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Bashing of any sort will result in temp bans. |
On October 18 2012 01:35 silent_owl wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2012 01:10 red4ce wrote:On October 18 2012 01:04 zestzorb wrote:On October 18 2012 00:59 silent_owl wrote:On October 18 2012 00:55 Woizit wrote:On October 18 2012 00:46 Inori wrote:On October 18 2012 00:27 FFW_Rude wrote:On October 18 2012 00:25 Inori wrote:On October 18 2012 00:20 FFW_Rude wrote:On October 18 2012 00:18 Inori wrote:
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Oh please, is anybody seriously buying this "he did x, so now I don't want to play" bs?
MMA is just used as scapegoat and excuse. Why not ? Did you never have a passion that somebody crushed ? I've had a few situations where I was given a mild push into direction I was going to anyway. Then you are quite a lucky man. Whas this passion something you gave your WHOLE life ? People keep playing music instruments/painting after losing hands/sight. People keep racing cars after breaking every bone in their body. People keep on living after losing their whole family to disasters. Teachers keep on teaching to ungrateful shits, while getting severely underpaid. You're seriously going to tell me that something a 18 year old said is severe enough to call "crushing passion"? When a 18 year old is touted as a "son", I would give it consideration. Imagine a son telling his father that he doesn't trust him. This. Sounds to me like Boxer and Jessica should have kept all of this strictly business. Because they invested so much emotionally they end up hurt like this. And I can't find the post anymore that says that this seems to be about a difference in mentality between generations and I think that's true, to a certain extent. I think it's just a difference of general perspective. Boxer comes from the Kespa side which is all professional and extremely dedicated to working on the game itself. Most ESF players have admitted that they moved to SC2 to relax more. I think Boxer modeled Slayers after SKT T1, which went very well. Slayers was doing quite well earlier and there was a nice team atmosphere (remember when they won their first GSTL). Not sure what happened afterwards so it's become like this in the end. Probably a mixture of mismanagement, lack of communication, and inflated egos. I blame foreign money. Boxer's generation built up the BW proscene from the ground up, it was all or nothing. These SC2 kids, they see players in foreign countries half as good as them making twice the money even though Starcraft is supposedly Korea's game. In that regard it isn't too surprising to see MMA, Alicia and Crank act the way they did. Just my own thoughts, I know ESF teams are in bad places financially but from what I know, KESPA players earn quite the boatload.
That is why kespa is free from such kinds of dramas.
Kespa has their own set of dramas, btw. Not saying that kespa is conpletely drama-free in the least.
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On October 18 2012 01:39 mongmong wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2012 01:35 silent_owl wrote:On October 18 2012 01:10 red4ce wrote:On October 18 2012 01:04 zestzorb wrote:On October 18 2012 00:59 silent_owl wrote:On October 18 2012 00:55 Woizit wrote:On October 18 2012 00:46 Inori wrote:On October 18 2012 00:27 FFW_Rude wrote:On October 18 2012 00:25 Inori wrote:On October 18 2012 00:20 FFW_Rude wrote:
[quote]
Why not ? Did you never have a passion that somebody crushed ? I've had a few situations where I was given a mild push into direction I was going to anyway. Then you are quite a lucky man. Whas this passion something you gave your WHOLE life ? People keep playing music instruments/painting after losing hands/sight. People keep racing cars after breaking every bone in their body. People keep on living after losing their whole family to disasters. Teachers keep on teaching to ungrateful shits, while getting severely underpaid. You're seriously going to tell me that something a 18 year old said is severe enough to call "crushing passion"? When a 18 year old is touted as a "son", I would give it consideration. Imagine a son telling his father that he doesn't trust him. This. Sounds to me like Boxer and Jessica should have kept all of this strictly business. Because they invested so much emotionally they end up hurt like this. And I can't find the post anymore that says that this seems to be about a difference in mentality between generations and I think that's true, to a certain extent. I think it's just a difference of general perspective. Boxer comes from the Kespa side which is all professional and extremely dedicated to working on the game itself. Most ESF players have admitted that they moved to SC2 to relax more. I think Boxer modeled Slayers after SKT T1, which went very well. Slayers was doing quite well earlier and there was a nice team atmosphere (remember when they won their first GSTL). Not sure what happened afterwards so it's become like this in the end. Probably a mixture of mismanagement, lack of communication, and inflated egos. I blame foreign money. Boxer's generation built up the BW proscene from the ground up, it was all or nothing. These SC2 kids, they see players in foreign countries half as good as them making twice the money even though Starcraft is supposedly Korea's game. In that regard it isn't too surprising to see MMA, Alicia and Crank act the way they did. Just my own thoughts, I know ESF teams are in bad places financially but from what I know, KESPA players earn quite the boatload. Very very few. Majority of them barely earn minimum wage
Seriously? Oh that's pretty sad. That's why the mid-tier and lower players from Korean teams all want to go to foreign teams.
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On October 18 2012 01:38 Benjamin99 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2012 01:32 masterbreti wrote:
I think the really horrible part here is that if MMA says that Jessica was Lying, Then people will believe MMA just because. The fact is that People won't believe Jessica because for some reason they don't like her. She has tried her best under all these circumstances.
I know for a fact most of what she is saying is true, not only from speaking to SlayerS players, but from talking to other ESF players and their relationship with the SlayerS players. Jessica has been fairly truthful about everything. But people people want to not Believe what Jessica says, they will follow whatever MMA says because thats how they are.
That depresses me more than anything really. There is to many incidents to believe what Jessica is saying is the truth. Yea if one or 2 players had a problem with her then it might be the same but reading about all these problems it seems unlikely Jessica wasn't the main course for this.
I would just wait instead of passing judgement.
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On October 18 2012 01:27 vthree wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2012 01:23 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On October 18 2012 01:19 Roynalf wrote:
why league of legends???!??!?!! they are wasting all their multi tasking potential on game with single unit..... It's probably easier money. Imagine a LoL team of SlayerS players. Their multi-tasking and unit control is far superior to anyone who's only played LoL, and they've already been on a pro team for years... once they fully understand the interactions of the different champions, they'll just roll everyone. No. The games require different skills sets. Although there is some overlap, it would be like saying someone good in tennis will be good in squash. If you took a pro tennis player and have them play against someone random, that would be true. But even if a tennis pro switches and trains in squash, they might not reach pro levels.
Meh. As someone who's played tennis for a very long time, and teaches it... I understand pretty well the skillset required to play that game. And I also feel that there is a lot of overlap between tennis and racquetball or squash (I've played both). While I don't play racquetball or squash at a pro-level, some of my friends who have played for a very long time and need an opponent will give me a call.
And I'm not saying that these SC2 players are going to win everything the second they change over, but having their set of skills, plus their team atmosphere (and if they could continue training the way StarCraft pro-gamers did? O.O) and understanding how to analyze replays that's been incredibly refined over the years... I think they'd be kicking ass quite quickly. Maybe not as quickly as BW -> SC2, but there's clearly a reason why so many of these StarCraft pro-gamers are switching to LoL.
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On October 18 2012 01:35 silent_owl wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2012 01:10 red4ce wrote:On October 18 2012 01:04 zestzorb wrote:On October 18 2012 00:59 silent_owl wrote:On October 18 2012 00:55 Woizit wrote:On October 18 2012 00:46 Inori wrote:On October 18 2012 00:27 FFW_Rude wrote:On October 18 2012 00:25 Inori wrote:On October 18 2012 00:20 FFW_Rude wrote:On October 18 2012 00:18 Inori wrote:
[quote]
Oh please, is anybody seriously buying this "he did x, so now I don't want to play" bs?
MMA is just used as scapegoat and excuse. Why not ? Did you never have a passion that somebody crushed ? I've had a few situations where I was given a mild push into direction I was going to anyway. Then you are quite a lucky man. Whas this passion something you gave your WHOLE life ? People keep playing music instruments/painting after losing hands/sight. People keep racing cars after breaking every bone in their body. People keep on living after losing their whole family to disasters. Teachers keep on teaching to ungrateful shits, while getting severely underpaid. You're seriously going to tell me that something a 18 year old said is severe enough to call "crushing passion"? When a 18 year old is touted as a "son", I would give it consideration. Imagine a son telling his father that he doesn't trust him. This. Sounds to me like Boxer and Jessica should have kept all of this strictly business. Because they invested so much emotionally they end up hurt like this. And I can't find the post anymore that says that this seems to be about a difference in mentality between generations and I think that's true, to a certain extent. I think it's just a difference of general perspective. Boxer comes from the Kespa side which is all professional and extremely dedicated to working on the game itself. Most ESF players have admitted that they moved to SC2 to relax more. I think Boxer modeled Slayers after SKT T1, which went very well. Slayers was doing quite well earlier and there was a nice team atmosphere (remember when they won their first GSTL). Not sure what happened afterwards so it's become like this in the end. Probably a mixture of mismanagement, lack of communication, and inflated egos. I blame foreign money. Boxer's generation built up the BW proscene from the ground up, it was all or nothing. These SC2 kids, they see players in foreign countries half as good as them making twice the money even though Starcraft is supposedly Korea's game. In that regard it isn't too surprising to see MMA, Alicia and Crank act the way they did. Just my own thoughts, I know ESF teams are in bad places financially but from what I know, KESPA players earn quite the boatload.
Well, I think Startale is doing OK, LG-IM is obviously making bread, and FXO are doing pretty well.
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Looking forward to MMA's response.
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On October 18 2012 01:41 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2012 01:27 vthree wrote:On October 18 2012 01:23 DarkPlasmaBall wrote:On October 18 2012 01:19 Roynalf wrote:
why league of legends???!??!?!! they are wasting all their multi tasking potential on game with single unit..... It's probably easier money. Imagine a LoL team of SlayerS players. Their multi-tasking and unit control is far superior to anyone who's only played LoL, and they've already been on a pro team for years... once they fully understand the interactions of the different champions, they'll just roll everyone. No. The games require different skills sets. Although there is some overlap, it would be like saying someone good in tennis will be good in squash. If you took a pro tennis player and have them play against someone random, that would be true. But even if a tennis pro switches and trains in squash, they might not reach pro levels. Meh. As someone who's played tennis for a very long time, and teaches it... I understand pretty well the skillset required to play that game. And I also feel that there is a lot of overlap between tennis and racquetball or squash (I've played both). While I don't play racquetball or squash at a pro-level, some of my friends who have played for a very long time and need an opponent will give me a call. And I'm not saying that these SC2 players are going to win everything the second they change over, but having their set of skills, plus their team atmosphere (and if they could continue training the way StarCraft pro-gamers did? O.O) and understanding how to analyze replays that's been incredibly refined over the years... I think they'd be kicking ass quite quickly. Maybe not as quickly as BW -> SC2, but there's clearly a reason why so many of these StarCraft pro-gamers are switching to LoL.
Because LoL is easy...
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manager J: Jung "Garfield"' Chul
source: liquipedia
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On October 18 2012 01:35 silent_owl wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2012 01:10 red4ce wrote:On October 18 2012 01:04 zestzorb wrote:On October 18 2012 00:59 silent_owl wrote:On October 18 2012 00:55 Woizit wrote:On October 18 2012 00:46 Inori wrote:On October 18 2012 00:27 FFW_Rude wrote:On October 18 2012 00:25 Inori wrote:On October 18 2012 00:20 FFW_Rude wrote:On October 18 2012 00:18 Inori wrote:
[quote]
Oh please, is anybody seriously buying this "he did x, so now I don't want to play" bs?
MMA is just used as scapegoat and excuse. Why not ? Did you never have a passion that somebody crushed ? I've had a few situations where I was given a mild push into direction I was going to anyway. Then you are quite a lucky man. Whas this passion something you gave your WHOLE life ? People keep playing music instruments/painting after losing hands/sight. People keep racing cars after breaking every bone in their body. People keep on living after losing their whole family to disasters. Teachers keep on teaching to ungrateful shits, while getting severely underpaid. You're seriously going to tell me that something a 18 year old said is severe enough to call "crushing passion"? When a 18 year old is touted as a "son", I would give it consideration. Imagine a son telling his father that he doesn't trust him. This. Sounds to me like Boxer and Jessica should have kept all of this strictly business. Because they invested so much emotionally they end up hurt like this. And I can't find the post anymore that says that this seems to be about a difference in mentality between generations and I think that's true, to a certain extent. I think it's just a difference of general perspective. Boxer comes from the Kespa side which is all professional and extremely dedicated to working on the game itself. Most ESF players have admitted that they moved to SC2 to relax more. I think Boxer modeled Slayers after SKT T1, which went very well. Slayers was doing quite well earlier and there was a nice team atmosphere (remember when they won their first GSTL). Not sure what happened afterwards so it's become like this in the end. Probably a mixture of mismanagement, lack of communication, and inflated egos. I blame foreign money. Boxer's generation built up the BW proscene from the ground up, it was all or nothing. These SC2 kids, they see players in foreign countries half as good as them making twice the money even though Starcraft is supposedly Korea's game. In that regard it isn't too surprising to see MMA, Alicia and Crank act the way they did. Just my own thoughts, I know ESF teams are in bad places financially but from what I know, KESPA players earn quite the boatload.
They actually don't earn that much unless they're like star players. There's a whole article on it somewhere on TL but it sorta just shows otherwise.
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On October 18 2012 01:40 silent_owl wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2012 01:39 mongmong wrote:On October 18 2012 01:35 silent_owl wrote:On October 18 2012 01:10 red4ce wrote:On October 18 2012 01:04 zestzorb wrote:On October 18 2012 00:59 silent_owl wrote:On October 18 2012 00:55 Woizit wrote:On October 18 2012 00:46 Inori wrote:On October 18 2012 00:27 FFW_Rude wrote:On October 18 2012 00:25 Inori wrote:
[quote]
I've had a few situations where I was given a mild push into direction I was going to anyway. Then you are quite a lucky man. Whas this passion something you gave your WHOLE life ? People keep playing music instruments/painting after losing hands/sight. People keep racing cars after breaking every bone in their body. People keep on living after losing their whole family to disasters. Teachers keep on teaching to ungrateful shits, while getting severely underpaid. You're seriously going to tell me that something a 18 year old said is severe enough to call "crushing passion"? When a 18 year old is touted as a "son", I would give it consideration. Imagine a son telling his father that he doesn't trust him. This. Sounds to me like Boxer and Jessica should have kept all of this strictly business. Because they invested so much emotionally they end up hurt like this. And I can't find the post anymore that says that this seems to be about a difference in mentality between generations and I think that's true, to a certain extent. I think it's just a difference of general perspective. Boxer comes from the Kespa side which is all professional and extremely dedicated to working on the game itself. Most ESF players have admitted that they moved to SC2 to relax more. I think Boxer modeled Slayers after SKT T1, which went very well. Slayers was doing quite well earlier and there was a nice team atmosphere (remember when they won their first GSTL). Not sure what happened afterwards so it's become like this in the end. Probably a mixture of mismanagement, lack of communication, and inflated egos. I blame foreign money. Boxer's generation built up the BW proscene from the ground up, it was all or nothing. These SC2 kids, they see players in foreign countries half as good as them making twice the money even though Starcraft is supposedly Korea's game. In that regard it isn't too surprising to see MMA, Alicia and Crank act the way they did. Just my own thoughts, I know ESF teams are in bad places financially but from what I know, KESPA players earn quite the boatload. Very very few. Majority of them barely earn minimum wage Seriously? Oh that's pretty sad. That's why the mid-tier and lower players from Korean teams all want to go to foreign teams.
Indeed. Someone posted a listing of top KeSPA player earnings for Brood War before, and the vast majority of A-teamers earns much less than Stephano. Makes little difference whether you are eSF or KeSPA there, unless you are in NSH or something.
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A bit off-topic, but I have to make this statement:
Stop wishing for Dota 2 to take off in korea. It will NEVER happen, EVER!!
Sorry, but it is the truth.
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Such a shame that SlayerS became like this. Boxer and MMA was what made Slayers so enjoyable to watch
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Rip Slayers, now on to reading the drama !
Jessica sure likes to point fingers doesn't she ... Yet not a single one of them to herself intresting.
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On October 18 2012 01:24 silent_owl wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2012 01:23 NightOfTheDead wrote:
Until MMA himself makes a statement, dont believe anything that was written there. And if she uploads the hard evidence and conversation transcripts? I can't believe anyone would take MMA's word over BOXER's.
Have you been reading? Boxer is not painted in a very good light even from Jessica's point of view.
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On October 18 2012 01:30 Kaitokid wrote:
CoCa and Puzzle going to LoL surprises me the most wow... they were both so good.
There will always be movement between the games.
Anyway, a lot of us saw this coming and poor management & communication led to this.
Jessica, go back to acting darling because this type of business venture isn't for you.
I would really like to see what policies the Federation have set in motion.
The players are too accessible online and events. Add in the different languages and it's a complete nuisance to manage. Everyone is so concerned about poaching there really needs to be firmer stance on contracts and teams need to settle on a free agency period and terms acceptable.
All of this should be in writing.
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On October 18 2012 01:36 silent_owl wrote:
Man, I literally feel like breaking down right now. This is probably really really difficult on Boxer right now.
Not really he probably knew this was happening long long time ago. That's probably why he finally accepted T1 coaching position.
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On October 18 2012 01:31 Mortal wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2012 01:25 silent_owl wrote:On October 18 2012 01:24 Von wrote:On October 18 2012 01:01 silent_owl wrote:On October 18 2012 00:58 multiversed wrote:On October 18 2012 00:56 silent_owl wrote:On October 18 2012 00:53 multiversed wrote:
i'm going to start telling everyone that does something that i don't like that i'm going to sue them. i kind of like the absurdest vibe that gives off. people will know you are crazy and will be automatically intimidated. what an alpha shark. i mean really how many people has she threaten to sue? what is her record on cases? she must be a pretty high level sewer by now. If someone I trust and pay to help me tried to underhand me in my business, I'd sue the hell outta that person until that person has no money for himself, his father, mother, sons and daughters. i'm going to sue you. LOL! Your amusement at this situation is totally out of line. See you in court  I'll bring my tennis racquet. Lol. Kidding aside though, suing manager J seemed completely reasonable. He was a fraud, therefore you sue his ass. I'll see you on the golf course.
Don't forget to bring the shuttlecocks.
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Wow. Reading this shocked me. I had no idea that it was this bad. If players trust some random manager more than the guys that actually run the team, something went terribly wrong. Combined with the other things, I can see that Jessica just didn't have the energy to continue, which is totally understandable with this situations.
I really seems like those people (federation and manager j) just abused their power and damaged SlayerS. This is really sad, not just for esports, but in general. Such people shouldn't be allowed to run anything, but sadly, those are often the people who rise to the top of an organization.
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On October 18 2012 01:46 Condor Hero wrote:Show nested quote +On October 18 2012 01:36 silent_owl wrote:
Man, I literally feel like breaking down right now. This is probably really really difficult on Boxer right now. Not really he probably knew this was happening long long time ago. That's probably why he finally accepted T1 coaching position.
That's true and apparently he and Jessica discussed it at length. Still, it's like having a child that's terminally ill. You know it's coming and when the inevitable happens, it's still pretty difficult.
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On October 18 2012 01:43 jpak wrote:
A bit off-topic, but I have to make this statement:
Stop wishing for Dota 2 to take off in korea. It will NEVER happen, EVER!!
Sorry, but it is the truth.
And you believe that because of what reason? Sorry for derailing the thread.
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EPT
