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This Friday ESL TV is hosting the first ESL TV Pro Invite Cup in the StarCraft II Beta. But this time not only four players are going to show their skills. A total of 16 players well known from the StarCraft-, WoW- and WC3-scene will play for honor and 200€ plus ESL T-Shirts by adidas. The cup will start live on ESL TV this Friday at 5pm CET and will bring you about 5 hours of thrilling StarCraft II action live to your monitor!
A lot of StarCraft players such as White-Ra, ret and Strelok join the show. Additionally some WarCraft III pros will join us as well as orly, who made a name for himself in World of Warcraft. The two former ESL Pro Series WarCraft III champions HasuObs and XlorD will be live in the ESL TV studio to give statements and their impressions on the games.
To find out the full lineup and tournament bracket, head HERE
There are also chances to get your hands on some prizes. During the show ESL TV will raffle 5 Starcraft II Beta Keys. To win, all you have to do is watch ESL TV and answer the question that the commentators will ask during the show.
There are also 10x 1 Month ESL TV Premium Keys up for grabs. All you have to do to win an ESL TV Premium key is post below why you think you need the key more than anyone else!
The show will be brought to you in German, but during the Beta Key raffle it will switch to English.
You find the Livestream HERE
The tournament setup:
Structure: Single Elemination
Mode: Best of Three
Mapvoting: 2 Vetos per players, High Seed bans and picks first
Prizepot: 200€ and 2 ESL adidas T-Shirts for the champion
Mappool
* Blistering Sands
* Desert Oasis
* Scrap Station
* Steppes of War
* Kulas Ravine
* Lost Temple
* Metalopolis
Brackets for the ESL TV Starcraft II Beta Pro-Invite Cup
Replays
ESL Invite Tournament #1 Full Replay Pack
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On March 19 2010 02:48 TaKeSeN wrote:
All you have to do to win an ESL TV Premium key is post below why you think you need the key more than anyone else!
I want a ESL Premium SC Key key more than anyone else because I dropped out of college to go pro at SC2 and don't have my own key still. I've been training Brood War the last 3 years after I heard the announcement for SC2. Plz pick meeee.
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Glad to see you posting here yourself! We will make this the official thread.
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On March 19 2010 03:00 PokePill wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2010 02:48 TaKeSeN wrote:
All you have to do to win an ESL TV Premium key is post below why you think you need the key more than anyone else!
I want a beta key more than anyone else because I dropped out of college to go pro at SC2 and don't have my own key still. I've been training Brood War the last 3 years after I heard the announcement for SC2. Plz pick meeee.
ESL TV premium key
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I need the ESL TV Premium Key because i didn't get a SC2 Beta Key. That made me so sad i need to watch SC2 24/7 now to prevent me from dieing.
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No ret 
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hey ret got some important meeting and he is said that he can t make it. we replaced him with zeerax who is also in a really good shape from what i ve seen. I hope you gonna enjoy the event 
//Dennis
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I'm in the same boat as Pokepill. Dropped out and everything to train. I've been training on and off on sc1 in preparation for sc2. Now that its in beta I've been playing as much as I can in between work and gf. I'd give my left nut to be able to have an ESL premium key to watch the pro scene and I'd give even more to actually get invited to that tournament or one like it. Please let me have one!
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I need a premium key because i dont have a beta key and otherwise i will start playing CnC4.
This sounds like and awesome event and i really want to watch it in HD.
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Betting atleast half your followers are from outside germany, so please do this in english, if the casters know english that is:p
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Doubtful half their sponsors are outside of Germany though! If German companies pay for their stuff they need to keep their German viewers happy.
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I should get an ESL TV Premium Key because I've watched your ESL tv shows for a long time now. You should also bring back that guy who casted with Matt who always wore lumberjack shirts.
Why am I more deserving than other people? I don't know really. I'm #1 in my division and I've played Terran since day 1 beta? I'm also half German?
http://img641.imageshack.us/img641/5687/screenshot016y.jpg
anyway, good luck with your shows.
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Dont really know why id deserve a esl TV premium key over someone else, just that id really like to watch it in nice quality, dont have a beta key so observing ist the only option to enjoy the game atm for me and i have the bonus of understanding what Take filly spell and Sonic were talking about.
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i definitely want a esl tv premium key! i watched the show from the first episode! (after it switched from giga to esl tv) and most likely didnt miss any since tomorrow is gonna be fucking great for me this will be such a huuuge bonus <3
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Um, does anyone know what time EST this is at? I suck at time zones.
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its 5 hours difference imo that means 5 pm cet is 1pm est imo and the tournament ends at like 6 - 7 pm ur time
best regards
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I have my money on Lucifron. He's so young and he was coming up fast in WC3 scene. If he's not good at sc2 yet, he will be.
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On March 19 2010 08:06 Two_DoWn wrote:
Um, does anyone know what time EST this is at? I suck at time zones.
CET: 5 pm (UTC +1)
EST: 11 am (UTC -5)
PST: 8 am (UTC -8)
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Canada5565 Posts
Damn I might just have to skip class for this..
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I need the premium key more than anyone else, because the lineup of that tournament is so promising and awesome, that I just GOTTA see that in good quality.
All that is stopping me from tuning in to esl.tv more frequently is the crappy quality of the free streams, as I like the commentators as well as the content.
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i really love watching your tournaments. Been following for a while now and watched the last sc2 tourney you put on and it was amazing. The premium would make it so i would be in awe over the stream and really decipher what is going on.
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I don't know what an esl premium key is so you should give me one to satisfy my curiosity.
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I need the key because otherwise I have to buy the premium quality key and then I can't afford to renew my son's WoW subscription. I don't want to live through that.
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Cheering for wc3 players - Insomnia and Lucifron. We need moar competition in SC2.
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I don't really need the premium key, because I already have premium stream. 
However, since I am currently an research exchange student in Japan, I haven't played any game for the last freaking 6 month. That is because my laptop is so shit and has crappy onboard graphics.
Needless to say ping to Europe is devastating as well, if I could play anyway. 
What is more, there are still 6 month to go. :O
Help me to survive, even if I can only watch the VoD afterwards, because the show is from 1 am to 6 am and I need to travel by train 10 hours tomorrow, starting at 6 am. Oo
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I'd like a premium key , so i can show ESPORTS to my IRL friend's.
My friends currently refuse/ arent engaged to watch any of the current quality .
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Chance to win key... will sacrifice sleep so I can watch all the matches, but with my luck I won't get the key anyways
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I would like an ESL premium key so that I would be able to enjoy the esports matches on ESL TV. I have a very fast internet connection and I hope to watch the stream via high quality with my friends and family and spread the joy of esports. I also think I deserve the key more than anyone else as I share computers with my friends and family members and giving me a key is like giving 5 other people a key to enjoy esports at a high quality.
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Hopefully I can catch some vod's on this :|
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Best of luck to all the players!
Put on a good show for us.
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I should get an ESL key because I spent countless hours watching every single SC vod for the past 3 years. I'm a hardcore starcraft fan and it sucks to be without a key
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I totally want an ESL TV premium key, because not only could I watch all those great ESL TV shows in high definition, but also adore the ESL TV hosts, especially Take in their full HD glory!
I love you Take! You're so sexy! 
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i want premium so i can cheat in high quality without commercials
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I need ESL premium TV key because I dont own a TV at all and I watch pretty much everything on ESL instead.
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I would really love a ESL TV premium key. What is it exactly btw ?
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Canada5565 Posts
On March 19 2010 20:24 zionman wrote:
I'd like a premium key , so i can show ESPORTS to my IRL friend's.
My friends currently refuse/ arent engaged to watch any of the current quality .
There are plenty of high quality videos you can show them.
You should give the premium account to someone who can actually understand the casters : /
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real livestream or no thanks! octoshit needs to go.
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On March 19 2010 23:59 G4MR wrote:
Yeah I just purchased premium to watch it in HD ($6.00) looks good. It's about to start in 2 minutes guys!!!!
Make sure you post in the thread that you just purchased an account and would like to see future streams in English, this is the post I made:
"Hi, I just subscribed to the premium stream to check it out for 3 months or so. If it turns out that every single one of your events is in German I will not renew the subscription. ESL-TV, with the release of SC2 this is your chance to transition into English streams and hugely broaden your audience beyond just your limited base of subscribers in Germany. You probably won't get another chance like this, make good use of it!"
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On March 20 2010 00:44 SteeJanS wrote:Show nested quote +On March 19 2010 23:59 G4MR wrote:
Yeah I just purchased premium to watch it in HD ($6.00) looks good. It's about to start in 2 minutes guys!!!! Make sure you post in the thread that you just purchased an account and would like to see future streams in English, this is the post I made: "Hi, I just subscribed to the premium stream to check it out for 3 months or so. If it turns out that every single one of your events is in German I will not renew the subscription. ESL-TV, with the release of SC2 this is your chance to transition into English streams and hugely broaden your audience beyond just your limited base of subscribers in Germany. You probably won't get another chance like this, make good use of it!"
Send me a link I'll support it.
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On March 20 2010 00:49 G4MR wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 00:44 SteeJanS wrote:On March 19 2010 23:59 G4MR wrote:
Yeah I just purchased premium to watch it in HD ($6.00) looks good. It's about to start in 2 minutes guys!!!! Make sure you post in the thread that you just purchased an account and would like to see future streams in English, this is the post I made: "Hi, I just subscribed to the premium stream to check it out for 3 months or so. If it turns out that every single one of your events is in German I will not renew the subscription. ESL-TV, with the release of SC2 this is your chance to transition into English streams and hugely broaden your audience beyond just your limited base of subscribers in Germany. You probably won't get another chance like this, make good use of it!" Send me a link I'll support it.
Below the livestream is a comment section, assuming you're logged in and watching the stream you should just be able to comment normally:
http://tv.esl.eu/de/esltv_stream/#/de/esltv_stream/stream/55-flv-future
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can not wait for it to start!
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Hmm has it started yet? Im still watching the commercials.
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Okay just some Counter-Strike commercials?
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Yeah just highlight footage atm
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What time is it suppose to start then. It says 11.00am CST and its already 11:10 on my part.
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as always some delay
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On March 20 2010 01:09 TRAP[yoo] wrote:as always some delay
not ALWAYS on ESL TV, but it happens :D has started now
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haha its sonic from bwcl isn't it?
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Cheering for Dennis (HasuObs), Marius (HoRRoR), Silviu (NightEnd) & Stefan (MorroW). But I also like Ixi (XLORD), Hayder (Haypro) and Naaaaugrim!! :D Actually nearly all of them are on my friend list-_-;
GladHeAteHer and MorroW as well as LucifroNNN are all really good Terrans with MorroW and LucifroNNN both playing really macro-heavy style, while GladHeAteHer is more agressive. NightEnd and HasuObs are both clever Protoss with good macro and micro (storm / feedback). ZeeRax always rushes to storm PvT and is really good at taking expansions and in battles, also has great macro to back it up. Weak vs early game agression (marine rush though).
Don't know about the Zergs too much, DIMAGA creeps over the whole map and defends with mass speed/baneling while teching.
Too bad I'm at work T_T.. wanted to play in it / see it ;;
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Australia7069 Posts
has a game actually started yet? I'm seeing an old sc2 movie :S
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I would love to have an ESL premium key because I just can't bring myself to finally subscribe permanently.
I watch nearly every show on esl-tv but I still couldn't convince myself yet. Hopefully one of those keys can change my mind. At least I hope so.
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Yeah it is damn hard to cheer for one player... HasuObs is probably the player i cheer the most for. He is such a nice guy.
I probably cheer for:
P: HasuObs
Z: Orly
T: Demuslim
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On March 20 2010 01:15 Kiante wrote:
has a game actually started yet? I'm seeing an old sc2 movie :S
no probably gonna take some minutes. both hasuobs and xlord are on the studio and are getting pre-interviewed. then we probably gonna hear some words from the commentators (filly and spell i think?) and then it will start, i predict like 20 more minutes till one game starts
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I would be glad if someone could live-report.
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Australia7069 Posts
Anyone know a way to limit the uploads from octoshape? uploads eat up my quota :S Can someone relay on livestream or something?
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If someone wants to give me a premium key or whatever I can stream on justin TV in 1080p as long as that's not against forum rules or whatever =o
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bought premium for this, but take and filly look weird in hq:D
anyone yay esports party got friends invited and snacks
hoping for a good show
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Its really laggy for me can someone stream it T__T
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On March 20 2010 01:23 Dacendoran wrote:
If someone wants to give me a premium key or whatever I can stream on justin TV in 1080p as long as that's not against forum rules or whatever =o
probably not allowed.. you'd steal their viewers :p
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omg can some1 retell the adress plz
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On March 20 2010 01:28 KhAlleB wrote:omg can some1 retell the adress plz
Edit: Wrong Info
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On March 20 2010 01:30 iDfyU wrote:
gewinn@esl.eu
thanks man :D
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question is: what is the homeworld of the protoss.
for everyone who missed it
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http://www.justin.tv/dacendoran
For people that find the original stream unwatchable (I'll take it down if asked to)
It's in crappy stream quality but the same quality that the original is cast at
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On March 20 2010 01:12 Coulthard wrote:
haha its sonic from bwcl isn't it?
it is i think, yes
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game1 hasuobs vs strelok is starting
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my eyes are bleeding so much light ._.
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Australia7069 Posts
dacendoran: the bottom is cut off a bit
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<TheLittleOne> Nazgul owned Orly.
<TheLittleOne> esl tourney
<TheLittleOne> and its still 1-0 not 2-0^^
gogo Nazgul :D
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Orly is a faggot :-(! He abuses imbalance to the max and thinks he's good. Hope he goes back to WOW. GO NAZGUL~
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Can someone please livereport ?
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morrow 1:0 too, aswell as demuslim 1:0
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On March 20 2010 01:45 G.s)NarutO wrote:Can someone please livereport ?
http://www.mymym.com/en/news/18193.html
I'll be updating until I fall asleep at my keyboard, and I have to go vote tomorrow morning, screw that! :D
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fail EMP's, nice micro by hasu
LucifroNNN 2:0
Demuslim 2:0
XlorD 1:0
lmao nice storms, not a weak spell lol
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<@MYM|DeMusliM> won my first 2-0
<@myMYM|frequency> awesome :D
and Nazgul 2-0
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HasuObs army composition is extremely good.
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Canada5565 Posts
On March 20 2010 01:52 frequency wrote:<@MYM|DeMusliM> won my first 2-0 <@myMYM|frequency> awesome :D and Nazgul 2-0
against Orly?? holy crap.
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nvm, readmore just said that lol
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On March 20 2010 01:45 G.s)NarutO wrote:Can someone please livereport ?
If just for the results, you can check out the match ticker on www.readmore.de
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On March 20 2010 01:53 uNiGNoRe wrote:
HasuObs army composition is extremely good.
Not even one Sentry though, dunno If I agree with that.
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3 terrans first 3 to go ro8, this is interesting :p
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On March 20 2010 01:58 MorroW wrote:
3 terrans first 3 to go ro8, this is interesting :p
<3 morrow :D
gogo morrow vs demuslim final :D
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On March 20 2010 01:58 MorroW wrote:
3 terrans first 3 to go ro8, this is interesting :p
terran strongest race obviously :-)
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On March 20 2010 01:59 HolydaKing wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 01:58 MorroW wrote:
3 terrans first 3 to go ro8, this is interesting :p terran strongest race obviously :-)
argghhh
xD not true
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DIMAGA 2:0 White-Ra, let's see if he will eat the terrans again.
Horror 1:1 Insomnia
XlorD got totally outmacroed
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Naugrim with some sexy sexy Zerg macro.
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ESL got some technical issues with their mail inbox (it's full). They said they are currently looking for a solution.
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LucifroNNN will win vs HasuObs, he's very strong... But I hope Dennis makes it~
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Canada5565 Posts
I just thought of something...where is retje?
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On March 20 2010 02:13 G.s)NarutO wrote:
LucifroNNN will win vs HasuObs, he's very strong... But I hope Dennis makes it~
First of all HasuObs has to win vs Strelok -_- Man, these terrans! :D
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And I still need livereports from the matches^^ not just results :D
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guys how many people you think watch this event ?
wow 30,000 email
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Ret and Infernal couldn't play, replaced by LucifroN and ZeeRaX.
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Lol glad I already got my beta key with all those mails 
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game #3 strelok vs hasuobs now
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I think Dennis said 30k jokingly in German earlier, and Sonic didn't get it.
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+ Show Spoiler +STRAIGHT BET
Match (2) 4.60 [6221] ORLY vrs LIQUID.NAZGUL
STAKE 3.00
TO WIN 10.80
WIN
10.80 WIN
03/18/2010 02:20 AM
oh yea, thanks naz :D
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2:1 HasuObs, Hasu massed Zealots+Immortals and 2 phoenix, then attacked. While Strelok decided to build an expansion after a couple of marauder/marines/a ghost and one banshee... the expansion was pretty late, just finished when Hasuobs attacked... HasuObs attack totally destroyed him though.
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I always believed in you Hasuuuuuu.
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HasuObs is my fav, he is just a nice guy :D
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Wow that ghost stasis was sexy by HasuObs
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Naugrim 2:1 XlorD, didn't see much of it, seemed like mass roaches ^^
Horror 2:1 Insomnia apparently
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y really loved that
edit: the ghost action by hasu
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That page is wrong, HasuObs won 2:1
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Predictions:
MorroW 2-1 Naugrim
HoRRoR 1-2 Nazgul
GladHeAteHer 2-0 DIMAGA
LucifroNNN 2-0 HasuObs
Nazgul 2-1 MorroW
LucifroNNN 2-0 GladHeAteHer
LucifroNNN 2-0 Nazgul
:D lets try these.
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On March 20 2010 02:20 no_re wrote:+ Show Spoiler +STRAIGHT BET
Match (2) 4.60 [6221] ORLY vrs LIQUID.NAZGUL
STAKE 3.00
TO WIN 10.80
WIN
10.80 WIN
03/18/2010 02:20 AM oh yea, thanks naz :D
Crazy pick lol! GG
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No games going on right now? :O
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10 BETA keys now in the raffle
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On March 20 2010 02:32 G.s)NarutO wrote:
No games going on right now? :O
Dimaga vs Demuslim right now.
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dimaga v demuslim, looking good for demuslim
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demuslim killing dimas natural
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Now Hasuobs vs Lucifron on LT.
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lucifron/demuslim/morrow, so many dominating terrans
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How can u win shuffle keys?
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hasuobs late expo because of his weird robo stargate build
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lucifron pushing, hasuobs has to retreat
battle evens out
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but lucfron at big eco advantage, prolly gonna push him over
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microing with marauder slow seems so strong
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I need a key because I need more reasons to sit down all day.
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lucifron snipes hasuobs' natural
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yeah this game is over. lucifron 1:0
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hasuobs ggs, 1-0 lucifron
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I wonder why HasuObs never uses sentries? :/
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demuslim dima game 2, nothing happening so far
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demuslim looking like hes gonna push soon with mass mm, dima now on 3 bases vs demuslim 2
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both macroing up huge armies, demuslim still pure mm, dima bane/ling adding hydras now
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dimaga flanking demuslim very nice but has to retreat as he has too few units
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Oh nice, actual micro to handle the banelings instead of just dying to them and crying OP.
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demuslim had a SICK marauder arc around his marine ball to prevent baneling damage there. Amazing control!
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Huge battle, Demuslim uses his marauders to tank the banelings, marines largely unscathed, Dimaga retreats.
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4 bases for dimage, 3 for demuslim, demuslim short of minerals
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next battle, now its demuslim retreating as dimaga managed to macro up a huge ass army
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Fungal growth devastates Demuslim's army. Demuslim retreats back to his nat.
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dimaga containing while killing off demuslims 3rd expo
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dimaga won that. pretty sweet game. i think demuslim played too scared, he kind of owned dimaga in the first battle, so i think he could've expanded early without risk
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Nazgul beats Horror in like 1 second, as expected.
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On March 20 2010 02:53 Bane_ wrote:
Oh nice, actual micro to handle the banelings instead of just dying to them and crying OP.
Try to micro vs banelings on creep, when they have hydras as support before stating all Terrans are just crybabies.
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GJ nazgul
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On March 20 2010 02:57 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
won 2-1
gj :D
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LucifroNNN beat HasuObs ((
Damn Terrans! ^^ Nice job Nazgul <--- last Protoss remaining
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On March 20 2010 02:25 G.s)NarutO wrote:
Predictions:
MorroW 2-1 Naugrim
HoRRoR 1-2 Nazgul -> CHECK
GladHeAteHer 2-0 DIMAGA
LucifroNNN 2-0 HasuObs -> CHECK
Nazgul 2-1 MorroW
LucifroNNN 2-0 GladHeAteHer
LucifroNNN 2-0 Nazgul
:D lets try these.
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so nice of them always talking in english about prices , y we watch to know about that:D
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HELL YEA 10 BETA KEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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On March 20 2010 03:03 KhAlleB wrote:
HELL YEA 10 BETA KEY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
yes but can we win that keys?
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If they'd make an English cast I'd pay for the HD stream
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YEA LUCIFRON DA BOSS.
He's so young, I think like 16 years old. He was a rising star in WC3. He has a future at the top of SC2 almost guaranteed.
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Demuslim killing spies like a boss.
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Fuck. Is anyone on the mac and watching this? I can't install that damn octoshape plugin thing and I want to know if there's some way to watch this. Any mac gurus??!
Go Lucifron! I'm glad war3 players are not getting mopped. I'm so sad that DImaga's the only zerg left. Go Zerg, Go Toss!
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like game 2 pretty stale match, both macroing up, demuslim with mm, bc, raven and dimage with hydra corruptor teching bloodlords
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send email to gewinn@esl.eu with the name name of protoss homeplanet
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On March 20 2010 03:04 rjT. wrote:yes but can we win that keys?
think so
if they make the announce in english, anyway i wont die if i try do so i already send my mail
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On March 20 2010 03:10 [DUF]MethodMan wrote:
demuslim fast bc lol
<3
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demuslim winning the first big battle despite having 80% of his units covered in fungal growth
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This seems awesome but the stream window and quality is quite shitty, I'm guessing ESL has some sort of premium stream though.
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very close fight in dimagas natural with dimaga cleaning it up eventually, no econ losses
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Dimaga's econ advantage is going to overwhelm Demuslim soon.
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demuslim ggs, broodlords raped him
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<@MYM|DeMusliM> i lost
<@myMYM|frequency>
/cry
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dimaga got way too good eco. great macro ability that guy. i wonder if lucifron will take him down
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Canada5565 Posts
Blizzard gives ESL 5 more beta keys, that's pretty damn cool. They must be really following the community.
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Broodlords are pretty spectacular.
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AH TT Demuslim, well fought!
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Some great fights, really looking forward to lucifronnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn vs dimaga.
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nice looking forward to luci dimaga
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As soon as my 13 years of german class at school prove to be useful the ESL casters start speaking english. FML.
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Lol at bit back and forth between English and German
Nice when I hear something I can understand and then they switch so I only get 10% of it
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Those guys are so nice to take care of us and speak a bit in englsih for we can understand.
this cast just make my day :D
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w00tw00t, naugrim beat morrow
TvZ and ZvP semis
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hope tvp/z final
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gonna be cool to see lucifer vs dimaga
aka its gonna be fun to see if terran manages to win any game at all
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nazgul is on the phone, yeah
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On March 20 2010 03:30 MorroW wrote:
gonna be cool to see lucifer vs dimaga
nononono not MYM]Lucifer! LucifroN7! xD
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HasuObs out Cheering for nazgul now!
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Cool Nazgul interview
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I wonder if you buy premium those germans start speaking English?
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Go Nazgul you are doing awesome Protoss Pride Sir!
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GO NAZGUL AND PEDROFRON !
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sweet attempt by lucifron
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lolmao those lings melted the hellions
this mu is hilarious
its funny how dimaga makes hydra when luficernn is making pure hellion
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On March 20 2010 03:33 Bshad wrote:
I wonder if you buy premium those germans start speaking English?
Then I'd buy it. Not when German. Even though the stage and setup seems very good.
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i just think scrap station is too hard a map for T v Z -
helps that dimaga is real good too ^^
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OUCH thos hellion do so much dmg
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Pardon me but is Roaches not good in the matchup? I'm thinking about the heal fast with burrow so you shouldn't have to rebuild that many units all the time?
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dimaga nicely turning around that game, 1-0
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i didnt understand that game. he had the complete mapcontrol, didnt expand for ages... plus why didnt he have tanks for so long vs so many hydras, and in the end where he had 2 tanks he didnt even have siege mode Oo
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how did luci lose to hydras?
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I think lucifron keep for to long the production with hellion
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On March 20 2010 03:41 3nickma wrote:Pardon me but is Roaches not good in the matchup? I'm thinking about the heal fast with burrow so you shouldn't have to rebuild that many units all the time?
ur right, roaches own vs hellion cause they r armored and has 2 armor = 6 dmg with hellion while hydra is light so its = 24 dmg
but ofc dimaga still wins the game, thats how hilarious hellions r ^^
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esl.tv has english shows the hardsomething guy casts wow arena in english i belive
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On March 20 2010 03:35 MorroW wrote:
lolmao those lings melted the hellions
this mu is hilarious
its funny how dimaga makes hydra when luficernn is making pure hellion
THIS
Why were there no roaches? Or Mutas? WTF!?!?!
This was making me furious, I ended up praying for the zerg to lose but then he wins wtf bbq?
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i think every terran goes through a phase (1game) where he goes mass hellions vs hydras, and although in theory it should kinda work, it just doesn't, Hellions attack annimation is far too slow - by the time they get off 1 attack they are more or less dead.
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Hellions seem to beat Hydras mostly in smaller numbers due to their very slow attack speed/animation. Once their initial attack doesn't make the immediate difference, they get slaughtered.
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I just wanna see a terran beat dimaga ! :D
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why didnt he have siege mode for tanks? sc2 tanks didn't look any weak last time i saw them, and in sc1 they raped hydras too. i know they cost more gas, but he did almost no gas units so i don't get why he didn't have them.
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On March 20 2010 03:46 DeMusliM wrote:
i think every terran goes through a phase (1game) where he goes mass hellions vs hydras, and although in theory it should kinda work, it just doesn't, Hellions attack annimation is far too slow - by the time they get off 1 attack they are more or less dead.
In that case, my hat goes off to the zerg for realizing this. A good thing for me to learn I suppose.
Looks like I know who I am rooting for.
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On March 20 2010 03:47 DeMusliM wrote:
I just wanna see a terran beat dimaga ! :D
This!
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Isn't that desert oasis aka the worst terran map?
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On March 20 2010 03:50 HolydaKing wrote:
Isn't that desert oasis aka the worst map?
fixed!
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On March 20 2010 03:50 HolydaKing wrote:
Isn't that desert oasis aka the worst terran map?
ye it is
thats why were seeing this most desperate terran rush in the game, plus the distances r close
lucifernn is very smart gamer, he use this strat on right map, but its allin ^^
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He should know better than to not expect fast banshee on a that map especially in zvt -_-
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On March 20 2010 03:52 MorroW wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 03:50 HolydaKing wrote:
Isn't that desert oasis aka the worst terran map? ye it is thats why were seeing this most desperate terran rush in the game, plus the distances r close lucifernn is very smart gamer, he use this strat on right map, but its allin ^^
He all-ins on every map. But yea, his all-ins are "smart".
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On March 20 2010 03:55 LaLuSh wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 03:52 MorroW wrote:On March 20 2010 03:50 HolydaKing wrote:
Isn't that desert oasis aka the worst terran map? ye it is thats why were seeing this most desperate terran rush in the game, plus the distances r close lucifernn is very smart gamer, he use this strat on right map, but its allin ^^ He all-ins on every map. But yea, his all-ins are "smart".
well hes way smarter than dimaga who masses hydra vs hellion and dont even suspect banshee rush on desert oasis -.-
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Australia7069 Posts
On March 20 2010 03:55 LaLuSh wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 03:52 MorroW wrote:On March 20 2010 03:50 HolydaKing wrote:
Isn't that desert oasis aka the worst terran map? ye it is thats why were seeing this most desperate terran rush in the game, plus the distances r close lucifernn is very smart gamer, he use this strat on right map, but its allin ^^ He all-ins on every map. But yea, his all-ins are "smart".
so true. It kind of pains me to see these 4 rax constant pressure into gg builds. So helpless if the rush gets fought off because your tech is sooooo bad. But i guess if it works...why not
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So how do you know the terran is going banshees, other than guessing? Scouting is hard, since the ramp is blocked, and ovies don't have any speed till lair. Going spore crawlers without scouting the banshees, is risky because he can marine/marauder push you -_-
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Where can I download these Dimaga replays at? =o
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On March 20 2010 04:00 cyclone25 wrote:
So how do you know the terran is going banshees, other than guessing? Scouting is hard, since the ramp is blocked, and ovies don't have any speed till lair. Going spore crawlers without scouting the banshees, is risky because he can marine/marauder push you -_-
dude zergs are imba
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My guess is you have to rush as fast as possible to lair and get hydras, faster than what dimaga did now.
Or does anyone have a better suggestion?
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On March 20 2010 04:00 cyclone25 wrote:
So how do you know the terran is going banshees, other than guessing? Scouting is hard, since the ramp is blocked, and ovies don't have any speed till lair. Going spore crawlers without scouting the banshees, is risky because he can marine/marauder push you -_-
he just need to get lair relatively fast, the distance will allow him to survive against any attack easily
he can just pool,hatch,queen,lair,baneling nest,hydra nest and he will survive against anything
obviously he should just do this tech tree if he scouts no expo from t with the lings
u can just peak into the terran base with the overlord if he wanted, 1 marine or something by then by the wallin, no chance to kill it before it gets out again
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Sweden33719 Posts
Did they jump into the middle of the game?
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So for those wanting to see the game. Quick viking from Lucifron
Lower left on Kulas ravine for dimaga and top left for lucifon
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Harassing with the vikiungs on the expo for dimaga. Taking out the overlords. Spinecrawler lings defending the hellion push on the expo.
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lucifron is so good in harras
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Fast Hive I think for DImaga, he's hitting vikings at the expo with hydralisks. Vikings continously raping the overlords.
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terran air fleet seems -____- zergs can be glad that only lucifron uses this :D
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Kennigit
Canada19447 Posts
Wait...they just jump straight into the middle of the game?
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4th or 5th Overlord goes down . Hellion push coming the expo is pretty much down for Dimaga. I don't see him winining this.
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On March 20 2010 04:05 Kennigit wrote:
Wait...they just jump straight into the middle of the game?
yes they did it any single game, totally pointless
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On March 20 2010 04:05 Kennigit wrote:
Wait...they just jump straight into the middle of the game?
Ya pretty much joined in about 4 or 5 minutes late I think.
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great map abuse by Lucifron ^^
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best part if dimaga was really a smarter player than lucifer he would just mine from 1base and make a hydra army then run over lucifer because he only has invested in vikings and hellions which only work well to harass a zerg
but dimaga keeps trying to mine from his natural and losing tons of stuff tt
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I think this is game, the overlords are fucked hellions raping the expo, they aren't showing main base for dimaga, wtf commentators move around the map :| A lot of hydras being made to take out the viking harass from top cliff of Dimagas close expo Huge army coming in with hellions to take out the expo of Dimaga
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Sweden33719 Posts
Why didn't he kill the rocks blocking the path to his cliff ;O
It sucks they don't show the full game, but looked like Lucifron played well.
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there we go, a terran stomps dimaga to win 2:1
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ya he calls GG. Lucifron wins!
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HELL YEA
gg lucifron so great harras
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Why does the zerg player never get roaches or mutas?
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On March 20 2010 04:08 FrozenArbiter wrote:
Why didn't he kill the rocks blocking the path to his cliff ;O
It sucks they don't show the full game, but looked like Lucifron played well.
i dont even think he knows they exist there
man i hope a terran wins the final, would be awesome
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omg, wtf jumped after he landed the vikings on the high ground
really liked watching that!
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Ouch, well played though very abusive by Lucifron, not nearly as fun to watch as his other games Luceifron's control was so good (Not very well exemplified with Terran air).
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That harass was very very good. Way too many overlords and Dimaga pretty much was waiting there for the inevitable end that the hydras would face against the million-hellions lol. I'm sad Zerg lost, but really happy with the skill level Lucifron is showing (It's not LUCIFER!!)
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next it's naugrim vs nazgul
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Australia7069 Posts
yeah they've been doing it every game. the earliest i've seen them get in is before the pool was done after a 14-15 hatch
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Showed once again why I think that Dimaga's bo is very risky.
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I've been watching on and off from the start. Have they done the english part yet for the beta keys? Have I missed it?
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Why didnt dimaga take down rocks, or simply stop mining from that base. 9 range vikings> overlords.
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Now let's cheer for the TL rep Nazgul!
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Wow nice strategys by lucifron!
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On March 20 2010 04:12 Viperskwa wrote:
I've been watching on and off from the start. Have they done the english part yet for the beta keys? Have I missed it?
They talked about it multiple times in english. (inbetween games)
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mh its nice to watch games from the beginning, but they tell u if the did something strange
and there is no really a need to watch the standard bos, or?
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On March 20 2010 04:09 MorroW wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 04:08 FrozenArbiter wrote:
Why didn't he kill the rocks blocking the path to his cliff ;O
It sucks they don't show the full game, but looked like Lucifron played well. i dont even think he knows they exist there man i hope a terran wins the final, would be awesome
LOL sure dimaga is one of the very top sc2 zergs and he doesnt know therer are rocks to his cliff on Kulas Ravine...
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wish the stream worked for me :/
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On March 20 2010 04:12 Pekkz wrote:
Why didnt dimaga take down rocks, or simply stop mining from that base. 9 range vikings> overlords.
because zerg users r the new toss users, spoiled by the strength of their race that they dont understand they should sometimes respect and take sacrifices by his opponents build order
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On March 20 2010 04:02 MorroW wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 04:00 cyclone25 wrote:
So how do you know the terran is going banshees, other than guessing? Scouting is hard, since the ramp is blocked, and ovies don't have any speed till lair. Going spore crawlers without scouting the banshees, is risky because he can marine/marauder push you -_- he just need to get lair relatively fast, the distance will allow him to survive against any attack easily he can just pool,hatch,queen,lair,baneling nest,hydra nest and he will survive against anything obviously he should just do this tech tree if he scouts no expo from t with the lings u can just peak into the terran base with the overlord if he wanted, 1 marine or something by then by the wallin, no chance to kill it before it gets out again
I don't think I have ever seen you do a hellion opening morrow (I'm sure you've tried it sometime, but not extensively). A zerg can't be too greedy teching or the hellions will do irreversible damage. It's a guessing game of sorts for the Z. That's why at first I had such trouble playing against you. My mind set was too defensive from playing blind against all these gay hellion variation builds without being able to scout shit. Nowadays when I'm not able to scout you I just guess you're FE:ing (and it usually turns out to be right).
On a related note, I don't think I have ever seen lucifron not do a hellion opening. So against him I guess he's gonna do hellion every game. The hard part is knowing whether he transitions into an expo, banshees, or keeps pumping hellions. You basically gotta guess. If you don't guess right you're either too far behind on economy, too far behind on tech, or you have too few units to be able to defend.
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Lucifron played intelligently to win and it seems Dimaga didn't make the right decisions, but what if it was another map with no cliff over the natural's minerals? I'm guessing it would have gone to the usual macro game with Zerg getting an unstoppable, simple to micro army. Given that Lucifron won the second game with a gimmicky build I don't think this result is evidence that Terran is even with Zerg balance-wise at the highest level. And even if they are even, it seems like it is a lot easier to play Zerg, viz.:
-Dimaga building hydras that beat hellions despite hellions being a semi-counter to them
-Dimaga expanding excessively without fear (remember the Zotac cup where he lost a hatchery to a rush every game yet still came out on top
-General lack of micro for Zerg units versus Terran (all Terran units in the matchup seem to be hit-and-run based, the need to target and avoid banelings etc., whereas Zerg seem to be just mass a-move, though admittedly Dimaga pulled off some very nice surrounds in the Zotac cup)
-Relative unimportance of positioning for Zerg: zerglings move so fast on creep it is easy to move between and defend the many expansions you'd have, Dimaga exploits this more than others with creep tumors
I don't have beta so perhaps this is all ignorant speculation.
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On March 20 2010 04:14 Fogul wrote:
wish the stream worked for me :/
http://www.justin.tv/dacendoran
I'm streaming the stream at the same quality that the low quality stream is (Obviously it's not exactly the same quality but I'm stream above the Kbps that the stream is so I don't lose too much of the quality)
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Sad that everyone will be like "Terran isn't underpowered" when LucifroNNN wins-_-
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what a sweet micro by nazgul there :D stupid to not tech to hydras though.
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holy fuck, nice by nazgul
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On March 20 2010 04:17 LaLuSh wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 04:02 MorroW wrote:On March 20 2010 04:00 cyclone25 wrote:
So how do you know the terran is going banshees, other than guessing? Scouting is hard, since the ramp is blocked, and ovies don't have any speed till lair. Going spore crawlers without scouting the banshees, is risky because he can marine/marauder push you -_- he just need to get lair relatively fast, the distance will allow him to survive against any attack easily he can just pool,hatch,queen,lair,baneling nest,hydra nest and he will survive against anything obviously he should just do this tech tree if he scouts no expo from t with the lings u can just peak into the terran base with the overlord if he wanted, 1 marine or something by then by the wallin, no chance to kill it before it gets out again I don't think I have ever seen you do a hellion opening morrow (I'm sure you've tried it sometime, but not extensively). A zerg can't be too greedy teching or the hellions will do irreversible damage. It's a guessing game of sorts for the Z. That's why at first I had such trouble playing against you. My mind set was too defensive from playing blind against all these gay hellion variation builds without being able to scout shit. Nowadays when I'm not able to scout you I just guess you're FE:ing (and it usually turns out to be right). On a related note, I don't think I have ever seen lucifron not do a hellion opening. So against him I guess he's gonna do hellion every game. The hard part is knowing whether he transitions into an expo, banshees, or keeps pumping hellions. You basically gotta guess. If you don't guess right you're either too far behind on economy, too far behind on tech, or you have too few units to be able to defend.
u just scout fast with drone
terran no gas =expo or mass rax
terran get gas = 1base
and from this intel u chose if u go evo chamber for +1armor(counter vs terran fe) and start massling baneling and if he 1base u get lair skip the evo chamber and get hydra den as soon as the lair is done
ur lings r outside him so ull know whenever he moves out
if he moves out with an army of MMM u can start massling baneling and if he move out with hellions u just keep making hydra roach
its ridiculously imbalanced and its harder for terran to scout compared to zerg in the midgame because of ur creep tumors changelings and overseers mapcontrol of xel naga towers
seriously lalush i get ur point, i didnt change up my play too much and i think u might be right here. but coming here and saying u have to play a guess game as a zerg well guess what - zerg beat all builds with same build cause they r imba
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sit in base sit in base sit in base attack one player has superior army gg
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On March 20 2010 04:20 Dacendoran wrote:http://www.justin.tv/dacendoranI'm streaming the stream at the same quality that the low quality stream is (Obviously it's not exactly the same quality but I'm stream above the Kbps that the stream is so I don't lose too much of the quality)
ah nice thanks alot
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On March 20 2010 04:22 G.s)NarutO wrote:
Sad that everyone will be like "Terran isn't underpowered" when LucifroNNN wins-_-
Yes I was trying to pre-empt that with my post above.
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Sick shield wall. Omfg that was awesome. I really thought the zerg would be able to take that battle with just numbers but I'm in awe now.
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On March 20 2010 04:22 G.s)NarutO wrote:
Sad that everyone will be like "Terran isn't underpowered" when LucifroNNN wins-_-
Well Terran certainly don't have more problems than Protoss And LucifroNNNNN shows us that you don't have to go blindly M&M&M vs everything.
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Sweden33719 Posts
Gogo Naz :D
On March 20 2010 04:22 G.s)NarutO wrote:
Sad that everyone will be like "Terran isn't underpowered" when LucifroNNN wins-_-
Then you'll be happy to know that Naz is going to win this ;p
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damn that was some PRO toss playing. Very, very good player.
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On March 20 2010 04:24 HolydaKing wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 04:22 G.s)NarutO wrote:
Sad that everyone will be like "Terran isn't underpowered" when LucifroNNN wins-_- Well Terran certainly don't have more problems than Protoss And LucifroNNNNN shows us that you don't have to go blindly M&M&M vs everything.
while lucifron played smarter than his oppo, what happens when people don't make silly mistakes vs this style of play?
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On March 20 2010 04:23 Crunchums wrote:
sit in base sit in base sit in base attack one player has superior army gg
lol this was not that case at all. The Zerg clearly had the counter to all those immortals/sentries.
HOWEVER, the Toss obviously used a bit of innovation in creating a 5 force field wall making all those speedlings useless while he destroyed the roaches.
It had nothing to do with him having a 'superior army'
It had everything to do with him having a superior strategy.
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Canada5565 Posts
I LOVE this wall off Nazgul did, so smart!
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lol so clever play by nazgul
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gogo nazgul! Lucifron and Nazgul are both nice gamers, looking forward watching the finals :>
They are both sympathic guys too, not like Morrow who is a 17 year old kid instantly whining in these forums after he drop out of a tourney and talking about "imbalances" because he lost with his 20 minutes turtle-until-200 trash style. Freaking Moron.
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On March 20 2010 04:24 FrozenArbiter wrote:Gogo Naz :D Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 04:22 G.s)NarutO wrote:
Sad that everyone will be like "Terran isn't underpowered" when LucifroNNN wins-_- Then you'll be happy to know that Naz is going to win this ;p
Probably still cheering a bit more for Terran.. but aah its Nazugul. Ccc...an't resist!! Gogo Nazgul :D
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Heart wants WC3 player to take it but he's terran. Nazgul vs lucifron would be nice to watch.
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Go nazgul that was rape. Naugrim calls GG.
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the 2 smartest players in the final, great!
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nagul is good lol, im actualy proud on myself im 1-3 vs him in ladder :D:D
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These 2 games are totally photocopies of nazgul's games against orly
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mega sexy nazgul
imohe had the most hard opponents but kick them all out the tournament.
pro gg he will win
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Sweden33719 Posts
Absolutely sick play by naz :D
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Kennigit
Canada19447 Posts
Nazgul!!!! Such nice play ^^.
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The games are ok, but is it just me or is sc1 like 10 times more epic.
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Braavos36373 Posts
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On March 20 2010 04:32 Obbalord wrote:
gogo nazgul! Lucifron and Nazgul are both nice gamers, looking forward watching the finals :>
They are both sympathic guys too, not like Morrow who is a 17 year old kid instantly whining in these forums after he drop out of a tourney and talking about "imbalances" because he lost with his 20 minutes turtle-until-200 trash style. Freaking Moron.
Clever first post.
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man that last game was boring
Hopefully finals are awesome!
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On March 20 2010 04:28 Perseverance wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 04:23 Crunchums wrote:
sit in base sit in base sit in base attack one player has superior army gg lol this was not that case at all. The Zerg clearly had the counter to all those immortals/sentries. HOWEVER, the Toss obviously used a bit of innovation in creating a 5 force field wall making all those speedlings useless while he destroyed the roaches. It had nothing to do with him having a 'superior army' It had everything to do with him having a superior strategy.
lol are you serious
is making a force field wall really some amazing strategy? the fuck else would you do with that much sentry energy. hence, his army composition won him it because force field walls are not at all innovative
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Nazguls build in the second game was so smart <3
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That's why roaches aren't imbalanced :p
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Go nazgul would be so nice to see a european protoss win a tournament nowerdays.
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On March 20 2010 04:38 psyote wrote:
The games are ok, but is it just me or is sc1 like 10 times more epic.
Sc2 is still brand new game and no one has fully figured it out. Watching nazgul pull off that shield wall was epic. Sc2 will still be as epic or even more than sc1 over time.
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On March 20 2010 04:38 psyote wrote:
The games are ok, but is it just me or is sc1 like 10 times more epic.
man, tell me how old is sc1 and then how old is sc2 beta...
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On March 20 2010 04:39 Crunchums wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 04:28 Perseverance wrote:On March 20 2010 04:23 Crunchums wrote:
sit in base sit in base sit in base attack one player has superior army gg lol this was not that case at all. The Zerg clearly had the counter to all those immortals/sentries. HOWEVER, the Toss obviously used a bit of innovation in creating a 5 force field wall making all those speedlings useless while he destroyed the roaches. It had nothing to do with him having a 'superior army' It had everything to do with him having a superior strategy. lol are you serious is making a force field wall really some amazing strategy? the fuck else would you do with that much sentry energy. hence, his army composition won him it because force field walls are not at all innovative
It wasn't about the 'superior army'
It was about how he used his army effectively.
Lets just hug and get back to the game, okay?
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On March 20 2010 04:39 Crunchums wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 04:28 Perseverance wrote:On March 20 2010 04:23 Crunchums wrote:
sit in base sit in base sit in base attack one player has superior army gg lol this was not that case at all. The Zerg clearly had the counter to all those immortals/sentries. HOWEVER, the Toss obviously used a bit of innovation in creating a 5 force field wall making all those speedlings useless while he destroyed the roaches. It had nothing to do with him having a 'superior army' It had everything to do with him having a superior strategy. lol are you serious is making a force field wall really some amazing strategy? the fuck else would you do with that much sentry energy. hence, his army composition won him it because force field walls are not at all innovative
Unit composition is part of the strategy.
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Canada5565 Posts
On March 20 2010 04:39 DrainX wrote:Nazguls build in the second game was so smart <3
The total wall in at his nat's choke was so nice, first time I've seen that. It makes perfect sense. I think that should become standard play.
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On March 20 2010 04:38 psyote wrote:
The games are ok, but is it just me or is sc1 like 10 times more epic.
Maybe because it's a beta
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On March 20 2010 04:41 shin ken wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 04:38 psyote wrote:
The games are ok, but is it just me or is sc1 like 10 times more epic. Maybe because it's a beta
People tend to forget that quite often ^^
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On March 20 2010 04:39 DrainX wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 04:32 Obbalord wrote:
gogo nazgul! Lucifron and Nazgul are both nice gamers, looking forward watching the finals :>
They are both sympathic guys too, not like Morrow who is a 17 year old kid instantly whining in these forums after he drop out of a tourney and talking about "imbalances" because he lost with his 20 minutes turtle-until-200 trash style. Freaking Moron.
Clever first post.
Thank you! :-]
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Lot of talking goin on, something about SCV Rush? Don't think the games tarted, I dont know what the questions are for the beta key, but I see some 5000 something being said.. can anyone translate?
Who is maugrim btw? He played pretty well reaching semi finals after all for an unknown player.
And they mentioned TeamLiquid!!
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On March 20 2010 04:47 Kage wrote:
Lot of talking goin on, something about SCV Rush? Don't think the games tarted, I dont know what the questions are for the beta key, but I see some 5000 something being said.. can anyone translate?
Who is maugrim btw? He played pretty well reaching semi finals after all for an unknown player.
And they mentioned TeamLiquid!!
LOL! ToT)Naugrim( one of the best Starcraft Broodwar Zerg players from Sweden T_T~~~
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wow those hunter seeker missile do terrible terrible domage
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On March 20 2010 04:49 G.s)NarutO wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 04:47 Kage wrote:
Lot of talking goin on, something about SCV Rush? Don't think the games tarted, I dont know what the questions are for the beta key, but I see some 5000 something being said.. can anyone translate?
Who is maugrim btw? He played pretty well reaching semi finals after all for an unknown player.
And they mentioned TeamLiquid!! LOL! ToT)Naugrim( one of the best Starcraft Broodwar Zerg players from Sweden T_T~~~
Ah my apologies, I didn't know that (now I feel stupid heh)
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Not 3rd/4th place match before the Finals?
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On March 20 2010 04:38 psyote wrote:
The games are ok, but is it just me or is sc1 like 10 times more epic.
no, see the seekermissle video
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On March 20 2010 04:32 Obbalord wrote:
gogo nazgul! Lucifron and Nazgul are both nice gamers, looking forward watching the finals :>
They are both sympathic guys too, not like Morrow who is a 17 year old kid instantly whining in these forums after he drop out of a tourney and talking about "imbalances" because he lost with his 20 minutes turtle-until-200 trash style. Freaking Moron.
Yeah MorroW whining all the time. In Zotac cup he whined, here he whined and he flaked hello, goodbye tournament.
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On March 20 2010 04:23 MorroW wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 04:17 LaLuSh wrote:On March 20 2010 04:02 MorroW wrote:On March 20 2010 04:00 cyclone25 wrote:
So how do you know the terran is going banshees, other than guessing? Scouting is hard, since the ramp is blocked, and ovies don't have any speed till lair. Going spore crawlers without scouting the banshees, is risky because he can marine/marauder push you -_- he just need to get lair relatively fast, the distance will allow him to survive against any attack easily he can just pool,hatch,queen,lair,baneling nest,hydra nest and he will survive against anything obviously he should just do this tech tree if he scouts no expo from t with the lings u can just peak into the terran base with the overlord if he wanted, 1 marine or something by then by the wallin, no chance to kill it before it gets out again I don't think I have ever seen you do a hellion opening morrow (I'm sure you've tried it sometime, but not extensively). A zerg can't be too greedy teching or the hellions will do irreversible damage. It's a guessing game of sorts for the Z. That's why at first I had such trouble playing against you. My mind set was too defensive from playing blind against all these gay hellion variation builds without being able to scout shit. Nowadays when I'm not able to scout you I just guess you're FE:ing (and it usually turns out to be right). On a related note, I don't think I have ever seen lucifron not do a hellion opening. So against him I guess he's gonna do hellion every game. The hard part is knowing whether he transitions into an expo, banshees, or keeps pumping hellions. You basically gotta guess. If you don't guess right you're either too far behind on economy, too far behind on tech, or you have too few units to be able to defend. u just scout fast with drone terran no gas =expo or mass rax terran get gas = 1base and from this intel u chose if u go evo chamber for +1armor(counter vs terran fe) and start massling baneling and if he 1base u get lair skip the evo chamber and get hydra den as soon as the lair is done ur lings r outside him so ull know whenever he moves out if he moves out with an army of MMM u can start massling baneling and if he move out with hellions u just keep making hydra roach its ridiculously imbalanced and its harder for terran to scout compared to zerg in the midgame because of ur creep tumors changelings and overseers mapcontrol of xel naga towers seriously lalush i get ur point, i didnt change up my play too much and i think u might be right here. but coming here and saying u have to play a guess game as a zerg well guess what - zerg beat all builds with same build cause they r imba
I'm saying you only see the matchup through the eyes of one build order: fast expanding.
You're not "qualified" enough to make claims about how easy it is for a zerg to block everything based on one "magical" build order.
On March 20 2010 04:02 MorroW wrote:
he can just pool,hatch,queen,lair,baneling nest,hydra nest and he will survive against anything
Good luck blocking a hellion rush by building every basic tech building available to the race. I'd like to see you try this from a zergs point of view and see how many units you have available to defend by the time the hellions arrive. There is no way you can expo and get hydras up in time to defend a hellion rush. You have to squeeze in speedlings or roaches somewhere in your "magical" build order before hydras.
Which order do you suggest we zerg players should build all these buildings in order to block everything? You just whined about dimaga not having his tech up in time despite succesfully blocking the hellions in most games. Where do you fit in powering drones in this "build order to rule them all"? Dimaga guessed there would be no more pressure in 2 games and powered drones and got punished for it when it turned out Lucifron went air. Are you calling dimaga incompetent for not using "the build order to rule them all"?
I don't even want to get in to the scenarios of what happens when you guess wrong and it turns out the opponent is doing an MM-build. Good luck 1 basing against that shit morrow. Looking forward to seeing a demonstration of this build order from you.
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I selfishly attribute Nazguls success to my late night 3 am practice with him last night! ^^
GO NAZ!
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On March 20 2010 04:47 Kage wrote:
Lot of talking goin on, something about SCV Rush? Don't think the games tarted, I dont know what the questions are for the beta key, but I see some 5000 something being said.. can anyone translate?
Who is maugrim btw? He played pretty well reaching semi finals after all for an unknown player.
And they mentioned TeamLiquid!!
question is: what's the name of the protoss homeplanet?
send to: gewinn@esl.eu
shouldn't be too hard
e// actually I don't know if u can get a key cuz ur not from europe... hmm I'd say just try :D
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Hyped for the final! First euro toruney final with no Z in it?
Hoping for good games!
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blistering sands game begins.
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too many obs in final, lucfi complained of lag, few of us left them with esl hosts in game, glgl
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NOOO, i missed this :/
at least i am in for the final, gogogo for good games
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Okay, I dont get this...
They stream matches with semipro-players from all over the world but they refuse to shoutcast in english even though it's like a huge amount of viewers that are not from germany. Wow..will they ever learn?
They got a studio and alot of equipment but the stream quality is worse than what we find in Livestream.com and Justin.tv where some users actually get above 800 viewers a day. Ouch..something is wrong.
I watched a couple of games but I couldnt stand it in the end. I dont wanna be rude or anything but this probably how many viewers that are not german feels. I hope they change this in the future. :S
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Lol they've gotten too many emails and won't accept anymore now.
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closed rax opening, seems standard for bothplayers so far.
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Quick refinery, seems hees goin the marauder build. Quick tech to that mule thing (forgot what it's called) orbital command i think?
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On March 20 2010 05:01 Gackt_ wrote:
Okay, I dont get this...
They stream matches with semipro-players from all over the world but they refuse to shoutcast in english even though it's like a huge amount of viewers that are not from germany. Wow..will they ever learn?
They got a studio and alot of equipment but the stream quality is worse than what we find in Livestream.com and Justin.tv where some users actually get above 800 viewers a day. Ouch..something is wrong.
I watched a couple of games but I couldnt stand it in the end. I dont wanna be rude or anything but this probably how many viewers that are not german feels. I hope they change this in the future. :S
ESL TV is German cable television. Their sponsors are German, their paying viewers are German. The free stream is a nice gesture to the community, but the cast will be German.
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quick robotics facility from nazgul. stalker opening, dual gas for nazgul. fast expo from lucifron. observer scout from nazgul.
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On March 20 2010 05:01 Gackt_ wrote:
Okay, I dont get this...
They stream matches with semipro-players from all over the world but they refuse to shoutcast in english even though it's like a huge amount of viewers that are not from germany. Wow..will they ever learn?
They got a studio and alot of equipment but the stream quality is worse than what we find in Livestream.com and Justin.tv where some users actually get above 800 viewers a day. Ouch..something is wrong.
I watched a couple of games but I couldnt stand it in the end. I dont wanna be rude or anything but this probably how many viewers that are not german feels. I hope they change this in the future. :S
the problem is that they dont have english starcraft casters... some time ago they tried an english scbw show with their german mods but even non germans said its better in german :D
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stim pack research by lucifron, bunker protection and expo defend by lucifron nazgul getting to the rocks to hit it at lucifrons base . mass marauder army defending. Tri rax for lucifron
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800 viewers is like nothing. I bet they have more than 10000
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I was expecting Lucifron to go for a 1 base allin and instead he fast expands. Seems like his TvP mindset is different from his TvZ
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Collossus incoming! and expo from Nazgul. Lucifron moving in army of marauders to take out the expo attempt by nazgul. warp gate research going up for nazgul
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oh boy, lucifron pushes in, the collossus gets fucked, army goes down for nazgul expo goin down fast, collossus coming out to defend
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fuck that was quick, army decimated, nazgul calls gg :|
Lucifron 1: 0 Nazgul
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yay 1-0 lucifron
go terran go!!
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lucifrons attack succeeded, nazgul ggs
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On March 20 2010 05:06 DrainX wrote:
I was expecting Lucifron to go for a 1 base allin and instead he fast expands. Seems like his TvP mindset is different from his TvZ
Or maybe not...
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On March 20 2010 05:05 HolydaKing wrote:
800 viewers is like nothing. I bet they have more than 10000
actually the the contest they have over 30 000 entry
On March 20 2010 05:10 Dia wrote:
is final Bo3 or Bo5 ?
Bo5
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On March 20 2010 05:10 Dia wrote:
is final Bo3 or Bo5 ?
BO5!
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On March 20 2010 05:10 Dia wrote:
is final Bo3 or Bo5 ?
Bo5
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Lost temple second game, Im hopin its best of 5, not sure..
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left top spawn for nazgul, right bottom on lt for lucifron
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On March 20 2010 05:01 Gackt_ wrote:
Okay, I dont get this...
They stream matches with semipro-players from all over the world but they refuse to shoutcast in english even though it's like a huge amount of viewers that are not from germany. Wow..will they ever learn?
They got a studio and alot of equipment but the stream quality is worse than what we find in Livestream.com and Justin.tv where some users actually get above 800 viewers a day. Ouch..something is wrong.
I watched a couple of games but I couldnt stand it in the end. I dont wanna be rude or anything but this probably how many viewers that are not german feels. I hope they change this in the future. :S
Their free stream is actually pretty good: Here
And its been said many times, this is a German sponsored event aimed first at German viewers, you shouldn't be bitching about it, be glad they bother to hold such an event and show it to all of us.
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Lost Temple is really good for TvP, nearly winning 95% of my TvP's on Lt.
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On March 20 2010 05:11 Megalisk wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 05:01 Gackt_ wrote:
Okay, I dont get this...
They stream matches with semipro-players from all over the world but they refuse to shoutcast in english even though it's like a huge amount of viewers that are not from germany. Wow..will they ever learn?
They got a studio and alot of equipment but the stream quality is worse than what we find in Livestream.com and Justin.tv where some users actually get above 800 viewers a day. Ouch..something is wrong.
I watched a couple of games but I couldnt stand it in the end. I dont wanna be rude or anything but this probably how many viewers that are not german feels. I hope they change this in the future. :S Their free stream is actually pretty good: HereAnd its been said many times, this is a German sponsored event aimed first at German viewers, you shouldn't be bitching about it, be glad they bother to hold such an event and show it to all of us.
read my last sentence. I didnt mean to be rude.
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the free stream quality is quite good, I won't complain. I also won one of the free HD streams and the quality is great.
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On March 20 2010 05:03 Mastermyth wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 05:01 Gackt_ wrote:
Okay, I dont get this...
They stream matches with semipro-players from all over the world but they refuse to shoutcast in english even though it's like a huge amount of viewers that are not from germany. Wow..will they ever learn?
They got a studio and alot of equipment but the stream quality is worse than what we find in Livestream.com and Justin.tv where some users actually get above 800 viewers a day. Ouch..something is wrong.
I watched a couple of games but I couldnt stand it in the end. I dont wanna be rude or anything but this probably how many viewers that are not german feels. I hope they change this in the future. :S ESL TV is German cable television. Their sponsors are German, their paying viewers are German. The free stream is a nice gesture to the community, but the cast will be German.
Its not all in german.
quake live is in eng and probably some other stuff. Also QL commentators are very good..
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quick expo again, immortal and stalker tries to harass the expo that lucifron has. Mass marauders again and dual orbital commands for him. counter expo by nazgul quicj collosus too
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stim pack rush to take out the collosus which goes down but the immortals push back the rest of the army, so that rush wasnt successful expo goes up, more collosus for nazgul
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fuck there it goes down again, base goes down and mass immortal thing with collosus was stopped again.
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Canada5565 Posts
why did you need colossus?
immortals would have done the trick
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2:0 down Nazgul .
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omg 2-0 for terran how this is possible, where is the imbalance
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Damn Nazgul is getting hammered
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Poor Nazgul. Perhaps a Warp Prism to load up the Colossus when its being focus fired by those marauders?
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maybe this next game nazgul will make more than 5 nonprobe units
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yup, needs immortal/sentry to hold push and tech to ht, colossus is waste of resources
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On March 20 2010 05:18 Xxio wrote:why did you need colossus? immortals would have done the trick
Cost of it, plus the speed of getting it not to ention that mass eco advantage lucifron gets. IT seems lucifrons going to win this. That should help not showing wc3 guys as total noobs.. Lucifrons one of the best war3 players (plays orc there) and seems to have a good knowledge of this game too.
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On March 20 2010 05:19 d.Apollo wrote:
yup, needs immortal/sentry to hold push and tech to ht, colossus is waste of resources
yea, pretty much this
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On March 20 2010 05:19 d.Apollo wrote:
yup, needs immortal/sentry to hold push and tech to ht, colossus is waste of resources
+1
Colossus was so bad.
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come on Nazgul hwaiting!!
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i think warp prism is the key .....just like reaver in sc1
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On March 20 2010 05:13 Gackt_ wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 05:11 Megalisk wrote:On March 20 2010 05:01 Gackt_ wrote:
Okay, I dont get this...
They stream matches with semipro-players from all over the world but they refuse to shoutcast in english even though it's like a huge amount of viewers that are not from germany. Wow..will they ever learn?
They got a studio and alot of equipment but the stream quality is worse than what we find in Livestream.com and Justin.tv where some users actually get above 800 viewers a day. Ouch..something is wrong.
I watched a couple of games but I couldnt stand it in the end. I dont wanna be rude or anything but this probably how many viewers that are not german feels. I hope they change this in the future. :S Their free stream is actually pretty good: HereAnd its been said many times, this is a German sponsored event aimed first at German viewers, you shouldn't be bitching about it, be glad they bother to hold such an event and show it to all of us. read my last sentence. I didnt mean to be rude.
Actually they were doing English streams some time ago but IIRC they had way worse feedback and less viewers than when they transmitted in DE, so now they stream in German again.
Want it to be streamed in English? No problem, make donations (+$$ from subscriptions) from English people bigger than ones from German people and i think they will switch to English.
Don't be selfish, if more ESL viewers want DE stream be like rest of us and deal with it
What i didn't like though was casters not trying to point out what was the progress of collosi range upgrade which was so crucial
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he has smaller army, and expands behind lucifron.
Should either tech less or expand earlier and get some units out.
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Canada5565 Posts
On March 20 2010 05:20 Kage wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 05:18 Xxio wrote:why did you need colossus? immortals would have done the trick Cost of it, plus the speed of getting it not to ention that mass eco advantage lucifron gets. IT seems lucifrons going to win this. That should help not showing wc3 guys as total noobs.. Lucifrons one of the best war3 players (plays orc there) and seems to have a good knowledge of this game too.
Immortals cost less resources, less supply, is lower tech, and has a faster build time O.o
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i missed dimaga games is it possible to get replays/vods?
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On March 20 2010 05:19 d.Apollo wrote:
yup, needs immortal/sentry to hold push and tech to ht, colossus is waste of resources
I think its kinda stupid that protoss has to tech to better units to fight z/t tier 1 units as zealots and stalkers are bad vs mm due to slowing down and stalkers being weak..
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I'll upload the replay pack as soon as the games are over.
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I think, if you're used to Starleague streams, quality or a foreign language shoudn't be a problem for you.
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I pretty much think that lucifron is going to take this, his units counter toss so well and he's getting the eco advantage.
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gz, I hope marauders get fixed soon tbh.
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HasuObs: "Kidding me?"
qft, how was he able to stop that
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Ya game over. 3:0 Lucifron.
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I guess that settles it. WC3 palyers > SCBW palyers. lawl
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pvt seems like it sucks right now, 3-0 in 15min
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gg, luci wins, too bad for naz tho
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Canada5565 Posts
Yea a sentry with guardian shield would be really nice..much more useful than that stalker because the shield not only decreases damage but takes away the decrease movement speed effect from marauders too
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wow that sucked.. i have no idea about PvT but it seems like marauder is just ridiculous
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possibly the most boring, lamest final ever. Naz just did the same thing each time, only diff in game 3 he got an extra immortal and stalker.....
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gg's!
sorry for the final that wasn't pretty, gotta go back and re-think my PvT since everything I did comes in time against other terrans who like to turtle a bit longer
as for sentries over goons, on kulas you need your goons against reapers
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wow, nice strat tvp by lucifron o.o
Whole tournament was great and I'm happy it showed that good T/P's are able to beat top Zergs
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just to remind, LucifroN is on korean pro level in wc3, even owning there pretty much for some time.
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SCVs raped, Naz had to fight there retreating from marauders its suicide usually
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On March 20 2010 05:29 Dacendoran wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Wow that terran made PvT look so imba
He isn't the only one. You need to watch Gretorps stream.
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Yay, I hope all TvP's will look like this in SC2. Payback time.
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On March 20 2010 05:28 HolydaKing wrote:
HasuObs: "Kidding me?"
qft, how was he able to stop that
how? immortals suck once T got a large enough group of rauders. the only chance for p is to get storm, which is a very close timing and can be dodged, mass zealots (but they need too much econ) or to get 2 or 3 colossi +range as fast as possible.
the moderators were discussing the possibility of delaying that push with dts. im not sure about that. tried it like once but didnt get them out in time in a large enough number,
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ye, I do same opening as luci but tech to ghost/starport in order to kill collosus but then toss has all its stuff out he needs. He goes for a 3-4 rax timing attack when only 1 collo is in the field and no critical number is reached.
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wp against the zergs nazgul =) but the strategy of luci seems to be kinda imba
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So glad for Lucifron, he's the biggest talent wc3 has seen in last three or so years but never got the cred he deserved due to being Orc. It feels so good to see him perform in SC2 aswell.
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On March 20 2010 05:30 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
gg's!
sorry for the final that wasn't pretty, gotta go back and re-think my PvT since everything I did comes in time against other terrans who like to turtle a bit longer
as for sentries over goons, on kulas you need your goons against reapers
When i was watching these games i had similar thought - that he just won by better timings and surprisingly fast attacks even though he expanded quickly. I was expecting (especially in game 2.) some heavy turtle into push with marine shields and maybe ghost which probably would not work. Instead he went for this build which not only attacked at very good timing but also gave him eco to have nice followup after the attack.
It was "disappointing" finals indeed, but only because the game is still young and this means from time to time someone will "invite" new timing that will dominate for a few days (or sometimes only hours) until someone finds good counter to this.
Anyway good job on going that far Naz, impressive!
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As I said, now people think Terran is imba. They don't even realize Marauders lose 20 HP on Stimpack..
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Are they going to air the bronze match?
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On March 20 2010 05:28 HolydaKing wrote:
HasuObs: "Kidding me?"
qft, how was he able to stop that
LOL. LucifroN send his SCV's to attack and Nazgul focused fire on them while the Marauders blasted his immortals.
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well done Nazgul^^
Lucifrons performance was really strong. GGs.
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On March 20 2010 05:35 G.s)NarutO wrote:
As I said, now people think Terran is imba. They don't even realize Marauders lose 20 HP on Stimpack..
i can just speak for myself, but when i said pvt sucked right now i meant it observerwise. it seems like a 1fight-game over matchup right now
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I feel naz should have taken the cliff and just denie the expo instead of trying to kill him =/, scv can be so strong with no collosi arround.
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On March 20 2010 05:35 G.s)NarutO wrote:
As I said, now people think Terran is imba. They don't even realize Marauders lose 20 HP on Stimpack..
Not everyone is as fast as you in jumping on the imba crying bandwagon ^^
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On March 20 2010 05:42 diehilde wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 05:35 G.s)NarutO wrote:
As I said, now people think Terran is imba. They don't even realize Marauders lose 20 HP on Stimpack.. Not everyone is as fast as you in jumping on the imba crying bandwagon ^^
... he just is not.
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mby nazgul should have called for some timeout or so to watch the replay and think about it. sure they wouldve granted him the time
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On March 20 2010 05:46 kyym wrote:
mby nazgul should have called for some timeout or so to watch the replay and think about it. sure they wouldve granted him the time
Lol that's not quite how tournaments work.
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at least nazgul now has the nickname "zerg-zerstörer" xD
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On March 20 2010 05:47 Jdanzi wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 05:46 kyym wrote:
mby nazgul should have called for some timeout or so to watch the replay and think about it. sure they wouldve granted him the time Lol that's not quite how tournaments work.
It's pretty common in WC3 that you are allowed watch the replay even in big televised tournaments. Plus they had plenty of airtime left.
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On March 20 2010 05:44 VabuDeltaKaiser wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 05:42 diehilde wrote:On March 20 2010 05:35 G.s)NarutO wrote:
As I said, now people think Terran is imba. They don't even realize Marauders lose 20 HP on Stimpack.. Not everyone is as fast as you in jumping on the imba crying bandwagon ^^ ... he just is not.
you obviously never won against him in a ladder match :D
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On March 20 2010 05:42 diehilde wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 05:35 G.s)NarutO wrote:
As I said, now people think Terran is imba. They don't even realize Marauders lose 20 HP on Stimpack.. Not everyone is as fast as you in jumping on the imba crying bandwagon ^^
Check my post on the baneling thread, where you stated that the Zergs are just better right now and realize why Terrans cry. And about hopping on the "imba bandwagon" I did not jump on it. LucifroNNN is great and his fast expo and fast push totally countered the style of Nazgul, as he said he has to think over his pvt
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i missed games vs dimaga is it possible to download replays or vods?
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51395 Posts
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i always go 1 base against terran fast exe and rush colossi with berserker because if the maro focus the colossi the dont slow the beserker and its quite a good fight
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On March 20 2010 05:53 diehilde wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 05:44 VabuDeltaKaiser wrote:On March 20 2010 05:42 diehilde wrote:On March 20 2010 05:35 G.s)NarutO wrote:
As I said, now people think Terran is imba. They don't even realize Marauders lose 20 HP on Stimpack.. Not everyone is as fast as you in jumping on the imba crying bandwagon ^^ ... he just is not. you obviously never won against him in a ladder match :D
so, your post didn't make sense in this context. if you refer to insider knowledge, spread that first!
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On March 20 2010 06:00 VabuDeltaKaiser wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 05:53 diehilde wrote:On March 20 2010 05:44 VabuDeltaKaiser wrote:On March 20 2010 05:42 diehilde wrote:On March 20 2010 05:35 G.s)NarutO wrote:
As I said, now people think Terran is imba. They don't even realize Marauders lose 20 HP on Stimpack.. Not everyone is as fast as you in jumping on the imba crying bandwagon ^^ ... he just is not. you obviously never won against him in a ladder match :D so, your post didn't make sense in this context. if you refer to insider knowledge, spread that first!
its pretty much common knowledge amongst people ^^
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51395 Posts
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On March 20 2010 06:04 diehilde wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 06:00 VabuDeltaKaiser wrote:On March 20 2010 05:53 diehilde wrote:On March 20 2010 05:44 VabuDeltaKaiser wrote:On March 20 2010 05:42 diehilde wrote:On March 20 2010 05:35 G.s)NarutO wrote:
As I said, now people think Terran is imba. They don't even realize Marauders lose 20 HP on Stimpack.. Not everyone is as fast as you in jumping on the imba crying bandwagon ^^ ... he just is not. you obviously never won against him in a ladder match :D so, your post didn't make sense in this context. if you refer to insider knowledge, spread that first! its pretty much common knowledge amongst people ^^
lol from my personal experience so far in sc2, no one cries more than naruto
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I missed it, will replays or vods be up?
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On March 20 2010 06:34 Chairman Ray wrote:
I missed it, will replays or vods be up?
you have replays up
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Since pushing to get the collossii out quickly didn't work vs Lucifron's marauder heavy approach (and just sticking with immortals didn't either), might a decent alternative be to get a stargate+void rays instead of the robotics bay+collossii? There's not enough marines in the initial push to threaten them in any way so it would have to be aborted and then you can use their mobility to briefly harrass the terran's main and natural as they'll have no instant answer other than a bit of marine spam.
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You guys should learn to read ...
Gratz Vic and Luci :D
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On March 20 2010 06:58 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
void rays T_T
Hey, I think they're a pretty underrated unit when used as part of your army and not just thrown in as a ninja attempt on a CC/Hatchery/Nexus. I'm not saying to spam them nonstop either, just 2 or 3 to throw the balance back in your favour initially and then work from there.
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Actually I didn't read your post, I just posted void rays cause I think that was the solution today so I'm in agreement with you! But It's almost impossible to see the difference between his build and one more marine heavy before you have an observer so it would be a bit of guesswork.
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I need a premium account because SC is all I have left and I need to improve and become godlike!
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On March 20 2010 07:06 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
Actually I didn't read your post, I just posted void rays cause I think that was the solution today so I'm in agreement with you!
Great.
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Sweden33719 Posts
On March 20 2010 05:36 GenoZStriker wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 05:28 HolydaKing wrote:
HasuObs: "Kidding me?"
qft, how was he able to stop that LOL. LucifroN send his SCV's to attack and Nazgul focused fire on them while the Marauders blasted his immortals.
All units auto-target workers now... and i just checked the rep once the battle started there was only 1 shot on scvs by the immrotals till they targeted marauders
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I think a good counter to this would be a relativly fast expansion, with immortals, like you did in the games. But add a warpprism in the mix. Since Marauders have flying projectiles and cant attack air, you should be able to do some sweet micro, to minimize the damage marauders do and prevent any kind of focus firering.
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On March 20 2010 08:56 trickser wrote:
I think a good counter to this would be a relativly fast expansion, with immortals, like you did in the games. But add a warpprism in the mix. Since Marauders have flying projectiles and cant attack air, you should be able to do some sweet micro, to minimize the damage marauders do and prevent any kind of focus firering.
Warp prisms don't cost gas but they build slow, which effectively costs you an Immortal by the time his push comes. Versus this timing attack i doubt it would work in combat, but perhaps you can keep him busy by dropping his mineral line?
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nice tournament
a few great games
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is there actually anything useful coming out of gateways for toss against rine/rauder except the odd sentry for guardian shield?
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On March 19 2010 03:41 Viperskwa wrote:
I'm in the same boat as Pokepill. Dropped out and everything to train. I've been training on and off on sc1 in preparation for sc2. Now that its in beta I've been playing as much as I can in between work and gf. I'd give my left nut to be able to have an ESL premium key to watch the pro scene and I'd give even more to actually get invited to that tournament or one like it. Please let me have one!
You should purchase one if you are being serious .
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Right before the first battle of the finals my computer died..........I spent 2 hours trying to fix it all the while wondering if that collosus would be enough to stop those 12 marauders...FML!
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So who won the beta keys..........
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wow.
wc3 players doing real well it seems.
i feel so bad for white-ra.
he is not doing well at all. he tries sc1 strats too much.
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+ Show Spoiler +lucifron won because of good rushes and micro, but his macro was incredibily bad. Even only few minutes in the game he had like 2 marauders queued up in one rax and several marines in the other. :S
It's kinda sad to see that T can only win by rushes and requires that much more micro, whereas macro doesn't seem to matter, because if you're in a macro-war, you're probably gonna loose anyways. So far, I've not seen a T win in a macro-game, when he wasn't ahead from the start.
For me, there's clearly a huge difference in playstyles between most WC3-players and SC1-Players. Although WC3-players have good micro, they mostly win because of cheeses and rushes and have incredibly bad macro and scouting, Demuslim being an exception imho.
As soon as players like DIMAGA, Strelok, White-Ra, Morrow etc. get a hang of timings and how to defend well against different timing-attacks, they'll probably stomp WC3-players because of huge advantages in Macro, Multitasking and a way higher APM. I mean: I have 200-250 APM as Terran and only about 250 games and as Terran you definitely need that high APM, especially if you wanna have decent macro.
I wasn't sure at first whether WC3-players would be worse than SC1-players, but it's getting harder and harder to surprise/cheese in SC2, so they'll have a REALLY hard time playing against ppl that have way better multitasking, macro and an all-around higher apm etc.
It's just a fact that you don't really learn how to macro one bit in WC3 and even multitasking isn't as important in WC3 as in SC1. WC3-players really have to get their macro up and APM up to 300 soon to stand a chance in the near future.
Oh yes, but the Tournament as a whole was really enjoyable, to bad it's just Europeans competing, it would be great to have Koreans/Americans in those tournaments as well. ^^'
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On March 20 2010 18:10 kickinhead wrote:+ Show Spoiler +lucifron won because of good rushes and micro, but his macro was incredibily bad. Even only few minutes in the game he had like 2 marauders queued up in one rax and several marines in the other. :S
It's kinda sad to see that T can only win by rushes and requires that much more micro, whereas macro doesn't seem to matter, because if you're in a macro-war, you're probably gonna loose anyways. So far, I've not seen a T win in a macro-game, when he wasn't ahead from the start.
For me, there's clearly a huge difference in playstyles between most WC3-players and SC1-Players. Although WC3-players have good micro, they mostly win because of cheeses and rushes and have incredibly bad macro and scouting, Demuslim being an exception imho.
As soon as players like DIMAGA, Strelok, White-Ra, Morrow etc. get a hang of timings and how to defend well against different timing-attacks, they'll probably stomp WC3-players because of huge advantages in Macro, Multitasking and a way higher APM. I mean: I have 200-250 APM as Terran and only about 250 games and as Terran you definitely need that high APM, especially if you wanna have decent macro.
I wasn't sure at first whether WC3-players would be worse than SC1-players, but it's getting harder and harder to surprise/cheese in SC2, so they'll have a REALLY hard time playing against ppl that have way better multitasking, macro and an all-around higher apm etc.
It's just a fact that you don't really learn how to macro one bit in WC3 and even multitasking isn't as important in WC3 as in SC1. WC3-players really have to get their macro up and APM up to 300 soon to stand a chance in the near future. Oh yes, but the Tournament as a whole was really enjoyable, to bad it's just Europeans competing, it would be great to have Koreans/Americans in those tournaments as well. ^^'
who cares, europe has the best players anyway
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Netherlands4511 Posts
well done nazgul
I'm sad I wasn't around for this!
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well known from the WoW scene?????
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Beyonder
Netherlands15103 Posts
Yeah-- watched the final just now. I don't know how to stop that either -_-
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On March 20 2010 18:10 kickinhead wrote:+ Show Spoiler +lucifron won because of good rushes and micro, but his macro was incredibily bad. Even only few minutes in the game he had like 2 marauders queued up in one rax and several marines in the other. :S
It's kinda sad to see that T can only win by rushes and requires that much more micro, whereas macro doesn't seem to matter, because if you're in a macro-war, you're probably gonna loose anyways. So far, I've not seen a T win in a macro-game, when he wasn't ahead from the start.
For me, there's clearly a huge difference in playstyles between most WC3-players and SC1-Players. Although WC3-players have good micro, they mostly win because of cheeses and rushes and have incredibly bad macro and scouting, Demuslim being an exception imho.
As soon as players like DIMAGA, Strelok, White-Ra, Morrow etc. get a hang of timings and how to defend well against different timing-attacks, they'll probably stomp WC3-players because of huge advantages in Macro, Multitasking and a way higher APM. I mean: I have 200-250 APM as Terran and only about 250 games and as Terran you definitely need that high APM, especially if you wanna have decent macro.
I wasn't sure at first whether WC3-players would be worse than SC1-players, but it's getting harder and harder to surprise/cheese in SC2, so they'll have a REALLY hard time playing against ppl that have way better multitasking, macro and an all-around higher apm etc.
It's just a fact that you don't really learn how to macro one bit in WC3 and even multitasking isn't as important in WC3 as in SC1. WC3-players really have to get their macro up and APM up to 300 soon to stand a chance in the near future. Oh yes, but the Tournament as a whole was really enjoyable, to bad it's just Europeans competing, it would be great to have Koreans/Americans in those tournaments as well. ^^'
Yes obviously Lucifron can't macro, coming from the newb-game WC3 where the _only_ skill you need is micro.
Fun fact: There's a lot more multitasking involved in certain matchups in Wc3 than SC2.
You also won't need 300 apm in SC2 due to the very comfortable user interface. (Not like this would be an issue anyway, some wc3 players are at 300-400apm as it is)
Make love, not wc3 bashing.
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I was actually pretty impressed with the strats Lucifron used. Nice use of hellions and vikings vs zerg and nice marauder pushes versus protoss.
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On March 20 2010 20:15 Seacow wrote:Show nested quote +On March 20 2010 18:10 kickinhead wrote:+ Show Spoiler +lucifron won because of good rushes and micro, but his macro was incredibily bad. Even only few minutes in the game he had like 2 marauders queued up in one rax and several marines in the other. :S
It's kinda sad to see that T can only win by rushes and requires that much more micro, whereas macro doesn't seem to matter, because if you're in a macro-war, you're probably gonna loose anyways. So far, I've not seen a T win in a macro-game, when he wasn't ahead from the start.
For me, there's clearly a huge difference in playstyles between most WC3-players and SC1-Players. Although WC3-players have good micro, they mostly win because of cheeses and rushes and have incredibly bad macro and scouting, Demuslim being an exception imho.
As soon as players like DIMAGA, Strelok, White-Ra, Morrow etc. get a hang of timings and how to defend well against different timing-attacks, they'll probably stomp WC3-players because of huge advantages in Macro, Multitasking and a way higher APM. I mean: I have 200-250 APM as Terran and only about 250 games and as Terran you definitely need that high APM, especially if you wanna have decent macro.
I wasn't sure at first whether WC3-players would be worse than SC1-players, but it's getting harder and harder to surprise/cheese in SC2, so they'll have a REALLY hard time playing against ppl that have way better multitasking, macro and an all-around higher apm etc.
It's just a fact that you don't really learn how to macro one bit in WC3 and even multitasking isn't as important in WC3 as in SC1. WC3-players really have to get their macro up and APM up to 300 soon to stand a chance in the near future. Oh yes, but the Tournament as a whole was really enjoyable, to bad it's just Europeans competing, it would be great to have Koreans/Americans in those tournaments as well. ^^' Yes obviously Lucifron can't macro, coming from the newb-game WC3 where the _only_ skill you need is micro. Fun fact: There's a lot more multitasking involved in certain matchups in Wc3 than SC2. You also won't need 300 apm in SC2 due to the very comfortable user interface. (Not like this would be an issue anyway, some wc3 players are at 300-400apm as it is) Make love, not wc3 bashing.
I've played thousands of WC3-games and was over lvl30 laddering, so I'm not just bashing, but telling what I think while knowing both games.
And Multitasking is maybe important when running around with BM and one other army, but it's nothing compared to multitasking in SC1, you can't argue with that. Of course there are players that have very good multitasking, even though they're Wc3-players, like Moon, who is always on top of scouting with multiple wisps, running around with split armies, exing etc. but that's an exception in WC3, not the norm.
I don't say WC3-players don't have the dedication and ability to learn fast, I just think they'll have a harder time in SC2 as a little more time passes by and they can't win just because of builds and micro.
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On March 20 2010 18:10 kickinhead wrote:
As soon as players like DIMAGA, Strelok, White-Ra, Morrow etc. get a hang of timings and how to defend well against different timing-attacks, they'll probably stomp WC3-players because of huge advantages in Macro, Multitasking and a way higher APM....'
Or you could say... when Lucifron get his macro up he would be unbeatable :p
Anyway, nice games by Lucifron and I like also DeMuslim ... it's really enjoyable to watch you guys play. Though' I hope the top starcraft players like White-Ra shape up a little bit, too
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On March 20 2010 17:33 G3nXsiS wrote:
So who won the beta keys..........
i guess if u won they send u an email
BUT dont expect them to send them in the next 2 days cuz its weekend and they recieved over 30.000 mails
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I blew at macro in sc1 and i'm still near perfect in sc2 macro, it's preeeetty easy and lucifron will pick it up pretty fast. Don't really see macro ever being a problem for anyone really.
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On March 20 2010 22:43 Zurles wrote:
I blew at macro in sc1 and i'm still near perfect in sc2 macro, it's preeeetty easy and lucifron will pick it up pretty fast. Don't really see macro ever being a problem for anyone really.
of course it depends on how fast ppl will adapt, but I've just seen the same playstyle from WC3-players and I don't think this will be a good playstyle when the game is more balanced and ppl getting better at identifiying and countering certain rushes/harrassment.
Just because I was very disappointed on how the WC3-players played in this tournament, even if they managed to beat certain SC-players, it was mostly because of the builds and good micro and this will not continue to work much longer. But that's just my opinion on how I see the scene developing over the next few months. In the long run, it depends more on how much the ppl play, how fast they adapt new skills etc.
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In german.. NEVERMIND. SIIIIGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
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I've watched about 15 of these replays now. Stellar games! Lots of creative use of new tech by many of TL's own. I also saw some really sad failures... I bet protoss in this tournament are learning the value of good building placement to reduce surface area of buildings vs. lings!
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Are there maybe videos of this tournament coz my comp is bad and i cant run sc2 but i would be grateful if it would be possible to watch at least videos
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On March 21 2010 21:24 Art.FeeL wrote:
Are there maybe videos of this tournament coz my comp is bad and i cant run sc2 but i would be grateful if it would be possible to watch at least videos
every single game they've shown
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EPT![[image loading]](/staff/LiquidNazgul/21682.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/c4Zcx.jpg)
