 18 2015 18:46 Nerchio wrote:
On January 18 2015 16:59 OtherWorld wrote:
On January 18 2015 16:57 thecrazymunchkin wrote:
Nerchio

respectful, professional, non-drama mongering pro gamers


lol

You missed the "or" part. Though Nerchio never accused ESL's PCs or soundproofing for his losses afaik.

Meh, I think that most of what I did and why a lot of people don't like me was really blown up out of proportion. It's true that I was always balance whining but it's my opinion about the game. Sure there was some soft insults from time to time which were probably quite unnecessary but that weren't the end of the world either. Being on the other side of insults or whines from other players I actually have more fun instead of being butthurt, thinking to myself "Did you really say that?".
I think you guys(or progamers) are really too sensitive from time to time, especially those that do the same behing curtains.

Out of curiosity, would you ever try to get an opponent disqualified from a tournament if he BM'ed you?

Of course not, considering what I did in the past that would be hypocrisy. And as I said in my post, I don't really take any insult towards me too personal inside the game and I think nobody really should unless it's something really bad.


Oh Nerchio. I've ... strongly disliked you for years. First because you were a damn beast, destroying many players I was cheering for in various tournaments. Then because I'm a huge Naniwa fanboy and you guys seemed to be enemies, so of course I'd stand by my champ in the rivalry.

But now, with these posts you're... mffhhssmgff.... getting my respect. You display a great deal of self distance and perspective here, just as I think Naniwa does. You made a small fan out of me just now. It's always tough to cheer for two guys with a huge rivalry, so I guess this should be interesting.

Btw for those who missed it, my favourite Nani quote from Desrow's show the other day (not verbatim, and credit to Daniel B, a poster in Barcraft Sthlm):

NaNiwa: I don't remember this game being so hard to play but I've improved so much in just a month

XMGToD: But you said you would be the best forigner in one (1) week?

NaNiwa: Yes but I talk alot of shit


:D
In the age of the internet, attaching a famous name to your personal opinion to give more weight to it is a very valid strategy. - Benjamin Franklin
Alex007
Profile Joined December 2010
Ukraine211 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-18 12:01:49
January 18 2015 11:55 GMT
#249
Why the hell are TL authors not even checking what they are writing? It was figured out like 100 times that Russian stream HAD a 3-min delay (which was less than 5-min on other streams, but still it was clear, that nobody could listern to a stream, it's a bullshit), so you're just lying in the article. Great job!
Senior Product Manager for ESL SC2 Pro Tour
Dav1oN
Profile Joined January 2012
Ukraine3164 Posts
January 18 2015 11:55 GMT
#250
On January 18 2015 20:45 OtherWorld wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 18 2015 20:37 cSc.Dav1oN wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:23 OtherWorld wrote:
On January 18 2015 20:16 cSc.Dav1oN wrote:
got a theory why ppl hates Nani

simply, cause he's talented and able to show high results, the highest in Europe I would say.

a person that our scene needs, the evil genius, but I like it :D he's a very special guy, u don't have to bash him, simply enjoy him playing

I have a theory on this too. It's because he often shows disrespect towards his opponents, towards casters, towards the community, towards the game itself, because he constantly whines about everything.
Edit : oh yeah, and the behavior of some/most of his fans probably plays a part in that too.


He had a real point in everything he ever started to complain. Is it so hard to accept behind the wall of hate?

He had a real point? Funny how no one else complained about ESL's PCs, then. Funny how he was still saying how Protoss was UP back in the Golden Era of Protoss. Oh yeah, too, how is insulting Stephano (the "you already made 200K$ building only infestors" tweet), or Kane ("you know SC2 is dead when Kane is number one on ladder"), or other progamers, making a good point?
I'm sorry but no. Some of his concerns/complaints were legit. Most of them were not.
edit : funnily enough I've never seen him complain after a win lol.


Some people are not afraid to show emotions and not afraid to share emotions. And it's clrearly can be seens that half of his posts are filled with sarcasm almost completely. Exactly that post was about Kane us number 1 on ladder while #dreampool, "daed gaem". Soundproofing at IEM? It is a very real issue, streamcheating by Happy? Less likely but the result was different and Happy played an awful decider.

Hate him or love him, more likely u're still going to watch him playing which is going to be positive for viewer numbers.
In memory of Geoff "iNcontroL" Robinson 11.09.1985 - 21.07.2019 A tribute to incredible man, embodiment of joy, esports titan, starcraft community pillar all in one. You will always be remembered!
mRpolite
Profile Joined March 2012
189 Posts
January 18 2015 12:01 GMT
#251
I will never, ever, evereverever understand people's opsesion with a player's personality. How can you care about something outside of the game? You think naniwa's personality is awful? You think there are no others like him in other sports? The only problem with naniwa is he communicates with the community and then he hits a wall made by idlers who can never understand what it means to give it your all and try and move the world around you.
The only thing important is that he is fucking good at the game, that he gives us amazing series, allways seeks out new ways to win and that his micro allows him to stop a push warping exatly 1 more zealot. I could not care less even he draws dicks in the chat as long as he plays his all.
I think naniwa is the best thing that happened to foreign starcraft. I don't see how it could not be. He skills set and dedication to win are what few outside of korea have shown during the years.

Dingodile
Profile Joined December 2011
4137 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-18 12:09:47
January 18 2015 12:07 GMT
#252
On January 18 2015 21:01 mRpolite wrote:
I will never, ever, evereverever understand people's opsesion with a player's personality. How can you care about something outside of the game?

And prizepool gets more attraction than the playerpool or/and tournament itself.
All this phenomenons exist since sc2. I complained this thing for 5 yrs now.
Grubby | ToD | Moon | Lyn | Sky
messioso
Profile Joined June 2011
Denmark635 Posts
January 18 2015 12:08 GMT
#253
I enjoyed this Long may he reign.
Former ESL League Operations. I ran IEM/WCS for like 3 years or something. I did map vetos on a tablet. That guy.
SonGoku
Profile Joined September 2013
Germany152 Posts
January 18 2015 12:11 GMT
#254


Why not You vs Naniwa in real life? Is it because you think you have a slight... disadvantage...?
pms
Profile Joined April 2008
Poland611 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-18 12:15:34
January 18 2015 12:12 GMT
#255
On January 18 2015 20:55 Alex007 wrote:
Why the hell are TL authors not even checking what they are writing? It was figured out like 100 times that Russian stream HAD a 3-min delay (which was less than 5-min on other streams, but still it was clear, that nobody could listern to a stream, it's a bullshit), so you're just lying in the article. Great job!


The Russian stream was breaking the rules by considerable margin of 2 minutes and that's what matters. In fact, they should be punished in some way for that.

WCS Player Handbook, pg. 32:
+ Show Spoiler +
Guidelines for non-official World Championship Series Shoutcasters and Streams
The shoutcaster must receive permission from both players to broadcast if the game is being broadcast on a non-official World Championship Series Qualifier stream;
The stream must be broadcast on a 5 minute delay;
Dingodile
Profile Joined December 2011
4137 Posts
January 18 2015 12:15 GMT
#256
thank you @pms for that handbook site. It also says that players can play the game without any stream.
Grubby | ToD | Moon | Lyn | Sky
Liquid`Nazgul
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
22427 Posts
January 18 2015 12:19 GMT
#257
Do people actually know Kane has an amputated foot? How can you say he had that coming. Nuts. It's like Kane poked Naniwa in the cheek and Naniwa blew his head off in return. It's way over the line.
Administrator
Alex007
Profile Joined December 2010
Ukraine211 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-01-18 12:23:08
January 18 2015 12:22 GMT
#258
The Russian stream was breaking the rules by considerable margin of 2 minutes and that's what matters. In fact, they should be punished in some way for that.

WCS Player Handbook, pg. 32:

If you're such a fan of last year's handbook, try also to count the amount of times Naniwa broke it while insulting his opponent and all russians in general. That's definitely the one to be "punished".
Senior Product Manager for ESL SC2 Pro Tour
TargA
Profile Joined December 2010
Norway204 Posts
January 18 2015 12:26 GMT
#259
On January 18 2015 21:19 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
Do people actually know Kane has an amputated foot? How can you say he had that coming. Nuts. It's like Kane poked Naniwa in the cheek and Naniwa blew his head off in return. It's way over the line.



When you fuck with people 24/7, they might actually say or do something back at you.
ProgamerOn October 26 2013 00:10 Nerchio wrote: Shoutout to Targa, best zerg in europe || http://twitter.com/#!/TargA01
BEARDiaguz
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Australia2362 Posts
January 18 2015 12:27 GMT
#260
On January 18 2015 21:19 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
Do people actually know Kane has an amputated foot? How can you say he had that coming. Nuts. It's like Kane poked Naniwa in the cheek and Naniwa blew his head off in return. It's way over the line.


Yea but Kane does a lot of that sort of provoking shit. Can't say I sympathise all that much.
ProgamerAustralian alcohol user follow @iaguzSC2
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