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Off-Topic General Discussion - Page 2477

Forum Index > The Shopkeeper′s Inn
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wei2coolman
Profile Joined November 2010
United States60033 Posts
July 14 2014 18:41 GMT
#49521
holy shit my arms feel fucking dead. like i woke up, i couldn't stretch out my arms all hte way, if i tried to bend at the elbow past 90 degrees, it feels like someone is trying to cut my arms off.
liftlift > tsm
BlackPaladin
Profile Joined May 2010
United States9316 Posts
July 14 2014 18:42 GMT
#49522
On July 15 2014 03:37 Lord Tolkien wrote:
"I don't mind poop that much, not that I have a fetish or anything" -wav


Apparently after getting operated on his colon, Wave has an affinity towards poop.
"Your full potential does not matter if you do not use all 100% of it."
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
July 14 2014 18:45 GMT
#49523
Newbee crushing. Yango the non-believer.
If you want disappointing teams to support, join me on the Dignitas bandwagon.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-14 18:52:15
July 14 2014 18:50 GMT
#49524
On July 14 2014 14:36 Requizen wrote:
First run at my Destroyer Lord, about to get lost in EVO Hype

+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]
[image loading]
[image loading]
[image loading]

Req pls why no glowing eyes


On July 14 2014 23:05 Cixah wrote:


And were back on the hype train.

CHOO CHOOOOO

ALLLLLLL ABOARD THE HYPE TRAIN

CHUGGA CHUGGA CHUGGA CHUGGA CHUGGA CHUGGA CHOOO CHOOOOOOOO


On July 15 2014 00:26 Requizen wrote:
Also, who are these new characters in SSB? They keep adding more FE characters, the one Nintendo franchise I know nothing about -.-

There are loads of English ports. Fire Emblem Awakening for 3DS, Shadow Dragon for DS, Blazing Sword and Sacred Stones on GBA, Radiant Dawn for Wii, Path of Radiance for the Game Cube and all the unofficial translations like the ones for Binding Blade and Heroes of Light and Shadow.

Awakening is obviously the main choice here if you want to learn about Lucina, Robin, Chrom and also it's the newest so just pop it into your 3DS and play!


On July 15 2014 00:30 Requizen wrote:
Is FE a tactics style game?

It's made by the same guys who did the Advance Wars series if that helps.


On July 15 2014 01:41 Cixah wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 15 2014 01:34 Frudgey wrote:
Super Smash Bros trailer reveals Captain Falcon and then doesn't showcase any of his moves. I mean, I know he's been in all of the previous games so we should really know what to expect from him, but I still wanted to see him smash something


http://i.imgur.com/vaSQoCl.gif

Please.

You subtle pun has no power here.

Damn you just got called out son. You gonna take it lying down like that?


On July 15 2014 03:37 Sufficiency wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 15 2014 03:33 Alaric wrote:
FE7 has Merlinus always staying behind, though, and sometimes 3 horsemen spawn in range to reach him. :<


Merlinus is kind of a different beast. And look, it never came back after FE7...

You can access Convoy with Chrom in Fire Emblem Awakening no?
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
July 14 2014 18:55 GMT
#49525
On July 15 2014 03:36 Sufficiency wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 15 2014 03:27 TheYango wrote:
lol Sufficiency the only reason those reinforcements screw you over is because you move through missions too slow and leave stragglers to get buttfucked.

The point of enemy reinforcements from your side of the map, is to force you to maintain a tight formation. They only pose a problem if you're progressing too slowly (resulting in you being too close to their initial location when they spawn) or leaving vulnerable units to get picked off.

FFT doesn't need to use this because it already has facing mechanics which approach a similar concept in a different manner--but facing also has its own problems (mostly that the the penalty for attacking from the front is miss chance--which makes the game even more RNG-dependent at times).


Even if the purpose is to force tight formation, it can be done in a way that the player can anticipate (eg "reinforcement will arrive at the back in 2 turns!"). Otherwise you are making the player to make certain choices only after the nasty surprise has happened once.

No, because that means you can play shitty up to the moment when you get the warning. Conversely if there's no warning then if you get fucked by it once or twice, you play careful for the rest of the missions (or you don't like Sufficiency and continue to get fucked by them and complain about the game being bad).

Honestly, it seems your quip is just that FE isn't an easier game or more forgiving of mistakes--which should be apparent from the get-go with character permadeath.
Moderator
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
July 14 2014 19:02 GMT
#49526
There is a HUGE difference between a difficult game and a frustrating game. the frustrating ones happen to be difficult, but difficulty does not imply frustration.

When the correct choice in game cannot be deduce from available information - or even the slightest hint - and once you trigger the pitfall you have to restart - that is not difficulty. That is just trial and error gameplay that is frustrating.

Even if the player is warned two turns in advance it can still be very difficult to keep the formation intact. It doesn't need to be a surprise to be effective.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Sufficiency
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
Canada23833 Posts
July 14 2014 19:15 GMT
#49527
Also, trial and error gameplay is OK, if iteration cycles are short and the gameplay relies on execution (I want to be the guy, those hacked super mario levels, super meat boy, etc.)

It just does not fit the kind of gameplay of FE games.
https://twitter.com/SufficientStats
Frudgey
Profile Joined September 2012
Canada3367 Posts
July 14 2014 19:19 GMT
#49528
On July 15 2014 03:50 MoonBear wrote:

Show nested quote +
On July 15 2014 01:41 Cixah wrote:
On July 15 2014 01:34 Frudgey wrote:
Super Smash Bros trailer reveals Captain Falcon and then doesn't showcase any of his moves. I mean, I know he's been in all of the previous games so we should really know what to expect from him, but I still wanted to see him smash something


http://i.imgur.com/vaSQoCl.gif

Please.

You subtle pun has no power here.

Damn you just got called out son. You gonna take it lying down like that?

When I first wrote that I didn't intend to do that pun. I wasn't even aware that it was there until I was called out on it.

You guys are giving me much more credit than I deserve. So yes, I am going to take it lying down like that.
It is better to die for The Emperor than live for yourself.
TheYango
Profile Joined September 2008
United States47024 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-14 19:31:23
July 14 2014 19:28 GMT
#49529
On July 15 2014 04:02 Sufficiency wrote:
There is a HUGE difference between a difficult game and a frustrating game. the frustrating ones happen to be difficult, but difficulty does not imply frustration.

When the correct choice in game cannot be deduce from available information - or even the slightest hint - and once you trigger the pitfall you have to restart - that is not difficulty. That is just trial and error gameplay that is frustrating.

Even if the player is warned two turns in advance it can still be very difficult to keep the formation intact. It doesn't need to be a surprise to be effective.

You're missing the point.

The expected gameplay pattern isn't that you get to one set of reinforcements, lose to it, restart the mission, then play with knowledge of the reinforcements arriving on X turn. The expected gameplay pattern is that you lose to it maybe once, LEARN from your mistake, and then from there on out play in such a way that your formation/clearing speed are ALWAYS resilient to potential surprises. That the trial/error gameplay scenario is possible is simply an unfortunate consequence of the game's linear/non-random nature.

If you get caught pants-down by the surprise, you made a mistake. The mistake wasn't "I didn't know there would be reinforcements on turn 9 in mission 6", the mistake was "I wasn't playing in a way that I would be ready for reinforcements, regardless of whether I knew they were coming or not". The latter being a completely legitimate fault, and not some arbitrary product of not having foreknowledge of the scenario.
Moderator
Requizen
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States33802 Posts
July 14 2014 19:33 GMT
#49530
On July 15 2014 03:50 MoonBear wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 14 2014 14:36 Requizen wrote:
First run at my Destroyer Lord, about to get lost in EVO Hype

+ Show Spoiler +

[image loading]
[image loading]
[image loading]
[image loading]

Req pls why no glowing eyes

It's a strange angle. As you can see, he's sorta looking down, so while the actual "eyes" within the sockets are painted, it's hard to see in these pictures. I could try to apply a "glow" effect to the rims of the eye sockets, but I don't want to overdo it and make the eyes seem silly.

Show nested quote +
On July 15 2014 00:26 Requizen wrote:
Also, who are these new characters in SSB? They keep adding more FE characters, the one Nintendo franchise I know nothing about -.-

There are loads of English ports. Fire Emblem Awakening for 3DS, Shadow Dragon for DS, Blazing Sword and Sacred Stones on GBA, Radiant Dawn for Wii, Path of Radiance for the Game Cube and all the unofficial translations like the ones for Binding Blade and Heroes of Light and Shadow.

Awakening is obviously the main choice here if you want to learn about Lucina, Robin, Chrom and also it's the newest so just pop it into your 3DS and play!


Show nested quote +
On July 15 2014 00:30 Requizen wrote:
Is FE a tactics style game?

It's made by the same guys who did the Advance Wars series if that helps.


Eh... still. I don't particularly like Tactics games, I really only liked the one Advance Wars game I played. And even then I disliked the last half of it and didn't even finish it.
It's your boy Guzma!
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
July 14 2014 19:43 GMT
#49531
On July 15 2014 04:33 Requizen wrote:
It's a strange angle. As you can see, he's sorta looking down, so while the actual "eyes" within the sockets are painted, it's hard to see in these pictures. I could try to apply a "glow" effect to the rims of the eye sockets, but I don't want to overdo it and make the eyes seem silly.

Oh ok. I just thought it was weird not to paint the eyes since I couldn't see anything!

On July 15 2014 04:33 Requizen wrote:
Eh... still. I don't particularly like Tactics games, I really only liked the one Advance Wars game I played. And even then I disliked the last half of it and didn't even finish it.

It's not quite Advance Wars since it's RPG-esque. Why not try and game and if you like it go buy Awakening then?

On July 15 2014 04:28 TheYango wrote:
If you get caught pants-down by the surprise, you made a mistake. The mistake wasn't "I didn't know there would be reinforcements on turn 9 in mission 6", the mistake was "I wasn't playing in a way that I would be ready for reinforcements, regardless of whether I knew they were coming or not". The latter being a completely legitimate fault, and not some arbitrary product of not having foreknowledge of the scenario.

FE7 Sacred Sword is good at teaching you this since it actually scores you on your time so you feel like you have to keep moving and it becomes you trying to crash through the ranks of the enemies in front of you and build up a head start before the reinforcements that are coming soon from the back catch up to you.
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
jcarlsoniv
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States27922 Posts
July 14 2014 19:49 GMT
#49532
On July 15 2014 04:28 TheYango wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 15 2014 04:02 Sufficiency wrote:
There is a HUGE difference between a difficult game and a frustrating game. the frustrating ones happen to be difficult, but difficulty does not imply frustration.

When the correct choice in game cannot be deduce from available information - or even the slightest hint - and once you trigger the pitfall you have to restart - that is not difficulty. That is just trial and error gameplay that is frustrating.

Even if the player is warned two turns in advance it can still be very difficult to keep the formation intact. It doesn't need to be a surprise to be effective.

You're missing the point.

The expected gameplay pattern isn't that you get to one set of reinforcements, lose to it, restart the mission, then play with knowledge of the reinforcements arriving on X turn. The expected gameplay pattern is that you lose to it maybe once, LEARN from your mistake, and then from there on out play in such a way that your formation/clearing speed are ALWAYS resilient to potential surprises. That the trial/error gameplay scenario is possible is simply an unfortunate consequence of the game's linear/non-random nature.

If you get caught pants-down by the surprise, you made a mistake. The mistake wasn't "I didn't know there would be reinforcements on turn 9 in mission 6", the mistake was "I wasn't playing in a way that I would be ready for reinforcements, regardless of whether I knew they were coming or not". The latter being a completely legitimate fault, and not some arbitrary product of not having foreknowledge of the scenario.


"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, my healers deserve to be dead."
Soniv ||| Soniv#1962 ||| @jcarlsoniv ||| The Big Golem ||| Join the Glorious Evolution. What's your favorite aminal, a bear? ||| Joe "Don't call me Daniel" "Soniv" "Daniel" Carlsberg LXIX ||| Paging Dr. John Shadow
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
July 14 2014 19:52 GMT
#49533


The description for the video says Champion Steven. Hm. Do we get RS or E style Liza and Tate gym though? Also that Meteor Mash animation seemed kinda... idk weak.
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
Frudgey
Profile Joined September 2012
Canada3367 Posts
July 14 2014 20:01 GMT
#49534
At first I thought MoonBear posted another Super Smash Bros video and then I got super excited.

Then I realized that he didn't post another Super Smash Bros video. Probably a good thing because I'm not sure if I could take that much hype. That's too much hype for a Monday.
It is better to die for The Emperor than live for yourself.
Zess
Profile Joined July 2012
Adun Toridas!9144 Posts
July 14 2014 20:01 GMT
#49535
On July 15 2014 04:28 TheYango wrote:
If you get caught pants-down by the surprise, you made a mistake. The mistake wasn't "I didn't know there would be reinforcements on turn 9 in mission 6", the mistake was "I wasn't playing in a way that I would be ready for reinforcements, regardless of whether I knew they were coming or not". The latter being a completely legitimate fault, and not some arbitrary product of not having foreknowledge of the scenario.


This requires playing in a robust manner for your first runs, and from what I can tell Sufficiency is an optimizer. In which case Sufficiency, you should just get the Wiki so you can have all of your knowledge ahead of time so you can be efficient.

What I enjoy most out of games is getting RNG-fucked and having your run ruined, which is why I like RNG focussed strategy/tactics games (Tactics - SWOTS: The Pit; Strategy - FTL; Both - XCOM).

Not being able to deduce the state of the game isn't necessarily a design flaw for tactics, but I can see why it would be frustrating for a type of player. Maybe FE isn't for you.



Also, on some maps you can stop reinforcements from spawning at all by being really pro
Administrator@TL_Zess
| (• ◡•)|八 (❍ᴥ❍ʋ)
Alaric
Profile Joined November 2009
France45622 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-14 20:13:26
July 14 2014 20:12 GMT
#49536
MB telling Requizen not to spend on models he won't paint then suggesting him to buy a game he may not even enjoy nor finish. :')

Posts made in the last week 215
Really fuck EVO+TI4+extra time week.
Cant take LMS hipsters serious.
MoonBear
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Straight outta Johto18973 Posts
July 14 2014 20:19 GMT
#49537
On July 15 2014 05:12 Alaric wrote:
MB telling Requizen not to spend on models he won't paint then suggesting him to buy a game he may not even enjoy nor finish. :')

Posts made in the last week 215
Really fuck EVO+TI4+extra time week.

That's why I said try it first and then decide whether to buy lol

Your highest recorded ports per week is just above 300. Try harder.
ModeratorA dream. Do you have one that has cursed you like that? Or maybe... a wish?
Lord Tolkien
Profile Joined November 2012
United States12084 Posts
July 14 2014 20:22 GMT
#49538
On July 15 2014 04:52 MoonBear wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-wTDPviFq8

The description for the video says Champion Steven. Hm. Do we get RS or E style Liza and Tate gym though? Also that Meteor Mash animation seemed kinda... idk weak.

Ah, the "create a house" feature. Seems popular, after all that's what WoW is doing now.
"His father is pretty juicy tbh." ~WaveofShadow
Frolossus
Profile Joined February 2010
United States4779 Posts
July 14 2014 20:23 GMT
#49539
On July 15 2014 05:22 Lord Tolkien wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 15 2014 04:52 MoonBear wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P-wTDPviFq8

The description for the video says Champion Steven. Hm. Do we get RS or E style Liza and Tate gym though? Also that Meteor Mash animation seemed kinda... idk weak.

Ah, the "create a house" feature. Seems popular, after all that's what WoW is doing now.

that was in the original R/S
Parnage
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States7414 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-14 20:25:08
July 14 2014 20:24 GMT
#49540
Metagross isn't my thing but it's apparently quite a smash with most other players so eh. I do like how it looks at least, nothing overly complex just him being like "my legs are now arms, I float now, deal with it"
-orb- Fan. Live the Nal_rA dream. || Yordles are cool.
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