EPTTomorrow I will calculate the points for the new PokerStrategy.com League! The GIGABYTE NVIDIA Invitational being in tournament Limbo is going to bring down the rankings of Grubby and Kas, slightly hurting the PSL, but there is nothing I can do about that.
Introducing the SC2 World Ranking - Page 11
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Metalteeth
United States115 Posts
Tomorrow I will calculate the points for the new PokerStrategy.com League! The GIGABYTE NVIDIA Invitational being in tournament Limbo is going to bring down the rankings of Grubby and Kas, slightly hurting the PSL, but there is nothing I can do about that. | ||
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divito
Canada1213 Posts
This can play havoc with a true ranking. Winning an MLG where 10 of the top 100 attended (just hypothetical for logic) garners the same points as someone who wins one with 70 of the top 100? This can further be credited by breaking down top 10, 25, 50 etc... for truly accurate point distribution. When I developed a world ranking for Counter-Strike, I instituted a multiplier based on strength of field to assist the general points per placing to ensure teams that were able to attend more events and lesser quality events didn't artificially pad their numbers. | ||
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glzElectromaster
Japan2474 Posts
I mean, CreatorPrime is like 20 places behind IdrA? I mean no offense to IdrA (he's a good player), but Creator is definitely much better than him. Edit: I would weigh GSL more, and then figure out a better system for team leagues. Some players are really good at team leagues (some in fact rarely appear in individual leagues because of how intense Code A qualifiers are), so maybe take that into consideration. I also want to know how you would weigh certain online tournaments, like ESV weeklies. | ||
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JJH777
United States4418 Posts
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Gotnerves
56 Posts
August GSL #1 Date 9/10 5,000 points Geforce Pro #2 DAte 9/29 300 points Octover GSL #2 Date 10/22 2,499 points Blizzcon #1 Date 10/23 (2,000)?? points Arena of Legends #1 Date 11/13 500 points MLG Providence #4 11/20 500 points November GSL #3-4 Date 11/28 1,500 points WCG #1 Date 12/11 2000 points Blizzard Cup #3-4 Date 12/15 900 points 2012 GSL season 2 #1 Date 5/19 5,000 points IEM cologne #1 Date 8/19 500 points | ||
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Oreo7
United States1647 Posts
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b0mBerMan
Japan289 Posts
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Gotnerves
56 Posts
IEM cologne #2 Date 8/21 250 points MLG Orlando #2 Date 10/16 1200 points Blizzard Cup #3-4 Date 12/15 900 points HSC 4 #1 DAte 1/8 1500 points IEM WC #1 DAte 3/10 2000 points Red Bull #1 Date 5/27 500 points HSC 5 #3 Date 7/8 700 points NASL 3 #3 DAte 7/15 950 GSL season 3 #2 7/27 2,499 points Asus #2 Date 8/4 1,200 So i Messed up on the IEM i see now that you put the them at 1,500 non WC....but i made the same mistake for both so it equals out.....either way....this does not come close to the one posted above.....hence something is wrong. | ||
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Metalteeth
United States115 Posts
divito: Starting with Tournaments at August 10, 2012, all tournaments are weighted based on the players attending. I originally was following the Tennis style where every tournament is given a default point total, but based on feedback, I changed it to an equation that uses the players attending. All previous results prior to August 10, 2012 remain as pure points. It turned out to be useful for a baseline to start weighing tournaments. glzElectromaster: Thing is, what has Creator done in the past year? Middling results in GSL, 9th in IPL4 (which was a few months ago), and a really good result in TSL4 that, because TSL4 is not done, has not been put in yet. As for team leagues, I'm open to suggestions, but everything I think of comes back to one problem: How can I create a way that rewards team success, but doesn't harshly punish players for the team they are on. What do I mean? Should Taeja get a boost because the rest of Liquid is not quite as good as he is right now? He would get far less all kills if someone else on Liquid got kills more often. Should someone like MC be punished because he is on a stacked team, thus rarely plays? Either it is too small a bonus to really matter, or it is too large and punishes players in certain team situations. And because there are far less team leagues than 1v1 events, there wouldn't be a large enough sample size to cancel out irregularites. JJH777: People complain that GSL is worth too little, people complain that GSL is worth too much. I think this is a nice happy medium right now. Especially with Code S players constantly coming to MLG events. Gotnerves: This does not count all events equally. Points decay over time, so events further in the past count less. Up to 365 days after the event, when they no longer count at all. Mvp has the most results over all time, but not the most results in the recent past. This is not a all time ranking, this is a CURRENT ranking. And Mvp, outside of his run at IEM, hasn't done much since GSL Season 2, whereas MC has gotten 3rd at HSC and NASL, 2nd in GSL S3, 2nd at ASUS Summer, and 4th at Spring Arena 2. Oreo: Of course players that attend more tournaments will do better. But even then, players that do well in GSL get high rankings. Seed had never left Korea for Starcraft until TAC3 finals, and yet is in the Top 10. There is no requirement to go to many tournaments to be a top player, you have to do well in the tournaments you compete in. | ||
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Shinespark
Chile843 Posts
No, that is not a typo, I mean 4 points. | ||
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Metalteeth
United States115 Posts
On August 21 2012 13:26 Shinespark wrote: Shouldn't Homestory Cup give like, 4 points for the winner or something? I didn't see it listed. No, that is not a typo, I mean 4 points. 1) HSC is in the spreadsheet. I don't explicitly say it in the points listing, because I just used the same scale as an MLG or something. Feel free to check, you can get the Excel sheet I use to calculate it all. 2) 4 points? You are going to sit there, and seriously say that winning a HSC does not matter? It's a more casual environment, but you mean to tell me that the players don't try or something? | ||
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Shinespark
Chile843 Posts
On August 21 2012 13:30 Metalteeth wrote: 1) HSC is in the spreadsheet. I don't explicitly say it in the points listing, because I just used the same scale as an MLG or something. Feel free to check, you can get the Excel sheet I use to calculate it all. 2) 4 points? You are going to sit there, and seriously say that winning a HSC does not matter? It's a more casual environment, but you mean to tell me that the players don't try or something? No, I was just kidding. Gotta be worth at least 9 points, I mean, come on. Kidding again. It's one of the major but unlisted tournaments so it gives 250 for the winner, right? | ||
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Gotnerves
56 Posts
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Metalteeth
United States115 Posts
On August 21 2012 13:32 Shinespark wrote: No, I was just kidding. Gotta be worth at least 9 points, I mean, come on. Kidding again. It's one of the major but unlisted tournaments so it gives 250 for the winner, right? I used the Dreamhack scale for HSC, so it's worth 2000. It was changed slightly for the different style, but the point breakdown is the same, just where it says something like GS 5th, change it to 1st GS 4th or something. | ||
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Gotnerves
56 Posts
On August 21 2012 13:37 Metalteeth wrote: I used the Dreamhack scale for HSC, so it's worth 2000. It was changed slightly for the different style, but the point breakdown is the same, just where it says something like GS 5th, change it to 1st GS 4th or something. So HSC is worth more the IEM stops? wow not sure i agree with that. I thought you clocked them both in at 1,500. | ||
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Metalteeth
United States115 Posts
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Iron_
United States389 Posts
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Gotnerves
56 Posts
On August 21 2012 13:44 Metalteeth wrote: Gotnerves, if you think one tournament should be rated differently, good for you. That has been the majority of the 10 pages of this thread, and I am not changing it. All future tournaments are going to be calculated using the weight of the players, and changing a single event by 500 points will change nothing. This change was done based on feedback about the tournament weightings being subjective, and they will not be as much anymore. So it really doesn't matter anymore. Well still good work, but common sense would agree with me but it's your rankings and formula. Impressed you took the time to do this  | ||
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VediVeci
United States82 Posts
The point drop of between places (especially first and second) seems a bit extreme. If two players finish 1st and second in the GSL, they may well be the top two players in the world, why does first get so many more points than second? Your system doesn't take into account difficulty. If the best 3 players in a tournament start in the same group of four, from which only two advance, is it really fair to punish the third place player so heavily? (this is an extreme example but you can see the point). Your weighting methodology is very subjective. It promotes quantity as a substitute for quality (this is fixed slightly by the drastic fall off in point values as players finish lower, but it remains an issue I think the TLPD Elo system does an excellent job of covering all the points I've mentioned, and in a far more established manner. The one area where your system may be a viable substitute is as a measurement of tournament success. As I contend in my second point, this is related to, but not a perfect approximation of, skill. If you keep updating this I'll keep looking as it seems like an interesting system and fresh ideas are always great. I don't think it will be replacing Elo anytime soon though. | ||
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SupLilSon
Malaysia4123 Posts
On August 07 2012 14:22 hunts wrote: GSL should definitely be worth more than it is IMO. Winning a GSL is a MUCH bigger accomplishment than something like an MLG or IPL which are all relatively close in points. While I agree GSL is by far the hardest tournament, there's the problem with it being so regional based. Many players don't get the opportunities to try and qualify over and over. I know it's a super safe assumption to say that 99% of those players wouldn't be able to qualify anyways, given all the chances in the world, but who knows? | ||
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