As the 2013 IPTL Season 1 steams ahead for it's finish, it's time for IPL to bring you the Playoffs and Up & Down matches to both determine the winner and who earns the $9,000 in prize money and who will move down to Contender, and who will ascend to Premier. The winners of the playoff matches will also receive 6 seeds into the WoL Main Bracket and paid trips to IPL 6!.
Playoff Schedule: EG v LG-IM: February 26th StarTale v MVP: March 5th
Up & Down Schedule: Team Liquid v NsHoSeo: February 19th ROOT v FXO: February 20th coL v Prime: February 21st Acer v Karont3: February 28th
When: Wednesday, Feb 20 12:00am GMT (GMT+00:00) (we will also rebroadcast repeatedly afterwards!)
Format
MVP, StarTale, EG and LG-IM will remain in Premier Division. The winners of NsHoseo v Team Liquid, ROOT v FXO, compLexity v Prime and Acer v Karon3 will join them. Stay tuned for more announcements about the 2013 IPTL Season 2.
The playoff teams battle for the $9,000 and a trip to IPL 6. Here is the prize distribution:
Go NSHoseo! This is definitely a team that I would like to see in the Premier division. I just hope that they haven't practiced too much HotS to a point where their WoL has become rusty.
don't care much for either of these teams they're both rivals as far as I am concerned but I suppose I like team liquid a little better then the other. so go hero all kill.
On February 20 2013 09:18 Shellshock1122 wrote: I hope we get to see some Madbull today! Too bad we can't see what antics he's up to outside of the game, though.
I don't post what'll happen, I post what I want to happen. Anyway, Jjakji just lost to set up the Tassadar 4-kill, wouldn't be the first time the cheesemaster embarasses Liquid. ;-))
I don't post what'll happen, I post what I want to happen. Anyway, Jjakji just lost to set up the Tassadar 4-kill, wouldn't be the first time the cheesemaster embarasses Liquid. ;-))
I don't post what'll happen, I post what I want to happen. Anyway, Jjakji just lost to set up the Tassadar 4-kill, wouldn't be the first time the cheesemaster embarasses Liquid. ;-))
Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
On February 20 2013 10:57 Proseat wrote: Wonder when these games were played. Must have been before EG-TL went into a slump with HerO and TaeJa losing.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
A bit, yeah. Still, IPL probably doesn't want the big teams who bring in viewers to drop too far down.
We'll see if the upcoming format change will help a bit.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
It does seem a bit ridiculous a team could return to Premier division by only needing to defeat a relatively easy team once.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
What 10 teams are going to be in your ideal Premier Division then? KeSPA teams can't participate... There's only 7 eSF teams... That leaves room for 3 foreign teams... I'd say Liquid is one of the top 3 foreign teams...
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
What 10 teams are going to be in your ideal Premier Division then? KeSPA teams can't participate... There's only 7 eSF teams... That leaves room for 3 foreign teams... I'd say Liquid is one of the top 3 foreign teams...
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
What 10 teams are going to be in your ideal Premier Division then? KeSPA teams can't participate... There's only 7 eSF teams... That leaves room for 3 foreign teams... I'd say Liquid is one of the top 3 foreign teams...
First off, the term foreign team is largely meaningless now. There is hardly a major non-Korean team that does not have a Korean player on their roster.
The reason I'm concerned is because the format seems...imperfect. Liquid has gone 0-6 over 2 seasons, and including Up and Down, they have a 25% winrate. Technically Liquid has earned a spot in the Premier division, but it certainly doesn't feel that way. It doesn't really have anything to do with how strong they "should" be on paper. They just have not been getting results that I feel merit another season in the Premier division.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
What 10 teams are going to be in your ideal Premier Division then? KeSPA teams can't participate... There's only 7 eSF teams... That leaves room for 3 foreign teams... I'd say Liquid is one of the top 3 foreign teams...
I think you meant 8 teams...
They are increasing the IPTL Premier and Contender division to 10 teams each next season.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
Well, I think it is more due to the lack of tier 1 teams. The 2011 format you mention only had 8 players (25%) in Code S falling to Up&Downs while IPTL has (50%).
But if you look at the 4 teams from Premier and 4 from Contender
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
What 10 teams are going to be in your ideal Premier Division then? KeSPA teams can't participate... There's only 7 eSF teams... That leaves room for 3 foreign teams... I'd say Liquid is one of the top 3 foreign teams...
First off, the term foreign team is largely meaningless now. There is hardly a major non-Korean team that does not have a Korean player on their roster.
The reason I'm concerned is because the format seems...imperfect. Liquid has gone 0-6 over 2 seasons, and including Up and Down, they have a 25% winrate. Technically Liquid has earned a spot in the Premier division, but it certainly doesn't feel that way. It doesn't really have anything to do with how strong they "should" be on paper. They just have not been getting results that I feel merit another season in the Premier division.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
What 10 teams are going to be in your ideal Premier Division then? KeSPA teams can't participate... There's only 7 eSF teams... That leaves room for 3 foreign teams... I'd say Liquid is one of the top 3 foreign teams...
I think you meant 8 teams...
They are increasing the IPTL Premier and Contender division to 10 teams each next season.
I see where you are coming from. But I think teams like NSHS, Acer, Root, Complexity would have similiar records playing the likes of ST, MVP, LG-IM, etc. Can they upset these teams? Possibility. But they would still be huge underdogs.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
Well, I think it is more due to the lack of tier 1 teams. The 2011 format you mention only had 8 players (25%) in Code S falling to Up&Downs while IPTL has (50%).
But if you look at the 4 teams from Premier and 4 from Contender
And if you had to pick top 4, which would you go with? TL actually beat NSHS which was probably the strongest in the Contender's division.
I agree with you about the lack of Tier 1 teams. With oGs, Slayers, and TSL disbanding, the number of top level teams in this tournament has fallen. I personally wouldn't mind if IPTL would try to get teams like Azubu or Axiom to participate though (I certainly won't hold my breathe for Kespa teams).
What I would like to actually see is maybe IPTL taking a page from the GSL book. Maybe the lowest performing team from the Premier division gets seeded into the Contender division, and has to play it out there as well.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
Well, I think it is more due to the lack of tier 1 teams. The 2011 format you mention only had 8 players (25%) in Code S falling to Up&Downs while IPTL has (50%).
But if you look at the 4 teams from Premier and 4 from Contender
And if you had to pick top 4, which would you go with? TL actually beat NSHS which was probably the strongest in the Contender's division.
I agree with you about the lack of Tier 1 teams. With oGs, Slayers, and TSL disbanding, the number of top level teams in this tournament has fallen. I personally wouldn't mind if IPTL would try to get teams like Azubu or Axiom to participate though (I certainly won't hold my breathe for Kespa teams).
What I would like to actually see is maybe IPTL taking a page from the GSL book. Maybe the lowest performing team from the Premier division gets seeded into the Contender division, and has to play it out there as well.
It is likely that Azubu and Axiom will join next season. As for your last suggestion, I think it might be hard to schedule since unlike GSL, it is round robin. So unless they change their scheduling a lot, it might be difficult. Would the contender division only have 6 teams and wait for the 2 from premier? Or would it have 8 teams and have a total of 10 when the last place premier teams join?
GSL works because it is more a bracket single elim in Code A and the scheduling is different.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
Well, I think it is more due to the lack of tier 1 teams. The 2011 format you mention only had 8 players (25%) in Code S falling to Up&Downs while IPTL has (50%).
But if you look at the 4 teams from Premier and 4 from Contender
And if you had to pick top 4, which would you go with? TL actually beat NSHS which was probably the strongest in the Contender's division.
I agree with you about the lack of Tier 1 teams. With oGs, Slayers, and TSL disbanding, the number of top level teams in this tournament has fallen. I personally wouldn't mind if IPTL would try to get teams like Azubu or Axiom to participate though (I certainly won't hold my breathe for Kespa teams).
What I would like to actually see is maybe IPTL taking a page from the GSL book. Maybe the lowest performing team from the Premier division gets seeded into the Contender division, and has to play it out there as well.
I agree with the part about lowest team automatically being seeded into Contender division now that there's 10 teams. Maybe make the top team of the Contender division seeded into Premier next season too. It guarantees at least a slightly different group of teams each season...
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
Well, I think it is more due to the lack of tier 1 teams. The 2011 format you mention only had 8 players (25%) in Code S falling to Up&Downs while IPTL has (50%).
But if you look at the 4 teams from Premier and 4 from Contender
And if you had to pick top 4, which would you go with? TL actually beat NSHS which was probably the strongest in the Contender's division.
I agree with you about the lack of Tier 1 teams. With oGs, Slayers, and TSL disbanding, the number of top level teams in this tournament has fallen. I personally wouldn't mind if IPTL would try to get teams like Azubu or Axiom to participate though (I certainly won't hold my breathe for Kespa teams).
What I would like to actually see is maybe IPTL taking a page from the GSL book. Maybe the lowest performing team from the Premier division gets seeded into the Contender division, and has to play it out there as well.
I agree with the part about lowest team automatically being seeded into Contender division now that there's 10 teams. Maybe make the top team of the Contender division seeded into Premier next season too. It guarantees at least a slightly different group of teams each season...
(My next post, below, might be clearer than this one)
Perhaps...
For each Premiere Division Group: 1st advances to R2 of Playoffs 2nd advances to R1 of Playoffs 3rd advances to R1 of Playoffs 4th drops to U&Ds 5th drops to Contender Division next season
Playoffs are then: Group A 1st vs. (Group B 2nd vs. Group A 3rd) Group B 1st vs. (Group A 2nd vs. Group B 3rd) The top 4 are guaranteed to remain in premiere division 5th/6th drop to the U&Ds
Contender Division Groups: 1st advances to Premiere division next season 2nd advances to U&Ds 3rd advances to U&Ds 4th drops and must requalify 5th drops and must requalify
U&Ds are then: Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd
Qualifiers are 4 single elimination brackets, resulting in 4 winners who advance to the Contender division.
Thus each season the Premiere groups could be:
[Premiere Group A] Previous Season Premiere 1st Previous Season Premiere 4th (team who lost to 2nd in the semi) Previous Season Contender Group A 1st Winner of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Winner of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd"
[Premiere Group B] Previous Season Premiere 2nd Previous Season Premiere 3rd (team who lost to 1st in the semi) Previous Season Contender Group B 1st Winner of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Winner of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd"
And for Contender:
[Contender Group A] Previous Season Premiere Group B 5th (swapped A->B because cont->prem is A->A) Loser of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Loser of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd" Qualifying Team #1 Qualifying Team #2
[Contender Group B] Previous Season Premiere Group A 5th (swapped B->A because cont->prem is B->B) Loser of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Loser of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd" Qualifying Team #3 Qualifying Team #4
Of course you can simplify it by making the playoffs in premiere division only involve 4 teams, but I think it's more fun if it's a 6-man single elimination. Plus, it accounts for the case where one group is weaker than the other, where as going straight to 4 doesn't as much.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
Well, I think it is more due to the lack of tier 1 teams. The 2011 format you mention only had 8 players (25%) in Code S falling to Up&Downs while IPTL has (50%).
But if you look at the 4 teams from Premier and 4 from Contender
And if you had to pick top 4, which would you go with? TL actually beat NSHS which was probably the strongest in the Contender's division.
I agree with you about the lack of Tier 1 teams. With oGs, Slayers, and TSL disbanding, the number of top level teams in this tournament has fallen. I personally wouldn't mind if IPTL would try to get teams like Azubu or Axiom to participate though (I certainly won't hold my breathe for Kespa teams).
What I would like to actually see is maybe IPTL taking a page from the GSL book. Maybe the lowest performing team from the Premier division gets seeded into the Contender division, and has to play it out there as well.
I agree with the part about lowest team automatically being seeded into Contender division now that there's 10 teams. Maybe make the top team of the Contender division seeded into Premier next season too. It guarantees at least a slightly different group of teams each season...
For each Premiere Division Group: 1st advances to R2 of Playoffs 2nd advances to R1 of Playoffs 3rd advances to R1 of Playoffs 4th drops to U&Ds 5th drops to Contender Division next season
Playoffs are then: Group A 1st vs. (Group B 2nd vs. Group A 3rd) Group B 1st vs. (Group A 2nd vs. Group B 3rd) The top 4 are guaranteed to remain in premiere division 5th/6th drop to the U&Ds
Contender Division Groups: 1st advances to Premiere division next season 2nd advances to U&Ds 3rd advances to U&Ds 4th drops and must requalify 5th drops and must requalify
U&Ds are then: Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd
Qualifiers are 4 single elimination brackets, resulting in 4 winners who advance to the Contender division.
Thus each season the Premiere groups could be:
[Premiere Group A] Previous Season Premiere 1st Previous Season Premiere 4th (team who lost to 2nd in the semi) Previous Season Contender Group A 1st Winner of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Winner of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd"
[Premiere Group B] Previous Season Premiere 2nd Previous Season Premiere 3rd (team who lost to 1st in the semi) Previous Season Contender Group B 1st Winner of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Winner of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd"
And for Contender:
[Contender Group A] Previous Season Premiere Group B 5th (swapped A->B because cont->prem is A->A) Loser of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Loser of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd" Qualifying Team #1 Qualifying Team #2
[Contender Group B] Previous Season Premiere Group A 5th (swapped B->A because cont->prem is B->B) Loser of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Loser of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd" Qualifying Team #3 Qualifying Team #4
Of course you can simplify it by making the playoffs in premiere division only involve 4 teams, but I think it's more fun if it's a 6-man single elimination. Plus, it accounts for the case where one group is weaker than the other, where as going straight to 4 doesn't as much.
Thanks for writing this all out! This is along the lines of what we're thinking, though we prefer to play Premier and Contender simultaneously, as that creates a better narrative and scheduling for the season. Definitely gonna show this to the other IPL folks.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
Well, I think it is more due to the lack of tier 1 teams. The 2011 format you mention only had 8 players (25%) in Code S falling to Up&Downs while IPTL has (50%).
But if you look at the 4 teams from Premier and 4 from Contender
And if you had to pick top 4, which would you go with? TL actually beat NSHS which was probably the strongest in the Contender's division.
I agree with you about the lack of Tier 1 teams. With oGs, Slayers, and TSL disbanding, the number of top level teams in this tournament has fallen. I personally wouldn't mind if IPTL would try to get teams like Azubu or Axiom to participate though (I certainly won't hold my breathe for Kespa teams).
What I would like to actually see is maybe IPTL taking a page from the GSL book. Maybe the lowest performing team from the Premier division gets seeded into the Contender division, and has to play it out there as well.
I agree with the part about lowest team automatically being seeded into Contender division now that there's 10 teams. Maybe make the top team of the Contender division seeded into Premier next season too. It guarantees at least a slightly different group of teams each season...
For each Premiere Division Group: 1st advances to R2 of Playoffs 2nd advances to R1 of Playoffs 3rd advances to R1 of Playoffs 4th drops to U&Ds 5th drops to Contender Division next season
Playoffs are then: Group A 1st vs. (Group B 2nd vs. Group A 3rd) Group B 1st vs. (Group A 2nd vs. Group B 3rd) The top 4 are guaranteed to remain in premiere division 5th/6th drop to the U&Ds
Contender Division Groups: 1st advances to Premiere division next season 2nd advances to U&Ds 3rd advances to U&Ds 4th drops and must requalify 5th drops and must requalify
U&Ds are then: Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd
Qualifiers are 4 single elimination brackets, resulting in 4 winners who advance to the Contender division.
Thus each season the Premiere groups could be:
[Premiere Group A] Previous Season Premiere 1st Previous Season Premiere 4th (team who lost to 2nd in the semi) Previous Season Contender Group A 1st Winner of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Winner of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd"
[Premiere Group B] Previous Season Premiere 2nd Previous Season Premiere 3rd (team who lost to 1st in the semi) Previous Season Contender Group B 1st Winner of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Winner of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd"
And for Contender:
[Contender Group A] Previous Season Premiere Group B 5th (swapped A->B because cont->prem is A->A) Loser of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Loser of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd" Qualifying Team #1 Qualifying Team #2
[Contender Group B] Previous Season Premiere Group A 5th (swapped B->A because cont->prem is B->B) Loser of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Loser of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd" Qualifying Team #3 Qualifying Team #4
Of course you can simplify it by making the playoffs in premiere division only involve 4 teams, but I think it's more fun if it's a 6-man single elimination. Plus, it accounts for the case where one group is weaker than the other, where as going straight to 4 doesn't as much.
Thanks for writing this all out! This is along the lines of what we're thinking, though we prefer to play Premier and Contender simultaneously, as that creates a better narrative and scheduling for the season. Definitely gonna show this to the other IPL folks.
It's very possible to play them out simultaneously. I just formatted them separately for clarity
In schedule order I suppose you could do something like...
Week 1: Premiere Group A Match 1 Premiere Group B Match 1 Contender Group A Match 1 Contender Group B Match 1
Week 2: Premiere Group A Match 2 Premiere Group B Match 2 Contender Group A Match 2 Contender Group B Match 2
(and so on...)
Week 10: Premiere Group A Match 10 Premiere Group B Match 10 Contender Group A Match 10 Contender Group B Match 10
At this point, Premiere division Playoffs would be:
Ro6 Ro4 Ro2
Group A 1st \ \______ Group B 2nd \ / \ --------------/ \ Group A 3rd / \______ / Group B 1st \ / \______/ Group A 2nd \ / --------------/ Group B 3rd /
Where as 4th in both groups is dropped to the U&Ds, and 5th is dropped to next season's Contender Division.
Also, 1st for both of the current season's Contender Division is promoted to next season's Premiere Division. 2nd and 3rd from the Contender Division are placed into the U&Ds. 4th and 5th drop out of the competition and must re-qualify.
Continuing:
Week 11: Premiere Ro6 Match #1 Premiere Ro6 Match #2 U&D Match 1 (Premiere Group A 4th vs. Contender Group A 2nd) U&D Match 2 (Premiere Group B 4th vs. Contender Group B 2nd)
Now that the Ro6 matches are done, the losers of that also fall into the U&Ds...
Week 12: Premiere Ro4 Match #1 Premiere Ro4 Match #2 U&D Match 3 (Premiere Ro6 Loser #1 vs. Contender Group A 3rd) U&D Match 4 (Premiere Ro6 Loser #2 vs. Contender Group B 3rd)
Then all that remains is the Premiere Grand Final (Week 13/14)!
Amateur bracket can be played at any point, either after the conclusion of the Contender Division (so as to include the dropouts) or during it (excluding the dropouts). The amateur finals can be broadcast either directly before or directly after the Premiere grand finals (Week 13/14).
Next season's groups would then be:
Prem A: The Prem Champion Prem 3rd/4th who lost to the runner-up Contender Group A 1st U&D Match 2 winner U&D Match 3 winner
Prem B: Last season's Prem Runner-up Prem 3rd/4th who lost to the champion Contender Group B 1st U&D Match 1 winner U&D Match 4 winner
Cont A: Premiere Group B 5th U&D Match 1 loser U&D Match 4 loser Amateur Division Winner #1 Amateur Division Winner #2
Cont B: Premiere Group A 5th U&D Match 2 loser U&D Match 3 loser Amateur Division Winner #3 Amateur Division Winner #4
Rinse and repeat!
If a team disbands in Premiere Division, award them last place in whatever group, then create a 5th Amateur Division spot for the Contender Division group that has the hole in it in the following season. (Perhaps a 4-man single elim between the runnerups from the four main Amateur division groups?) If a team disbands in Contender Division, award them last place. Because they 'drop out of the competition' it all works out and there's no issues the following season.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
Well, I think it is more due to the lack of tier 1 teams. The 2011 format you mention only had 8 players (25%) in Code S falling to Up&Downs while IPTL has (50%).
But if you look at the 4 teams from Premier and 4 from Contender
And if you had to pick top 4, which would you go with? TL actually beat NSHS which was probably the strongest in the Contender's division.
I agree with you about the lack of Tier 1 teams. With oGs, Slayers, and TSL disbanding, the number of top level teams in this tournament has fallen. I personally wouldn't mind if IPTL would try to get teams like Azubu or Axiom to participate though (I certainly won't hold my breathe for Kespa teams).
What I would like to actually see is maybe IPTL taking a page from the GSL book. Maybe the lowest performing team from the Premier division gets seeded into the Contender division, and has to play it out there as well.
I agree with the part about lowest team automatically being seeded into Contender division now that there's 10 teams. Maybe make the top team of the Contender division seeded into Premier next season too. It guarantees at least a slightly different group of teams each season...
For each Premiere Division Group: 1st advances to R2 of Playoffs 2nd advances to R1 of Playoffs 3rd advances to R1 of Playoffs 4th drops to U&Ds 5th drops to Contender Division next season
Playoffs are then: Group A 1st vs. (Group B 2nd vs. Group A 3rd) Group B 1st vs. (Group A 2nd vs. Group B 3rd) The top 4 are guaranteed to remain in premiere division 5th/6th drop to the U&Ds
Contender Division Groups: 1st advances to Premiere division next season 2nd advances to U&Ds 3rd advances to U&Ds 4th drops and must requalify 5th drops and must requalify
U&Ds are then: Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd
Qualifiers are 4 single elimination brackets, resulting in 4 winners who advance to the Contender division.
Thus each season the Premiere groups could be:
[Premiere Group A] Previous Season Premiere 1st Previous Season Premiere 4th (team who lost to 2nd in the semi) Previous Season Contender Group A 1st Winner of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Winner of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd"
[Premiere Group B] Previous Season Premiere 2nd Previous Season Premiere 3rd (team who lost to 1st in the semi) Previous Season Contender Group B 1st Winner of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Winner of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd"
And for Contender:
[Contender Group A] Previous Season Premiere Group B 5th (swapped A->B because cont->prem is A->A) Loser of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Loser of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd" Qualifying Team #1 Qualifying Team #2
[Contender Group B] Previous Season Premiere Group A 5th (swapped B->A because cont->prem is B->B) Loser of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Loser of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd" Qualifying Team #3 Qualifying Team #4
Of course you can simplify it by making the playoffs in premiere division only involve 4 teams, but I think it's more fun if it's a 6-man single elimination. Plus, it accounts for the case where one group is weaker than the other, where as going straight to 4 doesn't as much.
Thanks for writing this all out! This is along the lines of what we're thinking, though we prefer to play Premier and Contender simultaneously, as that creates a better narrative and scheduling for the season. Definitely gonna show this to the other IPL folks.
It's very possible to play them out simultaneously. I just formatted them separately for clarity
Oh, I got confused with some one else's post that was more Code A style.
On February 20 2013 11:04 Bagration wrote: Not going to lie, seeing Liquid back in the Premier division after going 0-6 in matches over the past 2 seasons feels wrong to me. It reminds me of GSL 2011, when players like Ensnare held Code S spots all the way until the tournament format was finally reformed.
I think the IPTL format is starting to see some of the same issues that the GSL format had back in 2011.
Well, I think it is more due to the lack of tier 1 teams. The 2011 format you mention only had 8 players (25%) in Code S falling to Up&Downs while IPTL has (50%).
But if you look at the 4 teams from Premier and 4 from Contender
And if you had to pick top 4, which would you go with? TL actually beat NSHS which was probably the strongest in the Contender's division.
I agree with you about the lack of Tier 1 teams. With oGs, Slayers, and TSL disbanding, the number of top level teams in this tournament has fallen. I personally wouldn't mind if IPTL would try to get teams like Azubu or Axiom to participate though (I certainly won't hold my breathe for Kespa teams).
What I would like to actually see is maybe IPTL taking a page from the GSL book. Maybe the lowest performing team from the Premier division gets seeded into the Contender division, and has to play it out there as well.
I agree with the part about lowest team automatically being seeded into Contender division now that there's 10 teams. Maybe make the top team of the Contender division seeded into Premier next season too. It guarantees at least a slightly different group of teams each season...
For each Premiere Division Group: 1st advances to R2 of Playoffs 2nd advances to R1 of Playoffs 3rd advances to R1 of Playoffs 4th drops to U&Ds 5th drops to Contender Division next season
Playoffs are then: Group A 1st vs. (Group B 2nd vs. Group A 3rd) Group B 1st vs. (Group A 2nd vs. Group B 3rd) The top 4 are guaranteed to remain in premiere division 5th/6th drop to the U&Ds
Contender Division Groups: 1st advances to Premiere division next season 2nd advances to U&Ds 3rd advances to U&Ds 4th drops and must requalify 5th drops and must requalify
U&Ds are then: Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd
Qualifiers are 4 single elimination brackets, resulting in 4 winners who advance to the Contender division.
Thus each season the Premiere groups could be:
[Premiere Group A] Previous Season Premiere 1st Previous Season Premiere 4th (team who lost to 2nd in the semi) Previous Season Contender Group A 1st Winner of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Winner of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd"
[Premiere Group B] Previous Season Premiere 2nd Previous Season Premiere 3rd (team who lost to 1st in the semi) Previous Season Contender Group B 1st Winner of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Winner of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd"
And for Contender:
[Contender Group A] Previous Season Premiere Group B 5th (swapped A->B because cont->prem is A->A) Loser of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Loser of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd" Qualifying Team #1 Qualifying Team #2
[Contender Group B] Previous Season Premiere Group A 5th (swapped B->A because cont->prem is B->B) Loser of an U&D "Premiere Group 4th vs. Contender Group 2nd" Loser of an U&D "Premiere Playoffs 5/6th vs. Contender Group 3rd" Qualifying Team #3 Qualifying Team #4
Of course you can simplify it by making the playoffs in premiere division only involve 4 teams, but I think it's more fun if it's a 6-man single elimination. Plus, it accounts for the case where one group is weaker than the other, where as going straight to 4 doesn't as much.
Thanks for writing this all out! This is along the lines of what we're thinking, though we prefer to play Premier and Contender simultaneously, as that creates a better narrative and scheduling for the season. Definitely gonna show this to the other IPL folks.
It's very possible to play them out simultaneously. I just formatted them separately for clarity
Oh, I got confused with some one else's post that was more Code A style.
Check my post above again, I edited it with a hypothetical schedule to demonstrate. But if there's no problems, then there's no problem, so no worries.
EPT
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