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On December 13 2011 23:26 Liquid`Tyler wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:12 zul wrote:
Naniwa responds on twitter: "apparently people got upset when i probe rushed nestea, the game was pointless and it couldnt change anything in the tournament."
people who bought the HD Pass just to see good games from him, will not approve of this behavior. The people who bought the HD Pass knew the format of the tournament and knew that it allowed for inconsequential games. Without the incentive of winning a tournament, progamers should not try to win. No one is good enough to waste their best effort on inconsequential games, especially with how many major tournaments there are nowadays. Whatever the best strategy Naniwa had in mind for the game, he should not use it. What irrational people want and expect is for the players to put on a false show of a competition, where they both seem to be trying enough for viewers to successfully suspend their disbelief. Such people don't constitute a significant enough part of the community to justify this huge reaction.
Agreed. I feel like people are still stuck with this idea that progamers are actually professional entertainers. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's mixing up cause and effect - the act of competition; more specifically, the act of competing, causes entertainment. Entertainment does not cause someone to compete. If there's no way a progamer will win, it is not his job to somehow inject entertainment into a game. Sure, I'd have loved to see Nani throw everything he had at Nestea for that last game, but why would he? The game would literally be entirely for my benefit, and not at all for his, which is not how professional competition works.
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On December 13 2011 22:44 Sated wrote:Show nested quote +We swear that calling Naniwa a pro-gamer is overrating him. Even considering that he is young and free-style minded foreign player, he forgot to remember that pro-gamers are meant to show the best games out of their ability to fans. Does he make most of his money from gaming? Yes. Is he therefore a pro-gamer? Yes. This is moronic. It's like saying that calling Mario Balotelli a pro-footballer is "overrating him" because he does stupid shit. NaNiWa is a pro-gamer whether you like his attitude or not.
Progaming in the SC scene is understood differently than what you think.
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On December 13 2011 23:24 mind_control wrote:
nice article ever. I have to leave a comment here. well my opinion about his action on game # 9, when he started to game, and when he tried to put gg. it wasn't so arrogant or disrespectful all staffs/ gom tv people/his fans, or offend feeling bad against nestea at all. He was already 0-3 regardless his mood. his condition. regardless his purpose. Game comes always with luck/conditions. etc. Even though he put all his efforts all his life, there must be variable and not going with him unfortunately. We had thousands of fans for him before he starts that show 18:10. If he would win that games, the result could change all everything. but now he lost, we change back against him. I don't think people change. that's true. But because of that, I don't hate people. I understand every culture. and background. I understand this situation. I mean, I don't think this situation it's not his bad manner or disrespectful us. Did you think ever his schedule? He had run many games since Sep. even moved new countries, met many games. countries to countries. Do you think, he had enough journey whilst he having pause in Sweden? Didn't you read his twitter? Well, as you noticed already people(gamers) considered like a item to company(like col,qxg) they contact all the time. and it must be also stressed, maybe pro gamers don't have free time. and don't have free time enjoy themselves. After he spent 10 days after deamhack, he had to attend direct blizz cup, even changing such dramatic changing company. Didn't you think, how much he was under stress? Let's take a look one more time. Korea is mostly stress country. stress giving. more with manner-important taking. I don't think, there is pressure between naniwa-nestea. It must just certain temporary things in MLG in orlando. I cant believe people saying that issue even still now. Let's take a look in the mirror. Even we are such perfect. that we can be judged. If we see last 200-300 yrs ago genious. people didn't take as good, or genious at all. They had hard life. If I see naniwa, I see same thing. I'm not a fan or naniwa, I'm not fan of nestea either, I see all the time in the middle. I'm just saying what I see. and experienced. just people cant be perfect. Naniwa in the studio action. he just abstain. there wasn't anything disrespectful. Didnt you see his tears/eyes via youtube. when he says to you guys to fan. I could see his real heart. and how much he's thanksful to his team/fans And how much he think so important and want to communicate with you guys.
Don't blame to him. He's also just a person. He's not a beast. He seems just cold but he just doesn't show. but you guys already show and edit lots of his data right ? I'm also understand korean newspaper against to him but. We didn't see so let's not judge. I just think, this happening just can regards as abstrain. like yes, football kick his ball into his goal. He must just tired, after long trip to meet new people(where are all koreans there) . Let's try to understand him as a person. Not just score/ or money or appearance. He's now in new country, new people in his young age.
I expect another succeed in his life again. I tried to mention his schedule to say his background. Hope you guys understand a little bit too.
IF you are from South Korea,you should know that Korean take gaming very seriously and dun tolerate this type of thing even when you are throwing a game that doesn't matter against Nestea.
Koreans emphasize A LOT on professionalism and respect in sc2 and also in their culture.Foreigners may take this and say"meh it was a pointless game so he throwed it away"but Koreans look at differently and say you cant have that.
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On December 13 2011 23:26 Liquid`Tyler wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:12 zul wrote:
Naniwa responds on twitter: "apparently people got upset when i probe rushed nestea, the game was pointless and it couldnt change anything in the tournament."
people who bought the HD Pass just to see good games from him, will not approve of this behavior. The people who bought the HD Pass knew the format of the tournament and knew that it allowed for inconsequential games. Without the incentive of winning a tournament, progamers should not try to win. No one is good enough to waste their best effort on inconsequential games, especially with how many major tournaments there are nowadays. Whatever the best strategy Naniwa had in mind for the game, he should not use it. What irrational people want and expect is for the players to put on a false show of a competition, where they both seem to be trying enough for viewers to successfully suspend their disbelief. Such people don't constitute a significant enough part of the community to justify this huge reaction.
I do seem to wonder how any sport in a league format would be played out if people used this logic. Empty seats, empty arenas and then they would stop making the inconsequential games be played.
What's the point of everyone having to play the same amount of games if it has no value? We're not talking about hours of work that gives no result. And it's important to consider that this eSport genre is still new and volatile, and does not need this kind of drama. People payed for something and expect to see it. There's no argument to counter this. Maybe once eSports has grown for two decades, but for now; Don't act like children.
Without spectators there would be no eSports. That's the most important point as I see it...
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On December 13 2011 23:33 Weemoed wrote:
The entire Starcraft 2 community seems to consist of constantly menstruating 17 years old females.
At least one person is a sexist in this community.
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I can't believe so many people are jumping on the hate bandwagon. What was actually harmed? What was actually lost? Nothing. Perhaps the anger should be placed at the tournament style that allowed a meaningless game like this to take place to begin with.
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On December 13 2011 23:33 Weemoed wrote:
The entire Starcraft 2 community seems to consist of constantly menstruating 17 years old females.
W-to the fuckin-ord.
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Wow, I never realized Korean's are insane...
Naniwa is taking way too much heat. Who cares if he threw a match that didn't matter?
If anything I think Naniwa should be upset with the Koreans...
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On December 13 2011 23:33 Vega62a wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:26 Liquid`Tyler wrote:On December 13 2011 23:12 zul wrote:
Naniwa responds on twitter: "apparently people got upset when i probe rushed nestea, the game was pointless and it couldnt change anything in the tournament."
people who bought the HD Pass just to see good games from him, will not approve of this behavior. The people who bought the HD Pass knew the format of the tournament and knew that it allowed for inconsequential games. Without the incentive of winning a tournament, progamers should not try to win. No one is good enough to waste their best effort on inconsequential games, especially with how many major tournaments there are nowadays. Whatever the best strategy Naniwa had in mind for the game, he should not use it. What irrational people want and expect is for the players to put on a false show of a competition, where they both seem to be trying enough for viewers to successfully suspend their disbelief. Such people don't constitute a significant enough part of the community to justify this huge reaction. Agreed. I feel like people are still stuck with this idea that progamers are actually professional entertainers. Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's mixing up cause and effect - the act of competition; more specifically, the act of competing, causes entertainment. Entertainment does not cause someone to compete. If there's no way a progamer will win, it is not his job to somehow inject entertainment into a game. Sure, I'd have loved to see Nani throw everything he had at Nestea for that last game, but why would he? The game would literally be entirely for my benefit, and not at all for his, which is not how professional competition works.
you can think of the progamer-fan relationship as Progamer entertain fan, fan pay progamer money.
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Well GOMTV should expect something like this, like comeon no1 would have minded if nestea did 6pool naniwa in the last game, its bo1, and it seems GOM guys didnt understand fast enough u cant run tournaments on bo1 format while expecting an amazing skillfull tournament. I though this lesson was learned 1 year ago at dreamhack
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So he should play this game and give "his best" ???
This game was more meaningless then those "funny" showmatches before one of GSL tournaments where "pro-gamers" like boxer or nestea were playing bad for fun. Nestea was even angry @ huk playing serious and now he is giving shit to Naniwa for throwing meaningless game?
I understand that koreans are very competitive, but things like that happen everywhere left and right (eg. ToD not playing his games @ WCG in KOREA!)
I hope that Nani will show them who's the boss @ next GSL.
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On December 13 2011 23:34 ChowChillaCharlie wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:33 Weemoed wrote:
The entire Starcraft 2 community seems to consist of constantly menstruating 17 years old females. W-to the fuckin- ord.
Explains why so many people here like douchebags.
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On December 13 2011 23:26 Liquid`Tyler wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:12 zul wrote:
Naniwa responds on twitter: "apparently people got upset when i probe rushed nestea, the game was pointless and it couldnt change anything in the tournament."
people who bought the HD Pass just to see good games from him, will not approve of this behavior. The people who bought the HD Pass knew the format of the tournament and knew that it allowed for inconsequential games. Without the incentive of winning a tournament, progamers should not try to win. No one is good enough to waste their best effort on inconsequential games, especially with how many major tournaments there are nowadays. Whatever the best strategy Naniwa had in mind for the game, he should not use it. What irrational people want and expect is for the players to put on a false show of a competition, where they both seem to be trying enough for viewers to successfully suspend their disbelief. Such people don't constitute a significant enough part of the community to justify this huge reaction.
this. I don't think people are focusing enough on the circumstances that allowed this to happen: a faulty and confusing tournament format. Sure Naniwa is known to BM, but not placing any of the blame on the tourney organizers is a bit delusional.
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It wasn't the most clever idea, but this thing is blown way out of proportion. Maybe it's in fact because of some cutural differences but I really don't think the whole thing is so bad.
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On December 13 2011 23:31 brachester wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:26 Liquid`Tyler wrote:On December 13 2011 23:12 zul wrote:
Naniwa responds on twitter: "apparently people got upset when i probe rushed nestea, the game was pointless and it couldnt change anything in the tournament."
people who bought the HD Pass just to see good games from him, will not approve of this behavior. The people who bought the HD Pass knew the format of the tournament and knew that it allowed for inconsequential games. Without the incentive of winning a tournament, progamers should not try to win. No one is good enough to waste their best effort on inconsequential games, especially with how many major tournaments there are nowadays. Whatever the best strategy Naniwa had in mind for the game, he should not use it. What irrational people want and expect is for the players to put on a false show of a competition, where they both seem to be trying enough for viewers to successfully suspend their disbelief. Such people don't constitute a significant enough part of the community to justify this huge reaction. that doesn't mean he can THROW AWAY a game. Sure he can hide his strat, but at least try to play a standard game/show a good game for the fans.
Lets stop lying her.
THIS is more fun then a proper game. Anyone who posted anything in these threads and claims he would prefer seeing a shitty game over this drama is a liar.
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What NaNiwa did was bad!
BUT
This is NOT an article, it is an opinion piece. You can call it "Opine" "Blog" or whatever, but not article.
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On December 13 2011 23:36 Sfydjklm wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:31 brachester wrote:On December 13 2011 23:26 Liquid`Tyler wrote:On December 13 2011 23:12 zul wrote:
Naniwa responds on twitter: "apparently people got upset when i probe rushed nestea, the game was pointless and it couldnt change anything in the tournament."
people who bought the HD Pass just to see good games from him, will not approve of this behavior. The people who bought the HD Pass knew the format of the tournament and knew that it allowed for inconsequential games. Without the incentive of winning a tournament, progamers should not try to win. No one is good enough to waste their best effort on inconsequential games, especially with how many major tournaments there are nowadays. Whatever the best strategy Naniwa had in mind for the game, he should not use it. What irrational people want and expect is for the players to put on a false show of a competition, where they both seem to be trying enough for viewers to successfully suspend their disbelief. Such people don't constitute a significant enough part of the community to justify this huge reaction. that doesn't mean he can THROW AWAY a game. Sure he can hide his strat, but at least try to play a standard game/show a good game for the fans. Lets stop lying her. THIS is more fun then a proper game. Anyone who posted anything in these threads and claims he would prefer seeing a shitty game over this drama is a liar.
False dichotomy hi
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On December 13 2011 23:36 Sfydjklm wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:31 brachester wrote:On December 13 2011 23:26 Liquid`Tyler wrote:On December 13 2011 23:12 zul wrote:
Naniwa responds on twitter: "apparently people got upset when i probe rushed nestea, the game was pointless and it couldnt change anything in the tournament."
people who bought the HD Pass just to see good games from him, will not approve of this behavior. The people who bought the HD Pass knew the format of the tournament and knew that it allowed for inconsequential games. Without the incentive of winning a tournament, progamers should not try to win. No one is good enough to waste their best effort on inconsequential games, especially with how many major tournaments there are nowadays. Whatever the best strategy Naniwa had in mind for the game, he should not use it. What irrational people want and expect is for the players to put on a false show of a competition, where they both seem to be trying enough for viewers to successfully suspend their disbelief. Such people don't constitute a significant enough part of the community to justify this huge reaction. that doesn't mean he can THROW AWAY a game. Sure he can hide his strat, but at least try to play a standard game/show a good game for the fans. Lets stop lying her. THIS is more fun then a proper game. Anyone who posted anything in these threads and claims he would prefer seeing a shitty game over this drama is a liar.
you can speak to yourself if you want
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On December 13 2011 23:26 Liquid`Tyler wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:12 zul wrote:
Naniwa responds on twitter: "apparently people got upset when i probe rushed nestea, the game was pointless and it couldnt change anything in the tournament."
people who bought the HD Pass just to see good games from him, will not approve of this behavior. The people who bought the HD Pass knew the format of the tournament and knew that it allowed for inconsequential games. Without the incentive of winning a tournament, progamers should not try to win. No one is good enough to waste their best effort on inconsequential games, especially with how many major tournaments there are nowadays. Whatever the best strategy Naniwa had in mind for the game, he should not use it. What irrational people want and expect is for the players to put on a false show of a competition, where they both seem to be trying enough for viewers to successfully suspend their disbelief. Such people don't constitute a significant enough part of the community to justify this huge reaction.
Dont speak for me. not everyone lacks the competitive spirit and will to go at 100% even when nothing is on the line
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On December 13 2011 23:35 Zalithian wrote:Show nested quote +On December 13 2011 23:34 ChowChillaCharlie wrote:On December 13 2011 23:33 Weemoed wrote:
The entire Starcraft 2 community seems to consist of constantly menstruating 17 years old females. W-to the fuckin- ord. Explains why so many people here like douchebags.
 ))) so full of win this thread :D
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EPT
