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On January 02 2014 11:48 Eventine wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2014 11:22 Panamon wrote:
Okay..i see a couple of people banned for using foul language in this thread, and I also see "famous" users who have posted foul language and nothing happened to them. One rule for all, not some. all animals are equal. but some are more equal than others.
And not all that is gold glitters. Anyways, damn that's quite a bit of money for Hyun to try to get back somehow. Hopefully there aren't soon to be revealed cases of this from other sources as well.
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On January 02 2014 11:22 Panamon wrote:
Okay..i see a couple of people banned for using foul language in this thread, and I also see "famous" users who have posted foul language and nothing happened to them. One rule for all, not some.
Sorry doesn't work that way here. Rule 1 of ten commandments pretty much states the attitude here towards comments being accepted or rejected. So you gotta be careful what you type on this website if you aren't important in some way to TL and don't want them to ban you.
Anyway sucks HyuN got burned by his team. Sure somebody else will get him on their roster and fulfill payment obligations.
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On January 02 2014 08:52 Finalmastery wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2014 08:48 NoobSkills wrote:On January 02 2014 08:43 Finalmastery wrote:On January 02 2014 08:10 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:09 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 08:08 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:00 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 03:18 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 01 2014 17:57 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 01 2014 16:28 TotalBiscuit wrote:
[quote]
Axiom is not a foreign team Foreign owned, Foreign ran, Foreign paid... This is the reason I come to Teamliquid, to have random forum posters inform me of what my team is and isn't. Right, random forum poster who has been following and organizing the way teams are recognized in Starcraft longer than you've been interested in the game... Take your attitude somewhere else on this one Biscuitboy Why is it so important to you people call Axiom a "Korean" team anyway? its not going to happen if you keep calling it your team and you keep telling us that you pay them and that you organize their flights, and without GSTL now, Axiom not in Proleague, you're as far as you can get from being a proper "Korean" team in the meaning of the phrase coming from the BW days... at best you're a International team who happens to only sign Koreans, if TL dropped all their players except for Taeja and HerO would that make Liquid a Korean team? no... But of course i get ahead of my self here, I'm talking to you of all people and whats in your mind is right! can't argue with that... It's cute that the Broodwar Elitists are still around and still as snippy as ever. I'm a Starcraft 2 Elitist if anything lol, run along manchild. Take your cancerous attitude elsewhere. Your Brood War definitions are meaningless in SC2 and it's hilarious that you think you can tell a team what they are and are not considered to be. Stop bickering you two this is about making sure Hyun gets what he deserves! Having an argument over stupid stuff isn't helpful. >.> This thread is about informing people what happened to Hyun not getting Hyun his money because let's be honest it is complexity. And the thread is also for a debate over nothing for the past page or so. Yeah I guess this is true. What I really want to see is accountability for teams this year. Hopefully this coming to light at the beginning of the year will lead to change. I also know this probably won't happen but I would love to see a lawsuit actually go through against Simon, he's done this a few times already and maybe if some legal action happens stuff will shape up. >.>
No legal action will happen. The costs of trying to get the money from Simon would equal the amount of money owed in the end most likely. That isn't for sure it could be straight forward, but I doubt it. Honestly though I do feel bad for Hyun, but I place blame on anyone who trusts someone with their money. I'd let a lot of people use my POS car, but I wouldn't let them manage my bank account. NEVER let anyone touch your money because every person can be tempted.
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Really bothers me to see "management" at this level. So disappointing. Hope it all works out for Hyun.
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So nothing gets done when he owes you 1000... then 3000... then 5000.. then 10000... then 23000 later it's a problem. Pro-gamer.
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Im sure he'll get his money and more. More being on account of undue stress and gross incompetence of this so called ceo. If i was a lawyer id take his case easy contacting through twitter. Hint hint nudge nudge my lawyer starcraft 2 teamliquiders.
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opterown
Australia54785 Posts
i dno, seems pretty damn active thread haha and it's in calendar too
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How the hell can this guy get away with this and "disappear"? Don't tons of people know him if he was running a well known team? How can he just vanish and hide... Someone has to know him in real life etc
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Too common in sc2. Too many players, too little money going around. Hyun made it clear, the money went to LoL team instead.
Time to dipscene bro! from the chatlog, dont think he is gonna give you your money!
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On January 02 2014 12:05 NoobSkills wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2014 08:52 Finalmastery wrote:On January 02 2014 08:48 NoobSkills wrote:On January 02 2014 08:43 Finalmastery wrote:On January 02 2014 08:10 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:09 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 08:08 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:00 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 03:18 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 01 2014 17:57 ZodaSoda wrote:
[quote]
Foreign owned, Foreign ran, Foreign paid...
This is the reason I come to Teamliquid, to have random forum posters inform me of what my team is and isn't. Right, random forum poster who has been following and organizing the way teams are recognized in Starcraft longer than you've been interested in the game... Take your attitude somewhere else on this one Biscuitboy Why is it so important to you people call Axiom a "Korean" team anyway? its not going to happen if you keep calling it your team and you keep telling us that you pay them and that you organize their flights, and without GSTL now, Axiom not in Proleague, you're as far as you can get from being a proper "Korean" team in the meaning of the phrase coming from the BW days... at best you're a International team who happens to only sign Koreans, if TL dropped all their players except for Taeja and HerO would that make Liquid a Korean team? no... But of course i get ahead of my self here, I'm talking to you of all people and whats in your mind is right! can't argue with that... It's cute that the Broodwar Elitists are still around and still as snippy as ever. I'm a Starcraft 2 Elitist if anything lol, run along manchild. Take your cancerous attitude elsewhere. Your Brood War definitions are meaningless in SC2 and it's hilarious that you think you can tell a team what they are and are not considered to be. Stop bickering you two this is about making sure Hyun gets what he deserves! Having an argument over stupid stuff isn't helpful. >.> This thread is about informing people what happened to Hyun not getting Hyun his money because let's be honest it is complexity. And the thread is also for a debate over nothing for the past page or so. Yeah I guess this is true. What I really want to see is accountability for teams this year. Hopefully this coming to light at the beginning of the year will lead to change. I also know this probably won't happen but I would love to see a lawsuit actually go through against Simon, he's done this a few times already and maybe if some legal action happens stuff will shape up. >.> No legal action will happen. The costs of trying to get the money from Simon would equal the amount of money owed in the end most likely. That isn't for sure it could be straight forward, but I doubt it. Honestly though I do feel bad for Hyun, but I place blame on anyone who trusts someone with their money. I'd let a lot of people use my POS car, but I wouldn't let them manage my bank account. NEVER let anyone touch your money because every person can be tempted.
All of you saying this don't know that for sure. This "case" could be as easy as HyuN paying $300 in court fees, showing up to his court date with his lawyer, and showing his contract + bank records to the judge. Simon would then be summonsed, and if Simon didn't show an automatic judgment could be declared in favor of HyuN. If Simon refused to pay, seizure of assets could be ordered. For an amount this large, an arrest warrant might even be put out for Simon. Also, any lawyer who took this case would probably take at least 10% of the plaintiff's winnings anyway.
Some lawyers will take cases such as this and promise, say, 10 hours of free work to a client. After that, they would begin to charge. This lets lawyers try to end cases such as this quickly for lower income clients (lawyer takes 10% of the winnings still), however if it gets too time consuming they arent in neck-deep.
Don't underestimate the power of the legal system.
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On January 02 2014 14:24 BrieFanFiction wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2014 12:05 NoobSkills wrote:On January 02 2014 08:52 Finalmastery wrote:On January 02 2014 08:48 NoobSkills wrote:On January 02 2014 08:43 Finalmastery wrote:On January 02 2014 08:10 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:09 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 08:08 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:00 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 03:18 TotalBiscuit wrote:
[quote]
This is the reason I come to Teamliquid, to have random forum posters inform me of what my team is and isn't. Right, random forum poster who has been following and organizing the way teams are recognized in Starcraft longer than you've been interested in the game... Take your attitude somewhere else on this one Biscuitboy Why is it so important to you people call Axiom a "Korean" team anyway? its not going to happen if you keep calling it your team and you keep telling us that you pay them and that you organize their flights, and without GSTL now, Axiom not in Proleague, you're as far as you can get from being a proper "Korean" team in the meaning of the phrase coming from the BW days... at best you're a International team who happens to only sign Koreans, if TL dropped all their players except for Taeja and HerO would that make Liquid a Korean team? no... But of course i get ahead of my self here, I'm talking to you of all people and whats in your mind is right! can't argue with that... It's cute that the Broodwar Elitists are still around and still as snippy as ever. I'm a Starcraft 2 Elitist if anything lol, run along manchild. Take your cancerous attitude elsewhere. Your Brood War definitions are meaningless in SC2 and it's hilarious that you think you can tell a team what they are and are not considered to be. Stop bickering you two this is about making sure Hyun gets what he deserves! Having an argument over stupid stuff isn't helpful. >.> This thread is about informing people what happened to Hyun not getting Hyun his money because let's be honest it is complexity. And the thread is also for a debate over nothing for the past page or so. Yeah I guess this is true. What I really want to see is accountability for teams this year. Hopefully this coming to light at the beginning of the year will lead to change. I also know this probably won't happen but I would love to see a lawsuit actually go through against Simon, he's done this a few times already and maybe if some legal action happens stuff will shape up. >.> No legal action will happen. The costs of trying to get the money from Simon would equal the amount of money owed in the end most likely. That isn't for sure it could be straight forward, but I doubt it. Honestly though I do feel bad for Hyun, but I place blame on anyone who trusts someone with their money. I'd let a lot of people use my POS car, but I wouldn't let them manage my bank account. NEVER let anyone touch your money because every person can be tempted. All of you saying this don't know that for sure. This "case" could be as easy as HyuN paying $300 in court fees, showing up to his court date with his lawyer, and showing his contract + bank records to the judge. Simon would then be summonsed, and if Simon didn't show an automatic judgment could be declared in favor of HyuN. If Simon refused to pay, seizure of assets could be ordered. For an amount this large, an arrest warrant might even be put out for Simon. Also, any lawyer who took this case would probably take at least 10% of the plaintiff's winnings anyway. Some lawyers will take cases such as this and promise, say, 10 hours of free work to a client. After that, they would begin to charge. This lets lawyers try to end cases such as this quickly for lower income clients (lawyer takes 10% of the winnings still), however if it gets too time consuming they arent in neck-deep. Don't underestimate the power of the legal system.
And honestly, some lawyer fan in the relevant jurisdiction could easily do it for free. It's not a tough collection case to win. But it might be nigh impossible to execute the judgment.
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Wow, that is really unfair... Hate when these kind of situations occur it hurts esports and hits the community just as hard.
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I m no expert in law but i got a very good sense about it (i assume :D).
1.Doesnt matter if it is esportsbusiness or not, business is business. They have a contract, so they (he) are obligated to pay the money.
2.If this guy simon has a lot of money then i would file a law suit. Because you have a very good chance of getting your money back. It is not like some broke guy that spend all the money on blackjack and hookers and now is broke.
3.I doubt that if quantic is bankrupt that you cant get anything. I think that way because if you can prove that simon knew about this beforehand and was irresponsibly using hyuns money to keep a broke company running then this is fraud. And i m pretty sure he will be liable with his very own private money. This stuff can also mean jail (at least in germany and i doubt it isnt the same way in canada). If you know or if you have to know that you will run out of money then you cant tell people everything is ok and keep going like nothing is wrong.
Basically: It is business, this guy has money, this guy commmited a crime. Means hyun has good odds of getting his money back if he files a lawsuit. I think people are making it morer complicated than it really is.
The only thing i can think of that might be tricky is the fact that dreamhack sent the money to quantic which means quantic is the owner of the money if they made it look like this. But then again it would make no sense (even if you dont have a contract about the money transfer) that a player would give his money to the company after he is only an employee.
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Could somebody pls add to the op that one of our fellow TL ers already offered his help as lawyer and contact between him and hyun is trying to be made? Thx. Im on my phone so cant post the relevant info.
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Not defending Quantic by any means, but Hyun is at fault for letting this go on past the first occurrence and not bringing it to light.
Hopefully any current players reading this will take note. Good faith doesn't exist in this 'business'.
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On January 02 2014 14:39 Caladbolg wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2014 14:24 BrieFanFiction wrote:On January 02 2014 12:05 NoobSkills wrote:On January 02 2014 08:52 Finalmastery wrote:On January 02 2014 08:48 NoobSkills wrote:On January 02 2014 08:43 Finalmastery wrote:On January 02 2014 08:10 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:09 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 08:08 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:00 ZodaSoda wrote:
[quote]
Right, random forum poster who has been following and organizing the way teams are recognized in Starcraft longer than you've been interested in the game...
Take your attitude somewhere else on this one Biscuitboy
Why is it so important to you people call Axiom a "Korean" team anyway? its not going to happen if you keep calling it your team and you keep telling us that you pay them and that you organize their flights, and without GSTL now, Axiom not in Proleague, you're as far as you can get from being a proper "Korean" team in the meaning of the phrase coming from the BW days... at best you're a International team who happens to only sign Koreans, if TL dropped all their players except for Taeja and HerO would that make Liquid a Korean team? no...
But of course i get ahead of my self here, I'm talking to you of all people and whats in your mind is right! can't argue with that... It's cute that the Broodwar Elitists are still around and still as snippy as ever. I'm a Starcraft 2 Elitist if anything lol, run along manchild. Take your cancerous attitude elsewhere. Your Brood War definitions are meaningless in SC2 and it's hilarious that you think you can tell a team what they are and are not considered to be. Stop bickering you two this is about making sure Hyun gets what he deserves! Having an argument over stupid stuff isn't helpful. >.> This thread is about informing people what happened to Hyun not getting Hyun his money because let's be honest it is complexity. And the thread is also for a debate over nothing for the past page or so. Yeah I guess this is true. What I really want to see is accountability for teams this year. Hopefully this coming to light at the beginning of the year will lead to change. I also know this probably won't happen but I would love to see a lawsuit actually go through against Simon, he's done this a few times already and maybe if some legal action happens stuff will shape up. >.> No legal action will happen. The costs of trying to get the money from Simon would equal the amount of money owed in the end most likely. That isn't for sure it could be straight forward, but I doubt it. Honestly though I do feel bad for Hyun, but I place blame on anyone who trusts someone with their money. I'd let a lot of people use my POS car, but I wouldn't let them manage my bank account. NEVER let anyone touch your money because every person can be tempted. All of you saying this don't know that for sure. This "case" could be as easy as HyuN paying $300 in court fees, showing up to his court date with his lawyer, and showing his contract + bank records to the judge. Simon would then be summonsed, and if Simon didn't show an automatic judgment could be declared in favor of HyuN. If Simon refused to pay, seizure of assets could be ordered. For an amount this large, an arrest warrant might even be put out for Simon. Also, any lawyer who took this case would probably take at least 10% of the plaintiff's winnings anyway. Some lawyers will take cases such as this and promise, say, 10 hours of free work to a client. After that, they would begin to charge. This lets lawyers try to end cases such as this quickly for lower income clients (lawyer takes 10% of the winnings still), however if it gets too time consuming they arent in neck-deep. Don't underestimate the power of the legal system. And honestly, some lawyer fan in the relevant jurisdiction could easily do it for free. It's not a tough collection case to win. But it might be nigh impossible to execute the judgment.
exactly. winning a court case would be easy collecting coould take months and require all sorts of costs like private investigators to track him down. Plus it's a no win situation. either SImon has no money in which it's useless or he has money in which he can hire a laywer and drag it out with appeales and the like which can take forever.end of story collecting money is hard as hell, particualarly when it's international stuff.
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On January 02 2014 08:10 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2014 08:09 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 08:08 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:00 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 03:18 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 01 2014 17:57 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 01 2014 16:28 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 01 2014 12:21 Undead1993 wrote:
ye you could feel in the last couple of tournaments that he was stressed out, poor guy. kind of sad how some foreign teams treat the clueless koreans, axiom obviously doesn't but. Axiom is not a foreign team Foreign owned, Foreign ran, Foreign paid... This is the reason I come to Teamliquid, to have random forum posters inform me of what my team is and isn't. Right, random forum poster who has been following and organizing the way teams are recognized in Starcraft longer than you've been interested in the game... Take your attitude somewhere else on this one Biscuitboy Why is it so important to you people call Axiom a "Korean" team anyway? its not going to happen if you keep calling it your team and you keep telling us that you pay them and that you organize their flights, and without GSTL now, Axiom not in Proleague, you're as far as you can get from being a proper "Korean" team in the meaning of the phrase coming from the BW days... at best you're a International team who happens to only sign Koreans, if TL dropped all their players except for Taeja and HerO would that make Liquid a Korean team? no... But of course i get ahead of my self here, I'm talking to you of all people and whats in your mind is right! can't argue with that... It's cute that the Broodwar Elitists are still around and still as snippy as ever. I'm a Starcraft 2 Elitist if anything lol, run along manchild. Take your cancerous attitude elsewhere. Your Brood War definitions are meaningless in SC2 and it's hilarious that you think you can tell a team what they are and are not considered to be.
Who has a cancerous attitude? Didn't you stop posting on forums like 15 times because you always make yourself and your iq of 150 look bad?
So the moral of the story is, if you want to be treated with respect, don't act like a haughty little shit for no reason. Mindblowing right?
Take your own advice
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Canada16217 Posts
On January 02 2014 16:36 Jaaaaasper wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2014 08:10 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:09 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 08:08 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:00 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 03:18 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 01 2014 17:57 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 01 2014 16:28 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 01 2014 12:21 Undead1993 wrote:
ye you could feel in the last couple of tournaments that he was stressed out, poor guy. kind of sad how some foreign teams treat the clueless koreans, axiom obviously doesn't but. Axiom is not a foreign team Foreign owned, Foreign ran, Foreign paid... This is the reason I come to Teamliquid, to have random forum posters inform me of what my team is and isn't. Right, random forum poster who has been following and organizing the way teams are recognized in Starcraft longer than you've been interested in the game... Take your attitude somewhere else on this one Biscuitboy Why is it so important to you people call Axiom a "Korean" team anyway? its not going to happen if you keep calling it your team and you keep telling us that you pay them and that you organize their flights, and without GSTL now, Axiom not in Proleague, you're as far as you can get from being a proper "Korean" team in the meaning of the phrase coming from the BW days... at best you're a International team who happens to only sign Koreans, if TL dropped all their players except for Taeja and HerO would that make Liquid a Korean team? no... But of course i get ahead of my self here, I'm talking to you of all people and whats in your mind is right! can't argue with that... It's cute that the Broodwar Elitists are still around and still as snippy as ever. I'm a Starcraft 2 Elitist if anything lol, run along manchild. Take your cancerous attitude elsewhere. Your Brood War definitions are meaningless in SC2 and it's hilarious that you think you can tell a team what they are and are not considered to be. Who has a cancerous attitude? Didn't you stop posting on forums like 15 times because you always make yourself and your iq of 150 look bad? Show nested quote +So the moral of the story is, if you want to be treated with respect, don't act like a haughty little shit for no reason. Mindblowing right? Take your own advice
take it elsewhere please(Send him a pm or whatever)
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On January 02 2014 16:36 Jaaaaasper wrote:Show nested quote +On January 02 2014 08:10 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:09 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 08:08 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 02 2014 08:00 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 02 2014 03:18 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 01 2014 17:57 ZodaSoda wrote:On January 01 2014 16:28 TotalBiscuit wrote:On January 01 2014 12:21 Undead1993 wrote:
ye you could feel in the last couple of tournaments that he was stressed out, poor guy. kind of sad how some foreign teams treat the clueless koreans, axiom obviously doesn't but. Axiom is not a foreign team Foreign owned, Foreign ran, Foreign paid... This is the reason I come to Teamliquid, to have random forum posters inform me of what my team is and isn't. Right, random forum poster who has been following and organizing the way teams are recognized in Starcraft longer than you've been interested in the game... Take your attitude somewhere else on this one Biscuitboy Why is it so important to you people call Axiom a "Korean" team anyway? its not going to happen if you keep calling it your team and you keep telling us that you pay them and that you organize their flights, and without GSTL now, Axiom not in Proleague, you're as far as you can get from being a proper "Korean" team in the meaning of the phrase coming from the BW days... at best you're a International team who happens to only sign Koreans, if TL dropped all their players except for Taeja and HerO would that make Liquid a Korean team? no... But of course i get ahead of my self here, I'm talking to you of all people and whats in your mind is right! can't argue with that... It's cute that the Broodwar Elitists are still around and still as snippy as ever. I'm a Starcraft 2 Elitist if anything lol, run along manchild. Take your cancerous attitude elsewhere. Your Brood War definitions are meaningless in SC2 and it's hilarious that you think you can tell a team what they are and are not considered to be. Who has a cancerous attitude? Didn't you stop posting on forums like 15 times because you always make yourself and your iq of 150 look bad? Show nested quote +So the moral of the story is, if you want to be treated with respect, don't act like a haughty little shit for no reason. Mindblowing right? Take your own advice
please, lets not start this up again....
On topic, i think is cool that the other members of Quantic gaming are going to try and help Hyun out. he's one of the nicest guys on the scene, and doesn't deserve this kind of stuff.
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EPT
