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On June 23 2017 22:23 Keyboard Warrior wrote:
I mean this when i say this - im neither a troll nor a lebron hater. and im not dogmatic about it, its just a great game that i passionately follow. based on my watching the nba closely in the last half decade, he is nowhere near as great as people say he is. he is barely in my top 5 to be honest. this based on the aforementined games and data that i read and saw here and there. but, i am willing to consider a good argument when i see one. so your stats, lets have it...
What data? Because if you've been following closely as you say you do, all data points to his greatness
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Guy made 1 play and suddenly he is the hero goat lol. is he also goat because he made 6 or 8 straight points down the last few seconds of game 5 in this years finals? no, not when he fails on defensive assignments and allow iguodala and durant to dunk and shoot in his face all game especially in crucial moments.
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On June 23 2017 22:38 JimmiC wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2017 22:12 Keyboard Warrior wrote:On June 23 2017 22:06 ZenithM wrote:
Can't we say both Lebron and Kyrie brought them a championship? I would agree, if lbj showed that he had the courage to win it. he is all party and highlights when they steamroll their opponents, peacocking and highfiving like middle school bullies. but when the game and series is on the line, he bricks his shots, he fails on his responsibilities, and defers to kyrie. i would like to point out duncan manu and tp. yes, you could say duncan was monumental in their championship, but you could make a noncontroversial argument that all three of them won it because all three of them made the effort. the same thing also applies to shaq and kobe. Imagine what great player he would be if he had a game saving come from no where superior athleticism block to secure the win in a game 7 of the finals. That would be a dude i could get behind as the best of his generation. That would show heart and determination Anyways as keyboard warrior continues to troll for fights about lbj, i cant stop being excited about the twolves. This is there best roster since Garnett and starbury! I wonder how much their team d will improve with butler.
My only regret is that they play in the West. They would legitimately improve the NBA a hundredfold if they were an East team. Read somewhere that they are still shopping for pgs for Rubio, anyone knowledgeable here confirm. Thanks.
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Yeah being in the West really makes it way harder for budding teams to even make it to the playoffs.
I was watching the draft yesterday (first time I do that, probably last as well, not really interesting :D) and Lavar Ball said something like "the Lakers will make the playoffs this year!". I know he's a boastful guy when it comes to his sons, but I actually thought he could have a point if the Lakers were in the East :D. Especially if Paul George and Jimmy G. Buckets go to West teams (or Boston for PG). Unless I missed something, the East will be ridiculously weak this year.
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To change topic a little bit. NBA Awards this far away from the playoffs is the dumbest idea of all. Who the hell even cares anymore?
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Let me share something funny. While watching the draft last night, something clicked. I suddenly liked Lavar Ball. I used to hate his guts and ugly face to hell. But last night, suddenly it all made sense. Lavar Ball might be an insufferable egotistical attention whore douchebag, but it's all a show, all so that Lonzo and his children can have the best opportunity to succeed. I even empathize with Skip saying that he can't blame Lavar for overloving his sons. Damn Skip. Last night he was genuinely a proud parent and was humble and respectful, He was selfying around Coach K and other sports celebrities. ESPN, that vile bottom dweller, egged him on BBB, but he handled it very well. The clincher was the hat throw when they exited.
And now to focus a bit, we may ridicule and hate him for BBB, but it's honestly a good move. He may believe his sons are the second coming of Jesus or not, but taking full control the merchandise element of his sons careers. It is unprecedented, brash, and ill-advised. It may torpedo and the Balls may be forced later to bargain with Nike or any takers at a lower price, but no matter, he is in the NBA now and the opportunities are endless. But imagine, just imagine, if Lonzo blows up. Nike and Adidas would be rushing to buy the brand for at least at $2B.
And now, more than ever, regardless of the result, the spotlight is on Lonzo - which is what Lavar wanted all along.
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On June 23 2017 22:50 Twinkle Toes wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2017 22:38 JimmiC wrote:On June 23 2017 22:12 Keyboard Warrior wrote:On June 23 2017 22:06 ZenithM wrote:
Can't we say both Lebron and Kyrie brought them a championship? I would agree, if lbj showed that he had the courage to win it. he is all party and highlights when they steamroll their opponents, peacocking and highfiving like middle school bullies. but when the game and series is on the line, he bricks his shots, he fails on his responsibilities, and defers to kyrie. i would like to point out duncan manu and tp. yes, you could say duncan was monumental in their championship, but you could make a noncontroversial argument that all three of them won it because all three of them made the effort. the same thing also applies to shaq and kobe. Imagine what great player he would be if he had a game saving come from no where superior athleticism block to secure the win in a game 7 of the finals. That would be a dude i could get behind as the best of his generation. That would show heart and determination Anyways as keyboard warrior continues to troll for fights about lbj, i cant stop being excited about the twolves. This is there best roster since Garnett and starbury! I wonder how much their team d will improve with butler. My only regret is that they play in the West. They would legitimately improve the NBA a hundredfold if they were an East team. Read somewhere that they are still shopping for pgs for Rubio, anyone knowledgeable here confirm. Thanks.
The T-Wolves just suck at drafting pgs. Why do they keep drafting pgs?
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On June 24 2017 00:02 andrewlt wrote:Show nested quote +On June 23 2017 22:50 Twinkle Toes wrote:On June 23 2017 22:38 JimmiC wrote:On June 23 2017 22:12 Keyboard Warrior wrote:On June 23 2017 22:06 ZenithM wrote:
Can't we say both Lebron and Kyrie brought them a championship? I would agree, if lbj showed that he had the courage to win it. he is all party and highlights when they steamroll their opponents, peacocking and highfiving like middle school bullies. but when the game and series is on the line, he bricks his shots, he fails on his responsibilities, and defers to kyrie. i would like to point out duncan manu and tp. yes, you could say duncan was monumental in their championship, but you could make a noncontroversial argument that all three of them won it because all three of them made the effort. the same thing also applies to shaq and kobe. Imagine what great player he would be if he had a game saving come from no where superior athleticism block to secure the win in a game 7 of the finals. That would be a dude i could get behind as the best of his generation. That would show heart and determination Anyways as keyboard warrior continues to troll for fights about lbj, i cant stop being excited about the twolves. This is there best roster since Garnett and starbury! I wonder how much their team d will improve with butler. My only regret is that they play in the West. They would legitimately improve the NBA a hundredfold if they were an East team. Read somewhere that they are still shopping for pgs for Rubio, anyone knowledgeable here confirm. Thanks. The T-Wolves just suck at drafting pgs. Why do they keep drafting pgs?
Only problem right now is they still don't have enough outside/3 pt. shooting. Rubio, Wiggins, Butler don't really do that.
Wiggins is definitely the worst starter they have now too, but they will probably try to trade Ricky.
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8748 Posts
On June 23 2017 23:15 Twinkle Toes wrote:
Let me share something funny. While watching the draft last night, something clicked. I suddenly liked Lavar Ball. I used to hate his guts and ugly face to hell. But last night, suddenly it all made sense. Lavar Ball might be an insufferable egotistical attention whore douchebag, but it's all a show, all so that Lonzo and his children can have the best opportunity to succeed. I even empathize with Skip saying that he can't blame Lavar for overloving his sons. Damn Skip. Last night he was genuinely a proud parent and was humble and respectful, He was selfying around Coach K and other sports celebrities. ESPN, that vile bottom dweller, egged him on BBB, but he handled it very well. The clincher was the hat throw when they exited.
Don't get fooled. Think about how much of the spotlight he stole from the other players. The draft is about the families only when the player gets interviewed and takes the opportunity to honor their family. The fact that he's orchestrated for so much of the draft coverage to be about him instead of the players is despicable. Doesn't matter that he composed himself last night.
Being a jackass for your own gain is reprehensible but the idea that doing the exact same harm to society with your jackass behavior becomes okay if the benefit is for your kids is just wrong. People aren't expected to be perfect -- they can care more about themselves than others, they can care more about their family than strangers, they can care more about their country than other countries. But there are reasonable amounts of selfishness and preferential treatment allowed and then there are unreasonable amounts. He crosses the line. Just clear your mind and think "has this guy been a jackass?" and if the answer is yes, then don't let his motivations ameliorate his behavior. He's just a jackass.
Not saying everything he does crosses the line. Not saying the media isn't responsible too. Etc etc there are a ton of angles to cover. Point is that he doesn't get a pass for bad behavior just because he's doing it for his kids.
edit: btw, what's the point of phil jackson if he can't get the most out of porzingis? wasn't jackson some legendary player-tamer? i don't think he's playing mind games to get the optimal result for the knicks. he's lost touch and it's ego controlling his mouth now.
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The timberwolves should just stick with Rubio and look for a back up.. whether through draft or trade.
Rubio is better than his boxscore stats.
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On June 24 2017 00:25 JimmiC wrote:Show nested quote +On June 24 2017 00:14 MassHysteria wrote:On June 24 2017 00:02 andrewlt wrote:On June 23 2017 22:50 Twinkle Toes wrote:On June 23 2017 22:38 JimmiC wrote:On June 23 2017 22:12 Keyboard Warrior wrote:On June 23 2017 22:06 ZenithM wrote:
Can't we say both Lebron and Kyrie brought them a championship? I would agree, if lbj showed that he had the courage to win it. he is all party and highlights when they steamroll their opponents, peacocking and highfiving like middle school bullies. but when the game and series is on the line, he bricks his shots, he fails on his responsibilities, and defers to kyrie. i would like to point out duncan manu and tp. yes, you could say duncan was monumental in their championship, but you could make a noncontroversial argument that all three of them won it because all three of them made the effort. the same thing also applies to shaq and kobe. Imagine what great player he would be if he had a game saving come from no where superior athleticism block to secure the win in a game 7 of the finals. That would be a dude i could get behind as the best of his generation. That would show heart and determination Anyways as keyboard warrior continues to troll for fights about lbj, i cant stop being excited about the twolves. This is there best roster since Garnett and starbury! I wonder how much their team d will improve with butler. My only regret is that they play in the West. They would legitimately improve the NBA a hundredfold if they were an East team. Read somewhere that they are still shopping for pgs for Rubio, anyone knowledgeable here confirm. Thanks. The T-Wolves just suck at drafting pgs. Why do they keep drafting pgs? Only problem right now is they still don't have enough outside/3 pt. shooting. Rubio, Wiggins, Butler don't really do that. Wiggins is definitely the worst starter they have now too, but they will probably try to trade Ricky. Id say their worst is who ever they put at tge 4/5 i know you are all low on wiggins. But he is the same age as some of the guys drafted he still has upside, putting up 25 a night constantly is a skill. If he can play better d which he has shown he can at the 2 and if his 3 stroke improves he can be a great 3rd best player on this roster.
The main problem isn't his offense though, its his horrendous defense. 2nd worst defender behind I. Thomas last season. I am assuming Dieng is at 4, and KAT is at 5 btw.
edit: I agree JimmyJ, I feel like they type of player he is is undervalued right now in the league.
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On June 24 2017 00:39 JimmiC wrote:
Lets see how his numbers look with butler at the 3 before he gets written off.
No one is writing him off, just stating facts.
edit: + Show Spoiler +
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if Colangelo is being honest in the quote below then i think he has been reading to many power of positive thinking books. he somehow thinks if he creates an expectation then a player ( embiid ) will meet it. he did this same kind of shit with Bosh in Toronto. Its probably Colangelo's biggest weakness as GM/Prez/BBOps Guy.
The key word in BC's comment is "expects". Let's see if common sense prevails and Embiid plays with restrictions.
IMO, If Embiid plays next year without minutes restrictions he is going to sustain an injury that will knock him out for 4+ weeks.
Last year Embiid played 29 games out of 40; never played back-to-back and played under 30 minutes every game.
On June 24 2017 00:41 MassHysteria wrote:Show nested quote +On June 24 2017 00:39 JimmiC wrote:
Lets see how his numbers look with butler at the 3 before he gets written off. No one is writing him off, just stating facts. edit: + Show Spoiler +
i found a great way to "smell test" these advanced defense stats. Take Player X. Examine every team mate of player X and their defensive efficiency with player X on the floor. Then examine the same team mate's defensive efficiency in general.
If every player on the team has their defensive efficiency decline in the presence player X then Player X is very bad ( Irving, Korver, Jamal Crawford) . If every team mate has their defensive efficiency improve in the presence of Player X then the guy is a very good defender ( Paul , Green , Beverley, Davis) .
If the majority of team mates ( but not all ) have worse defensive efficiency in the presence of Player X then Player X is below average ( Derozan ).
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On June 24 2017 00:52 JimmyJRaynor wrote:Show nested quote +On June 24 2017 00:41 MassHysteria wrote:On June 24 2017 00:39 JimmiC wrote:
Lets see how his numbers look with butler at the 3 before he gets written off. No one is writing him off, just stating facts. edit: + Show Spoiler + i found a great way to "smell test" these advanced defense stats. Take Player X. Examine every team mate of player X and their defensive efficiency with player X on the floor. Then examine the same team mate's defensive efficiency in general. If every player on the team has their defensive efficiency decline in the presence player X then Player X is very bad ( Irving, Korver, Jamal Crawford) . If every team mate has their defensive efficiency improve in the presence of Player X then the guy is a very good defender ( Paul , Green , Beverley, Davis) . If the majority of team mates ( but not all ) have worse defensive efficiency in the presence of Player X then Player X is below average ( Derozan ).
Ya that's definitely the best way to do it b/c defense is of course a team-strategy and the stats don't necessarily tell the whole story. In this case though, if you rank that low and in the bottom 2, there is usually something to it that makes it harder to overlook (and less motivating to delve deeper).
Good thing is that after the trade, you would assume Butler will get the assignment on the other team's best offensive players so that will definitely help Wiggins in this "stat"-sense. I would be surprised at seeing him this low next season, but it will definitely make it much more interesting to look deeper into it like you explained above.
edit:That's true JimmiC, I think ppl were definitely trying to troll/bait you previously so I get you. And I don't but that would be something else that would be interesting to look into.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/CMGSTv4.jpg)
