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Top 200 11.22.2010 - Page 3

Forum Index > SC2 General
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Sfydjklm
Profile Blog Joined April 2005
United States9218 Posts
November 22 2010 19:54 GMT
#41
On November 23 2010 04:50 Treehead wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2010 03:44 milkncheese wrote:
Everyone is saying 'poor toss, poor toss', but toss are #1 and #2. And if you look at the top 20, its

8 Protoss
7 Zerg
5 Terran

Quantity does not equal quality


If I showed you 7 sets of ladder distributions and tournament results saying that toss are underrepresented at the top levels of performance, you'd say you weren't convinced because of toss placing in tournaments, or doing well on other continents, or for some other reason.

Yet you accept the idea that they are adequately represented based on a similarly small set of data. This seems inconsistent. Do you have more data to support this argument, or did you decide this was all you needed. By a similar token, I could claim global warming is a farce because it's cold out today. Also, I'm curious as to how the phrase "Quantity does not equal quality" supports your argument?

Are you familiar with the concept that small sample sizes reflect the true state of things less often than large sample sizes, and thus the top 5, top 20, top 50 will always be less meaningful than the top 100, top 500 and top 1000?

the problem with the sample size logic is that the balance issues that apply to top 10 players are completely different from top 1000.
twitter.com/therealdhalism | "Trying out Z = lots of losses vs inferior players until you figure out how to do it well (if it even works)."- Liquid'Tyler
shaunnn
Profile Joined October 2010
Ireland1230 Posts
November 22 2010 19:57 GMT
#42
Anyone know if boyardee is actually naniwa?
The naniwa - Unit of protoss skill, defined as the number of gates you build off of one base
heishe
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Germany2284 Posts
November 22 2010 19:57 GMT
#43
don't know about pvt, but zvp is fine. in 99% of the replays out there where the toss lost against the zerg, after watching the replay I will be able to almost instantly point out a major mistake or missed opportunity of the protoss player.

may sound weird, but there are very few protoss who've got zerg figured out. most just don't play good enough.
If you value your soul, never look into the eye of a horse. Your soul will forever be lost in the void of the horse.
NonY
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
8751 Posts
November 22 2010 19:58 GMT
#44
On November 23 2010 04:16 chadissilent wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2010 03:31 Barook wrote:
On November 23 2010 03:23 MaiYoH wrote:
It's interesting to see mTwDIMAGA make this list with only 84 wins. While I would agree with Blizzard that he deserves to be in the top 200 in NA, his position with so few games played makes me even more curious as to how Blizzard actually determines who makes their top 200.

He's in a S-Rank league (means +0 modifier) and has enough points to qualify. Look it up in Excalibur's thread, it's an interesting read.

The division modifier is completely BS IMO, and I'm not sure it's an actual true representation of skill. I have a friend in the top 100 on SC2 ranks that didn't crack the top 200 here. He plays players like Sheth, EnvY, etc. and is usually even with them or they are slightly favored against him. He beat EnvY (even match), who is fairly high on that list, has more points than envy, but is in a "worse" division therefore does not crack the list? That's a load of bullshit if you ask me.

This isn't an isolated case, either. He plays a lot of the guys on the top200, as even matches, and beats many of them.

Your friend needs to play a lot more games and/or have a higher win percentage. Accumulating points is the only thing that matters.
"Fucking up is part of it. If you can't fail, you have to always win. And I don't think you can always win." Elliott Smith ---------- Yet no sudden rage darkened his face, and his eyes were calm as they studied her. Then he smiled. 'Witness.'
Talack
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada2742 Posts
November 22 2010 20:12 GMT
#45
On November 23 2010 03:22 dambros wrote:
Who kicked SeleCT out of GSL? Jesus look at his win ratio and the amount of games... Dont get how it's possible to have those numbers comparing with the rest lol


Big difference between ladder and events.

Example: Vs high-quality players he wins 70% of the time we'll say. And vs pro-gamers he wins 20% of the time(just giving example chill out peeps). So his record on ladder will show completly different results than what his record vs the highest calibre of players will be.

Being 2500 on the ladder doesn't mean as much compared to versing the quality of opponents at these events.
Deleted User 47542
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
1484 Posts
November 22 2010 20:30 GMT
#46
Damn, dropped 30 spots
ePAttack
Profile Joined September 2010
United States112 Posts
November 22 2010 20:37 GMT
#47
Glad TTone can represent the toss!
Arcanne
Profile Joined August 2010
United States1519 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-22 22:34:06
November 22 2010 20:42 GMT
#48
Nevermind
Professional tech investor, part time DotA scrub | Follow @AllMeasures on Twitter
chadissilent
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Canada1187 Posts
November 22 2010 20:43 GMT
#49
On November 23 2010 04:58 Liquid`Tyler wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2010 04:16 chadissilent wrote:
On November 23 2010 03:31 Barook wrote:
On November 23 2010 03:23 MaiYoH wrote:
It's interesting to see mTwDIMAGA make this list with only 84 wins. While I would agree with Blizzard that he deserves to be in the top 200 in NA, his position with so few games played makes me even more curious as to how Blizzard actually determines who makes their top 200.

He's in a S-Rank league (means +0 modifier) and has enough points to qualify. Look it up in Excalibur's thread, it's an interesting read.

The division modifier is completely BS IMO, and I'm not sure it's an actual true representation of skill. I have a friend in the top 100 on SC2 ranks that didn't crack the top 200 here. He plays players like Sheth, EnvY, etc. and is usually even with them or they are slightly favored against him. He beat EnvY (even match), who is fairly high on that list, has more points than envy, but is in a "worse" division therefore does not crack the list? That's a load of bullshit if you ask me.

This isn't an isolated case, either. He plays a lot of the guys on the top200, as even matches, and beats many of them.

Your friend needs to play a lot more games and/or have a higher win percentage. Accumulating points is the only thing that matters.

Over 900 games played, 55% win% and comfortably over 2500pts.
IPA
Profile Joined August 2010
United States3206 Posts
November 22 2010 20:44 GMT
#50
On November 23 2010 05:42 Arcanne wrote:
Katari = mTw-Ghostridah from wc3


Damn, really?

Blast from the past! Used to love watching that guy play.
Time held me green and dying though I sang in my chains like the sea.
ensis
Profile Joined May 2010
Germany340 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-22 20:59:59
November 22 2010 20:59 GMT
#51
On November 23 2010 04:57 heishe wrote:
don't know about pvt, but zvp is fine. in 99% of the replays out there where the toss lost against the zerg, after watching the replay I will be able to almost instantly point out a major mistake or missed opportunity of the protoss player.

may sound weird, but there are very few protoss who've got zerg figured out. most just don't play good enough.



you see, thats the problem with almost all of you guys. the protoss didnt play perfect, he made a mistake, he deserved to lose.
you actually know, that every zerg makes mistakes, too? and guess what, every pvz the toss won, i could easily as hell point out the big massive mistake the zerg did or a big awesome missed opportunity.
so its all balanced right?
its not about making mistakes in terms of balance, its about getting punished harder or less hard for them.

and pvz is a complete mess right now, you cant make any judgements about balance in this matchup right now, maybe it only needs time, maybe a change, only time will show. guess what, after zergies got their precious roach range upgrade (which was propably necessary though) and the zealots have been nerfed even further, this matchup got completely turned upside down for protoss.

i´m not saying, youre wrong, but i´m saying your argumentation is plain wrong and nothing like that stupid l2p shit, that every fucking toss or terran threw at zergs head back in the days where you were thoroughly underpowered.

the whiners from yesterday are the l2p flamers from tomorrow. damn people need to learn smth. about objectivity.
this is Day[9] Daily #266 where we learn to be a better substractor- - - - - - - - - - - - -even Chuck Norris watches Day[9] Daily - - - - - - - TL ban policy sucks ratsass
Kinky
Profile Blog Joined September 2008
United States4126 Posts
November 22 2010 21:41 GMT
#52
Gretorp is so handsome :3
NexUmbra
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Scotland3776 Posts
November 22 2010 22:15 GMT
#53
Do people not know the definition of rage? I'm frothing at the mouth here.
Life has won two GSLs and a Blizzard Cup. NOT three GSLs.
Kpyolysis32
Profile Joined April 2010
553 Posts
November 22 2010 22:16 GMT
#54
On November 23 2010 04:16 chadissilent wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 23 2010 03:31 Barook wrote:
On November 23 2010 03:23 MaiYoH wrote:
It's interesting to see mTwDIMAGA make this list with only 84 wins. While I would agree with Blizzard that he deserves to be in the top 200 in NA, his position with so few games played makes me even more curious as to how Blizzard actually determines who makes their top 200.

He's in a S-Rank league (means +0 modifier) and has enough points to qualify. Look it up in Excalibur's thread, it's an interesting read.

The division modifier is completely BS IMO, and I'm not sure it's an actual true representation of skill. I have a friend in the top 100 on SC2 ranks that didn't crack the top 200 here. He plays players like Sheth, EnvY, etc. and is usually even with them or they are slightly favored against him. He beat EnvY (even match), who is fairly high on that list, has more points than envy, but is in a "worse" division therefore does not crack the list? That's a load of bullshit if you ask me.

This isn't an isolated case, either. He plays a lot of the guys on the top200, as even matches, and beats many of them.


You actually have it completely backwards. The division modifier changes your ladder points, and not your top 200 points. So if your friend has the same number of points as people in the top 200, but isn't there, it just means he's worse than them but in a low tier division, so his points look the same. I don't like the system either, but it's certainly not screwing your friend out of a position in the top 200, instead it's just making him look higher on the ladder than he actually is.
Man, do I not keep this up to date, or what?
deth
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
Australia1757 Posts
November 22 2010 22:27 GMT
#55
Awesome, after migrating from SEA server I finally cracked into the top 200 at #130
Darpa
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Canada4413 Posts
November 22 2010 23:06 GMT
#56
On November 23 2010 03:26 kYem wrote:
grats Gretorp, i see why he don't stream any more, still hopefully he will in future

I miss his sweet voice ;D



Me too, hes my favorite streamer by a mile and yet he never streams anymore. Sad Face. Glad to see him in top 10, He'll be a big presence at MLG next year!
"losers always whine about their best, Winners go home and fuck the prom queen"
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46655 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-22 23:12:38
November 22 2010 23:12 GMT
#57
On November 23 2010 04:20 SheaR619 wrote:
Who is cheese? I see him in every top 200 NA but i never really see him in tournament. I see him a few time on Trump stream but everytime i see him play he always seem to 4 gate and play very cheesy. I also saw him probe rush Trump once -.-. So hmm.....who is he anyways?


So he plays really standard AND plays really cheesy from time to time?

Isn't this... how everyone plays?

But yeah, who is Cheese? I haven't heard of him, and as a Protoss player, I'm definitely interested in hearing about the top Protoss players!
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
FabledIntegral
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
United States9232 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-22 23:16:17
November 22 2010 23:15 GMT
#58
Interesting to see this graph as someone on BNET posted this...

http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/2558/top20011222010.jpg

[image loading]

Why are image sizes retarded again on TL? It happened just a bit ago (within the last month I think...)
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States46655 Posts
November 22 2010 23:43 GMT
#59
On November 23 2010 08:15 FabledIntegral wrote:
Interesting to see this graph as someone on BNET posted this...

http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/2558/top20011222010.jpg

[image loading]

Why are image sizes retarded again on TL? It happened just a bit ago (within the last month I think...)


At this rate, Random > Protoss in no time!

+ Show Spoiler +
Extrapolation FTW
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Najda
Profile Joined June 2010
United States3765 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-23 00:15:03
November 23 2010 00:13 GMT
#60
CombatEx #140 o.O

I think a chill vs combatex rematch would be one sided so many dreams crushed.
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