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Bashing of any sort will result in temp bans. |
On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:On October 21 2012 23:46 farnham wrote:On October 21 2012 23:41 Ansinjunger wrote:
So Crank's statement doesn't have any "hard facts" like receipts, recordings, or replays, and people consider it a weak statement? As someone pointed out, the two statements largely coincide, except for Crank's talks with Boxer.
In any case, none of these boys had any reason to be covering their tracks and all that bs that Jessica does. If you can't see how she is acting out of spite while they just want to be free from this hateful situation, I don't know what will convince you short of Boxer selling her out, which is very unlikely. the crank statement only says that the atmosphere was bad, he tried to fix it but couldnt. it doesnt say what he saw as the problem and what he suggested if he suggested a payrise of 1000 percent that might have been good for morale but would have been hard for jessica and boxer to fund he blames that boxer was in the team house but didnt help them... help them with what? he needs to be specific also that short statement took them days to produce... looks like they edited out everything that could be countered by jessicas evidences He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen?
He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house.
I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real.
Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams.
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On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:On October 21 2012 23:46 farnham wrote:On October 21 2012 23:41 Ansinjunger wrote:
So Crank's statement doesn't have any "hard facts" like receipts, recordings, or replays, and people consider it a weak statement? As someone pointed out, the two statements largely coincide, except for Crank's talks with Boxer.
In any case, none of these boys had any reason to be covering their tracks and all that bs that Jessica does. If you can't see how she is acting out of spite while they just want to be free from this hateful situation, I don't know what will convince you short of Boxer selling her out, which is very unlikely. the crank statement only says that the atmosphere was bad, he tried to fix it but couldnt. it doesnt say what he saw as the problem and what he suggested if he suggested a payrise of 1000 percent that might have been good for morale but would have been hard for jessica and boxer to fund he blames that boxer was in the team house but didnt help them... help them with what? he needs to be specific also that short statement took them days to produce... looks like they edited out everything that could be countered by jessicas evidences He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams.
"I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera."
He was.
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On October 22 2012 04:43 bucckevin wrote:
I don't understand, what was so bad about the SlayerS environment? Crank said things needed to change and blamed Boxer, Jessica, and Cella for not doing anything. This was one of the most successful team in Korea, 2 GSL wins, 2 GSTL championship and one time runner up. They had acquired new talent and they were rapidly improving. They occupied 2 luxurious apartments in a wealthy neighborhood. They exercised by playing football and had other form of entertainment to keep them occupied when not playing/practicing SC2. They had a maid that came to cook and clean for them. They had a team van to take them places and often went out to eat.
When I look at everything, I can't blame anyone else but the players, specifically MMA and Crank. They ruined the mood and friendly atmosphere of the team. They affected other people around them with their negativity.
The players weren't practicing anymore, there wasn't enough discipline in the house, Cella is hardly a great leader, more of a casual friend and he was one of the few people there. When you have a bunch of friendly guys in a house with no boss anything goes. It is stressful because you know everyone should be practicing but no-one really has any authority to tell others what to do. All Crank wanted is for everyone to do what they were supposed to be doing. Boxer was supposed to help get the players focused again, but he couldn't at least in CranKs eyes.
You are right the team was spoiled and that was Cranks argument. But management did nothing about it.
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On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:On October 21 2012 23:46 farnham wrote:On October 21 2012 23:41 Ansinjunger wrote:
So Crank's statement doesn't have any "hard facts" like receipts, recordings, or replays, and people consider it a weak statement? As someone pointed out, the two statements largely coincide, except for Crank's talks with Boxer.
In any case, none of these boys had any reason to be covering their tracks and all that bs that Jessica does. If you can't see how she is acting out of spite while they just want to be free from this hateful situation, I don't know what will convince you short of Boxer selling her out, which is very unlikely. the crank statement only says that the atmosphere was bad, he tried to fix it but couldnt. it doesnt say what he saw as the problem and what he suggested if he suggested a payrise of 1000 percent that might have been good for morale but would have been hard for jessica and boxer to fund he blames that boxer was in the team house but didnt help them... help them with what? he needs to be specific also that short statement took them days to produce... looks like they edited out everything that could be countered by jessicas evidences He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was.
He might as well have meant that there was not enough practice, or no direction in terms of coaching. You know, maybe, just maybe he really had legitimate concerns?
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On October 22 2012 04:58 Conti wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:On October 21 2012 23:46 farnham wrote:On October 21 2012 23:41 Ansinjunger wrote:
So Crank's statement doesn't have any "hard facts" like receipts, recordings, or replays, and people consider it a weak statement? As someone pointed out, the two statements largely coincide, except for Crank's talks with Boxer.
In any case, none of these boys had any reason to be covering their tracks and all that bs that Jessica does. If you can't see how she is acting out of spite while they just want to be free from this hateful situation, I don't know what will convince you short of Boxer selling her out, which is very unlikely. the crank statement only says that the atmosphere was bad, he tried to fix it but couldnt. it doesnt say what he saw as the problem and what he suggested if he suggested a payrise of 1000 percent that might have been good for morale but would have been hard for jessica and boxer to fund he blames that boxer was in the team house but didnt help them... help them with what? he needs to be specific also that short statement took them days to produce... looks like they edited out everything that could be countered by jessicas evidences He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was. He might as well have meant that there was not enough practice, or no direction in terms of coaching. You know, maybe, just maybe he really had legitimate concerns?
I never said he didn't mean that, did I? Although it does seem unlikely, he can hardly expect more practice at home or at Axiom, not to mention coaching.
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On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:On October 21 2012 23:46 farnham wrote:On October 21 2012 23:41 Ansinjunger wrote:
So Crank's statement doesn't have any "hard facts" like receipts, recordings, or replays, and people consider it a weak statement? As someone pointed out, the two statements largely coincide, except for Crank's talks with Boxer.
In any case, none of these boys had any reason to be covering their tracks and all that bs that Jessica does. If you can't see how she is acting out of spite while they just want to be free from this hateful situation, I don't know what will convince you short of Boxer selling her out, which is very unlikely. the crank statement only says that the atmosphere was bad, he tried to fix it but couldnt. it doesnt say what he saw as the problem and what he suggested if he suggested a payrise of 1000 percent that might have been good for morale but would have been hard for jessica and boxer to fund he blames that boxer was in the team house but didnt help them... help them with what? he needs to be specific also that short statement took them days to produce... looks like they edited out everything that could be countered by jessicas evidences He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was.
I have to question everything he said. Is someone suppose to be there to motivate the players? Isn't it up to the players to motivate themselves? Whenever EG streams, I don't see anyone standing behind their back trying to motivate them. What about the practice routines? Was it too harsh? It couldn't have been too light because they were still having a lot of success. Maybe not in individual GSL but they were always the top team in EG cup, IPTL, etc. House atmosphere, that can be anything. If players like Crank, MMA, Alicia didn't have things go their way, of course the house atmosphere can go bad. Lets face it, these guys were just SPOILED BRATS.
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On October 22 2012 05:02 bucckevin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:On October 21 2012 23:46 farnham wrote:On October 21 2012 23:41 Ansinjunger wrote:
So Crank's statement doesn't have any "hard facts" like receipts, recordings, or replays, and people consider it a weak statement? As someone pointed out, the two statements largely coincide, except for Crank's talks with Boxer.
In any case, none of these boys had any reason to be covering their tracks and all that bs that Jessica does. If you can't see how she is acting out of spite while they just want to be free from this hateful situation, I don't know what will convince you short of Boxer selling her out, which is very unlikely. the crank statement only says that the atmosphere was bad, he tried to fix it but couldnt. it doesnt say what he saw as the problem and what he suggested if he suggested a payrise of 1000 percent that might have been good for morale but would have been hard for jessica and boxer to fund he blames that boxer was in the team house but didnt help them... help them with what? he needs to be specific also that short statement took them days to produce... looks like they edited out everything that could be countered by jessicas evidences He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was. I have to question everything he said. Is someone suppose to be there to motivate the players? Isn't it up to the players to motivate themselves? Whenever EG streams, I don't see anyone standing behind their back trying to motivate them. What about the practice routines? Was it too harsh? It couldn't have been too light because they were still having a lot of success. Maybe not in individual GSL but they were always the top team in EG cup, IPTL, etc. House atmosphere, that can be anything. If players like Crank, MMA, Alicia didn't have things go their way, of course the house atmosphere can go bad. Lets face it, these guys were just SPOILED BRATS.
Jessicas statement clearly explains that Cranks argument was lack of practice and discipline so his argument was that they were being spoiled.
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On October 22 2012 03:30 ImNightmare wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 03:29 Zocat wrote:On October 22 2012 03:07 m4inbrain wrote:On October 22 2012 03:05 Boonbag wrote:On October 22 2012 03:03 m4inbrain wrote:On October 22 2012 03:02 Boonbag wrote:On October 22 2012 03:00 m4inbrain wrote:On October 22 2012 02:56 Boonbag wrote:On October 22 2012 02:52 m4inbrain wrote:On October 22 2012 02:49 Boonbag wrote:
[quote]
Well I could give a nice list of fucked up things I've seen on an almost daily basis done to women in Korea. I don't know, to me the way men behaved over there was reaaaaaally fucked up. Well the time i spent in france convinced me that there is no french guy that actually can drive a car properly (not to mention, park). That does not mean that im right though. It may very well be that women are not treated equal to the women here, but you're way exaggerating, i think. I'm talking first hand experience and im no way exagerating shit. And I love how you guys compare stupid stuff to actually mistreating an entire class of people. Me too. I said the time i spent in france. After that my car looked like it fell into a meatgrinder. Of course i am exaggerating, but you were the one telling us that its "normal" for a woman to get beaten up by his bf over there. Thats by no means exaggerated, right? I never said "normal" I said it wasn't uncommon at night to witness a bf beating up his gf in the streets. If you don't get the difference... Okay, then tell me the difference between common and normal. Also: Well I could give a nice list of fucked up things I've seen on an almost daily basis done to women in Korea. I don't know, to me the way men behaved over there was reaaaaaally fucked up. "Almost daily basis" is not "uncommon", its "normal". common as in a frequency of happening jesus christ you're dumb Yeah. I don't know if there's a language barrier here, but common equals to "normal" in german. As you said. On a daily basis, and if you want to tell me that "on a daily basis" is different from "normal", i really don't get what you mean. Common is not "normal/normalerweise", but "häufig". Like "often" ("oft") as in it regularly happens, but it's not the norm. I'd say common is a bit more often than "often"  Good lord, german sounds like a tough language to pick up if you are a english only person
It's actually one of the easier(possibly easiest) languages to pick from english imo. English is a germanic language after all.
Back on actual topic though, I think it's really hard to lay blame on any one thing or person in a situation like this. Sure it's on the manager and coach to provide a good atmosphere that will help motivate the players, but ultimately it's also the players responsibility to be motivated and the players themselves that determine the mood of the team within that atmosphere. Very rarely does a problem ever have a single answer or cause.
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On October 22 2012 05:02 bucckevin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:On October 21 2012 23:46 farnham wrote:On October 21 2012 23:41 Ansinjunger wrote:
So Crank's statement doesn't have any "hard facts" like receipts, recordings, or replays, and people consider it a weak statement? As someone pointed out, the two statements largely coincide, except for Crank's talks with Boxer.
In any case, none of these boys had any reason to be covering their tracks and all that bs that Jessica does. If you can't see how she is acting out of spite while they just want to be free from this hateful situation, I don't know what will convince you short of Boxer selling her out, which is very unlikely. the crank statement only says that the atmosphere was bad, he tried to fix it but couldnt. it doesnt say what he saw as the problem and what he suggested if he suggested a payrise of 1000 percent that might have been good for morale but would have been hard for jessica and boxer to fund he blames that boxer was in the team house but didnt help them... help them with what? he needs to be specific also that short statement took them days to produce... looks like they edited out everything that could be countered by jessicas evidences He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was. I have to question everything he said. Is someone suppose to be there to motivate the players? Isn't it up to the players to motivate themselves? Whenever EG streams, I don't see anyone standing behind their back trying to motivate them. What about the practice routines? Was it too harsh? It couldn't have been too light because they were still having a lot of success. Maybe not in individual GSL but they were always the top team in EG cup, IPTL, etc. House atmosphere, that can be anything. If players like Crank, MMA, Alicia didn't have things go their way, of course the house atmosphere can go bad. Lets face it, these guys were just SPOILED BRATS.
Okay, I'll just have to ask: Who the hell are you that you know so much more about the inner workings of the Slayers house than we do?
You're making your conclusions on wild assumptions with nothing whatsoever to back those assumptions up, and then present them as facts. It's bizarre.
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Canada16217 Posts
On October 22 2012 04:43 bucckevin wrote:
I don't understand, what was so bad about the SlayerS environment? Crank said things needed to change and blamed Boxer, Jessica, and Cella for not doing anything. This was one of the most successful team in Korea, 2 GSL wins, 2 GSTL championship and one time runner up. They had acquired new talent and they were rapidly improving. They occupied 2 luxurious apartments in a wealthy neighborhood. They exercised by playing football and had other form of entertainment to keep them occupied when not playing/practicing SC2. They had a maid that came to cook and clean for them. They had a team van to take them places and often went out to eat.
When I look at everything, I can't blame anyone else but the players, specifically MMA and Crank. They ruined the mood and friendly atmosphere of the team. They affected other people around them with their negativity.
The team WAS successful, if they had continued success then they wouldn't have dis-banded. Poor management/whoever ran slayers did a poor job and this was the end result.
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On October 22 2012 05:05 herbie wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 05:02 bucckevin wrote:On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:On October 21 2012 23:46 farnham wrote:
[quote]
the crank statement only says that the atmosphere was bad, he tried to fix it but couldnt.
it doesnt say what he saw as the problem and what he suggested
if he suggested a payrise of 1000 percent that might have been good for morale but would have been hard for jessica and boxer to fund
he blames that boxer was in the team house but didnt help them... help them with what?
he needs to be specific
also that short statement took them days to produce... looks like they edited out everything
that could be countered by jessicas evidences He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was. I have to question everything he said. Is someone suppose to be there to motivate the players? Isn't it up to the players to motivate themselves? Whenever EG streams, I don't see anyone standing behind their back trying to motivate them. What about the practice routines? Was it too harsh? It couldn't have been too light because they were still having a lot of success. Maybe not in individual GSL but they were always the top team in EG cup, IPTL, etc. House atmosphere, that can be anything. If players like Crank, MMA, Alicia didn't have things go their way, of course the house atmosphere can go bad. Lets face it, these guys were just SPOILED BRATS. Jessicas statement clearly explains that Cranks argument was lack of practice and discipline so his argument was that they were being spoiled.
No it wasn't, Jessica's statement only says that due to various reasons practice for GSTL started to drop. Never did Crank argued that such a thing is bad, in fact he seems to be one of the persons that actively tried to not practice for it according to her statement. Please point me to where Crank argues they were being spoiled in Jessica's statement.
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On October 22 2012 05:05 herbie wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 05:02 bucckevin wrote:On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:On October 21 2012 23:46 farnham wrote:
[quote]
the crank statement only says that the atmosphere was bad, he tried to fix it but couldnt.
it doesnt say what he saw as the problem and what he suggested
if he suggested a payrise of 1000 percent that might have been good for morale but would have been hard for jessica and boxer to fund
he blames that boxer was in the team house but didnt help them... help them with what?
he needs to be specific
also that short statement took them days to produce... looks like they edited out everything
that could be countered by jessicas evidences He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was. I have to question everything he said. Is someone suppose to be there to motivate the players? Isn't it up to the players to motivate themselves? Whenever EG streams, I don't see anyone standing behind their back trying to motivate them. What about the practice routines? Was it too harsh? It couldn't have been too light because they were still having a lot of success. Maybe not in individual GSL but they were always the top team in EG cup, IPTL, etc. House atmosphere, that can be anything. If players like Crank, MMA, Alicia didn't have things go their way, of course the house atmosphere can go bad. Lets face it, these guys were just SPOILED BRATS. Jessicas statement clearly explains that Cranks argument was lack of practice and discipline so his argument was that they were being spoiled.
I think it's funny that the spoiled ones that went bad were the much older players in their mid to early 20s. Brown, Arthur, Dark, Miya appeared happy and were improving every time I saw them play... the practice and discipline couldn't have been that bad.
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On October 22 2012 05:11 bucckevin wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 05:05 herbie wrote:On October 22 2012 05:02 bucckevin wrote:On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:
[quote]
He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was. I have to question everything he said. Is someone suppose to be there to motivate the players? Isn't it up to the players to motivate themselves? Whenever EG streams, I don't see anyone standing behind their back trying to motivate them. What about the practice routines? Was it too harsh? It couldn't have been too light because they were still having a lot of success. Maybe not in individual GSL but they were always the top team in EG cup, IPTL, etc. House atmosphere, that can be anything. If players like Crank, MMA, Alicia didn't have things go their way, of course the house atmosphere can go bad. Lets face it, these guys were just SPOILED BRATS. Jessicas statement clearly explains that Cranks argument was lack of practice and discipline so his argument was that they were being spoiled. I think it's funny that the spoiled ones that went bad were the much older players in their mid to early 20s. Brown, Arthur, Dark, Miya appeared happy and were improving every time I saw them play... the practice and discipline couldn't have been that bad.
Its probably because the younger you are, the less ego one have. They are probably thinking "Im in my mid 20s and I have to listen to some guy? This is unbelievable argh!"
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On October 22 2012 05:01 Shival wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 04:58 Conti wrote:On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:On October 21 2012 23:46 farnham wrote:
[quote]
the crank statement only says that the atmosphere was bad, he tried to fix it but couldnt.
it doesnt say what he saw as the problem and what he suggested
if he suggested a payrise of 1000 percent that might have been good for morale but would have been hard for jessica and boxer to fund
he blames that boxer was in the team house but didnt help them... help them with what?
he needs to be specific
also that short statement took them days to produce... looks like they edited out everything
that could be countered by jessicas evidences He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was. He might as well have meant that there was not enough practice, or no direction in terms of coaching. You know, maybe, just maybe he really had legitimate concerns? I never said he didn't mean that, did I? Although it does seem unlikely, he can hardly expect more practice at home or at Axiom, not to mention coaching.
You can look at it from the opposite side, too: If in the end he preferred to train alone instead of in the Slayers house, it really says a whole lot about how bad the training regime over there really was.
Of course I have no idea if that's the case, I'm just kind of annoyed at the oversimplification of the issue that's being done here all over the place.  We know next to nothing about all the details of what happened, and yet here we are, wildly speculating and making even wilder assumptions based on random speculations. If we do that, it's no wonder that one half comes to the conclusion that Crank was a lazy ungrateful bastard, while the other half thinks that the Slayers house was the worst progaming house, ever. Neither is true, most likely.
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On October 22 2012 05:11 Shival wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 05:05 herbie wrote:On October 22 2012 05:02 bucckevin wrote:On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:
[quote]
He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was. I have to question everything he said. Is someone suppose to be there to motivate the players? Isn't it up to the players to motivate themselves? Whenever EG streams, I don't see anyone standing behind their back trying to motivate them. What about the practice routines? Was it too harsh? It couldn't have been too light because they were still having a lot of success. Maybe not in individual GSL but they were always the top team in EG cup, IPTL, etc. House atmosphere, that can be anything. If players like Crank, MMA, Alicia didn't have things go their way, of course the house atmosphere can go bad. Lets face it, these guys were just SPOILED BRATS. Jessicas statement clearly explains that Cranks argument was lack of practice and discipline so his argument was that they were being spoiled. No it wasn't, Jessica's statement only says that due to various reasons practice for GSTL started to drop. Never did Crank argued that such a thing is bad, in fact he seems to be one of the persons that actively tried to not practice for it according to her statement. Please point me to where Crank argues they were being spoiled in Jessica's statement.
I don't know what kinds of conversations they had, but Crank began to say that the atmosphere was giving him stress. In a situation where players had to concentrate and practice for the GSTL, he said players weren't listening and not playing games. Boxer was resting with shoulder problems at the time, but it seemed like he should be with the team so I sent him to the house to look over the players.
The main concern Crank brings up is practice and he brings it up again in his statement. He doesen't talk about living conditions or money. He is talking about the stress he was living under because no one was in control.
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On October 22 2012 04:42 Seiniyta wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 00:23 lilsusie wrote:On October 21 2012 23:46 farnham wrote:On October 21 2012 23:41 Ansinjunger wrote:
So Crank's statement doesn't have any "hard facts" like receipts, recordings, or replays, and people consider it a weak statement? As someone pointed out, the two statements largely coincide, except for Crank's talks with Boxer.
In any case, none of these boys had any reason to be covering their tracks and all that bs that Jessica does. If you can't see how she is acting out of spite while they just want to be free from this hateful situation, I don't know what will convince you short of Boxer selling her out, which is very unlikely. the crank statement only says that the atmosphere was bad, he tried to fix it but couldnt. it doesnt say what he saw as the problem and what he suggested if he suggested a payrise of 1000 percent that might have been good for morale but would have been hard for jessica and boxer to fund he blames that boxer was in the team house but didnt help them... help them with what? he needs to be specific also that short statement took them days to produce... looks like they edited out everything that could be countered by jessicas evidences He chose his words to make sure that no one else would get hurt. Obviously he's not going to be like "Boxer was actually doing X, Y and Z instead of doing A, B, C with us" because that would cause an even bigger ordeal. He's being politically very careful because he just wants people to know where he's coming from - Unlike Jessica, he's not looking to pick any more fights. Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer? Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? Even if all the facilities are there the social part can still hit you mentally a lot. I can see how Alicia doesn't like it that nobody picks him up at the airport after a long exhausting flight.
It was said before, that's a REALLY bullshit thing to whine about. Subway between Incheon International Airport and Seoul is very fast, convenient, and cheap; the airport itself is simple to navigate also and doesn't have the queues and bullshit you might be used to seeing in many Western airports. It really does take a pretty spoiled character to complain about something like that.
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On October 22 2012 05:10 NovemberstOrm wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 04:43 bucckevin wrote:
I don't understand, what was so bad about the SlayerS environment? Crank said things needed to change and blamed Boxer, Jessica, and Cella for not doing anything. This was one of the most successful team in Korea, 2 GSL wins, 2 GSTL championship and one time runner up. They had acquired new talent and they were rapidly improving. They occupied 2 luxurious apartments in a wealthy neighborhood. They exercised by playing football and had other form of entertainment to keep them occupied when not playing/practicing SC2. They had a maid that came to cook and clean for them. They had a team van to take them places and often went out to eat.
When I look at everything, I can't blame anyone else but the players, specifically MMA and Crank. They ruined the mood and friendly atmosphere of the team. They affected other people around them with their negativity. The team WAS successful, if they had continued success then they wouldn't have dis-banded. Poor management/whoever ran slayers did a poor job and this was the end result.
They were still successful if you ask me. Like I said before, maybe not in individual GSL leagues/code A-S but in team leagues, GSTL, IPTL, EG Masters Cup, they were very successful. Some of their accomplished players left and the major contributor to their success was in a slump and didn't want to be there. If they got rid of the cancer earlier, they could've survived.
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On October 22 2012 05:15 herbie wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 05:11 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 05:05 herbie wrote:On October 22 2012 05:02 bucckevin wrote:On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:On October 22 2012 00:25 Shival wrote:
[quote]
Since when is saying that Boxer joined the house but didn't take care of them, nor did anything for the team, nor practiced starcraft 2 not hurting Boxer?
Besides, if I were on the wrong side of the stick, I wouldn't be wanting to continue the fight either. What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him. I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was. I have to question everything he said. Is someone suppose to be there to motivate the players? Isn't it up to the players to motivate themselves? Whenever EG streams, I don't see anyone standing behind their back trying to motivate them. What about the practice routines? Was it too harsh? It couldn't have been too light because they were still having a lot of success. Maybe not in individual GSL but they were always the top team in EG cup, IPTL, etc. House atmosphere, that can be anything. If players like Crank, MMA, Alicia didn't have things go their way, of course the house atmosphere can go bad. Lets face it, these guys were just SPOILED BRATS. Jessicas statement clearly explains that Cranks argument was lack of practice and discipline so his argument was that they were being spoiled. No it wasn't, Jessica's statement only says that due to various reasons practice for GSTL started to drop. Never did Crank argued that such a thing is bad, in fact he seems to be one of the persons that actively tried to not practice for it according to her statement. Please point me to where Crank argues they were being spoiled in Jessica's statement. Show nested quote +I don't know what kinds of conversations they had, but Crank began to say that the atmosphere was giving him stress. In a situation where players had to concentrate and practice for the GSTL, he said players weren't listening and not playing games. Boxer was resting with shoulder problems at the time, but it seemed like he should be with the team so I sent him to the house to look over the players. The main concern Crank brings up is practice and he brings it up again in his statement. He doesen't talk about living conditions or money. He is talking about the stress he was living under because no one was in control.
Indeed, and according to the same statement you are refering to, one of the players that tried to actively avoid practice for the GSTL was Crank. Kind of ironic to complain about lack of practice no?
Although, apperantly he did need someone to keep things in line by that statement. Whether that's a reason to lie your way out of Slayers and burn your bridges. Not so sure.
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On October 22 2012 05:26 Shival wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 05:15 herbie wrote:On October 22 2012 05:11 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 05:05 herbie wrote:On October 22 2012 05:02 bucckevin wrote:On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah. This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now. On October 22 2012 00:30 lilsusie wrote:
[quote]
What if he said Boxer came to the house but was only playing Hello Kitty Adventure all day and ignoring the players? That would make it worse, no? And according to the recording, he didn't say that Boxer did nothing for him.
I'm not saying that Crank is 100% right but people are taking sides like they need to - when in fact, both sides basically had misunderstandings. I think that Crank could have handled it in a more mature way and I think Jessica is overly emotional, thus things blew up. You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was. I have to question everything he said. Is someone suppose to be there to motivate the players? Isn't it up to the players to motivate themselves? Whenever EG streams, I don't see anyone standing behind their back trying to motivate them. What about the practice routines? Was it too harsh? It couldn't have been too light because they were still having a lot of success. Maybe not in individual GSL but they were always the top team in EG cup, IPTL, etc. House atmosphere, that can be anything. If players like Crank, MMA, Alicia didn't have things go their way, of course the house atmosphere can go bad. Lets face it, these guys were just SPOILED BRATS. Jessicas statement clearly explains that Cranks argument was lack of practice and discipline so his argument was that they were being spoiled. No it wasn't, Jessica's statement only says that due to various reasons practice for GSTL started to drop. Never did Crank argued that such a thing is bad, in fact he seems to be one of the persons that actively tried to not practice for it according to her statement. Please point me to where Crank argues they were being spoiled in Jessica's statement. I don't know what kinds of conversations they had, but Crank began to say that the atmosphere was giving him stress. In a situation where players had to concentrate and practice for the GSTL, he said players weren't listening and not playing games. Boxer was resting with shoulder problems at the time, but it seemed like he should be with the team so I sent him to the house to look over the players. The main concern Crank brings up is practice and he brings it up again in his statement. He doesen't talk about living conditions or money. He is talking about the stress he was living under because no one was in control. Indeed, and according to the same statement you are refering to, one of the players that tried to actively avoid practice for the GSTL was Crank. Kind of ironic to complain about lack of practice no? Although, apperantly he did need someone to keep things in line by that statement. Whether that's a reason to lie your way out of Slayers and burn your bridges. Not so sure.
He wasn't ever going to play in the GSTL...
He already decided to leave at that point..
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On October 22 2012 05:30 herbie wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2012 05:26 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 05:15 herbie wrote:On October 22 2012 05:11 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 05:05 herbie wrote:On October 22 2012 05:02 bucckevin wrote:On October 22 2012 04:50 Shival wrote:On October 22 2012 04:47 toadstool wrote:On October 22 2012 04:26 sekritzzz wrote:On October 22 2012 04:11 WhiteDog wrote:
I don't understand Crank's point of view at all. Like the team practice was bad ? What exactly ? Slayers was one of the most successful and one of the team with the most relaxed team environment. We even got video from Slayer players playing some random game like ninja turtle, and smiling, I don't see any team problem in there. Now of course he "rediscovered his passion for starcraft" thanks for axiom... blah.
This statement from axiom give nothing more and doesn't do anything to deny Jessica's arguments until now.
[quote]
You cannot ask people to be completly impartial in this because, no matter what, Crank found himself a team and a salary - something he would never have had before with his level (code B player) - while the Slayers team is no more. If anything cranks statement only re-enforced what Jessica was saying all along. These kids are spoilt brats. Im happy boxer left them actually, they dont deserve his experience and advice. Alicia whining about not being picked up from the airport (if i remember correctly) and crank whining about the condition when slayers is/was easily the most funded team, so I can only expect them to be in the top tier in terms of condition/training regime alongside IM. Honestly, I don't even get crank's whines, look at how many superstars slayers brought out. Who was Alicia, ryung, mma, crank, coca before slayers? How can anyone whine about slayers training regimen? He wasn't whining abt the training regime, he was complaining about the bad 'conditions' and lack of care at the house. I personally feel sorry for all the players involved. I can imagine the shitstorm they go through when they lose a gstl game and Jessica goes off at them judging from the way she's going off at all slights against her in the past, imagined or real. Good luck crank, mma and alicia in their future teams, hopefully they find good teams. "I felt for a while that Jessica, Boxer and coach Cella were not taking proper care of the team, in terms of motivation, practice routines, house atmosphere, etcetera." He was. I have to question everything he said. Is someone suppose to be there to motivate the players? Isn't it up to the players to motivate themselves? Whenever EG streams, I don't see anyone standing behind their back trying to motivate them. What about the practice routines? Was it too harsh? It couldn't have been too light because they were still having a lot of success. Maybe not in individual GSL but they were always the top team in EG cup, IPTL, etc. House atmosphere, that can be anything. If players like Crank, MMA, Alicia didn't have things go their way, of course the house atmosphere can go bad. Lets face it, these guys were just SPOILED BRATS. Jessicas statement clearly explains that Cranks argument was lack of practice and discipline so his argument was that they were being spoiled. No it wasn't, Jessica's statement only says that due to various reasons practice for GSTL started to drop. Never did Crank argued that such a thing is bad, in fact he seems to be one of the persons that actively tried to not practice for it according to her statement. Please point me to where Crank argues they were being spoiled in Jessica's statement. I don't know what kinds of conversations they had, but Crank began to say that the atmosphere was giving him stress. In a situation where players had to concentrate and practice for the GSTL, he said players weren't listening and not playing games. Boxer was resting with shoulder problems at the time, but it seemed like he should be with the team so I sent him to the house to look over the players. The main concern Crank brings up is practice and he brings it up again in his statement. He doesen't talk about living conditions or money. He is talking about the stress he was living under because no one was in control. Indeed, and according to the same statement you are refering to, one of the players that tried to actively avoid practice for the GSTL was Crank. Kind of ironic to complain about lack of practice no? Although, apperantly he did need someone to keep things in line by that statement. Whether that's a reason to lie your way out of Slayers and burn your bridges. Not so sure. He wasn't ever going to play in the GSTL... He already decided to leave at that point..
Indeed, and how was that communicated to the team?
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EPT
