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On July 16 2013 20:21 lichter wrote:
No one can really make the claim that Fantasy is "sure to throw" just because they are team mates. They may be team mates but they are still rivals in individual leagues. Being teammates also does not assure that they are good friends. You hear about players practicing with players from other teams and being really friendly with players on rival teams all the time. How would you ever know that it isn't a throw, unless you investigate all the player relationships? It might happen, but from our perspective it is all just meaningless speculation.
Yeah no, Fantasy will throw because it's what almost everyone would do given the team situation.
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Wow, speculating that SKT will match fix. Seriously, you guys think Boxer will let something like that happen? Don't you think Fantasy and Rain have integrity?
Wow
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On July 16 2013 20:25 lichter wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2013 20:22 Dodgin wrote:On July 16 2013 20:21 lichter wrote:
No one can really make the claim that Fantasy is "sure to throw" just because they are team mates. They may be team mates but they are still rivals in individual leagues. Being teammates also does not assure that they are good friends. You hear about players practicing with players from other teams and being really friendly with players on rival teams all the time. How would you ever know that it isn't a throw, unless you investigate all the player relationships? It might happen, but from our perspective it is all just meaningless speculation. It will happen 100%, because it's for the good of the team that rain has a chance in tiebreakers and boxer will tell fantasy to lose. Yes but if we become suspicious of that match (and we have reason to be), then we should be suspicious of all matches between friendly players. I'm not defending the format, because it really is shit (although I understand the necessity for it due to the scheduling on TV), but we can't just assume 100% that if Fantasy loses he threw the match. This is the biggest problem with this round robin format. If Fanta loses, it will always feel like a throw for viewers. If Fanta wins, he screws his teammate and friend over. No win situation.
well, personally I'm sometimes suspicious of situations that happen in the up/downs, we don't really use round robin anywhere else. if the past has taught us anything It's that stuff like that does happen.
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On July 16 2013 20:26 Bagration wrote:
Wow, speculating that SKT will match fix. Seriously, you guys think Boxer will let something like that happen? Don't you think Fantasy and Rain have integrity?
Wow
People like drama
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On July 16 2013 20:21 lichter wrote:
No one can really make the claim that Fantasy is "sure to throw" just because they are team mates. They may be team mates but they are still rivals in individual leagues. Being teammates also does not assure that they are good friends. You hear about players practicing with players from other teams and being really friendly with players on rival teams all the time. How would you ever know that it isn't a throw, unless you investigate all the player relationships? It might happen, but from our perspective it is all just meaningless speculation.
well, I'm thinking: what would I do in that situation? And my answer is: I would throw the game (or rather: not play 100%), even if I didn't like my teammate, he's still my teammate.
Not saying that Fantasy will do that, he's a professional player and I'm not, so we can't tell what exactly will happen.
I think he won't exactly throw it by doing a BC-rush or something like that but he'll most likely not play his best, not take it too serious
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Does OSL do 1 or 2 ro8 matches per day?
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On July 16 2013 20:20 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2013 20:19 Arceus wrote:
fantasy will throw. If I was fantasy I would throw. If you were fantasy, you would throw too
whats the discussion here? the discussion here is they should have played team kills first so this situation never happens, GOM always does that in up/downs.
1. Order of play is determined by the score of week 1
2. If Rain vs Fantasy was played first and terran won, would First just throw as well? (and First actually has more motive had he wanted to avoid Maru)
I know being teammate has some effect but people are just gonna whine
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I just wish concessions were legal and socially accepted (like in magic: the gathering), or that the format avoided meaningless matches altogether. There is no good outcome in Rain x Fantasy having to play in this scenario.
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On July 16 2013 20:26 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2013 20:25 lichter wrote:On July 16 2013 20:22 Dodgin wrote:On July 16 2013 20:21 lichter wrote:
No one can really make the claim that Fantasy is "sure to throw" just because they are team mates. They may be team mates but they are still rivals in individual leagues. Being teammates also does not assure that they are good friends. You hear about players practicing with players from other teams and being really friendly with players on rival teams all the time. How would you ever know that it isn't a throw, unless you investigate all the player relationships? It might happen, but from our perspective it is all just meaningless speculation. It will happen 100%, because it's for the good of the team that rain has a chance in tiebreakers and boxer will tell fantasy to lose. Yes but if we become suspicious of that match (and we have reason to be), then we should be suspicious of all matches between friendly players. I'm not defending the format, because it really is shit (although I understand the necessity for it due to the scheduling on TV), but we can't just assume 100% that if Fantasy loses he threw the match. This is the biggest problem with this round robin format. If Fanta loses, it will always feel like a throw for viewers. If Fanta wins, he screws his teammate and friend over. No win situation. well, personally I'm sometimes suspicious of situations that happen in the up/downs, we don't really use round robin anywhere else. if the past has taught us anything It's that stuff like that does happen.
I'm still sad Byun won 2 tvzs by proxy raxing, then played straight up against Symbol and lost.. made Symbol go through instead of Jaedong a few seasons back 
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On July 16 2013 20:26 Bagration wrote:
Wow, speculating that SKT will match fix. Seriously, you guys think Boxer will let something like that happen? Don't you think Fantasy and Rain have integrity?
Wow
I think Boxer would be the one to tell fantasy he needs to find a way to let rain win, It's his job to ensure the success of his team. you put him on too high or a moral pedestal, the team will look after itself before anything else.
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On July 16 2013 20:25 Erraa93 wrote:Missing this. Yet again. What happened. You make it sound so dramatic
On cheese: "Well some people say 'Oh, but the game isn't supposed to be played this way.' And I'm just like, I'm pretty sure the game was designed so people try to win."
Nothing dramatic, just a little targeted.
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1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On July 16 2013 20:25 Thrillz wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2013 20:21 lichter wrote:
No one can really make the claim that Fantasy is "sure to throw" just because they are team mates. They may be team mates but they are still rivals in individual leagues. Being teammates also does not assure that they are good friends. You hear about players practicing with players from other teams and being really friendly with players on rival teams all the time. How would you ever know that it isn't a throw, unless you investigate all the player relationships? It might happen, but from our perspective it is all just meaningless speculation. Yeah no, Fantasy will throw because it's what almost everyone would do given the team situation.
I am not speculating whether it will or won't happen. I guess we might be able to tell once we see the games. My main point is that the format creates suspicion for all meaningless-for-one-person games, and that there are more reasons to be suspicious than just 'they are teammates' (for example, because they are good friends). Whether Fantasy throws or not is irrelevant; we can never tell for sure unless he makes it obvious.
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On July 16 2013 20:26 Bagration wrote:
Wow, speculating that SKT will match fix. Seriously, you guys think Boxer will let something like that happen? Don't you think Fantasy and Rain have integrity?
Wow
It's not necessarily that he will lose on purpose, or that they will coordinate a fixed match, but Fantasy might try some funny builds that have low success rate, or maybe the opposite, play super standard that he knows Rain does well against, and play his best within that decision but the initial decision being designed to give Rain the best shot
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They got a nice crowd for today!
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On July 16 2013 20:26 Aeleron wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2013 20:26 Bagration wrote:
Wow, speculating that SKT will match fix. Seriously, you guys think Boxer will let something like that happen? Don't you think Fantasy and Rain have integrity?
Wow People like drama
No, they're idiots who would happily throw accusations of match fixing at progamers.
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Norway25712 Posts
On July 16 2013 20:28 Wintex wrote:
WHAT? FIRST LOST???
Are you actually surprised or faking it?
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Canada16217 Posts
On July 16 2013 20:28 Dodgin wrote:Show nested quote +On July 16 2013 20:26 Bagration wrote:
Wow, speculating that SKT will match fix. Seriously, you guys think Boxer will let something like that happen? Don't you think Fantasy and Rain have integrity?
Wow I think Boxer would be the one to tell fantasy he needs to find a way to let rain win, It's his job to ensure the success of his team. you put him on too high or a moral pedestal, the team will look after itself before anything else.
I think the best thing to do is not put the players or teams in this position at all.
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On July 16 2013 20:26 Bagration wrote:
Wow, speculating that SKT will match fix. Seriously, you guys think Boxer will let something like that happen? Don't you think Fantasy and Rain have integrity?
Wow
he is not going to roll over and die but im sure he wont put in the same preparation and effort he would if he was facing a non-teammate. And that is enough when you are att the level of play that these guys are. Nobody is blaming fantasy from what i can see, we are just saying the the format is bad and could have been fixed.
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EPT
