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On August 14 2010 16:13 NonFactor wrote:
Still waiting for some amazing creative replays from Kigari where he owns high level Terrans with ''creative'' play. Something tells me we won't see it. Maybe you can share some replays of Zergs destroying you when you play your Terran, with this very creative play that everybody else but you seem to have missed.
But its still fun to see his posts, ignorance is bliss.
Just watch MaDFrog beat TLO in some games during the showmatch. He does use creative play.
http://tv.esl.eu/de/vod/view/22299
http://tv.esl.eu/de/vod/22308
I would be very careful with that ignorance of your own ... but as an IdrA follower you will probably claim that MaDFrog and TLO arent good players.
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On August 14 2010 16:23 Rabiator wrote:
I would be very careful with that ignorance of your own ... but as an IdrA follower you will probably claim that MaDFrog and TLO arent good players.
I would be very careful with that ignorance of yours but as Idra hater you will probably keep on trolling.
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the thing is there are 2 idras, one is a clever man who is good at trash talking, and the other one is a child who rages when he loses.
So yea all your pro-idra sentiments are only limited to his more of a RL alter ego.
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On August 14 2010 16:26 Oleksandr wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2010 16:23 Rabiator wrote:
I would be very careful with that ignorance of your own ... but as an IdrA follower you will probably claim that MaDFrog and TLO arent good players.
I would be very careful with that ignorance of yours but as Idra hater you will probably keep on trolling.
Where is your proof then to counter mine? Semi-clever words dont make it true.
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On August 14 2010 15:57 Rabiator wrote:
I wonder why this thread is still running, since it was destined to be a "discussion" about manners and not Starcraft from the beginning. Most other people would probably have been told to "blog it" ... since it contains PERSONAL OPINION, but not Artosis ...
That's for the mods to decide and not someone who has been here for a couple of months, don't you think?
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On August 14 2010 16:23 Rabiator wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2010 16:13 NonFactor wrote:
Still waiting for some amazing creative replays from Kigari where he owns high level Terrans with ''creative'' play. Something tells me we won't see it. Maybe you can share some replays of Zergs destroying you when you play your Terran, with this very creative play that everybody else but you seem to have missed.
But its still fun to see his posts, ignorance is bliss. Just watch MaDFrog beat TLO in some games during the showmatch. He does use creative play. http://tv.esl.eu/de/vod/view/22299http://tv.esl.eu/de/vod/22308I would be very careful with that ignorance of your own ... but as an IdrA follower you will probably claim that MaDFrog and TLO arent good players.
Well Madfrog doesn't have awesome macro but he does ok with what he's got. So I can sorta agree but disagree with Idra on that point. The biggest thing holding both of them back is decision making be it builds or unit composition. TLO is getting better at it and is further along than Madfrog in that department as evidenced by that series. IF TLO sticks with T he should do alright so there's another point I can agree with Idra on.
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Why does everyone overlook TLO.
The guy is good. He is willing to try anything to see if it works.....
Unlike basically 75% of the starcraft populus, he grabs something and tries to think outside of the box.
Idra who barely changes his strategy would be already fighting an uphill battle as he will have no idea what TLO is doing.
The best thing about creativity is that you don't have the disadvantage of your oppenant knowing what you are going to do.
Tbh i think people are just calling all terran players bad because apperantly "TERRAN IS OP GG NUBS". TLO is i'd say one to watch for the future and i'd expect Idra if he doesn't try some new stuff to be easily picked off in the early stages.
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On August 14 2010 16:13 NonFactor wrote:
Still waiting for some amazing creative replays from Kigari where he owns high level Terrans with ''creative'' play. Something tells me we won't see it. Maybe you can share some replays of Zergs destroying you when you play your Terran, with this very creative play that everybody else but you seem to have missed.
But its still fun to see his posts, ignorance is bliss.
And you won't get any because the moment I post them, you're going to say "ololol doesn't matter not pro-tournament-korean games ololol".
I already posted some links to youtube videos; Quit your snail trail for 5 minutes and go watch them.
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On August 14 2010 18:31 Kigari wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2010 16:13 NonFactor wrote:
Still waiting for some amazing creative replays from Kigari where he owns high level Terrans with ''creative'' play. Something tells me we won't see it. Maybe you can share some replays of Zergs destroying you when you play your Terran, with this very creative play that everybody else but you seem to have missed.
But its still fun to see his posts, ignorance is bliss. And you won't get any because the moment I post them, you're going to say "ololol doesn't matter not pro-tournament-korean games ololol". I already posted some links to youtube videos; Quit your snail trail for 5 minutes and go watch them.
Right, keep dodging, your pretty good at it.
You posted a game of madfrog vs TLO, where TLO goes for a FE on where there is something blocking it. Delaying his expansion alot, which also gave Madfrog more then enough freedom to take a 3rd instantly.
TLO then follows it up by obviously going BIO.
So your actually thinking that a Zerg beating a fast expanding BIO Terran is a good showcase of ''creativity''? Seriously? LOL. Thank you for again showing that you really have no grasp on the bullshit you are spouting. What was so creative? He did some cute stuff in that game, but if I get such a commanding lead since the start, I do cute stuff too. He did the normal counter to bio army, which is mutabaneling. Destroyed TLOs first push, and the game was over by then.
But that game also shows well how fast Terran can swap up to a biomech army, of course, Madfrogs lead was so big by then it didn't matter.
Am I the only one that finds it ridicolous that his arguement that T isn't op vs Z is that when T goes for some wierd FE build that benefitted the Z way more and then follows it up with a pure bio push? Good job man. Also baneling mines have been used since phase 1 early weeks, but it died out for 1 reason. People stopped going for bio because Mech is so much stronger.
A better example would have been Metalopolis game where Madfrog was very aggressive with his Roaches and managed to win through that. But that game would probably make you hate him since he does the typical Idra type FE > Mass Roach build against Mech. >=[ Where he pretty much only made Roaches untill T3. Very creative play! He tried to use Nydus which was instantly put down.
Only ''creative'' part of that was his burrow movement but that was also due to TLOs sloppiness and overreaction. (Leaving his natural completely open just because he had a few Roaches in his base.) What I don't understand though how TLO let it happen in the first place. I thought it was pretty standard to make an engineering bay so you can quickly make turrets incase of you see Mutalisks. I know I do it, and I always put 1 turret in front of my base. Burrow attacks can be dangerous, but they are way too easily stopped. Also, TLO failed to see the movement underground even though it was quite obvious he was looking at the screen atleast once, which was just bad play for him. (It isn't hard to see, since nothing else in this game makes the same effect.)
I have a open mind when it comes to trying out new things, but I'm looking for something solid and consistent. (Terran has 3403924 solid openings with 329482 proper follow ups against Zerg.) So far I haven't found anything solid or consistent, closest what I have seen is what Idra does. And he has something to proove for it too. (King of the Beta.) While only thing Madfrog has is gimmicky stuff and he still got stomped twice in a BO series. Nothing solid.
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So Zerg isn't UP just that TLO is bad ok.
Different Spin, still same QQ.
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On August 14 2010 19:20 Samus wrote:
So Zerg isn't UP just that TLO is bad ok.
Different Spin, still same QQ.
tbh when you try things like bc rush and the likes in showmatches there are bound to be losses eventually. Everyone who are creative have an achilles heel in that if they get overly creative they die and suffer stupid losses to people who cant macro for shit. DID YOU EVEN SEE MADFROGS MONEY SKYROCKET ? ;D
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On August 14 2010 18:19 Samus wrote:
Why does everyone overlook TLO.
The guy is good. He is willing to try anything to see if it works.....
Unlike basically 75% of the starcraft populus, he grabs something and tries to think outside of the box.
Idra who barely changes his strategy would be already fighting an uphill battle as he will have no idea what TLO is doing.
The best thing about creativity is that you don't have the disadvantage of your oppenant knowing what you are going to do.
Tbh i think people are just calling all terran players bad because apperantly "TERRAN IS OP GG NUBS". TLO is i'd say one to watch for the future and i'd expect Idra if he doesn't try some new stuff to be easily picked off in the early stages.
TLO is also a zerg player, personally he's easely top 5 on my favorite Zerg players, altough he plays T way more
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can idra go 5 minutes without whining about terran?
i think this movie gives you the answer.
also i find it amusing that idra wouldn't want a ZvP final because people would say "ahh so terran isn't overpowered!". come on kiddo, blizzard balance the game, not the community.
if the community had their way then zerg would be unstoppable atm, roaches would be 0.1 supply and infestors would have AOE mind control.
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Also something I noticed while looking for those Youtube videos. Kigari claims that he plays random so I can throw the arguement of him being biased towards Terran out of the window. Oh wait, a few posts back on this thread he actually says his main is Terran.
Way to be biased and then try to lie about it. Damn I love stomping ignorant people.
Alright, whos next?
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On August 14 2010 19:27 Madkipz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2010 19:20 Samus wrote:
So Zerg isn't UP just that TLO is bad ok.
Different Spin, still same QQ.
tbh when you try things like bc rush and the likes in showmatches there are bound to be losses eventually. Everyone who are creative have an achilles heel in that if they get overly creative they die and suffer stupid losses to people who cant macro for shit. DID YOU EVEN SEE MADFROGS MONEY SKYROCKET ? ;D
So MaDFrogs money skyrocketing makes him bad? Well you understand the Zerg mechanics? The fact that you cant queue five units in a barracks but have to wait for larvae to be available? If he just builds some drones (because the game situation allows him to do it) the larvae are spent and his economy is still cashing in loads of resources. Obviously it is natural to have skyrocketing resources in a situation like that.
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On August 14 2010 11:47 Kigari wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2010 07:19 elroy wrote:
Also Terran won the second game. So I'm not sure why exactly you picked that one. Zerg didn't even do any harassing. Dimaga tried to do a doom drop but failed miserably running it straight through a cloud of vikings, although if he had just ran all those ultras through the front I think it would have done better. My point exactly. Zergs need to use ALL the options available. Scrubs thinking you can basecamp and then mass roach/muta while having scouted jack' to win are doomed to failure, just like idra. Call OP all you want, the fact is you're too bad to beat terran (which indeed takes more skill than to beat protoss depending on build). You know... I'm getting really tired of all this shit from scrub number one fanboys simply because of the number of times i've been OBLITERATED by zergs and protoss when I fell on terran as a random player. Fact is I actually had to learn the hard way how to decently play terran. Something I'm afraid most of you didn't. Terran isn't OP. Terran can't warp units. Terran can't suddenly decide to switch his entire strategy. Terrans must PLAN AHEAD and adapt according to the enemy if their pre-set plan can't work. Learning how to react/adapt ain't imbalance or "op", it's skill, pure and simple. If you can't deal with that then you're a scrub and a sore loser doomed to QQ imbalance, just like your "idol".
I think he finally figured it out. Zerg players all are sit on 2 bases massing a few unit types and are terrible... wait a second....
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On August 14 2010 19:27 Madkipz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2010 19:20 Samus wrote:
So Zerg isn't UP just that TLO is bad ok.
Different Spin, still same QQ.
tbh when you try things like bc rush and the likes in showmatches there are bound to be losses eventually. Everyone who are creative have an achilles heel in that if they get overly creative they die and suffer stupid losses to people who cant macro for shit. DID YOU EVEN SEE MADFROGS MONEY SKYROCKET ? ;D
Atleast you're not saying TLO is bad like some posters.
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On August 14 2010 19:27 Madkipz wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2010 19:20 Samus wrote:
So Zerg isn't UP just that TLO is bad ok.
Different Spin, still same QQ.
tbh when you try things like bc rush and the likes in showmatches there are bound to be losses eventually. Everyone who are creative have an achilles heel in that if they get overly creative they die and suffer stupid losses to people who cant macro for shit. DID YOU EVEN SEE MADFROGS MONEY SKYROCKET ? ;D
People don't seem to understand that it's actually ok for zergs to let their money skyrocket sometimes. You don't lose larvae (indeed, you can MASS them, to a point) and it allows for massive "tech switches," so what's the big deal? It's not like with terran or protoss where you miss out on an unmissable chance to get more units.
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On August 15 2010 02:16 kajeus wrote:Show nested quote +On August 14 2010 19:27 Madkipz wrote:On August 14 2010 19:20 Samus wrote:
So Zerg isn't UP just that TLO is bad ok.
Different Spin, still same QQ.
tbh when you try things like bc rush and the likes in showmatches there are bound to be losses eventually. Everyone who are creative have an achilles heel in that if they get overly creative they die and suffer stupid losses to people who cant macro for shit. DID YOU EVEN SEE MADFROGS MONEY SKYROCKET ? ;D People don't seem to understand that it's actually ok for zergs to let their money skyrocket sometimes. You don't lose larvae (indeed, you can MASS them, to a point) and it allows for massive "tech switches," so what's the big deal? It's not like with terran or protoss where you miss out on an unmissable chance to get more units.
I agree with you to an extent, but it's very situational. It didn't seem like that was what MaDFroG was doing though, simply looked like poor macro to me.
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I would love to see more interviews with progamers, but please not with arrogant whiners like IdrA. I would prefer relaxed, nice guys like Artosis or TLO.
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EPT
