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i played him a couple of times, he was really smart and good and a general nice guy. but there is an end for everyone and sc2 in NA just isn't worth it in general anymore. i can't tell you the last time i was interested in watching an NA tournament, and that's sad.
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On August 02 2013 05:07 govie wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2013 05:00 hellokittySC2 wrote:On August 02 2013 04:29 govie wrote:On August 02 2013 00:13 bayaka wrote:On August 01 2013 23:25 govie wrote:On August 01 2013 21:57 Plansix wrote:On August 01 2013 21:33 MrMercuG wrote:On August 01 2013 17:56 blade55555 wrote:On August 01 2013 17:01 Moosy wrote:
Its not just the wcs format, its also the hellbat nerf + banshee buff. a lot of terran are struggling (even innovation) in the current metagame. theo played exclusively hellbat tvt. hots is quickly going the route of wol. gg blizzard. Yeah terran is doing so badly they took 3/4th in the semis of this OSL, and 4 out of the 8 spots for the ro8 with 7 of the 16 in ro16. What a terrible race just so underpowered. I am kind of surprised to see Theo retire, but if you aren't enjoying the game or you want to move on good for him. Those are Korean terrans you're talking about, American and European terrans are no way on the lvl off the Korean terrans. He retired because he can't pay for shit in a Starcraft 2 pro-gaming career at the moment, Blizzard kind of killed the American and European scenes because they won't make it region-locked the Koreans just come over and get top 3 in the entire thing and then the Americans and Europeans don't get enough money to live from. Probably only a few times that pay their players a salary from which they can live. like TL, Mouz, EG. and then almost all the KeSPA teams and LG-IM, MVP, etc. Korean teams pull in way more sponsors than the European teams at the moment with the exception of EG of course. Come on, lets be clear, the American scene killed itself. Blizzard is offering the only tournament worth talking about in NA beyond MLG. The rest of the time, NA viewers refuse to watch anything that isn’t, live, in studio productions that rival GSL and complain when it isn’t of that level. If we have 7-10 online cups that were giving out 10K every 3-4 months, we would be doing better, but all the scene would do it complain. Meanwhile, Dota 2 has tons of events running at all time that are online, but no one can complain because they don’t have GSL is to compare it to and say “Why isn’t it that????” I so agree.. this feels exactly right! Peeps and players (like hellokitty i.e.) bitch to much about there so called WCS must be regionbased. 1st. there was no WCS, they could not even compete for 10k pricepool because they suck (sorry but hell, i cant beat around this korean bush). 2nd. Blizzard gives them also a chance to get 10k firstprize and they complain instantly.... 3. like little bitches they are... p They want 10k region GARANTUEED!!!1 Motherfucka's else our scene wont grow... what shameless bullshit is this NA proscene.. go suck donkeyballs because this is bullshit... if u give a plant to much water it dies... seems NA scene is also to wet atm. What? That was insanely hard to read. I believe the players complaining is pretty fair. If you become the best player in the US you can make the same amount of money as if you worked at McDonalds basically. WCS NA is a huge joke now because it's becoming WCS esF. I bet that a decent number of the koreans who made it into Challenger won't even be able to show up to the live event when they make it into premier league. I think people would rather have a smaller prize pool and region lock. You can complain about people feeling entitled, but you come across as incredibly entitled when you suggest that people should enter an extremely competitive environment and forgo school or a career only to make $150 and then get knocked out of their regional tournament by a Korean B teamer. At the very least these Korean players have the support and infrastructure available to focus only on improving, but we will never reach that point if the Korean scene can stomp out any up and coming players, which is what is happening. I know that many NA professional players have other jobs, how else could you compete without living with your parents? You are basically asking players to get screwed and not complain, which is pretty ignorant and entitled. edit: Also, I will really miss Theognis, he was a really nice guy it seemed. I really enjoyed watching his stream. Yes, ognis will be missed but im not ignorant at all. If there were progamers before WCS in the US, there will be progamers with WCS structure too. 2nd : dont put words in my mouth i didnt say. I only stated facts, nothing more. I didnt entitle anything. If u want to be a progamer go live where living is cheap! i.e. That is why whitera is still a progamer and can pay his expensis, this hasnt changed becuz of wcs... Being a progamer is hard with hard choices. Not many can live in the west and succeed at a progamingcareer the same time. and you really understand how to live as a pro gamer right? do you even know how much they make on Salary? and how much on average a westerner can make in tournaments with so many koreans stacked in a tournament? Also, do you know how much competition there is as a pro gamer? don't simply say : Live somewhere CHEAP, not everyone have the luxury to choose where they are born and where they live and what language they speak. Im sorry u dont like the statement, but whitera said it himself that progamers that are not from the west, had a better shot at a progaming career just becuz expense are lower then in the west. I like ur playstyle kitty, cheesy  but that doesnt mean NA should close the borders, becuz in the end, progaming will not benefit from it. So, shortterm u might be right! But longterm ur wrong.. A nice example is the ATP (tennis, also a solo prosport). The best in the world (djokovic) wins like alot of money every year, but do u know Xavier Malisse? I dont think so and i also think he has a hard time paying his probills, but still he attends tournaments and makes the best of the situation he is in. So should u Prosports pays shit when u dont win alot.. but thats the choice u need to make as a up and comming and down and going player.
Dude you know OF Xavier Malisse. You know absolutely nothing about his financial situation. When you say "i also think he has a hard time paying his probills...", that is completely pulled from your ass.
This is important because the opportunity cost for young US players is much higher than just about any other country in the world. Sure everyone is "giving up their lives", but here you are giving up much more in EV for future earnings. The financial situations are completely different and that's why you rarely see US players (relative to EU) in tennis as well. So if anything, in the long term (maybe 5-10 yrs for e-sport), there would 0 US players unless the opp costs somehow converge across the world.
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On August 02 2013 05:33 heartlxp wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2013 05:07 govie wrote:On August 02 2013 05:00 hellokittySC2 wrote:On August 02 2013 04:29 govie wrote:On August 02 2013 00:13 bayaka wrote:On August 01 2013 23:25 govie wrote:On August 01 2013 21:57 Plansix wrote:On August 01 2013 21:33 MrMercuG wrote:On August 01 2013 17:56 blade55555 wrote:On August 01 2013 17:01 Moosy wrote:
Its not just the wcs format, its also the hellbat nerf + banshee buff. a lot of terran are struggling (even innovation) in the current metagame. theo played exclusively hellbat tvt. hots is quickly going the route of wol. gg blizzard. Yeah terran is doing so badly they took 3/4th in the semis of this OSL, and 4 out of the 8 spots for the ro8 with 7 of the 16 in ro16. What a terrible race just so underpowered. I am kind of surprised to see Theo retire, but if you aren't enjoying the game or you want to move on good for him. Those are Korean terrans you're talking about, American and European terrans are no way on the lvl off the Korean terrans. He retired because he can't pay for shit in a Starcraft 2 pro-gaming career at the moment, Blizzard kind of killed the American and European scenes because they won't make it region-locked the Koreans just come over and get top 3 in the entire thing and then the Americans and Europeans don't get enough money to live from. Probably only a few times that pay their players a salary from which they can live. like TL, Mouz, EG. and then almost all the KeSPA teams and LG-IM, MVP, etc. Korean teams pull in way more sponsors than the European teams at the moment with the exception of EG of course. Come on, lets be clear, the American scene killed itself. Blizzard is offering the only tournament worth talking about in NA beyond MLG. The rest of the time, NA viewers refuse to watch anything that isn’t, live, in studio productions that rival GSL and complain when it isn’t of that level. If we have 7-10 online cups that were giving out 10K every 3-4 months, we would be doing better, but all the scene would do it complain. Meanwhile, Dota 2 has tons of events running at all time that are online, but no one can complain because they don’t have GSL is to compare it to and say “Why isn’t it that????” I so agree.. this feels exactly right! Peeps and players (like hellokitty i.e.) bitch to much about there so called WCS must be regionbased. 1st. there was no WCS, they could not even compete for 10k pricepool because they suck (sorry but hell, i cant beat around this korean bush). 2nd. Blizzard gives them also a chance to get 10k firstprize and they complain instantly.... 3. like little bitches they are... p They want 10k region GARANTUEED!!!1 Motherfucka's else our scene wont grow... what shameless bullshit is this NA proscene.. go suck donkeyballs because this is bullshit... if u give a plant to much water it dies... seems NA scene is also to wet atm. What? That was insanely hard to read. I believe the players complaining is pretty fair. If you become the best player in the US you can make the same amount of money as if you worked at McDonalds basically. WCS NA is a huge joke now because it's becoming WCS esF. I bet that a decent number of the koreans who made it into Challenger won't even be able to show up to the live event when they make it into premier league. I think people would rather have a smaller prize pool and region lock. You can complain about people feeling entitled, but you come across as incredibly entitled when you suggest that people should enter an extremely competitive environment and forgo school or a career only to make $150 and then get knocked out of their regional tournament by a Korean B teamer. At the very least these Korean players have the support and infrastructure available to focus only on improving, but we will never reach that point if the Korean scene can stomp out any up and coming players, which is what is happening. I know that many NA professional players have other jobs, how else could you compete without living with your parents? You are basically asking players to get screwed and not complain, which is pretty ignorant and entitled. edit: Also, I will really miss Theognis, he was a really nice guy it seemed. I really enjoyed watching his stream. Yes, ognis will be missed but im not ignorant at all. If there were progamers before WCS in the US, there will be progamers with WCS structure too. 2nd : dont put words in my mouth i didnt say. I only stated facts, nothing more. I didnt entitle anything. If u want to be a progamer go live where living is cheap! i.e. That is why whitera is still a progamer and can pay his expensis, this hasnt changed becuz of wcs... Being a progamer is hard with hard choices. Not many can live in the west and succeed at a progamingcareer the same time. and you really understand how to live as a pro gamer right? do you even know how much they make on Salary? and how much on average a westerner can make in tournaments with so many koreans stacked in a tournament? Also, do you know how much competition there is as a pro gamer? don't simply say : Live somewhere CHEAP, not everyone have the luxury to choose where they are born and where they live and what language they speak. Im sorry u dont like the statement, but whitera said it himself that progamers that are not from the west, had a better shot at a progaming career just becuz expense are lower then in the west. I like ur playstyle kitty, cheesy but that doesnt mean NA should close the borders, becuz in the end, progaming will not benefit from it. So, shortterm u might be right! But longterm ur wrong.. A nice example is the ATP (tennis, also a solo prosport). The best in the world (djokovic) wins like alot of money every year, but do u know Xavier Malisse? I dont think so and i also think he has a hard time paying his probills, but still he attends tournaments and makes the best of the situation he is in. So should u Prosports pays shit when u dont win alot.. but thats the choice u need to make as a up and comming and down and going player. Dude you know OF Xavier Malisse. You know absolutely nothing about his financial situation. When you say "i also think he has a hard time paying his probills...", that is completely pulled from your ass. This is important because the opportunity cost for young US players is much higher than just about any other country in the world. Sure everyone is "giving up their lives", but here you are giving up much more in EV for future earnings. The financial situations are completely different and that's why you rarely see US players (relative to EU) in tennis as well. So if anything, in the long term (maybe 5-10 yrs for e-sport), there would 0 US players unless the opp costs somehow converge across the world.
i dont like tennis but i guess u understand were i was going.
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Mike, you're the shit! You will always be the shit! Good luck in whatever you do in the future man~
<3
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On August 02 2013 05:07 govie wrote:Show nested quote +On August 02 2013 05:00 hellokittySC2 wrote:On August 02 2013 04:29 govie wrote:On August 02 2013 00:13 bayaka wrote:On August 01 2013 23:25 govie wrote:On August 01 2013 21:57 Plansix wrote:On August 01 2013 21:33 MrMercuG wrote:On August 01 2013 17:56 blade55555 wrote:On August 01 2013 17:01 Moosy wrote:
Its not just the wcs format, its also the hellbat nerf + banshee buff. a lot of terran are struggling (even innovation) in the current metagame. theo played exclusively hellbat tvt. hots is quickly going the route of wol. gg blizzard. Yeah terran is doing so badly they took 3/4th in the semis of this OSL, and 4 out of the 8 spots for the ro8 with 7 of the 16 in ro16. What a terrible race just so underpowered. I am kind of surprised to see Theo retire, but if you aren't enjoying the game or you want to move on good for him. Those are Korean terrans you're talking about, American and European terrans are no way on the lvl off the Korean terrans. He retired because he can't pay for shit in a Starcraft 2 pro-gaming career at the moment, Blizzard kind of killed the American and European scenes because they won't make it region-locked the Koreans just come over and get top 3 in the entire thing and then the Americans and Europeans don't get enough money to live from. Probably only a few times that pay their players a salary from which they can live. like TL, Mouz, EG. and then almost all the KeSPA teams and LG-IM, MVP, etc. Korean teams pull in way more sponsors than the European teams at the moment with the exception of EG of course. Come on, lets be clear, the American scene killed itself. Blizzard is offering the only tournament worth talking about in NA beyond MLG. The rest of the time, NA viewers refuse to watch anything that isn’t, live, in studio productions that rival GSL and complain when it isn’t of that level. If we have 7-10 online cups that were giving out 10K every 3-4 months, we would be doing better, but all the scene would do it complain. Meanwhile, Dota 2 has tons of events running at all time that are online, but no one can complain because they don’t have GSL is to compare it to and say “Why isn’t it that????” I so agree.. this feels exactly right! Peeps and players (like hellokitty i.e.) bitch to much about there so called WCS must be regionbased. 1st. there was no WCS, they could not even compete for 10k pricepool because they suck (sorry but hell, i cant beat around this korean bush). 2nd. Blizzard gives them also a chance to get 10k firstprize and they complain instantly.... 3. like little bitches they are... p They want 10k region GARANTUEED!!!1 Motherfucka's else our scene wont grow... what shameless bullshit is this NA proscene.. go suck donkeyballs because this is bullshit... if u give a plant to much water it dies... seems NA scene is also to wet atm. What? That was insanely hard to read. I believe the players complaining is pretty fair. If you become the best player in the US you can make the same amount of money as if you worked at McDonalds basically. WCS NA is a huge joke now because it's becoming WCS esF. I bet that a decent number of the koreans who made it into Challenger won't even be able to show up to the live event when they make it into premier league. I think people would rather have a smaller prize pool and region lock. You can complain about people feeling entitled, but you come across as incredibly entitled when you suggest that people should enter an extremely competitive environment and forgo school or a career only to make $150 and then get knocked out of their regional tournament by a Korean B teamer. At the very least these Korean players have the support and infrastructure available to focus only on improving, but we will never reach that point if the Korean scene can stomp out any up and coming players, which is what is happening. I know that many NA professional players have other jobs, how else could you compete without living with your parents? You are basically asking players to get screwed and not complain, which is pretty ignorant and entitled. edit: Also, I will really miss Theognis, he was a really nice guy it seemed. I really enjoyed watching his stream. Yes, ognis will be missed but im not ignorant at all. If there were progamers before WCS in the US, there will be progamers with WCS structure too. 2nd : dont put words in my mouth i didnt say. I only stated facts, nothing more. I didnt entitle anything. If u want to be a progamer go live where living is cheap! i.e. That is why whitera is still a progamer and can pay his expensis, this hasnt changed becuz of wcs... Being a progamer is hard with hard choices. Not many can live in the west and succeed at a progamingcareer the same time. and you really understand how to live as a pro gamer right? do you even know how much they make on Salary? and how much on average a westerner can make in tournaments with so many koreans stacked in a tournament? Also, do you know how much competition there is as a pro gamer? don't simply say : Live somewhere CHEAP, not everyone have the luxury to choose where they are born and where they live and what language they speak. Im sorry u dont like the statement, but whitera said it himself that progamers that are not from the west, had a better shot at a progaming career just becuz expense are lower then in the west. I like ur playstyle kitty, cheesy but that doesnt mean NA should close the borders, becuz in the end, progaming will not benefit from it. So, shortterm u might be right! But longterm ur wrong.. A nice example is the ATP (tennis, also a solo prosport). The best in the world (djokovic) wins like alot of money every year, but do u know Xavier Malisse? I dont think so and i also think he has a hard time paying his probills, but still he attends tournaments and makes the best of the situation he is in. So should u Prosports pays shit when u dont win alot.. but thats the choice u need to make as a up and comming and down and going player.
Xavier Malisse Yearly Earnings History
2006 $491,300
2009 $0
2010 $389,239
2011 $734,891
2012 $527,763
2013 $345,746
pretty sure you have no clue what youre talking about
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I helped buy your team a house. And you retire...
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Sad to hear about this. GL in the future!
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Northern Ireland27464 Posts
On August 02 2013 05:31 ROOTheognis wrote:Thanks for the support everyone. I'm writing a blog atm that hopefully I can release tonight if I finish to explain my thoughts/actions and what's in store. I'll try to keep it as low profile as possible. Don't want to be an attention whore  I always got annoyed by 'em so let's not do that! Cheers.
Look forward to reading it. You're no attention whore, if anything you're a shrinking violet 
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-- Nuked --
User was banned for this post.
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When you stop having fun playing video games, its time to do something different. I enjoyed the coaching with you, and following your games. Best of luck in the future. Taking that ONE game off your Protoss will forever be the highlight of my SC2 gaming!! <3 <3 <3
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Sad to see you go Theo. :<
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expect more foreigners to retire
SC2 isn't going in the right direction
I blame blizzard (WCS format)
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So he is also leaving ROOT?
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On August 02 2013 14:23 Grovbolle wrote:
So he is also leaving ROOT?
gg! I'm done :D. quit ROOT and done w sc2.
yea i think so
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On August 01 2013 07:52 Bayyne wrote:What's going on? It seems like everyday a thread pops up announcing the retirement of someone. 
When the game isn't fun to play or watch, it's usually time to move on.
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On August 02 2013 13:59 SpecialistSc wrote:
expect more foreigners to retire
SC2 isn't going in the right direction
I blame blizzard (WCS format)
What does this have to do with TheOgnis? Are you implying it's Blizzard's fault he's retiring?
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:'( does this mean no more theognis on meta?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?! but i learned so much from him!
Best of luck in whatever you pursue in the future, you will be greatly missed!
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On August 02 2013 05:31 ROOTheognis wrote:Thanks for the support everyone. I'm writing a blog atm that hopefully I can release tonight if I finish to explain my thoughts/actions and what's in store. I'll try to keep it as low profile as possible. Don't want to be an attention whore I always got annoyed by 'em so let's not do that! Cheers.
Good to hear. Will be waiting.
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On August 02 2013 07:07 reps)squishy wrote:
I helped buy your team a house. And you retire...
Wow, I don't know if you know this, but he dosen't owe you shit because you helped finance their team house.
Good luck Theo with whatever you choose to do. Will miss having you around.
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At a certain point you have to think about your long term future and not your SC2 future. People move on, you can't be in the scene until you're 62 and want to retire. Korea just happens to have retirement built into the culture (military service) so we see "less of it" over there, but eventually everyone moves on. You have to if you want to survive long term.
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EPT
