EPTWCS USA Runner-Up Daisuki maphacking? - Page 38
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1Dhalism
862 Posts
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Xoronius
Germany6362 Posts
On February 11 2013 22:09 1Dhalism wrote: do you guys think he should be stripped of his previous tournaments wins a la Lance. No. Lance doped in all of his tournament wins, Daisuke hacked on ladder. As most tournaments are not BYOC, it is safe to say he did´nt cheat there (+people stand behind him at MLG/WCS would have seen it). | ||
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ZenithM
France15952 Posts
On February 11 2013 10:26 Shellshock1122 wrote: He can't show up here anymore because he's already banned Why the hell would he get banned from the forum? That's a given that he shouldn't be allowed to be a pro/semipro-gamer anymore, but from TL as a video game forum?? Are you telling me that nobody on this forum ever used maphacks? | ||
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Cokefreak
Finland8096 Posts
On February 11 2013 23:12 ZenithM wrote: Why the hell would he get banned from the forum? That's a given that he shouldn't be allowed to be a pro/semipro-gamer anymore, but from TL as a video game forum?? Are you telling me that nobody on this forum ever used maphacks? Just like many hackers have been banned in the past from TL they will be banned in the future as well, some are let back in after a while but TL has zero tolerance for hacking in general. NITRIXdaisuki was just banned by Plexa. That account was created on 2010-12-09 01:48:38 and had 57 posts. Reason: Hacker. Zero tolerance for scum. | ||
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ZenithM
France15952 Posts
On February 11 2013 23:13 Cokefreak wrote: Just like many hackers have been banned in the past from TL they will be banned in the future as well, some are let back in after a while but TL has zero tolerance for hacking in general. I completely agree with the "Zero tolerance for scum" policy. I just didn't know that what you do on ladder had any impact on your account's status on TL. | ||
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shadymmj
1906 Posts
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Drake
Germany6146 Posts
otherwise everyone can try hack and if caught "ok now i play without cheating" ... sry but ask again in 2years On February 11 2013 23:20 shadymmj wrote: id bet savior would be allowed back in here to post though, if he wanted to he lost on purpose, not hacked ^^ jaeh i know its even worse but he not was against the other players just against the money betters ... still its nice he got perm banned from every game forever but well ... still i think cheating is worse ... | ||
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1Dhalism
862 Posts
On February 11 2013 22:37 Xoronius wrote: No. Lance doped in all of his tournament wins, Daisuke hacked on ladder. As most tournaments are not BYOC, it is safe to say he did´nt cheat there (+people stand behind him at MLG/WCS would have seen it). I meant online tournaments. | ||
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tili
United States1332 Posts
On February 11 2013 10:48 KaiserKieran wrote: A permaban seems unreasonable. Worst I see is him being banned for 6 months from all online tournaments. He would probably retire because of a 2 year ban so it would be no use. Stripping him of all recent online tournaments might be a little better although it might seem a little extreme. I hope he sees the error in his ways! I remember cheering him on versus Vibe haha. Daisuki fighting!!! I genuinely agree with this. Yes, he should be punished, but we have no proof he hacked at a tournament either offline or online. That would be grounds for a perma-ban. He's obviously not "scum", anymore than people who lie/cheat are scum. They are desperate and unscrupulous, but honestly, no one is perfect. Justice is necessary, but all this high-handed "scum" business is incredibly hypocritical. Not in the sense that everyone cheats, but in the sense that everyone fucks up, many times. Whatever the case, I hope Daisuki finds legitimate success and growth through this public denouncement. Godspeed. edit: spelling & clarity | ||
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YumYumGranola
Canada346 Posts
It hurts me to have to defend Daisuki, but this is getting out of hand. This whole cheating thing is really bringing out the inner-Javert from this community. Yes, what he did was wrong. Yes, he deserves some kind of punishment. But the level of vitriol and heavy handedness because of this incident is obnoxious. Some questions for all the people suggesting a permaban from competitive events: How exactly would such a ban be administered and enforced? There isn't a KeSPA here to block him from joining teams or attending events. It's up to each event, team, and sponsor to decide whether or not he can join. Are we seriously suggesting that we as a community bully and threaten them all into shunning him? Do we threaten boycotts of teams and events he's included in? Are we seriously considering enforcing a ban who's duration is based on nothing more then how angry as a mob we are? Cummon people, that's how middle school kids deal with problems. If you truly want the eSports community to be a professional scene (as I do) then it needs to be able to handle disputes in a reasonable and rational way. I know we're all upset about this now, but a permaban would be completely inconsistent with the precedents set on how we've dealt with similar incidents in the past. Are we really going to give Daisuki a more difficult time than Dragon for the simple reason that Daisuki doesn't make us laugh with silly videos of trolling people in Gold league? | ||
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Figgy
Canada1788 Posts
On February 12 2013 00:05 YumYumGranola wrote: This thread makes me sad. It hurts me to have to defend Daisuki, but this is getting out of hand. This whole cheating thing is really bringing out the inner-Javert from this community. Yes, what he did was wrong. Yes, he deserves some kind of punishment. But the level of vitriol and heavy handedness because of this incident is obnoxious. Some questions for all the people suggesting a permaban from competitive events: How exactly would such a ban be administered and enforced? There isn't a KeSPA here to block him from joining teams or attending events. It's up to each event, team, and sponsor to decide whether or not he can join. Are we seriously suggesting that we as a community bully and threaten them all into shunning him? Do we threaten boycotts of teams and events he's included in? Are we seriously considering enforcing a ban who's duration is based on nothing more then how angry as a mob we are? Cummon people, that's how middle school kids deal with problems. If you truly want the eSports community to be a professional scene (as I do) then it needs to be able to handle disputes in a reasonable and rational way. I know we're all upset about this now, but a permaban would be completely inconsistent with the precedents set on how we've dealt with similar incidents in the past. Are we really going to give Daisuki a more difficult time than Dragon for the simple reason that Daisuki doesn't make us laugh with silly videos of trolling people in Gold league? We are absolutely going to act professional BY BANNING HIM FROM EVERYTHING. I certainly wouldn't want to play against a cheater regardless of if he is still cheating or not, especially if my career and thousands of dollars are on the line which for most pros is absolutely the case. We need to prevent further hacking and cheating by doing exactly what is being done. By outing them for what they are, and banning them from everything and anything to do with professional Starcraft. ESPECIALLY online. Zero tolerance from scum is exactly the kind of attitute we need to keep things professional. The whole "it's just ladder" excuse people are using to defend him is utter garbage, especially when you are joining tournaments and have top 50 GM accounts. Considering that is how most Korean pros practice is primarily the ladder, you are ruining their hard work and dedication and most importantly of all, their careers. A cheater is a cheater, he deserves much harsher punishment than we are actually able to give him. | ||
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Mortal
2943 Posts
On February 11 2013 23:19 ZenithM wrote: I completely agree with the "Zero tolerance for scum" policy. I just didn't know that what you do on ladder had any impact on your account's status on TL. I too find it a bit ham-handed. Worst case ban him from SC2 forum and allow him elsewhere. TT1 made his way back onto the forums. | ||
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YumYumGranola
Canada346 Posts
On February 12 2013 00:20 Figgy wrote: We are absolutely going to act professional BY BANNING HIM FROM EVERYTHING. I certainly wouldn't want to play against a cheater regardless of if he is still cheating or not, especially if my career and thousands of dollars are on the line which for most pros is absolutely the case. We need to prevent further hacking and cheating by doing exactly what is being done. By outing them for what they are, and banning them from everything and anything to do with professional Starcraft. ESPECIALLY online. Zero tolerance from scum is exactly the kind of attitute we need to keep things professional. The whole "it's just ladder" excuse people are using to defend him is utter garbage, especially when you are joining tournaments and have top 50 GM accounts. Considering that is how most Korean pros practice is primarily the ladder, you are ruining their hard work and dedication and most importantly of all, their careers. A cheater is a cheater, he deserves much harsher punishment than we are actually able to give him. Again, how? How do you propose we go about "BANNING HIM FROM EVERYTHING." as you say? In the professional world you don't just throw undefined phrases like that and pretend you're doing justice. There has to be a consistent, well understood set of standards with consistently applied penalties to issues. Heavy handed justice based on making examples of those who do wrong are characteristics of mobs and dictators, not reasoned professionals. | ||
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MaxQT
69 Posts
On February 12 2013 00:20 Figgy wrote: We are absolutely going to act professional BY BANNING HIM FROM EVERYTHING. I certainly wouldn't want to play against a cheater regardless of if he is still cheating or not, especially if my career and thousands of dollars are on the line which for most pros is absolutely the case. We need to prevent further hacking and cheating by doing exactly what is being done. By outing them for what they are, and banning them from everything and anything to do with professional Starcraft. ESPECIALLY online. Zero tolerance from scum is exactly the kind of attitute we need to keep things professional. The whole "it's just ladder" excuse people are using to defend him is utter garbage, especially when you are joining tournaments and have top 50 GM accounts. Considering that is how most Korean pros practice is primarily the ladder, you are ruining their hard work and dedication and most importantly of all, their careers. A cheater is a cheater, he deserves much harsher punishment than we are actually able to give him. Then we should ban these "scums" (didnt want to use that word, but as you all call cheaters scum, and as and you say: a cheater is always a cheater..) TT1, Dragon, Spades, HayPrO, etc | ||
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moskonia
Israel1448 Posts
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OkStyX
Canada1199 Posts
On February 12 2013 00:20 Figgy wrote: We are absolutely going to act professional BY BANNING HIM FROM EVERYTHING. I certainly wouldn't want to play against a cheater regardless of if he is still cheating or not, especially if my career and thousands of dollars are on the line which for most pros is absolutely the case. We need to prevent further hacking and cheating by doing exactly what is being done. By outing them for what they are, and banning them from everything and anything to do with professional Starcraft. ESPECIALLY online. Zero tolerance from scum is exactly the kind of attitute we need to keep things professional. The whole "it's just ladder" excuse people are using to defend him is utter garbage, especially when you are joining tournaments and have top 50 GM accounts. Considering that is how most Korean pros practice is primarily the ladder, you are ruining their hard work and dedication and most importantly of all, their careers. A cheater is a cheater, he deserves much harsher punishment than we are actually able to give him. Agreed 100% , cheaters should not be tolerated , period. There is no reason to be lenient , he doesn't respect competition and fair play . We shouldn't allow him in the community , doesn't respect us he deserves none back. | ||
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Grovbolle
Denmark3825 Posts
Instead of speaking, do something, let your actions reflect your opinion. Say I was running a tournament, then it is up to me whether or not I wish to have someone who has admitted to cheating once play in my tournament. If I want to watch some games, as a viewer, which tournament do I tune in to, the one with former cheater or not. People need to stop pushing their own morals and beliefs on to others, if you want to shun Daisuki, then do that, if you think he deserves to be forgiven (either immediately or as time goes by) then support him. But instead of loud mouthing on the forums, speak with your actions (or wallet). The only one who HAS to act a certain way in this situation is Blizzard, because their job is to ban people who cheat on ladder. Everything else is subjective. | ||
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ragz_gt
9172 Posts
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Wpgstevo
Canada79 Posts
News flash: The posters on TL who don't have the power to enforce a ban are aware of this fact. What they are saying is that they hope the tournament organizers ban him. Since this community is comprised of pros and fans alike, it doesn't seem unreasonable to express that desire in this thread. Obviously they don't have the power to enforce, but they know that already. Redemption and/or forgiveness are down the line, not something to discuss before he even has occasion to uninstall the hacks... | ||
BisuDagger
Bisutopia19399 Posts
On February 10 2013 12:02 DarkPlasmaBall wrote: Wow this is just... lol. I wonder if all pro-hackers have some sort of secret channel or code that they abide by, in an attempt to protect one another from the community. That quote from him is about the only thing entertaining from this thread. It's hard to define proper judgement with these incidents because it sets the standard for future encounters with this. | ||
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