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United Kingdom16710 Posts
For once I agree with you Pandemona. People have very different perspectives on what is required to be 'the greatest ever' football player. There are so many factors involved, such as trophies won, both for club and country, goal/assist statistics, individual attributes, play style, positions, the team you play with, the teams you play against and etc.
I don't think there will ever be a consensus on who is the greatest, because people will always have their own opinions with their biases and prejudices. For example: those of you saying Messi is a step below Pele and Maradona because he hasn't won a World Cup obviously place a great value in the tournament. And while it arguably is the most prestigious tournament in world football, I don't think many will deny that the Champions League has tougher competition. So, anyone who believes a player can only be the greatest if he has won the most competitive tournament in the world, multiple times, will certainly say Pele and Maradona are behind Messi. Then again, those players didn't win the tournament by themselves. No matter how much a single player shines, you cannot just ignore the team they were part of. Messi's Barcelona, Pele's Brazil, Maradona's Argentina... the 3 wouldn't have been able to achieve greatness without them.
Let's say, hypothetically, that Messi does win a World Cup before he retires. I doubt that will change many people's minds. They will say that the teams Messi played with throughout his career were superior, and he was just fortunate to find himself in the right place at the right time. Sadly, once people's minds are set in a particular way, it's very difficult to sway it even with facts or overwhelming amount of evidence. Humans more often than not let their emotions override and outweigh logic, critical thinking, reasoning and etc. It's just how we roll, unfortunately.
The whole thing GOAT thing is pretty pointless anyway. Nothing but a pissing match between fans on who deserves to be higher up on the pedestal. I doubt any of the players being mentioned as GOAT give a crap - except Pele, that is.
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And there are also people that think that Eusébio was the best player ever  altough he is never mentioned in this kind of stuff. But clubism apart I think that Messi is a genius and he will stay in history as one of the best players of all time.
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Yeah Portugal probably rate Eusebio higher than Ronaldo right? Eusebio was sick and is such a star still. Is he ok btw? last i heard he was in hospital again.
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Oh by the way...
Transfer News!WALLACE DEAL AGREEDChelsea Football Club is delighted to announce we have agreed terms with Fluminense for the transfer of Wallace in the January window.
As part of the deal, the 18-year-old defender will remain with Fluminense until the end of the season.Source
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PSG are finally getting Lucas Moura come January. Pretty awesome.
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We should really have a different thread for this greatest/best ever discussion.
I don't see how this belongs into the 2012-2013 football thread any more than it belonged into the 2011-12 thread or than it will belong into the inevitable future-season-threads. It's a fun discussion, but it turned into beating a dead horse from my perspective.
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On December 05 2012 07:10 Steveling wrote:
If Messi had the geniouses pele was surrounded by, he'd won 8 world cups not 3.
That includes his horrible coaches in the national team btw, I still can't forget the idiot who subd him out in the 2006 game against germany. He was clearly the best player on the pitch, even that young.
Yes, clearly the best player on the pitch, even tho he didn't play a single second in that game :p
That was Riquelme and not Messi.
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Ah, football, I injured myself a couple of weeks ago and now I'm out till at least January, it fucking sucks. Watching football is so annoying if you want to jump in at every second but can't.
Eintracht Frankfurt fighting! - my contribution to the football thread.
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
News!Goal-line technology set to make its debut at Fifa Club World CupFifa will introduce goal-line technology for the first time at the Club World Cup this week in an effort to accurately judge when balls cross the goal line.
Hawkeye, widely used in cricket and tennis, and GoalRef, which uses a microchip in the ball and low magnetic waves around the goal, will be used at venues in Toyota and Yokohama.
Source
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On December 05 2012 21:53 clusen wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 07:10 Steveling wrote:
If Messi had the geniouses pele was surrounded by, he'd won 8 world cups not 3.
That includes his horrible coaches in the national team btw, I still can't forget the idiot who subd him out in the 2006 game against germany. He was clearly the best player on the pitch, even that young. Yes, clearly the best player on the pitch, even tho he didn't play a single second in that game :p That was Riquelme and not Messi.
haha yeah cant really blame Pekerman for not playing Messi, he wasnt going to get in ahead of Crespo and co, at that time.
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Giggs, bah that cock could of played for England...could of made us a half decent side in the 90s, we were screaming out for a left winger for years!!! Could argue we still are! (as in out and out left footer)
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On December 05 2012 21:53 clusen wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 07:10 Steveling wrote:
If Messi had the geniouses pele was surrounded by, he'd won 8 world cups not 3.
That includes his horrible coaches in the national team btw, I still can't forget the idiot who subd him out in the 2006 game against germany. He was clearly the best player on the pitch, even that young. Yes, clearly the best player on the pitch, even tho he didn't play a single second in that game :p That was Riquelme and not Messi.
That's even worse, he didn't even let him play, even though he was the best.
And yeah, riquelme was by far the best on the pitch.
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On December 06 2012 01:30 Steveling wrote:Show nested quote +On December 05 2012 21:53 clusen wrote:On December 05 2012 07:10 Steveling wrote:
If Messi had the geniouses pele was surrounded by, he'd won 8 world cups not 3.
That includes his horrible coaches in the national team btw, I still can't forget the idiot who subd him out in the 2006 game against germany. He was clearly the best player on the pitch, even that young. Yes, clearly the best player on the pitch, even tho he didn't play a single second in that game :p That was Riquelme and not Messi. That's even worse, he didn't even let him play, even though he was the best. And yeah, riquelme was by far the best on the pitch.
No he wasnt really, he was a promising teenager, theres tons of those..
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On December 06 2012 01:03 Pandemona wrote:
Giggs, bah that cock could of played for England...could of made us a half decent side in the 90s, we were screaming out for a left winger for years!!! Could argue we still are! (as in out and out left footer)
Apparently bale could have played for us too, bloody welsh wingers.
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
On December 06 2012 01:33 UdderChaos wrote:Show nested quote +On December 06 2012 01:03 Pandemona wrote:
Giggs, bah that cock could of played for England...could of made us a half decent side in the 90s, we were screaming out for a left winger for years!!! Could argue we still are! (as in out and out left footer) Apparently bale could have played for us too, bloody welsh wingers.
Must be a flippin' daft country if they choose to never see a world cup or a european championship.....
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Or they see themselves as Welshmen and not English?
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Giggs situation was his nan was welsh, everyone else in his family was English and he chose to play for wales.
Not sure about the Bale situation, just know he was bought up in England himself as well.
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LOL Benitez: Torres good at defending, can clear corners. hahahahhahahah
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On December 05 2012 20:50 Mafe wrote:
We should really have a different thread for this greatest/best ever discussion.
I don't see how this belongs into the 2012-2013 football thread any more than it belonged into the 2011-12 thread or than it will belong into the inevitable future-season-threads. It's a fun discussion, but it turned into beating a dead horse from my perspective.
It was pointless from the very start of it, theres just no way to compare any player from current era with people from 80' or 70'.EOT
Had to skip through bunch of posts in order to read what I wanted, current football news and discussion.
Barcelona vs Benfica was just horrible to watch, changed to Shahtar vs Juventus after 1st half.I knew that both the teams were content with a draw but it was good game anyway, and that own goal made it even better.
Damned ManU losing to Cluj destroyed my 3 coupons, everything else went perfectly:/ When will i learn that betting on football is the worst thing you can do, handball,volleyball, even basketball are so much easier.
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EPT
