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Top Tier Korean ZvT and TvZ TLPD statistics - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
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Bagi
Profile Joined August 2010
Germany6799 Posts
March 16 2012 02:29 GMT
#21
Lots of really good terran players, but less really good zergs? That means when you are going against a terran in code S, its more likely that he is a really good one instead of just a walkover.

I don't think anyone would argue that terran just has the strongest code S lineup.
Hall0wed
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States8486 Posts
March 16 2012 02:29 GMT
#22
On March 16 2012 11:20 Liquid`Jinro wrote:
How the fuck is 64% not good?


Obviously it is all relevant. Compare that 64% to some of the win% in other matchups and 64% is quite weak.
♦ My Life for BESTie ♦ 류세라 = 배 ♦
TheRabidDeer
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
United States3806 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-16 02:33:46
March 16 2012 02:30 GMT
#23
On March 16 2012 11:28 cozzE wrote:
Zerg's are allowed to dominate the shit out of ZvP yet when they're dominated by very highly mechanically skilled Terrans that simply can't be allowed.

Your logic here is clearly flawed and it's a blatant balance whine. I'm not trolling/baiting etc. I'm just calling out something that is obvious.

Meanwhile protoss generally dominate these "very highly mechanically skilled terrans"

Also, there arent many zergs that have a very high winrate vs protoss. Especially right now.

EDIT:
Same zergs vs protoss
DRG - 72.97%
Nestea - 75.86%
Leenock - 44.19%
Curious - 61.11%
July - 57.45%
Symbol - 61.54%
MaNaVoId
Profile Joined February 2012
492 Posts
March 16 2012 02:30 GMT
#24
lol if there is a new terran who win his first and only match in GSL he will have 100% winrate, that will be more huuuge of a discrepancy. Comeon guys you need to take a bigger sample. Even though MMA has 80% win ratio, he played way too few games to make a reliable statistics.
acrimoneyius
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
United States983 Posts
March 16 2012 02:30 GMT
#25
those extra few percents probably account for bunker rushing/2 rax and helion run-bys, which are extremely unforgiving for zerg and even top tier players die to all the time.

Makes you wonder if they'll ever put in a marine range upgrade (but that would possibly screw up TvP)
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
March 16 2012 02:30 GMT
#26
On March 16 2012 11:24 Gator wrote:
conclusion: having 300 apm and sick multitasking makes you good at TvZ


Being good at the game makes you... good at the game?
O.o
neoghaleon55
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States7435 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-16 08:31:59
March 16 2012 02:31 GMT
#27
On March 16 2012 11:24 Mentalizor wrote:
When you "only" have a 50 game sample (DRG's ZvT is 50games) small mistakes, missmicroes can easilly cost 2-5 games. if just 5 games a lost due to mistakes, that will alter your statistics by 10% which is pretty much. Get bigger samples before comparing statistics. They are just not viable to look at.



The optimal minimum sample size is 20. Above 20, the n value does not relevantly contribute over all (n-1) to the statistics.
I'm sure you remember from your AP stats class and college.


The statistics presented in the OP are greater than 20 sample sizes and thus are relevant.
moo...for DRG
Azzur
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Australia6267 Posts
March 16 2012 02:33 GMT
#28
Statistics need to be put in context and analysed properly...

DRG's win/loss against terran was in the backdrop of terran domination and when protoss was struggling. This means that when he gets into the end stages of tournaments, he is facing good terrans. On the other hand, protoss struggling means that his win-rate against protoss may be higher because he faces weaker opponents. Now, protoss is doing well, and you can begin to see a fall in his win rate.
Itsmedudeman
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States19229 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-16 02:34:07
March 16 2012 02:33 GMT
#29
These winrates mean nothing because they account for their entire match history. Remember when MC was unbeatable PvP and Nestea was unbeatable ZvZ? You'd still reach that conclusion if you analyzed the statistics in the way you did. Things change a lot. The only thing we can get from this is that historically terrans have been beating zergs in the matchup, but not who is good in which matchup currently.
WeaponX.7
Profile Joined June 2011
Canada52 Posts
March 16 2012 02:33 GMT
#30
I find it very unlikely that these stats are all current patch... and therfore pretty useless.
Grrr... = first bonjwa
MaNaVoId
Profile Joined February 2012
492 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-16 02:35:14
March 16 2012 02:33 GMT
#31
you cannot just outright compare win ratios like the way OP did coz it never shows what caliber of players they won against. It could be Dongraegu keep running into those top tier terrans while MMA keeps thrashing low tier zergs. The last time Dongraegu and MMA met, their score is 4-3, only differs by one. So i wouldnt say the matchup is imbalanced if the best zvt and tvz only differes by 1 game,
Bagration
Profile Blog Joined October 2011
United States18282 Posts
March 16 2012 02:33 GMT
#32
On March 16 2012 11:20 Liquid`Jinro wrote:
How the fuck is 64% not good?


It's relative. DRG is arguably the best Zerg in the world right now, and his ZvT had been perceived as amazing. To discover that it is actually his weakest MU, and his rival MMA has a TvZ 16% higher, is pretty surprising.
Team Slayers, Axiom-Acer and Vile forever
Whatson
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
United States5357 Posts
March 16 2012 02:34 GMT
#33
Thank you OP for firmly supporting my belief that MMA is a TvZ god...
¯\_(シ)_/¯
xrapture
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
United States1644 Posts
March 16 2012 02:35 GMT
#34
Dongraegu 72% win rate vs P. No Terran close to this. Quick make thread!
Everyone is either delusional, a nihlilst, or dead from suicide.
TheRabidDeer
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
United States3806 Posts
March 16 2012 02:35 GMT
#35
On March 16 2012 11:34 Whatson wrote:
Thank you OP for firmly supporting my belief that MMA is a TvZ god...

MMA is shining proof that just blindly dropping marines all over the place is hard to handle for zerg and almost always cost efficient.
X3GoldDot
Profile Joined August 2011
Malaysia3840 Posts
March 16 2012 02:35 GMT
#36
On March 16 2012 11:28 cozzE wrote:
Zerg's are allowed to dominate the shit out of ZvP yet when they're dominated by very highly mechanically skilled Terrans that simply can't be allowed......

Your logic here is clearly flawed and it's a blatant balance whine. I'm not trolling/baiting etc. I'm just calling out something that is obvious.


ROFL, top protosses are killing zerg right now, get ur facts straight b4 complaining.
prime/startale/[SexComaZerg, RoyalRoaderZerg, SirLifealot] ingame ID = GoodGame
Gecko4lif
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
United States42 Posts
March 16 2012 02:36 GMT
#37
Well if you look at foreigner stats

Terrans

Puma (Yes he is korean but he is Eg so I consider him one of us) vZ: 59-29 (67.05%)
Happy vZ: 184-77 (70.50%)
Thorzain vZ: 89-63 (58.55%)
BraT Ok vZ: 133-85 (61.01%)
Sjow vZ: 164-133 (55.22%)
Lucifron vZ: 24-15 (61.54%)


Zerg

Stephano vT: 188-102 (64.83%)
Nerchio vT: 323-176 (64.73%)
violet (Same situation as puma) vT: 75-38 (66.37%)
Ret vT: 101-82 (55.19%)
Sen vT: 57-41 (58.16%)
sLivko vT: 59-67 (46.83%)


There is still a bit of a gap
Whatson
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
United States5357 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-03-16 02:36:56
March 16 2012 02:36 GMT
#38
On March 16 2012 11:35 TheRabidDeer wrote:
Show nested quote +
On March 16 2012 11:34 Whatson wrote:
Thank you OP for firmly supporting my belief that MMA is a TvZ god...

MMA is shining proof that just blindly dropping marines all over the place is hard to handle for zerg and almost always cost efficient.

Which is exactly why i do it ^^
¯\_(シ)_/¯
Diomedes7
Profile Joined November 2011
67 Posts
March 16 2012 02:38 GMT
#39
MMA is amazing. If he figures out tvp, he'll be a complete beast.
hunts
Profile Joined September 2010
United States2113 Posts
March 16 2012 02:41 GMT
#40
On March 16 2012 11:20 Liquid`Jinro wrote:
How the fuck is 64% not good?


64% may be good for a sub par player, but nnot for a champion like DRG or nestea
twitch.tv/huntstv 7x legend streamer
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