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As emotionally invested as people are on this topic, TL rules still apply. That includes flaming and ad hominem attacks. |
On August 30 2012 11:59 valium wrote:
That would be hypocritical; casters and players keep telling the fans to contact companies when they do things that help the esports community to let them know it is appreciated. Now the tables have turned; that very advice was taken, people are contacting these companies when players they sponsor do things they do not like.
Was this reaction excessive? In my opinion, yes... but I will not condemn those who did contact the sponsors.
I hope you lose your job when you talk about a person that has flirted with you to your friends that you don't find attractive. 
Oh wait you won't because offline no one would give a flying fuck, except the law in which she broke it not him. What he did was disgusting and reprehensible to be sure. I am like 90% sure she broke the law, and if she didn't laws need to created to protect people from this kind of slander. Imagine this on a larger scale, Rihanna and one of her fans have a small one night stand and took pictures and shit she shows her friends the picture and they all laugh because after whatever happened happened she thought he was gross maybe tried some freaky stuff who knows. this gets leaked or at the very least he finds out so he goes online and breaks into her twitter and facebook to show the whole world her naked body. Tell me what you think of my hypothetical situation. Even though Rihanna mocked this guy and she was REALLY mean, I honestly doubt for even a second the record label would drop her or that she would get any backlash at all. All of you that are saying she isn't wrong in any way are all white knights hypocriting your way to killing entertainment values across the board.
TL/DR Destiny was wrong even to the point as an avid fan I am slightly grossed out, however anyone who thinks he should get humiliated in front of the internet and then lose his job on top of it, I have to believe that there is something seriously wrong with you.
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On August 30 2012 12:09 oBlade wrote:Show nested quote +On August 30 2012 12:05 Dundron2000 wrote:On August 30 2012 12:02 oBlade wrote:On August 30 2012 12:02 Dundron2000 wrote:On August 30 2012 11:55 oBlade wrote:On August 30 2012 11:45 Dundron2000 wrote:On August 30 2012 11:37 oBlade wrote:On August 30 2012 11:26 iky43210 wrote:On August 30 2012 11:22 oBlade wrote:On August 30 2012 11:17 Dundron2000 wrote:
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the expectation of privacy is a mistake and nothing that should be assumed. thats not my opinion thats how things are. he's a public figure on a team whose revenue is dependent on sponsorships therefore what he does in private could have consequences for him. Yes, it's pragmatic to be wary of the fact that there could always be someone watching. I was speaking ethically, that's why I said "ethical," so unless you're going to take the position that people shouldn't have privacy, you haven't contradicted me, just dodged the point. Your analysis is on the level of "well watch out, sometimes if you go outside, you might get shot." That doesn't mean people are going to stop going outside, or that we should stop working to fix our society so we don't shoot people. all the while you may not care but other people may No, why should anyone care? What's the reason? Your argument is someone should lose his job just because he did something in private, someone violated that privacy, and someone else... cared? there is no privacy for people working in the entertaining industry, don't work in that field if it bothers you that much. I literally just said: Yes, it's pragmatic to be wary of the fact that there could always be someone watching. That doesn't mean we have to give tattle-tales with a grudge such free reign to hurt people's careers. On August 30 2012 11:28 Dundron2000 wrote:On August 30 2012 11:22 oBlade wrote:On August 30 2012 11:17 Dundron2000 wrote:
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the expectation of privacy is a mistake and nothing that should be assumed. thats not my opinion thats how things are. he's a public figure on a team whose revenue is dependent on sponsorships therefore what he does in private could have consequences for him. Yes, it's pragmatic to be wary of the fact that there could always be someone watching. I was speaking ethically, that's why I said "ethical," so unless you're going to take the position that people shouldn't have privacy, you haven't contradicted me, just dodged the point. Your analysis is on the level of "well watch out, sometimes if you go outside, you might get shot." That doesn't mean people are going to stop going outside, or that we should stop working to fix our society so we don't shoot people. all the while you may not care but other people may No, why should anyone care? What's the reason? Your argument is someone should lose his job just because he did something in private, someone violated that privacy, and someone else... cared? i'm not terribly interested in presenting my own view of why i feel its morally wrong for a "public" figure to do what destiny did or why im interested in setting a standard for professionalism in e-sports. my original point was that Fayth wanted to make the distinction between his public and private actions while i argued that it was non-sensical for him to think that such a distinction existed since his private actions could become public creating negative consequences that he should expect. he could also have moral reasons for not being an asshole i just didn't feel like appealing to that side would do much good seeing his replies earlier in the thread. Your view of professionalism seems to be based around an idea of phantom "negative consequences" which involve a vocal minority that isn't part of the community writing enough angry letters to get someone ejected from a team. If you can't elaborate, this is untenable. i didn't say that, i said i'm not going to put forward my viewpoint because who gives a shit. you can find it as untenable as you want. having said that negative consequences are not a phantom idea they are a concrete concept, apparent by the fact the Destiny has in fact been fired. You have such confidence in your opinion you're going to withhold it from a discussion? You're not reading. I have explained 50 times that it's obvious bad shit happens. That's an observation, it's not an argument. You have yet to explain why it is at all fair or sensible that random people, disconnected from the actual scene, are allowed to single out innocuous behavior from someone they don't know and don't follow, write to a random sponsor they don't know or follow, and complain so much that they take his job? Is this to defend your nebulous idea of professionalism? What good is this doing for anybody? Why should this happen? Can you answer anything? an observation can be an argument. it could even be called a fact. can i answer anything? no not really, and i don't think i ever gave you any other impression. i like your use of the word nebulous though. That specific observation is not an argument. you had good questions why don't you answer them while i go sleep. There are probably good arguments against my position, but instead taking a stab at coming up with an argument and presenting it here, you're trying to play a rhetorical trick in front of the "audience" by getting some last word in, without clarifying or justifying the things you've said. How have I let you lead me on for so long, while you said so little every step of the way?
no dude i just dont want to argue but you keep reading so much into my replies its hilarious. you can have the last word. im sorry.
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Have I said negative things behind poeple's back? Yes I have, but I also recognize it is a terrible thing to do, I am a flawed human being. I would not get indignant about it if it were ever made public, I would admit I was wrong to do so, and it would be genuine. I also go faster than the speed limit, if i am ever caught I will pay the speeding ticket, I will not pass the blame on to the cop.
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i think the punishment on Fayth and TTOne a bit random since it's basically just a group of friends talking shit and the content got leaked out.
As far as I know, talking shit in their own personal private conversation is completely acceptable, unless it is about some illegal activities or cheating in tournaments etc
Why would they get punished for stating their opinion on a girl's face?
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On August 30 2012 12:03 ROOTFayth wrote:Show nested quote +On August 30 2012 11:55 nikoYO wrote:On August 30 2012 11:52 ROOTFayth wrote:On August 30 2012 11:49 EnE wrote:On August 30 2012 11:47 iky43210 wrote:On August 30 2012 11:41 ROOTFayth wrote:On August 30 2012 11:39 iky43210 wrote:On August 30 2012 11:37 ROOTFayth wrote:On August 30 2012 11:36 iky43210 wrote:On August 30 2012 11:35 ROOTFayth wrote:
[quote]
privately* what privately, you just criticize her a few more times few pages ago I just reiterated what was already public..... I mean yeah just because this has been made public didn't change my opinion on her looks, I'm sorry, and I also told her that when we discussed on skype while she was on steven's account you're not sorry, you're just a douche bag. At least have the decency to apologize for your criticism now that its public we get it, you're an unlikable ass. Nobody wants to hear your newly iteration of why someone is ugly yeah sure I'm a douchebag because I don't think a girl is good looking whatever floats ur boat man -_- you went past the point of stating someone is not good looking, and keep your disrespectful and inconsiderate criticism on someone's look to yourself. Yeah. Thinking someone isn't good looking =/= saying attrociously hurtful things about them on a forum to accompany their picture. lots of people made fun of my looks back in 2005 on a really bad wcg picture of myself nobody on TL was criticized for it 0 fucks was given by me oh wow. how blind can you be? she obv hurt or else she wouldnt have posted dick pics on twitter? why are you doing this to CatZ / ROOT? they needed to get rid of destiny it seems you want to be next. she's hurt by destiny betraying her trust, not by some random guy (me) saying she's not attractive........
mhm i think you really dont get it do you? YOU MAKE YOURSELF LOOK LIKE A SCUMBAG. just stop posting pls. you make root look even more like the "hey lets all be douchebags and assholes team" its really sad man.
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On August 30 2012 12:09 Sylverin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 30 2012 11:59 valium wrote:
That would be hypocritical; casters and players keep telling the fans to contact companies when they do things that help the esports community to let them know it is appreciated. Now the tables have turned; that very advice was taken, people are contacting these companies when players they sponsor do things they do not like.
Was this reaction excessive? In my opinion, yes... but I will not condemn those who did contact the sponsors. I hope you lose your job when you talk about a person that has flirted with you to your friends that you don't find attractive. Oh wait you won't because offline no one would give a flying fuck, except the law in which she broke it not him. What he did was disgusting and reprehensible to be sure. I am like 90% sure she broke the law, and if she didn't laws need to created to protect people from this kind of slander. Imagine this on a larger scale, Rihanna and one of her fans have a small one night stand and took pictures and shit she shows her friends the picture and they all laugh because after whatever happened happened she thought he was gross maybe tried some freaky stuff who knows. this gets leaked or at the very least he finds out so he goes online and breaks into her twitter and facebook to show the whole world her naked body. Tell me what you think of my hypothetical situation. Even though Rihanna mocked this guy and she was REALLY mean, I honestly doubt for even a second the record label would drop her or that she would get any backlash at all. All of you that are saying she isn't wrong in any way are all white knights hypocriting your way to killing entertainment values across the board. TL/DR Destiny was wrong even to the point as an avid fan I am slightly grossed out, however anyone who thinks he should get humiliated in front of the internet and then lose his job on top of it, I have to believe that there is something seriously wrong with you.
No one should but hey don't blame the fire, blame the person who started the fire.
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Fayth play me in a bo5 as charity for the community.
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Also very funny to note is that people are attacking ROOTFayth for saying the girls ugly. Hell this conversation was PRIVATE, it was NOT meant to be public. So what exactly did he do wrong? He is a douchebag for saying his opionion on a looks of a girl? I really dont get this srsly. Tell me WHAT is wrong about saying your true opinion? You never judged about the looks of someone? Acutally this thread is really showing the hypocrit nature of mankind and it makes me sad.
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On August 30 2012 12:10 valium wrote:
Have I said negative things behind poeple's back? Yes I have, but I also recognize it is a terrible thing to do, I am a flawed human being. I would not get indignant about it if it were ever made public, I would admit I was wrong to do so, and it would be genuine. I also go faster than the speed limit, if i am ever caught I will pay the speeding ticket, I will not pass the blame on to the cop.
If someone caught you in the act would you apologize profusely, swear it'll never happen again, accept and welcome the scorn of hundreds of people? Or would you think that the response is a bit unfair because you never meant for it to get out in the open, you only got caught when someone shoved a huge-ass microphone in your house.
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On August 30 2012 12:09 Sylverin wrote:Show nested quote +On August 30 2012 11:59 valium wrote:
That would be hypocritical; casters and players keep telling the fans to contact companies when they do things that help the esports community to let them know it is appreciated. Now the tables have turned; that very advice was taken, people are contacting these companies when players they sponsor do things they do not like.
Was this reaction excessive? In my opinion, yes... but I will not condemn those who did contact the sponsors. Imagine this on a larger scale, Rihanna and one of her fans have a small one night stand and took pictures and shit she shows her friends the picture and they all laugh because after whatever happened happened she thought he was gross maybe tried some freaky stuff who knows. this gets leaked or at the very least he finds out so he goes online and breaks into her twitter and facebook to show the whole world her naked body. Tell me what you think of my hypothetical situation. Even though Rihanna mocked this guy and she was REALLY mean, I honestly doubt for even a second the record label would drop her or that she would get any backlash at all. All of you that are saying she isn't wrong in any way are all white knights hypocriting your way to killing entertainment values across the board.
Eh...there is an entire website called TMZ that exists solely because of the scenarios you describe.
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On August 30 2012 11:56 Aerisky wrote:
Unless my facts are terribly wrong, Destiny shared nude pictures of that girl in private to a few friends, who made several very bad comments. The girl found out and took revenge by basically making the entire thing public, essentially ending Destiny (whom I've never liked, but this honestly matters little)'s career with ROOT. And yet people still blame taking it public and load the whole thing on Destiny, Fayth, and TT1. What the girl did was far worse. It doesn't mean what Destiny did, nor does it make what his teammates' privately commented (which had never been intended for the public and was just between friends), any less sleazy (or whatever you want to call it). But at this point it's rather silly to verbally abuse them when they're already down, so to speak, and distort the facts just to insult them more when the situation has been made clear.
If you stab me and I shoot you who do you think is more in the wrong, in your opinion and not legally? Human beings love a little payback and especially so to people they don't like so this is a great story. ROOT/CatZ should have seen some problem with Destiny happening sooner or later and although it was a private conversation it was pretty obvious to everyone who's read anything about Destiny that this is just who he is.
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The worst thing about drama like this is that an audience is its only source of fuel, without that it would die out pretty quick. It's the hundreds of dumbasses that decided to enact "justice" by emailing sponsors only escalate this.
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On August 30 2012 12:10 nikoYO wrote:Show nested quote +On August 30 2012 12:03 ROOTFayth wrote:On August 30 2012 11:55 nikoYO wrote:On August 30 2012 11:52 ROOTFayth wrote:On August 30 2012 11:49 EnE wrote:On August 30 2012 11:47 iky43210 wrote:On August 30 2012 11:41 ROOTFayth wrote:On August 30 2012 11:39 iky43210 wrote:On August 30 2012 11:37 ROOTFayth wrote:On August 30 2012 11:36 iky43210 wrote:
[quote]
what privately, you just criticize her a few more times few pages ago I just reiterated what was already public..... I mean yeah just because this has been made public didn't change my opinion on her looks, I'm sorry, and I also told her that when we discussed on skype while she was on steven's account you're not sorry, you're just a douche bag. At least have the decency to apologize for your criticism now that its public we get it, you're an unlikable ass. Nobody wants to hear your newly iteration of why someone is ugly yeah sure I'm a douchebag because I don't think a girl is good looking whatever floats ur boat man -_- you went past the point of stating someone is not good looking, and keep your disrespectful and inconsiderate criticism on someone's look to yourself. Yeah. Thinking someone isn't good looking =/= saying attrociously hurtful things about them on a forum to accompany their picture. lots of people made fun of my looks back in 2005 on a really bad wcg picture of myself nobody on TL was criticized for it 0 fucks was given by me oh wow. how blind can you be? she obv hurt or else she wouldnt have posted dick pics on twitter? why are you doing this to CatZ / ROOT? they needed to get rid of destiny it seems you want to be next. she's hurt by destiny betraying her trust, not by some random guy (me) saying she's not attractive........ mhm i think you really dont get it do you? YOU MAKE YOURSELF LOOK LIKE A SCUMBAG. just stop posting pls. you make root look even more like the "hey lets all be douchebags and assholes team" its really sad man.
Yeah, I kinda have to agree, dude. Reading how much you have invested in this tread has made me feel bad about how ROOT is represented in this situation. TT1 has at least stayed relatively quiet about the whole thing and is not making a huge deal out of it. Don't get caught up in the TL drama shitstorm, because honestly, they will fuck you over if you arent careful.
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On August 30 2012 12:12 zidaneshead wrote:Show nested quote +On August 30 2012 12:10 valium wrote:
Have I said negative things behind poeple's back? Yes I have, but I also recognize it is a terrible thing to do, I am a flawed human being. I would not get indignant about it if it were ever made public, I would admit I was wrong to do so, and it would be genuine. I also go faster than the speed limit, if i am ever caught I will pay the speeding ticket, I will not pass the blame on to the cop. If someone caught you in the act would you apologize profusely, swear it'll never happen again, accept and welcome the scorn of hundreds of people? Or would you think that the response is a bit unfair because you never meant for it to get out in the open, you only got caught when someone shoved a huge-ass microphone in your house.
I should not be saying these things in the first place, it is not a nice thing to do. Shame on me for talking behind people's back.
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On August 30 2012 12:13 CrazyF1r3f0x wrote:
The worst thing about drama like this is that an audience is its only source of fuel, without that it would die out pretty quick. It's the hundreds of dumbasses that decided to enact "justice" by emailing sponsors only escalate this.
Welcome to the internet, good sir. Where armchair police run rampant!
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On August 30 2012 12:10 valium wrote:
Have I said negative things behind poeple's back? Yes I have, but I also recognize it is a terrible thing to do, I am a flawed human being. I would not get indignant about it if it were ever made public, I would admit I was wrong to do so, and it would be genuine. I also go faster than the speed limit, if i am ever caught I will pay the speeding ticket, I will not pass the blame on to the cop.
If I have an opinion, express that opinion, and that opinion gets revealed to people who are offended by that opinion, I will not fucking apologize for said opinion.
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On August 30 2012 12:02 ROOTT1 wrote:
i feel like i have to counter all this negativity by doing something positive for the community, i dunno wat to do tho
You should do a charity streaming marathon for Doctors without Borders.
Then when you are caught doing immoral/ nasty/ inappropriate things, you can use such lousy arguments as "But I gave to charity. Do Samaritans do bad things?"
Oh wait.. that has already been done before... I forgot whom...
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I feel so sad for destiny. I really hope he is not to sad. Without Destiny Root would have been nothing.
Sure Destiny can be an asshole, but thats why we love him.
Because he's the hero the sc2 scene deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So we'll hunt him, because he can take it. Because he's not the hero. He's a silent guardian, watchful protector. The Dark Knight.
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At this point the best thing to do for Destiny would be to stop interacting with the community, go to the ministry of win, and practice his ass off to get results. People tend to forgive/forget bad things if you are a winner, but considering Destiny has both bad results AND bad drama where he's pretty much at fault is uber bad for him.
Either that or he can just go into professional streaming, but I don't think that'd work out in the long run. Actually, not sure if practicing will either. His rep is so damaged not sure if comeback is possible. At the very least no team will touch him with a 21 foot pike.
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On August 30 2012 12:14 valium wrote:Show nested quote +On August 30 2012 12:12 zidaneshead wrote:On August 30 2012 12:10 valium wrote:
Have I said negative things behind poeple's back? Yes I have, but I also recognize it is a terrible thing to do, I am a flawed human being. I would not get indignant about it if it were ever made public, I would admit I was wrong to do so, and it would be genuine. I also go faster than the speed limit, if i am ever caught I will pay the speeding ticket, I will not pass the blame on to the cop. If someone caught you in the act would you apologize profusely, swear it'll never happen again, accept and welcome the scorn of hundreds of people? Or would you think that the response is a bit unfair because you never meant for it to get out in the open, you only got caught when someone shoved a huge-ass microphone in your house. I should not be saying these things in the first place, it is not a nice thing to do. Shame on me for talking behind people's back.
But you'd do it again at some point, wouldn't you?
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EPT
