EPTits always helped me with practicing stuff though especially in bw1, it mainly just helps me get to speed on things when i see the timer and realize im not executing my build fast enough or not expanding early enough or whatever, but it probably would help lower level players like myself more than a better player in fine tuning early game stuff... either way its definitely unfair for tournaments and definitely should not be a feature in SC2
Anyone else wants a ingame match timer? - Page 2
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kyarisan
United States347 Posts
its always helped me with practicing stuff though especially in bw1, it mainly just helps me get to speed on things when i see the timer and realize im not executing my build fast enough or not expanding early enough or whatever, but it probably would help lower level players like myself more than a better player in fine tuning early game stuff... either way its definitely unfair for tournaments and definitely should not be a feature in SC2 | ||
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fabiano
Brazil4644 Posts
SC2 already lets you find them by pressing a single key; SC2 already let the workers automine; SC2 already has smartcasting; SC2 already has multiple building selection. edit: Like the guy said before in his post: supply count is your timer. | ||
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pilsken
Germany441 Posts
SC2 already shows you there are idle workers; SC2 already lets you find them by pressing a single key; SC2 already let the workers automine; SC2 already has smartcasting; SC2 already has multiple building selection. So SC2 isn't just a UI-fuckup anymore but lets you actually play the game instead of fighting against the limitiations of the interface/ai, congratulations for realizing that. I do not see how the information "You have played now 5 minutes and 32 seconds" is unfair, cheating or making the game more shallow. You could also just look at your minerals and deduct by the average mining rate how much time has passed and get a pretty exact result, which should be sufficent for all purposes. | ||
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Mulloy
United States86 Posts
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b0t
Luxembourg37 Posts
A warning message telling you that your Nexus has max energy? A command button to make a unit retreat to your HQ? A list of barracks not producing anything? IMHO these are all very good suggestions. As long as both players have the same information the game is fair. And the more information, the more convinient the interface the better. What will matter than is not so much the expirience, but strategy and inteligence. | ||
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-Archangel-
Croatia7457 Posts
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crate
United States2474 Posts
If you rule that they're not allowed, you've just created a 100% unenforceable rule, and if I cared about getting competitive and got good, I would 100% break it if I felt it would help (and right now I think it would). I think unenforceable rules are generally a bad idea, because they just punish people who follow them. (And I don't think that this really means much anyway. Do I have to take my watch off if I'm playing SC2? Toss my phone across the room? Disable my Windows clock?) --- I'd be in favor of having an in-game clock as an option. | ||
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Puosu
7104 Posts
On July 19 2010 02:39 b0t wrote: >> If you add a clock to help you then what's next? A list of enemy units inside your vision? A warning message telling you that your Nexus has max energy? A command button to make a unit retreat to your HQ? A list of barracks not producing anything? IMHO these are all very good suggestions. As long as both players have the same information the game is fair. And the more information, the more convinient the interface the better. What will matter than is not so much the expirience, but strategy and inteligence. If you start picking out all the minor skills like timing and mechanical things you will find yourself playing a game of rock paper scissors where the people are just trying to figure out which build order they should perfectly execute this time. In Brood War (and the current state of SC2) while some builds have advantages over each other you could still easily win if you were to make your opponent execute a mistake or had better execution. How do you force your enemy to make a mistake if he has the easiest interface that automates everything for you? How do you play better than him other than pick your strategy? Where do you capitalize? It doesn't matter if its "fair" when the game has absolutely no potential to show off any skill. If Blizzard would implement those things it would practically shout "fuck you!" out loud to the competitive scene and mold the game in to another easy to play, easy to master RTS the market is already full of. Brood War would remain the only true RTS eSports, casuals would enjoy the game for a while until moving on and Blizzard would have made a small fraction of what they could be making had a true eSports scene emerged. An in-game timer is just a small step as were MBS and automining. It's a slippery slope and if we continue to go on we're going to find a game not suitable for competitive gaming. | ||
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NB
Netherlands12045 Posts
 ofc it should be ban in serious esport but hving 1 around in daily life is not bad | ||
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Dental Floss
United States1015 Posts
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crate
United States2474 Posts
On July 19 2010 04:22 Puosu wrote: An in-game timer is just a small step as were MBS and automining. It's a slippery slope and if we continue to go on we're going to find a game not suitable for competitive gaming. No. You might end up with a very different kind of game, but I very much disagree that you'd necessarily end up with a game not suitable for competitive gaming. | ||
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Mortician
Bulgaria2332 Posts
On July 19 2010 02:04 pilsken wrote: So SC2 isn't just a UI-fuckup anymore but lets you actually play the game instead of fighting against the limitiations of the interface/ai, congratulations for realizing that. I do not see how the information "You have played now 5 minutes and 32 seconds" is unfair, cheating or making the game more shallow. You could also just look at your minerals and deduct by the average mining rate how much time has passed and get a pretty exact result, which should be sufficent for all purposes. For the lower level players it will be like "How to stop this push that comes at about 8 minutes, oh i need X amount of units" thus making the game even more like chess, you do this at this moment to prevent that at hight level it would be "I injected larvae at 1:00, next larvae at 1:25" it brings down the skill cap | ||
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HubertFelix
France631 Posts
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Lrn2pleyn00b
8 Posts
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Powster
United States650 Posts
And about the injected larva at specific times stuff.. if he has to look at the clock to know to inject more larva then hes obviously going to be messing up something else that doesnt require time like his micro while he sees that its 1:25 or whatever.. If both players know the time then theres still skill involved since you both know what time it is anyway.. | ||
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Sokalo
United States375 Posts
The fact that everyone has slight variations on build orders. The distance differences betweens spawning locations and maps. The sheer number of unit combinations that can come at you between the three races. Skill or speed gaps between players. The combination of all of the above. Yes, you could probably get pretty consistent numbers off of all of this stuff with a clock, but you'll have a better intuitive feel for it long before you memorize it all. If you've logged enough games, you usually know to get that photon cannon up at that expansion before you drop that stargate or you run the risk of getting overrun by a zerg player who hasn't expanded. Or whatever. I really wouldn't care if they put a timer into the game. It wouldn't lower the skill ceiling whatsoever. It might, just might help weaker players with very basic things. I really don't think it's worth much more than that. This reminds me of chess players who put hours and hours of work into their openings thinking it's going to help them improve. Meanwhile they can't play the middle or endgame worth a damn. If they'd worry more about their tactics and general knowledge, they'd end up seeing more results, and ironically it'd probably do more for their openings than had they just focused on them exclusively. | ||
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bulge
161 Posts
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-Archangel-
Croatia7457 Posts
Also compairing sc2 with chess is a good comparison as sc is often called a chess of video game world. Having strategies that revolve around minutes is a good thing as it promotes strategy and precision. | ||
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Thoreezhea1
United States532 Posts
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omninmo
2349 Posts
Poll: Would you choose to have a simple timer displayed in game? close this thread, please. (13) yes (3) no (3) 19 total votes Your vote: Would you choose to have a simple timer displayed in game? | ||
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