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On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer.
You can easily tell that MMA has been going downhill ever since the incident blew up ( in Feb ) coz he has been doing his own stuff.
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On October 25 2012 02:58 Xiaopewpew wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You can easily tell that MMA has been going downhill ever since the incident blew up ( in Feb ) coz he has been doing his own stuff.
He's also scammed a coach
who won him GSL October.
I wonder whats mma's comment about this one is lol.
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On October 25 2012 02:57 NightOfTheDead wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You make good point, but i dont think MMA was intently trying to hurt Boxer. He had some good achievements in SC2, and wanted to make his career even better. All this talk about money-grabbing is BS, cause that's what players trying to achieve. Make a living, make money. He is SC2 pro, he had results, he wasnt satisfied how he end up, he wanted to leave. Period.
Maybe he did not intend to , but he did anyway. And there are 2 reasons why it happened
1. Jessica trusted J but J screwed everyone over. Which NOTE THIS! Jessica apologized in team meeting, in first interview, and in second interview.
2. MMA did not trust someone who brought him to the esports scene at the first place and trusted some random guy who said Boxer and Jessica are screwing him over. Which NOTE THIS, even now MMA did not apologize about it in any sense!
Jessica did not push away this part of blame. Nobody said Jessica is clean. But the players need to shoulder their part of the blame/responsibility as well. Its not her own fault.
Jessica's fault cannot be avoided because J intended to screw up the team and grab players. Its a conspirarcy and she is a victim.However MMA's fault can easily be avoided if he had trusted Boxer, who , I dunno if anyone disagrees with this point, has a huge amount of credibility in the esports scene. (This guy formed 3 clans 2 in bw 1 in wol please)
Of course MMA is at fault.
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On October 25 2012 02:57 NightOfTheDead wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You make good point, but i dont think MMA was intently trying to hurt Boxer He had some good achievements in SC2, and wanted to make his career even better. All this talk about money-grabbing is BS, cause that's what all players trying to achieve. Make a living, make money They are not for some charity in there. He is SC2 pro, he had results, he wasnt satisfied how he end up, he wanted to leave.And of course Boxer couldnt be happy about that. Period.
Cmon guys, this just strenghts the fact that those two had always been close until Jessica starting putting her nose in the middle of SC2 business.
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On October 25 2012 03:03 mongmong wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 02:58 Xiaopewpew wrote:On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You can easily tell that MMA has been going downhill ever since the incident blew up ( in Feb ) coz he has been doing his own stuff. He's also scammed a coach who won him GSL October. I wonder whats mma's comment about this one is lol.
From the way it sounded, It was very immature how MMA handled the coach thing too. He expected the team to cover expenses for his private coach. That is unheard of. And despite winning so much money in MLG (ya, in Korea it is a lot of money believe me) All he gave his coach was a graphic card won from some tournament. And according to Jessica's account "MMA threw the graphic card at the ryu" if im not wrong.
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On October 25 2012 03:03 mongmong wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 02:58 Xiaopewpew wrote:On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You can easily tell that MMA has been going downhill ever since the incident blew up ( in Feb ) coz he has been doing his own stuff. He's also scammed a coach who won him GSL October. I wonder whats mma's comment about this one is lol.
JESSICA said this, did you see any coach RYU statements? Jesus you guys.
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Its funny how this Xiao guy has like over 40 posts and all of them are in here bashing MMA, that can tell you a lot.
I'm not even going to pay attention to what he writes anymore.
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On October 25 2012 03:04 Xiaopewpew wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 02:57 NightOfTheDead wrote:On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You make good point, but i dont think MMA was intently trying to hurt Boxer. He had some good achievements in SC2, and wanted to make his career even better. All this talk about money-grabbing is BS, cause that's what players trying to achieve. Make a living, make money. He is SC2 pro, he had results, he wasnt satisfied how he end up, he wanted to leave. Period. Maybe he did not intend to , but he did anyway. And there are 2 reasons why it happened 1. Jessica trusted J but J screwed everyone over. Which NOTE THIS! Jessica apologized in team meeting, in first interview, and in second interview. 2. MMA did not trust someone who brought him to the esports scene at the first place and trusted some random guy who said Boxer and Jessica are screwing him over. Which NOTE THIS, even now MMA did not apologize about it in any sense! Jessica did not push away this part of blame. Nobody said Jessica is clean. But the players need to shoulder their part of the blame/responsibility as well. Its not her own fault. Jessica's fault cannot be avoided because J intended to screw up the team and grab players. Its a conspirarcy and she is a victim.However MMA's fault can easily be avoided if he had trusted Boxer, who , I dunno if anyone disagrees with this point, has a huge amount of credibility in the esports scene. (This guy formed 3 clans 2 in bw 1 in wol please) Of course MMA is at fault.
Happy to answer such a calm and collected post. One question though, dont you think that Jessica deciding to go public did more harm to Boxer? I mean she just could call out the bluff on ESF, and end with it. Sure MMA is at fault, but her methods on doing things arent any better really. She doesnt seem like a sound manager anyway. What did she achieve with all this stuff in public? Slayers disbanded, she left. Whats the point? This is the question which no one could answer for me persuasively.
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On October 25 2012 03:12 JAWS_ wrote:
Its funny how this Xiao guy has like over 40 posts and all of them are in here bashing MMA, that can tell you a lot.
I'm not even going to pay attention to what he writes anymore.
I did not bash MMA in my posts, I said in almost every single fucking one of them that BOTH PARTY ARE AT FAULT.
But guys like you keep blaming everyting on Jessica.
perhaps you mean a different thing when you say bash though.
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On October 25 2012 01:29 dongmydrum wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 01:16 Rabiator wrote:On October 25 2012 01:09 dongmydrum wrote:On October 25 2012 00:56 NightOfTheDead wrote:On October 24 2012 15:34 dongmydrum wrote:On October 24 2012 15:32 DrakeFZX3 wrote:On October 24 2012 15:24 dongmydrum wrote:On October 24 2012 15:20 ImNightmare wrote:On October 24 2012 15:17 lilsusie wrote:
KimKaYeon @SlayerS_Jessica
이것이 레이저사의 입장인지.. J매니져와 대화햇던 크리스의 입장인지 명확히 밝히세요 그럼 나도 준비를 할께요
Is this the perspective of Razer... or is it the opinion of Chris that Manager J has been talking to, please clarify. I will prepare.
1h KimKaYeon @SlayerS_Jessica
크리스..당신과 나는 새로운 스폰서쉅에 대해서 얘기하지 않고 J매니저와 얘기햇어요
Chris, you and I did not talk about a new sponsorship, you talked to Manager J
1h KimKaYeon @SlayerS_Jessica
크리스가 얘기를 앞뒤 상황잘라먹고 하는거 같네요 제 기억과 이메일 확인 작업후 올릴께요 크리스.. 그럴 말할 자격 없을텐데요.. 모든게 연관이 잇다는걸 .. 제가 감춰주는게 있다는걸 이해 못하는군요. 전 그럼 확인 갑니다
It seems that Chris is cutting out the front and back of the story. I will post my memory [of this] and after checking my email once I'm done with work... You're not qualified to say things like that... everything is connected... You don't understand that I'm trying to hide something for you.. then I will go check now.
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More or less. Sorry for the rough translation. Why is she always always so aggressive with her tweets....and why is she again ambiguously saying MMA did something wrong by saying she is trying to hide something from chris... in which part is she being ambiguous? and you can't fault her for being aggressive, i'd go bat shit crazy if someone accused me for doing something I've never done. From the beginning, she provided all the facts and the other side only gave assumptions. Not an iota of evidence has been out that disproves her story Jessica's been the aggressor since the beginning. Everyone else is playing defender. Funny you said you'd go bat shit crazy if someone accused you of doing something. How do you think MMA, Crank, Ryung, Alicia, and MC feel at the moment? Did anybody come up with any proof that disproved Jessica's statement? Jessica was the victim from the beginning basically MMA and Crank thought she was guilty of embezzling their funds and now she's just defending herself. Not exactly, but they didnt think Jessica would secretly backstab them with proof she has been gathering. But even then she also didnt prove anything except for their horrible methods of trying to leave the team. It only reinforces the point that they really were trusting her. oh now you're blaming Jessica for gathering evidence. if Jessica didn't have those evidence i'd imagine people would actually believe all the lies those guys are feeding the media. all those guys have been lying and they have been disproved by Jessica and who do you blame? Jessica. when they slander Jessica, its a "misunderstanding" whereas when Jessica defends herself by providing real hard "evidence" and "facts", she's creating "drama". And seriously you say that MMA and Crank were trusting Jessica? guess who was backstabbing when they were plotting to leave the team and spreading false rumor that Jessica was embezzling their money So its a conspiracy of several players who are just greedy bastards and wanted to get rich quick and not an incompetent manager (Jessica) who mishandled the team in such a way that they just had to leave? It obviously makes more sense to spin a conspiracy theory about several people acting together than one incompetent person (who actually owns and thus is responsible for the team) ruining it. Except that we don't need to do any theorizing because we are given all the facts and what ESF, MMA and Crank said do not disprove her story
It is not necessary to "disprove her story", because all the "Jessica supporters" are missing the point ... which is the fact that she and Boxer seriously mismanaged the team to the extent that the players and sponsors all felt unwelcome / mistreated and left. The players certainly didnt make the sponsors leave and if you dont get any sponsors the team is dead.
All that Jessica does is blame the players, but it is her who didnt get any sponsors or behaved REALLY STUPID with the manager J situation and her email being accessible by him.
People need to learn to distinguish between CAUSE and EFFECT. Players leaving the team is the EFFECT and the CAUSE is mismanagement of the team. Only the cause really matters and any misunderstandings / changes of mind / supposed lies for the effect do not matter at all!
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On October 25 2012 03:14 NightOfTheDead wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 03:04 Xiaopewpew wrote:On October 25 2012 02:57 NightOfTheDead wrote:On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You make good point, but i dont think MMA was intently trying to hurt Boxer. He had some good achievements in SC2, and wanted to make his career even better. All this talk about money-grabbing is BS, cause that's what players trying to achieve. Make a living, make money. He is SC2 pro, he had results, he wasnt satisfied how he end up, he wanted to leave. Period. Maybe he did not intend to , but he did anyway. And there are 2 reasons why it happened 1. Jessica trusted J but J screwed everyone over. Which NOTE THIS! Jessica apologized in team meeting, in first interview, and in second interview. 2. MMA did not trust someone who brought him to the esports scene at the first place and trusted some random guy who said Boxer and Jessica are screwing him over. Which NOTE THIS, even now MMA did not apologize about it in any sense! Jessica did not push away this part of blame. Nobody said Jessica is clean. But the players need to shoulder their part of the blame/responsibility as well. Its not her own fault. Jessica's fault cannot be avoided because J intended to screw up the team and grab players. Its a conspirarcy and she is a victim.However MMA's fault can easily be avoided if he had trusted Boxer, who , I dunno if anyone disagrees with this point, has a huge amount of credibility in the esports scene. (This guy formed 3 clans 2 in bw 1 in wol please) Of course MMA is at fault. Happy to answer such a calm and collected post. One question though, dont you think that Jessica deciding to go public did more harm to Boxer? I mean she just could call out the bluff on ESF, and end with it. Sure MMA is at fault, but her methods on doing things arent any better really. She doesnt seem like a sound manager anyway. What did she achieve with all this stuff in public? Slayers disbanded, she left. Whats the point? This is the question which no one could answer for me persuasively.
You are certainly right that she did not do a nice thing going public with this mass. I dont understand the question though.... Are you asking if Jessica is trying to hurt MMA? It does not really seem like Boxer is involved in this alot ........
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On October 25 2012 02:57 NightOfTheDead wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You make good point, but i dont think MMA was intently trying to hurt Boxer He had some good achievements in SC2, and wanted to make his career even better. All this talk about money-grabbing is BS, cause that's what all players trying to achieve. Make a living, make money They are not for some charity in there. He is SC2 pro, he had results, he wasnt satisfied how he end up, he wanted to leave.And of course Boxer couldnt be happy about that. Period.
Of course MMA wasn't trying to hurt Boxer on purpose - very few people actively try to hurt others. The thing is, for Boxer money was always an after thought, something that comes to you when you are good at what you do (in this case, eSports). It's probably a little naive of him, but I have no doubt he expected the same from his players - to be devoted to the game and working hard rather than going wherever they smell more cash. Of course it's going to be painful for him to see a player he brought into the scene and raised to be a champion get involved in this kind of crap, especially since he literally funded the team with his personal money. It's obvious MMA had money and fame get to his head, which is unfortunate. It doesn't really make him a bad person, at least not in our world. But it's still a pretty shitty thing to do, and something that could have been avoided if he had shown some better judgement and patience.
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On October 25 2012 03:04 Xiaopewpew wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 02:57 NightOfTheDead wrote:On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You make good point, but i dont think MMA was intently trying to hurt Boxer. He had some good achievements in SC2, and wanted to make his career even better. All this talk about money-grabbing is BS, cause that's what players trying to achieve. Make a living, make money. He is SC2 pro, he had results, he wasnt satisfied how he end up, he wanted to leave. Period. Maybe he did not intend to , but he did anyway. And there are 2 reasons why it happened 1. Jessica trusted J but J screwed everyone over. Which NOTE THIS! Jessica apologized in team meeting, in first interview, and in second interview. 2. MMA did not trust someone who brought him to the esports scene at the first place and trusted some random guy who said Boxer and Jessica are screwing him over. Which NOTE THIS, even now MMA did not apologize about it in any sense! Jessica did not push away this part of blame. Nobody said Jessica is clean. But the players need to shoulder their part of the blame/responsibility as well. Its not her own fault. Jessica's fault cannot be avoided because J intended to screw up the team and grab players. Its a conspirarcy and she is a victim.However MMA's fault can easily be avoided if he had trusted Boxer, who , I dunno if anyone disagrees with this point, has a huge amount of credibility in the esports scene. (This guy formed 3 clans 2 in bw 1 in wol please) Of course MMA is at fault.
You make Boxer out to be the holy saint in this situation. Let me ask you 2 questions.
The team he build, where was he when the team in a dire situation needed him?
- He was busy playing the MMO he had some connection with for months.
Where was he when the team needed him the most?
- He abandoned ship to go for the better payed job at SK Telecom T1 and left Slayers for DEAD.
I love Boxer, there's no denying in what he did for eSports in general. But to make him be the holy saint in this situation is...
NO, just no.
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On October 25 2012 03:14 NightOfTheDead wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 03:04 Xiaopewpew wrote:On October 25 2012 02:57 NightOfTheDead wrote:On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You make good point, but i dont think MMA was intently trying to hurt Boxer. He had some good achievements in SC2, and wanted to make his career even better. All this talk about money-grabbing is BS, cause that's what players trying to achieve. Make a living, make money. He is SC2 pro, he had results, he wasnt satisfied how he end up, he wanted to leave. Period. Maybe he did not intend to , but he did anyway. And there are 2 reasons why it happened 1. Jessica trusted J but J screwed everyone over. Which NOTE THIS! Jessica apologized in team meeting, in first interview, and in second interview. 2. MMA did not trust someone who brought him to the esports scene at the first place and trusted some random guy who said Boxer and Jessica are screwing him over. Which NOTE THIS, even now MMA did not apologize about it in any sense! Jessica did not push away this part of blame. Nobody said Jessica is clean. But the players need to shoulder their part of the blame/responsibility as well. Its not her own fault. Jessica's fault cannot be avoided because J intended to screw up the team and grab players. Its a conspirarcy and she is a victim.However MMA's fault can easily be avoided if he had trusted Boxer, who , I dunno if anyone disagrees with this point, has a huge amount of credibility in the esports scene. (This guy formed 3 clans 2 in bw 1 in wol please) Of course MMA is at fault. Happy to answer such a calm and collected post. One question though, dont you think that Jessica deciding to go public did more harm to Boxer? I mean she just could call out the bluff on ESF, and end with it. Sure MMA is at fault, but her methods on doing things arent any better really. She doesnt seem like a sound manager anyway. What did she achieve with all this stuff in public? Slayers disbanded, she left. Whats the point? This is the question which no one could answer for me persuasively.
All along she wanted players and entities whom she considers to be at fault to give a honest recollection of the events and apologize for mistakes on their part. My guess is because she wants to preserve Boxer's imagine in eSports (Slayers disbanded because so and so fucked up as opposed to Slayers disbanded because Boxer jumped ship to SKT); probably emotional involvement is there as well, as both her and Boxer invested a LOT of their time, money, and careers into making Slayers happen, only to see it undermined by others' selfishness and greed.
She made some questionable decisions, there's no denying that - but there's also no denying that she was the one running the team that produced multiple championships both in team and individual leagues. There's no way she is anywhere remotely as bad as these forums make her out to be, and her aggressive criticism of players and eSF in this situation are, to me, very normal.
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On October 25 2012 03:24 Shinobi1982 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 03:04 Xiaopewpew wrote:On October 25 2012 02:57 NightOfTheDead wrote:On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You make good point, but i dont think MMA was intently trying to hurt Boxer. He had some good achievements in SC2, and wanted to make his career even better. All this talk about money-grabbing is BS, cause that's what players trying to achieve. Make a living, make money. He is SC2 pro, he had results, he wasnt satisfied how he end up, he wanted to leave. Period. Maybe he did not intend to , but he did anyway. And there are 2 reasons why it happened 1. Jessica trusted J but J screwed everyone over. Which NOTE THIS! Jessica apologized in team meeting, in first interview, and in second interview. 2. MMA did not trust someone who brought him to the esports scene at the first place and trusted some random guy who said Boxer and Jessica are screwing him over. Which NOTE THIS, even now MMA did not apologize about it in any sense! Jessica did not push away this part of blame. Nobody said Jessica is clean. But the players need to shoulder their part of the blame/responsibility as well. Its not her own fault. Jessica's fault cannot be avoided because J intended to screw up the team and grab players. Its a conspirarcy and she is a victim.However MMA's fault can easily be avoided if he had trusted Boxer, who , I dunno if anyone disagrees with this point, has a huge amount of credibility in the esports scene. (This guy formed 3 clans 2 in bw 1 in wol please) Of course MMA is at fault. You make Boxer out to be the holy saint in this situation. Let me ask you 2 questions. The team he build, where was he when the team in a dire situation needed him? - He was busy playing the MMO he had some connection with for months. Where was he when the team needed him the most? - He abandoned ship to go for the better payed job at SK Telecom T1 and left Slayers for DEAD. I love Boxer, there's no denying in what he did for eSports in general. But to make him be the holy saint in this situation is... NO, just no.
You do realize that he only left Slayers after it was pretty much decided to disband the team, right?
edit: if anything, his fault is that he is too good for the modern eSports world. He couldn't envision players putting their personal earnings above doing well in the teamleagues or growing together in the team that raised them, and that seems to have been the prime cause for Slayers collapsing.
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On October 25 2012 03:07 Xiaopewpew wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 03:03 mongmong wrote:On October 25 2012 02:58 Xiaopewpew wrote:On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You can easily tell that MMA has been going downhill ever since the incident blew up ( in Feb ) coz he has been doing his own stuff. He's also scammed a coach who won him GSL October. I wonder whats mma's comment about this one is lol. And according to Jessica's account "MMA threw the graphic card at the ryu" if im not wrong.
I hope he yelled "HADOKEN!" when he did it.
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On October 25 2012 03:19 Rabiator wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 01:29 dongmydrum wrote:On October 25 2012 01:16 Rabiator wrote:On October 25 2012 01:09 dongmydrum wrote:On October 25 2012 00:56 NightOfTheDead wrote:On October 24 2012 15:34 dongmydrum wrote:On October 24 2012 15:32 DrakeFZX3 wrote:On October 24 2012 15:24 dongmydrum wrote:On October 24 2012 15:20 ImNightmare wrote:On October 24 2012 15:17 lilsusie wrote:
KimKaYeon @SlayerS_Jessica
이것이 레이저사의 입장인지.. J매니져와 대화햇던 크리스의 입장인지 명확히 밝히세요 그럼 나도 준비를 할께요
Is this the perspective of Razer... or is it the opinion of Chris that Manager J has been talking to, please clarify. I will prepare.
1h KimKaYeon @SlayerS_Jessica
크리스..당신과 나는 새로운 스폰서쉅에 대해서 얘기하지 않고 J매니저와 얘기햇어요
Chris, you and I did not talk about a new sponsorship, you talked to Manager J
1h KimKaYeon @SlayerS_Jessica
크리스가 얘기를 앞뒤 상황잘라먹고 하는거 같네요 제 기억과 이메일 확인 작업후 올릴께요 크리스.. 그럴 말할 자격 없을텐데요.. 모든게 연관이 잇다는걸 .. 제가 감춰주는게 있다는걸 이해 못하는군요. 전 그럼 확인 갑니다
It seems that Chris is cutting out the front and back of the story. I will post my memory [of this] and after checking my email once I'm done with work... You're not qualified to say things like that... everything is connected... You don't understand that I'm trying to hide something for you.. then I will go check now.
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More or less. Sorry for the rough translation. Why is she always always so aggressive with her tweets....and why is she again ambiguously saying MMA did something wrong by saying she is trying to hide something from chris... in which part is she being ambiguous? and you can't fault her for being aggressive, i'd go bat shit crazy if someone accused me for doing something I've never done. From the beginning, she provided all the facts and the other side only gave assumptions. Not an iota of evidence has been out that disproves her story Jessica's been the aggressor since the beginning. Everyone else is playing defender. Funny you said you'd go bat shit crazy if someone accused you of doing something. How do you think MMA, Crank, Ryung, Alicia, and MC feel at the moment? Did anybody come up with any proof that disproved Jessica's statement? Jessica was the victim from the beginning basically MMA and Crank thought she was guilty of embezzling their funds and now she's just defending herself. Not exactly, but they didnt think Jessica would secretly backstab them with proof she has been gathering. But even then she also didnt prove anything except for their horrible methods of trying to leave the team. It only reinforces the point that they really were trusting her. oh now you're blaming Jessica for gathering evidence. if Jessica didn't have those evidence i'd imagine people would actually believe all the lies those guys are feeding the media. all those guys have been lying and they have been disproved by Jessica and who do you blame? Jessica. when they slander Jessica, its a "misunderstanding" whereas when Jessica defends herself by providing real hard "evidence" and "facts", she's creating "drama". And seriously you say that MMA and Crank were trusting Jessica? guess who was backstabbing when they were plotting to leave the team and spreading false rumor that Jessica was embezzling their money So its a conspiracy of several players who are just greedy bastards and wanted to get rich quick and not an incompetent manager (Jessica) who mishandled the team in such a way that they just had to leave? It obviously makes more sense to spin a conspiracy theory about several people acting together than one incompetent person (who actually owns and thus is responsible for the team) ruining it. Except that we don't need to do any theorizing because we are given all the facts and what ESF, MMA and Crank said do not disprove her story It is not necessary to "disprove her story", because all the "Jessica supporters" are missing the point ... which is the fact that she and Boxer seriously mismanaged the team to the extent that the players and sponsors all felt unwelcome / mistreated and left. The players certainly didnt make the sponsors leave and if you dont get any sponsors the team is dead. All that Jessica does is blame the players, but it is her who didnt get any sponsors or behaved REALLY STUPID with the manager J situation and her email being accessible by him. People need to learn to distinguish between CAUSE and EFFECT. Players leaving the team is the EFFECT and the CAUSE is mismanagement of the team. Only the cause really matters and any misunderstandings / changes of mind / supposed lies for the effect do not matter at all!
Jessica already took her part of the blame. She said she brought in J and resulted in loss of sponsor and team disbanding, she said she is sorry. First line in the interview. Read please?
Im familliar with Chinese dota scence, there were one or two of the teams had bad management, but the players stood united and turned the situation around. It did not happen in Slayers sadly. Jessica's mismanagement is not the sole cause of the team disbanding. You might think you are so smart understanding the situation reading translated scripts. But the Koreans are not stupid, yet most of them sided with Jessica calling MMA naive and inmature. You have to understand in a drama like this, there is no single cause.
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On October 25 2012 03:24 Shinobi1982 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 03:04 Xiaopewpew wrote:On October 25 2012 02:57 NightOfTheDead wrote:On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You make good point, but i dont think MMA was intently trying to hurt Boxer. He had some good achievements in SC2, and wanted to make his career even better. All this talk about money-grabbing is BS, cause that's what players trying to achieve. Make a living, make money. He is SC2 pro, he had results, he wasnt satisfied how he end up, he wanted to leave. Period. Maybe he did not intend to , but he did anyway. And there are 2 reasons why it happened 1. Jessica trusted J but J screwed everyone over. Which NOTE THIS! Jessica apologized in team meeting, in first interview, and in second interview. 2. MMA did not trust someone who brought him to the esports scene at the first place and trusted some random guy who said Boxer and Jessica are screwing him over. Which NOTE THIS, even now MMA did not apologize about it in any sense! Jessica did not push away this part of blame. Nobody said Jessica is clean. But the players need to shoulder their part of the blame/responsibility as well. Its not her own fault. Jessica's fault cannot be avoided because J intended to screw up the team and grab players. Its a conspirarcy and she is a victim.However MMA's fault can easily be avoided if he had trusted Boxer, who , I dunno if anyone disagrees with this point, has a huge amount of credibility in the esports scene. (This guy formed 3 clans 2 in bw 1 in wol please) Of course MMA is at fault. You make Boxer out to be the holy saint in this situation. Let me ask you 2 questions. The team he build, where was he when the team in a dire situation needed him? - He was busy playing the MMO he had some connection with for months. Where was he when the team needed him the most? - He abandoned ship to go for the better payed job at SK Telecom T1 and left Slayers for DEAD. I love Boxer, there's no denying in what he did for eSports in general. But to make him be the holy saint in this situation is... NO, just no.
Im not making Boxer a saint.... but the context of discussion in the above thread is Jessica and MMA.... Of course he shares responsibility mismanaging the team
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On October 25 2012 03:25 Salazarz wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 03:14 NightOfTheDead wrote:On October 25 2012 03:04 Xiaopewpew wrote:On October 25 2012 02:57 NightOfTheDead wrote:On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You make good point, but i dont think MMA was intently trying to hurt Boxer. He had some good achievements in SC2, and wanted to make his career even better. All this talk about money-grabbing is BS, cause that's what players trying to achieve. Make a living, make money. He is SC2 pro, he had results, he wasnt satisfied how he end up, he wanted to leave. Period. Maybe he did not intend to , but he did anyway. And there are 2 reasons why it happened 1. Jessica trusted J but J screwed everyone over. Which NOTE THIS! Jessica apologized in team meeting, in first interview, and in second interview. 2. MMA did not trust someone who brought him to the esports scene at the first place and trusted some random guy who said Boxer and Jessica are screwing him over. Which NOTE THIS, even now MMA did not apologize about it in any sense! Jessica did not push away this part of blame. Nobody said Jessica is clean. But the players need to shoulder their part of the blame/responsibility as well. Its not her own fault. Jessica's fault cannot be avoided because J intended to screw up the team and grab players. Its a conspirarcy and she is a victim.However MMA's fault can easily be avoided if he had trusted Boxer, who , I dunno if anyone disagrees with this point, has a huge amount of credibility in the esports scene. (This guy formed 3 clans 2 in bw 1 in wol please) Of course MMA is at fault. Happy to answer such a calm and collected post. One question though, dont you think that Jessica deciding to go public did more harm to Boxer? I mean she just could call out the bluff on ESF, and end with it. Sure MMA is at fault, but her methods on doing things arent any better really. She doesnt seem like a sound manager anyway. What did she achieve with all this stuff in public? Slayers disbanded, she left. Whats the point? This is the question which no one could answer for me persuasively. All along she wanted players and entities whom she considers to be at fault to give a honest recollection of the events and apologize for mistakes on their part. My guess is because she wants to preserve Boxer's imagine in eSports (Slayers disbanded because so and so fucked up as opposed to Slayers disbanded because Boxer jumped ship to SKT); probably emotional involvement is there as well, as both her and Boxer invested a LOT of their time, money, and careers into making Slayers happen, only to see it undermined by others' selfishness and greed. She made some questionable decisions, there's no denying that - but there's also no denying that she was the one running the team that produced multiple championships both in team and individual leagues. There's no way she is anywhere remotely as bad as these forums make her out to be, and her aggressive criticism of players and eSF in this situation are, to me, very normal.
Agreed. However, MMA is still in pursuing a career, Starcraft 2, and even though he didnt show expected respect to Jessica and Boxer, in my eyes, he didnt deserve so much hits on his reputation. All of Korea are now blaming him and Crank, while he was only a part of the reason of Slayers downfall.
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On October 25 2012 03:35 NightOfTheDead wrote:Show nested quote +On October 25 2012 03:25 Salazarz wrote:On October 25 2012 03:14 NightOfTheDead wrote:On October 25 2012 03:04 Xiaopewpew wrote:On October 25 2012 02:57 NightOfTheDead wrote:On October 25 2012 02:46 Salazarz wrote:
On a side note, MMA had known Boxer for much, much longer than 2 years, and owes Boxer a lot outside of Slayers. He's been introduced to SKT by Boxer, and when that didn't work out for him, it was Boxer who brought him into Starcraft 2 and team Slayers. Without Boxer, MMA would almost certainly never even become a progamer. You make good point, but i dont think MMA was intently trying to hurt Boxer. He had some good achievements in SC2, and wanted to make his career even better. All this talk about money-grabbing is BS, cause that's what players trying to achieve. Make a living, make money. He is SC2 pro, he had results, he wasnt satisfied how he end up, he wanted to leave. Period. Maybe he did not intend to , but he did anyway. And there are 2 reasons why it happened 1. Jessica trusted J but J screwed everyone over. Which NOTE THIS! Jessica apologized in team meeting, in first interview, and in second interview. 2. MMA did not trust someone who brought him to the esports scene at the first place and trusted some random guy who said Boxer and Jessica are screwing him over. Which NOTE THIS, even now MMA did not apologize about it in any sense! Jessica did not push away this part of blame. Nobody said Jessica is clean. But the players need to shoulder their part of the blame/responsibility as well. Its not her own fault. Jessica's fault cannot be avoided because J intended to screw up the team and grab players. Its a conspirarcy and she is a victim.However MMA's fault can easily be avoided if he had trusted Boxer, who , I dunno if anyone disagrees with this point, has a huge amount of credibility in the esports scene. (This guy formed 3 clans 2 in bw 1 in wol please) Of course MMA is at fault. Happy to answer such a calm and collected post. One question though, dont you think that Jessica deciding to go public did more harm to Boxer? I mean she just could call out the bluff on ESF, and end with it. Sure MMA is at fault, but her methods on doing things arent any better really. She doesnt seem like a sound manager anyway. What did she achieve with all this stuff in public? Slayers disbanded, she left. Whats the point? This is the question which no one could answer for me persuasively. All along she wanted players and entities whom she considers to be at fault to give a honest recollection of the events and apologize for mistakes on their part. My guess is because she wants to preserve Boxer's imagine in eSports (Slayers disbanded because so and so fucked up as opposed to Slayers disbanded because Boxer jumped ship to SKT); probably emotional involvement is there as well, as both her and Boxer invested a LOT of their time, money, and careers into making Slayers happen, only to see it undermined by others' selfishness and greed. She made some questionable decisions, there's no denying that - but there's also no denying that she was the one running the team that produced multiple championships both in team and individual leagues. There's no way she is anywhere remotely as bad as these forums make her out to be, and her aggressive criticism of players and eSF in this situation are, to me, very normal. Agreed. However, MMA is still in pursuing a career, Starcraft 2, and even though he didnt show expected respect to Jessica and Boxer, in my eyes, he didnt deserve so much hits on his reputation. All of Korea are now blaming him and Crank, while he was only a part of the reason of Slayers downfall.
All he had to do was say, "I am sorry I acted rashly and let down Boxer, Jessica, Ryu, and my team." Of course people would still be angry with him, but there would be no more said from Jessica's side, and everyone would forget anything happened in a week tops. Instead these guys wait around for the whole mess to get even worse, and continue fighting a losing battle for no real reason. Jessica has nothing to lose here - she already gave up on the team, and she obviously has little care left for these guys; it makes absolutely no sense for them not to just acknowledge their own mistakes and move on.
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EPT
