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On January 18 2015 19:30 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2015 19:03 pichoo wrote:
Regardless I'd say Naniwa is the most successful foreigner against Korean, especially when the scene has been very saturated with Koreans. He's the only one who's able to stand toe to toe with many Koreans even as Kespa players entered the scene, beating Dear (during his peak), Innovation, Hyun, Jaedong, San, Duckduck, and also reaching multiple finals against Leenock and life.
Most foreigners can only dream what he has achieved. IMO he did better than Stephano in this regard. aligulac appears to be down but something tells me Stephano is way ahead in that regard. Naniwa's only real advantage over him and most foreigners is that he was successful against Koreans in the gsl. Back to back ro8s in 2012 (when the competition had really ramped up) is quite a feat but still I'd firmly rank Stephano ahead of him as the undisputed #1 foreigner. After his big IPL3 win Stephano began to win so much against Koreans it almost stopped being noteworthy. He really felt indistinguishable from the average Korean zerg. Hell, even in Stephano's nadir, he was still the only foreigner to ever make a WCS final during the Korean invasion of 2013-2014.
Are you trying to use actual facts while arguing with Naniwa fans? Please
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On January 18 2015 14:06 lichter wrote:
yay drama already on the first page
everything goes as planned, stuchiu
haha yeah, i like to take the neutral side here
drama flows in the veins of the sc community; MOAR DRAMA = more viewership 
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I for one am glad that Naniwa is back, despite his incredibly toxic attitude.
After the last year, I welcome any foreigner that has the potential to fight Koreans on even grounds. 
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On January 18 2015 19:30 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2015 19:03 pichoo wrote:
Regardless I'd say Naniwa is the most successful foreigner against Korean, especially when the scene has been very saturated with Koreans. He's the only one who's able to stand toe to toe with many Koreans even as Kespa players entered the scene, beating Dear (during his peak), Innovation, Hyun, Jaedong, San, Duckduck, and also reaching multiple finals against Leenock and life.
Most foreigners can only dream what he has achieved. IMO he did better than Stephano in this regard. aligulac appears to be down but something tells me Stephano is way ahead in that regard. Naniwa's only real advantage over him and most foreigners is that he was successful against Koreans in the gsl. Back to back ro8s in 2012 (when the competition had really ramped up) is quite a feat but still I'd firmly rank Stephano ahead of him as the undisputed #1 foreigner. After his big IPL3 win Stephano began to win so much against Koreans it almost stopped being noteworthy. He really felt indistinguishable from the average Korean zerg. Hell, even in Stephano's nadir, he was still the only foreigner to ever make a WCS final during the Korean invasion of 2013-2014.
Zerg achievements during the Brood Lord / Infestor era doesn't count as achievements. There were plenty of foreigner zergs taking games and series of Koreans back then.
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Good to have the best foreigner back. 
Scene got hella lot more interesting.
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On January 18 2015 19:38 terrancake wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2015 19:30 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:On January 18 2015 19:03 pichoo wrote:
Regardless I'd say Naniwa is the most successful foreigner against Korean, especially when the scene has been very saturated with Koreans. He's the only one who's able to stand toe to toe with many Koreans even as Kespa players entered the scene, beating Dear (during his peak), Innovation, Hyun, Jaedong, San, Duckduck, and also reaching multiple finals against Leenock and life.
Most foreigners can only dream what he has achieved. IMO he did better than Stephano in this regard. aligulac appears to be down but something tells me Stephano is way ahead in that regard. Naniwa's only real advantage over him and most foreigners is that he was successful against Koreans in the gsl. Back to back ro8s in 2012 (when the competition had really ramped up) is quite a feat but still I'd firmly rank Stephano ahead of him as the undisputed #1 foreigner. After his big IPL3 win Stephano began to win so much against Koreans it almost stopped being noteworthy. He really felt indistinguishable from the average Korean zerg. Hell, even in Stephano's nadir, he was still the only foreigner to ever make a WCS final during the Korean invasion of 2013-2014. Zerg achievements during the Brood Lord / Infestor era doesn't count as achievements. There were plenty of foreigner zergs taking games and series of Koreans back then.
Agreed, especially since Stephano was so known because he abused BL / Infestor, amirite?
Everybody remembers the Stephano 12 min BL / Infestor max out, which gave him the vast majority of his wins.
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On January 18 2015 19:38 terrancake wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2015 19:30 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:On January 18 2015 19:03 pichoo wrote:
Regardless I'd say Naniwa is the most successful foreigner against Korean, especially when the scene has been very saturated with Koreans. He's the only one who's able to stand toe to toe with many Koreans even as Kespa players entered the scene, beating Dear (during his peak), Innovation, Hyun, Jaedong, San, Duckduck, and also reaching multiple finals against Leenock and life.
Most foreigners can only dream what he has achieved. IMO he did better than Stephano in this regard. aligulac appears to be down but something tells me Stephano is way ahead in that regard. Naniwa's only real advantage over him and most foreigners is that he was successful against Koreans in the gsl. Back to back ro8s in 2012 (when the competition had really ramped up) is quite a feat but still I'd firmly rank Stephano ahead of him as the undisputed #1 foreigner. After his big IPL3 win Stephano began to win so much against Koreans it almost stopped being noteworthy. He really felt indistinguishable from the average Korean zerg. Hell, even in Stephano's nadir, he was still the only foreigner to ever make a WCS final during the Korean invasion of 2013-2014. Zerg achievements during the Brood Lord / Infestor era doesn't count as achievements. There were plenty of foreigner zergs taking games and series of Koreans back then.
Ever heard of a thing called roach? I don't think you know what you're talking about
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On January 18 2015 19:38 terrancake wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2015 19:30 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:On January 18 2015 19:03 pichoo wrote:
Regardless I'd say Naniwa is the most successful foreigner against Korean, especially when the scene has been very saturated with Koreans. He's the only one who's able to stand toe to toe with many Koreans even as Kespa players entered the scene, beating Dear (during his peak), Innovation, Hyun, Jaedong, San, Duckduck, and also reaching multiple finals against Leenock and life.
Most foreigners can only dream what he has achieved. IMO he did better than Stephano in this regard. aligulac appears to be down but something tells me Stephano is way ahead in that regard. Naniwa's only real advantage over him and most foreigners is that he was successful against Koreans in the gsl. Back to back ro8s in 2012 (when the competition had really ramped up) is quite a feat but still I'd firmly rank Stephano ahead of him as the undisputed #1 foreigner. After his big IPL3 win Stephano began to win so much against Koreans it almost stopped being noteworthy. He really felt indistinguishable from the average Korean zerg. Hell, even in Stephano's nadir, he was still the only foreigner to ever make a WCS final during the Korean invasion of 2013-2014. Zerg achievements during the Brood Lord / Infestor era doesn't count as achievements. There were plenty of foreigner zergs taking games and series of Koreans back then.
People have been riding imbalances throughout the game. Should never discredit peoples achievements. The achievements are what the players play for, shouldn't take it away from them. No matter what imbalanced thing they used.
Only thing that should discredit achievements is straight up cheating. And fortunally we haven't had many big cheating scandals in sc2.
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On January 18 2015 19:39 Weavel wrote:Good to have the best foreigner back. Scene got hella lot more interesting.
Exactly my thoughts!
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On January 18 2015 19:38 terrancake wrote:Show nested quote +On January 18 2015 19:30 FrostedMiniWheats wrote:On January 18 2015 19:03 pichoo wrote:
Regardless I'd say Naniwa is the most successful foreigner against Korean, especially when the scene has been very saturated with Koreans. He's the only one who's able to stand toe to toe with many Koreans even as Kespa players entered the scene, beating Dear (during his peak), Innovation, Hyun, Jaedong, San, Duckduck, and also reaching multiple finals against Leenock and life.
Most foreigners can only dream what he has achieved. IMO he did better than Stephano in this regard. aligulac appears to be down but something tells me Stephano is way ahead in that regard. Naniwa's only real advantage over him and most foreigners is that he was successful against Koreans in the gsl. Back to back ro8s in 2012 (when the competition had really ramped up) is quite a feat but still I'd firmly rank Stephano ahead of him as the undisputed #1 foreigner. After his big IPL3 win Stephano began to win so much against Koreans it almost stopped being noteworthy. He really felt indistinguishable from the average Korean zerg. Hell, even in Stephano's nadir, he was still the only foreigner to ever make a WCS final during the Korean invasion of 2013-2014. Zerg achievements during the Brood Lord / Infestor era doesn't count as achievements. There were plenty of foreigner zergs taking games and series of Koreans back then.
thats true but not at Stephano's first year. First sign of BroodLord /Infestor era begun around May/June 2012. Stephano won IPL3 in October 2011. Plenty foreign zerg taking alot games during that BL/inf era, where Stephano lost his "alone" dominance.
but hell, why other Zerg were unable to win any tournament that time?
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best foreign SC player ever and mediocre kids are still trying to somehow justify their lack of skill by talking shit, better zip it and learn from the guy that still manages to kill you even that he retired
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On January 18 2015 19:36 JustPassingBy wrote:I for one am glad that Naniwa is back, despite his incredibly toxic attitude. After the last year, I welcome any foreigner that has the potential to fight Koreans on even grounds.
Yeah, I'm also happy that is he is back and yeah, last year was lukewarm at best, with foreigner contenders failing consistently when it counted the most. Let's see if the N-factor can make an impact in the long run, or if it is a temporary visit...
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It's not that easy to not flame/rage, work on our behaviour is one of the hardest thing to do.
Beside this, when playing becomes a job, you HAVE to do this work on yourself.
Since i watch this game, i've always been amazed about the reaction of losers (i-e losing a final last match to a cheese), they always seem "oh well i lost, meh .., well play to the other guy". Impressive self-control.
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10% of his attitude in here and he'd be permed.
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On January 18 2015 19:53 Kosak wrote:
best foreign SC player ever and mediocre kids are still trying to somehow justify their lack of skill by talking shit, better zip it and learn from the guy that still manages to kill you even that he retired
A: He never retired.
B: He acts like the biggest douche in the world, so theres a reaason why peo0ple dont like him.
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Over 10 pages of nanipassion, what a way to start the morning!
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EPT
