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On October 23 2011 03:36 RavenLoud wrote:
Well fuck, I really don't know why we complain that the whole package of t1-t3 units can actually beat t1 barracks unit with medivacs...but I like the terran changes. The shredder absolutely need a nerf against workers though...a couple of them will own/shut down the mineral line way better than any storm or baneling drops ever could.
Nonsense. Storm and baneling drops are instantaneous. Shredders need to deploy, which gives you more than enough time to move your workers. By the time see the blip on the minimap that happens to be a warp prism, its too late. Same for an overlord.
In terms of damage, the banelings would do almost twice as much damage as storm or the shredder, which effectively does the same damage as storm.
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On October 23 2011 03:28 Aiurr wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 03:18 ToguRo wrote:On October 23 2011 03:12 Aiurr wrote:
If that gay warhouds are for real then I am switching to zerg. Terran is no fun anymore. Blizzard makes it into a stupid turtle race... I didn't want more turtling... I wanted more mobility...
Terran cant have everyting ... mech is what terran is really supposed to be I am talking about mobiility, not about mech units. And I don't agree with you that mech units must be gay and immobile.
Not to derail this, but is "gay" really a good adjective for describing robots? >_>
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On October 23 2011 03:38 Reaper51 wrote:
new dt rush: oracle disables spores and dts rape ur base since u need a spire to get mobile detection now...
It's not exactly a "rush" when you tech to dark templars AND a gas expensive stargate unit. And this is why protoss are QQ'ing.
So far, the very design idea of the oracle is bad. We want an early-midgame harasser. Blizzard has confirmed this to be a protoss problem.
Combining the oracle with warpprism harass and/or dts makes it an even bigger of an all-in and investment which defeats the entire purpose of it.
Running around with the oracle by itself bubbling enemy mineral patches in early game means that the enemy army is going to be in his base being ready to destroy the bubbles asap. Again defeating the purpose of an early-midgame raider unit.
The mechanic of delaying tech and unit production was tried on the overseer. The overseer is cut because it wasn't interesting enough. I saw ONE professional game a long time ago where Zenio spammed goop on Idra's hatch for a timing attack. At no other point in the entirety of sc2:wol have I seen a professional game where this type of "raiding" actually made a difference when compared to your traditional "blow shit up raiding".
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On October 23 2011 03:41 kardinal wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 03:38 Reaper51 wrote:
new dt rush: oracle disables spores and dts rape ur base since u need a spire to get mobile detection now... It's not exactly a "rush" when you tech to dark templars AND a gas expensive stargate unit.
even without the orcale dts can easily snipe spores
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On October 23 2011 03:39 Daralii wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 03:28 Aiurr wrote:On October 23 2011 03:18 ToguRo wrote:On October 23 2011 03:12 Aiurr wrote:
If that gay warhouds are for real then I am switching to zerg. Terran is no fun anymore. Blizzard makes it into a stupid turtle race... I didn't want more turtling... I wanted more mobility...
Terran cant have everyting ... mech is what terran is really supposed to be I am talking about mobiility, not about mech units. And I don't agree with you that mech units must be gay and immobile. Not to derail this, but is "gay" really a good adjective for describing robots? >_>
if they look like anal probes then yes
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this is the true use of the oracle
Step 1) go 3gate/voidray all-in against terran every game
Step 2) disable every bunker the terran has with a single 200gas unit from the stargate. (so for 150 gas you can get a extra voidray, or for 200gas you can disable all the bunkers. oracle wins in the comparison)
Step 3) win
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On October 23 2011 01:13 roymarthyup wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 01:11 YoiChiBow wrote:On October 23 2011 01:09 mordk wrote:
I think the replicant might be a bit too strong in certain scenarios, its probably gonna be key in:
1-1-1 defense: It effectively nullifies 1-1-1 as a viable build; replicate a siege tank to control the area, or replicate a raven then HSM the marines.
Late game caster battles: The replicant counters ghosts if well played, and there's something else that hasn't been considered. The replicant is effectively a khaydarin amulet.
I could write up a few more situations in which it can really be an amazing unit, maybe too amazing. The high cost of the replicant (being 400/400 and 4 supply cost) seems very unfeasible with stopping the 1-1-1. This is a real time strategy and the biggest factor in dealing with the 1-1-1 is time because the fact that it comes so early. the replicant is 200/200 and turns into a 3 supply siege tank and this is NOT A BAD DEAL at all for toss. the replicant will essentially make it so terran can NEVER go tanks against toss, because the moment terran gets 1 tank the toss will replicate a few tanks for himself and now the terran must fight against tanks+collossi the replicant will kill the 1-1-1 strategy
Does not quite work that way. Supply is still 4 for the "Replicated Siege Tank/DT/Viking/etc" in exchange for FULL MP and FULL tech. i.e. VS MMMVG bio-ball, a well-timed replication of ghosts (via observer) will result in 8 snipes PER ghost or 7 snipes while cloaked. Or if lacking micro like most players, just EMP enemy ghosts and consider that a victory.
Likely HuK would be able to turn the tables on Terran. Such as replicating typical bio comp that has Medivacs and Vikings.
IMHO the hate is retarded, Blizzard clearly wants HotS to a different game from WoL.
That being said, each of the new units revolutionises their respective matchups.
TvT, 6-rax all in is basically dead. Two of these babies at the choke in front of the natural with two seiged tanks and it's pretty much go home, nothing to see here.
TvP, more mech included, battle hellions and warhounds joining in the typical MMMVG death ball. I am curious if warhounds would use their anti-mech weapon vs. Colossus or their AoE AtA attack.
TvZ, wow, battle hellions and/or shredders would be a critical counter to swarmhosts. Everything else would still be the same though, except maybe using vipers to pull-in seiged tanks for roaches to snipe off. Reapers will still be gimp.
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Does anyone know if the shredder will hit air?
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On October 23 2011 03:44 PhyreHazard wrote:
Does anyone know if the shredder will hit air?
it does
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On October 23 2011 03:44 PhyreHazard wrote:
Does anyone know if the shredder will hit air?
It will, unless Blizz changes their minds.
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Question, can Shredders be put into medivacs and dropped?... I cringe at the thought.
And I don't like the new Terran units. I don't have the credentials to comment on balance, but the concepts and reasoning seem strange to me.
-Uber thors? I never liked uber units or heroes.
-Shredders? Terran definitely needed more ability to hold positions and defend, right?
-Battle Hellions? This is prolly my biased opinion, but were those things really in need of this? They were pretty fucking efficient as is, and now they've become firebats that can become super mobile?
-Warhounds? Were mechanical units really an enormous problem for terran? I've never heard of one complaining about powerful stalkers were.
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On October 23 2011 03:42 Reaper51 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 03:41 kardinal wrote:On October 23 2011 03:38 Reaper51 wrote:
new dt rush: oracle disables spores and dts rape ur base since u need a spire to get mobile detection now... It's not exactly a "rush" when you tech to dark templars AND a gas expensive stargate unit. even without the orcale dts can easily snipe spores
Hmmm, from the video, it only stuns the building not remove from the game (building stasis, BW), so detection would still be in effect.
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even without the orcale dts can easily snipe spores
No, they can't. Zerglings will kill dts
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On October 23 2011 03:25 Fungal Growth wrote:
Think the Swarm Host's are getting a bad rap in the thread... In WOL, zerg doesn't have a cloak attack unit (burrowed roaches don't count) so this forces the opposition to get detection. Very important when zerg wants to maintain a defenders advantage. Many protoss builds skip the robo bay vs zerg...they will no longer be able to do this (well also because banelings will be able to move underground as well...but they will probably be too slow to be effective).
The other major advantage the swarm host will have is that it finally has a non-broodlord siege unit with great range. Very important for defenders advantage and forcing unseiges. In fact (it's not clear from the videos) the Swarm Host may be able to outrange the tank and the locusts may not lose their range going around corners (they may have 'as the crow flies' range like creep tumors) which would be very powerful.
How does it force detection? The actual attacking units themselves, unlike DTs or Banshees, aren't invisible. You can still stop them by killing the attacking units, which spawn very slowly and are very few in number.
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On October 23 2011 03:46 EnclaveUSA wrote:No, they can't. Zerglings will kill dts
not always before detection is destroyed
my other concern is with the new terran mech deathball which is easily better than the bio ball and can be attainable by midgame
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Pointless balance whining used to be a bannable offense, now it feels like the new norm. Even regarding units we haven't used or seen in action!
I'm glad I play random so that I don't succumb to the partisan mentality of "OMG NOW MY RACE WILL DIE TO THIS! NO FAIR!"
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seems like position becomes less and less immportant, hots seems to take a step towards C&C and away from sc bw.
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On October 23 2011 03:39 Daralii wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2011 03:28 Aiurr wrote:On October 23 2011 03:18 ToguRo wrote:On October 23 2011 03:12 Aiurr wrote:
If that gay warhouds are for real then I am switching to zerg. Terran is no fun anymore. Blizzard makes it into a stupid turtle race... I didn't want more turtling... I wanted more mobility...
Terran cant have everyting ... mech is what terran is really supposed to be I am talking about mobiility, not about mech units. And I don't agree with you that mech units must be gay and immobile. Not to derail this, but is "gay" really a good adjective for describing robots? >_>
+ Show Spoiler +
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On October 23 2011 03:51 Teejing wrote:
seems like position becomes less and less immportant, hots seems to take a step towards C&C and away from sc bw.
yes all we need is the sidebar : )
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On October 23 2011 02:35 Chloroplaste wrote:![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/bL06m.jpg) Hello everyone, What do you think of new terran units from a design point of view? I'm not really found of it and I prefer the firebat and goliath style...
Yeah I like the old style better too.
I wouldn't mind if starcraft 2 was just revamped BW.
IF IT AINT BROKEN DONT FIX IT.
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EPT
