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On September 27 2013 21:47 KelsierSC wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2013 21:43 rothsbury wrote:On September 27 2013 21:40 KelsierSC wrote:On September 27 2013 21:38 rothsbury wrote:On September 27 2013 21:31 KelsierSC wrote:On September 27 2013 21:27 robson1 wrote:On September 27 2013 21:26 KelsierSC wrote:On September 27 2013 21:21 ZenithM wrote:On September 27 2013 21:20 Waise wrote:On September 27 2013 21:14 KelsierSC wrote:
Oh well I see this thread has descended into shitting on a fantastic caster. Can't wait till next week when we talk about how improved Tasteless is.
the way people mope and pout when anyone criticizes the sacred cow casters is ridiculous And so far the discussion has been fairly reasonable. We're not "shitting" on anyone. ill informed criticism is not reasonable imo. Point to the "ill informed criticism" The only thing I'd say was unreasonable was the guy who just said: "fire the guy, right now" Pretty much everyone saying he doesn't watch, doesn't play, doesn't know about strategies. Unless you live in his house you don't know how much he plays. He does watch SC2 as he is a god damn caster, unless he casts with his eyes closed. He does know about strategies, he references them many times in the cast. however his role in the casting duo is for entertainment,play-by-play and to ask Artosis to talk about strategies in more depth. People calling for him to be fired or replaced by wolf when they don't really understand anything is not reasonable "Evolution is pretty well-supported by the fossil record." "Did you see the fossils put there? Unless you lived on Earth at the time you don't know how the fossils got there." well I guess that proves it then. Clearly the two arguments are comparable. The point is you're applying the strong sceptical argument to whether Tasteless plays/watches SC2 and denying any possibility of inferring how much he plays/watches SC2s from the quality of his casts. Someone who watches and plays SC2 should have a much greater game knowledge than Tasteless, especially one with Tasteless' native intelligence; therefore Tasteless very likely doesn't watch or play SC2 beyond what he casts. Yeh I don't think you can infer his game knowledge from his casts because his role isn't the analytical caster. I don't think we are going to convince eachother I just wish the criticism was more reasonable and toned down, rather than pitchforking and trying to get GOM to fire him.
You can absolutely infer his game knowledge from his casts because he says things which are flatly wrong, like TvT is Innovation's best match up. It'd be one thing for him not to talk about strategy / players at all and just be entertaining, but he does talk about strategy and players and his knowledge gaps really show.
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he did a good job considering how little time he had to prepare for that
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Crazy day...1 more all in and were done.
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On September 27 2013 21:53 TheDwf wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2013 21:52 Schelim wrote:
Innovation is the best player in the world at dying to zerg all-ins.
well, actually, that might be the one thing Flash is even better at. Held hyvaa's roach/bane bust without Mines or Tanks in the Derelict game, not so bad.
fair enough, didn't see that game. i guess Inno is the best then.
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On September 27 2013 21:54 Schelim wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2013 21:53 TheDwf wrote:On September 27 2013 21:52 Schelim wrote:
Innovation is the best player in the world at dying to zerg all-ins.
well, actually, that might be the one thing Flash is even better at. Held hyvaa's roach/bane bust without Mines or Tanks in the Derelict game, not so bad. fair enough, didn't see that game. i guess Inno is the best then.
Marineking is pretty good too ;P
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whats with all tasteless bashing?
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On September 27 2013 21:54 liberate71 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2013 21:52 Schelim wrote:
Innovation is the best player in the world at dying to zerg all-ins.
well, actually, that might be the one thing Flash is even better at. Bullshit, Flash defended against some roach/bane/ling shizen rather AMAZINGLY very recently *ponders* I think it was hyvaa?
Flash is way WAY better than Inno in holding Z all ins. I'd actually say Flash is one of the best.
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On September 27 2013 21:54 jonich0n wrote:
Terrans getting stomped by roaches lately
I lose most of my TvZ's to roaches :/
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wtf just happen, I have to do real programming for 3 mins and Inno loses ?
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glitch in the matrix then
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On September 27 2013 21:55 liberate71 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2013 21:54 Schelim wrote:On September 27 2013 21:53 TheDwf wrote:On September 27 2013 21:52 Schelim wrote:
Innovation is the best player in the world at dying to zerg all-ins.
well, actually, that might be the one thing Flash is even better at. Held hyvaa's roach/bane bust without Mines or Tanks in the Derelict game, not so bad. fair enough, didn't see that game. i guess Inno is the best then. Marineking is pretty good too ;P
Marineking held a 6 pool with a CC first... twice... xD
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On September 27 2013 21:55 artrea wrote:
wtf just happen, I have to do real programming for 3 mins and Inno loses ?
Unscouted Roach/Baneling bust.
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Canada16217 Posts
On September 27 2013 21:54 liberate71 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2013 21:52 Schelim wrote:
Innovation is the best player in the world at dying to zerg all-ins.
well, actually, that might be the one thing Flash is even better at. Bullshit, Flash defended against some roach/bane/ling shizen rather AMAZINGLY very recently *ponders* I think it was hyvaa?
yeah was vs hyvaa on derelict watcher
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On September 27 2013 21:49 JustPassingBy wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2013 21:43 rothsbury wrote:On September 27 2013 21:40 KelsierSC wrote:On September 27 2013 21:38 rothsbury wrote:On September 27 2013 21:31 KelsierSC wrote:On September 27 2013 21:27 robson1 wrote:On September 27 2013 21:26 KelsierSC wrote:On September 27 2013 21:21 ZenithM wrote:On September 27 2013 21:20 Waise wrote:On September 27 2013 21:14 KelsierSC wrote:
Oh well I see this thread has descended into shitting on a fantastic caster. Can't wait till next week when we talk about how improved Tasteless is.
the way people mope and pout when anyone criticizes the sacred cow casters is ridiculous And so far the discussion has been fairly reasonable. We're not "shitting" on anyone. ill informed criticism is not reasonable imo. Point to the "ill informed criticism" The only thing I'd say was unreasonable was the guy who just said: "fire the guy, right now" Pretty much everyone saying he doesn't watch, doesn't play, doesn't know about strategies. Unless you live in his house you don't know how much he plays. He does watch SC2 as he is a god damn caster, unless he casts with his eyes closed. He does know about strategies, he references them many times in the cast. however his role in the casting duo is for entertainment,play-by-play and to ask Artosis to talk about strategies in more depth. People calling for him to be fired or replaced by wolf when they don't really understand anything is not reasonable "Evolution is pretty well-supported by the fossil record." "Did you see the fossils put there? Unless you lived on Earth at the time you don't know how the fossils got there." well I guess that proves it then. Clearly the two arguments are comparable. The point is you're applying the strong sceptical argument to whether Tasteless plays/watches SC2 and denying any possibility of inferring how much he plays/watches SC2s from the quality of his casts. Someone who watches and plays SC2 should have a much greater game knowledge than Tasteless, especially one with Tasteless' native intelligence; therefore Tasteless very likely doesn't watch or play SC2 beyond what he casts. There are strong hints towards it though, considering how Tasteless and Artosis never talk about them playing starcraft and that is not because Tasteless dislikes talking about games he is playing. In fact, he is pretty vocal about it.
A lot of the time when Artosis tries to reference another game where people have played a similar strategy (i.e. Did you watch player x do this vs player y the other day), Tasteless usually hasn't watched it.
If anything that's one of the things that I like about Artosis, it clearly shows he does a lot of Starcraft outside the casting, even watching minor tournaments. Nothing Tasteless talks about gives me the feeling he does anything with Starcraft except casting at GOM and maybe watching a few of the big tournaments.
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On September 27 2013 21:55 saddaromma wrote:
whats with all tasteless bashing?
Games got boring. And tasteless called TvT Innovations best matchup.
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On September 27 2013 21:55 saddaromma wrote:
whats with all tasteless bashing?
you got to bash someone if toss doesn't advance.
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Canada16217 Posts
On September 27 2013 21:55 saddaromma wrote:
whats with all tasteless bashing?
it's that time of year again
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On September 27 2013 21:55 robson1 wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2013 21:55 liberate71 wrote:On September 27 2013 21:54 Schelim wrote:On September 27 2013 21:53 TheDwf wrote:On September 27 2013 21:52 Schelim wrote:
Innovation is the best player in the world at dying to zerg all-ins.
well, actually, that might be the one thing Flash is even better at. Held hyvaa's roach/bane bust without Mines or Tanks in the Derelict game, not so bad. fair enough, didn't see that game. i guess Inno is the best then. Marineking is pretty good too ;P Marineking held a 6 pool with a CC first... twice... xD
Anyone knowing what they're doing can hold a 6pool with a CC first... lol
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At the same time, the fact people are even talking about him as a write off is telling.
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United Kingdom10443 Posts
On September 27 2013 21:54 rothsbury wrote:Show nested quote +On September 27 2013 21:47 KelsierSC wrote:On September 27 2013 21:43 rothsbury wrote:On September 27 2013 21:40 KelsierSC wrote:On September 27 2013 21:38 rothsbury wrote:On September 27 2013 21:31 KelsierSC wrote:On September 27 2013 21:27 robson1 wrote:On September 27 2013 21:26 KelsierSC wrote:On September 27 2013 21:21 ZenithM wrote:On September 27 2013 21:20 Waise wrote:
[quote]
the way people mope and pout when anyone criticizes the sacred cow casters is ridiculous And so far the discussion has been fairly reasonable. We're not "shitting" on anyone. ill informed criticism is not reasonable imo. Point to the "ill informed criticism" The only thing I'd say was unreasonable was the guy who just said: "fire the guy, right now" Pretty much everyone saying he doesn't watch, doesn't play, doesn't know about strategies. Unless you live in his house you don't know how much he plays. He does watch SC2 as he is a god damn caster, unless he casts with his eyes closed. He does know about strategies, he references them many times in the cast. however his role in the casting duo is for entertainment,play-by-play and to ask Artosis to talk about strategies in more depth. People calling for him to be fired or replaced by wolf when they don't really understand anything is not reasonable "Evolution is pretty well-supported by the fossil record." "Did you see the fossils put there? Unless you lived on Earth at the time you don't know how the fossils got there." well I guess that proves it then. Clearly the two arguments are comparable. The point is you're applying the strong sceptical argument to whether Tasteless plays/watches SC2 and denying any possibility of inferring how much he plays/watches SC2s from the quality of his casts. Someone who watches and plays SC2 should have a much greater game knowledge than Tasteless, especially one with Tasteless' native intelligence; therefore Tasteless very likely doesn't watch or play SC2 beyond what he casts. Yeh I don't think you can infer his game knowledge from his casts because his role isn't the analytical caster. I don't think we are going to convince eachother I just wish the criticism was more reasonable and toned down, rather than pitchforking and trying to get GOM to fire him. You can absolutely infer his game knowledge from his casts because he says things which are flatly wrong, like TvT is Innovation's best match up. It'd be one thing for him not to talk about strategy / players at all and just be entertaining, but he does talk about strategy and players and his knowledge gaps really show.
Well I suppose he had one mistake. It happens. If he was getting things wrong all the time it would be an issue but I personally don't think he is. Like I said I don't think we can't convince eachother I love his casting.
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EPT
