EPT[Code S] RO32 Group H 2013 WCS Korea Season 1 - Page 126
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snakeeyez
United States1231 Posts
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LighT.
Canada4501 Posts
On April 19 2013 12:10 lichter wrote: Mvp's understanding of the game was unsurpassed during a time when the game wasn't figured out yet. To me that's a more impressive feat than dominating when it is figured out. His game sense and understanding of the game won him 1 championship and one runner's up medal (3-4) when he could barely play in 2012. Of course it's all hypothetical how we think he'd do healthy because we'll never have a healthy Mvp, but there is still no player in SC2 that has shown his level of understanding and resilience. But I do agree he wouldn't dominate and probably wouldn't be the best even if he was healthy. Always a contender though. The game is never figured out lichter. Like even at the end of bw, the game was never 'figured out" What Mvp did for the sc2 scene is great and all but the crop we see today are still figuring out new ways to play the game and switching it up. Sadly, the only time it got sort of stale was during the end of WoL days. | ||
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EpiK
Korea (South)5757 Posts
On April 19 2013 12:10 lichter wrote: Mvp's understanding of the game was unsurpassed during a time when the game wasn't figured out yet. To me that's a more impressive feat than dominating when it is figured out. His game sense and understanding of the game won him 1 championship and one runner's up medal (3-4) when he could barely play in 2012. Of course it's all hypothetical how we think he'd do healthy because we'll never have a healthy Mvp, but there is still no player in SC2 that has shown his level of understanding and resilience. But I do agree he wouldn't dominate and probably wouldn't be the best even if he was healthy. Always a contender though. At what point does the game get 'figured out?' I'd say the hots pro-scene is still in its infancy and far from figured out. I see new builds or variations of builds that I hadn't seen in every code s group. | ||
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27473 Posts
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lichter
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On April 19 2013 12:20 LighT. wrote: The game is never figured out lichter. Like even at the end of bw, the game was never 'figured out" What Mvp did for the sc2 scene is great and all but the crop we see today are still figuring out new ways to play the game and switching it up. Sadly, the only time it got sort of stale was during the end of WoL days. Figured out is probably the wrong term to use, but it's the most common one people use. I agree that no one will ever figure out the game, no one will ever reach the game's mechanical skill ceiling, and no one will ever play a game perfectly. It's not possible. What I meant was the game did not have many "standard" plays, the metagame changed every week, and almost all build orders were feasible though few were optimized. People were trying a lot more crazy shit back then. But few, if any, worked against Mvp. Players get better with time, of course. That's the way it is with sports. For example di Stefano was amazing for his time but athletically (conditioning, strength, speed) and skillwise any good striker of today is better than him. But things such as positioning, vision, his reading of the game, and killer instinct, those things are special and will last the test of time. Look at 2012. That's why mechanically gifted players like MKP will become irrelevant (sorry MKP fans) with time, but geniuses like Mvp still find a way to make their mark. I wouldn't be surprised if he becomes a successful coach in the future. (Of course with the introduction of HoTS we are back at that crazy stage again, though not as bad as it was before.) | ||
opterown
Australia54785 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27473 Posts
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lichter
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On April 19 2013 12:57 opterown wrote: i disagree with your point about mechanically gifted players, with proper coaching and mentality they would do better than slower players who might be smarter Of course mechanically gifted + intelligent coaching > slow but smart. You're giving the mechanically gifted player the advantage of coaching. But mechanically gifted alone, nope. Nestea is as slow as they get for progamers but he knows how to hold a 4gate with 1 zergling (scrap station, forget who against). And that's why he has 3 pins. Edit: Also, who's making the GSTL thread for today T_T | ||
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opterown
Australia54785 Posts
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WombaT
Northern Ireland27473 Posts
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lichter
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
not enough hype Nah I can't I'll be busy packing. Don't expect to see me around until around the 16th of May lol | ||
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samurai80
Japan4225 Posts
On April 18 2013 21:58 TheDwf wrote: Which is probably why 5/11 Zergs advanced in Code S so far, and perhaps 6/12 if Soulkey wins. It's really mind-boggling to use Flash's games to complain about Terran. Flash has perfect macro while still managing to apply relentless agression with excellent micro but no, they won't give credit where credit is due, it's just Mines, it's just Medivacs, blah blah. Disheartening. Maybe zergs care for protoss fate in GSL... | ||
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Schelim
Austria11528 Posts
On April 19 2013 12:12 snakeeyez wrote: I think innovation and flash have a good chance at winning the GSL they both are the two best terran players right now. Flash is like higher in supply then almost anyone he plays somehow I dont know if he just never idles his barracks even for split seconds or how he does that. gumiho will probably end up making it further than both of them tbh. maybe even taeja if he got his wrists back. | ||
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sinigang
360 Posts
On April 19 2013 15:42 Schelim wrote: gumiho will probably end up making it further than both of them tbh. maybe even taeja if he got his wrists back. Sorry, don't think so | ||
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lichter
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
Sorry, but MAYBE | ||
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sinigang
360 Posts
On April 19 2013 03:37 HolyArrow wrote: Yeah because Yoda, Gumiho, Symbol, Taeja, and LosirA didn't recently just beat Kespa players. Your standard for "proof" that Kespa beats the shit out of ESF is rather strange. Ok my standard is strange, w/e so what. My statement holds, and that those guys will most probably be offered a deal by KeSPA if they manage to straggle thru RO16 So again, bye bye eSF. On April 19 2013 03:45 the_business_og wrote: esf players can take matches, but as much as i hate to admit it, kespa players are better and will be getting better at a quicker rate What he said | ||
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lichter
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
None of the "ESF" fans are attached to "ESF". These fans only like the teams and players regardless of organization. So if "ESF" the organization does die, no one will care. It's the eventuality, because Kespa got the cash. It will happen one day. But as long as SC2 stays alive ESF fans will be ok with it. (Tbh Kespa buying out ESF and filling their roster with these guys kinda defeats the Kespa players > ESF players argument, but it does prove that Kespa the business > ESF the business) | ||
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opterown
Australia54785 Posts
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lichter
1001 YEARS KESPAJAIL22272 Posts
On April 19 2013 17:55 opterown wrote: yeah personally i don't really care if/when kespa does buy out esf, i think it's fairly inevitable. i know that my favourite team is probably the next to fall, and some of them are rumoured to kespa teams already, and that's cool. It's kinda weird to have this fan rivalry when there are no real "ESF fans" (that is, fans of the organization wanting it to exist and do well), only fans of teams and players currently (because they can move if they want to, they are not tied to ESF permanently) on ESF. | ||
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HolyArrow
United States7116 Posts
On April 19 2013 17:54 lichter wrote: When Kespa does buy out ESF don't expect a lot of ESF fans to really care about "ESF" dying. As long as the teams (if whole teams migrate, likely IM and ST) still exist, or the players still play and get paid better if they transfer, everyone's going to be happy. None of the "ESF" fans are attached to "ESF". These fans only like the teams and players regardless of organization. So if "ESF" the organization does die, no one will care. It's the eventuality, because Kespa got the cash. It will happen one day. But as long as SC2 stays alive ESF fans will be ok with it. (Tbh Kespa buying out ESF and filling their roster with these guys kinda defeats the Kespa players > ESF players argument, but it does prove that Kespa the business > ESF the business) Yeah this is a great point. I might seen like an ESF fanboy because I keep arguing with stupid shit that certain Kespa fans say, but that's because they're saying stupid shit, not because I particularly care about ESF as an organization. I am a fan of players first, and as long as the same players I'm a fan of keep playing, I'm happy. For example, I was a Parting fan when he was on ST, and now that he's on SKT, I'm still cheering for him. | ||
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