What is The Round Table Podcast and Showmatch series? The Round Table is a new weekly podcast and showmatch series that will be hosted by Gretorp, Doa, and GoSuRuM. Each week we will be accompanied by two guest players, that will take part in an hour long podcast, followed by a BO 5 Showmatch. The Podcast will cover a range of topics in our scene, as well as a 15 minute segment of user questions. Immediately following the showmatch will take place.
When will this event take place? 2/22 at 9:00 PM PST. The event will be recurring every Wednesday night at 9:00 PM PST.
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I think 3:1 or 3:2 for Dimaga. I would love to see Incontrol do well and I believe in him, but Dimaga has proved over the years that he is a baller SC player and he looks really good recently.
iNcontrol makes upsets happen. I look forward to getting to talk to these guys for a while and casting their games. I think it will be much better than people expect.
Thank you onerumcake for making this kind of entertainment possible! I hope you might be able to provide pre and post match interviews in the future. Also we need the big teams to do showmatches more often!
I love Incontrol and hope he has great results in 2012 but Dimaga will definitely win this showmatch.I would guess 3:1. Regardless if Incontrol does manage to win that would be pretty exciting. I'll definitely tune in.
This is my feedback: it would be good if you tell Doa to stop pretending and spreading false knowledge about the game, strategies, etc. It is very misleading to viewers to want to learn the game. He used to do this in GSL, and still he's still doing it. He should stick to play by play only.
On February 17 2012 20:56 eYeball wrote: I don't know why it's a showmatch between these two guys, it's a really big skill difference. I don't expect anything else than 3-0 result to Dimaga.
i woudnt expect 3-0 tbh, incontrol does alot of cheese with cannons and shit, he can take a game or even 2 with that stuff.
Dimaga 3-0, 3-1 if he loses to a cannon rush. Should pick players closer in skill to make a more even showmatch. If incontrol can pull this off that would be a huge win for him. For that reason I'll be cheering for the toss underdog.
On February 17 2012 19:32 bGr.MetHiX wrote: so is the same about catzpijamas and totalbiscuit?guys with below gold performance arent fit for casting in front of a 5 digit audience.
I can't say about catzpajamas because I've not seen much casting by him. About totalbiscuit, I've never seen him "pretend" or give a false impression to appear good. He has a good casting ability and seems to always asks his analytical co caster (like apollo) to do the analysis.
iNcontroL has take a few games recently from some decent players so I think he can take a game or two. I think Dimaga is the better player so I will predict a 3:1 in favor of Dimaga.
I realize that DIMAGA lost 5-0 to HerO in his last showmatch but I am pretty sure he was just having a bad day. Going from playing HerO to iNcontroL will be like playing a gold vs GM player. No chance for iNcontroL in this, Sorry Bud!
I love EG and incontrol, so I am going aginst the bandwagon and say that Geoff has gotten alot better and shoul dnot be ROFL STOPMED like most of yuo are saying. Is it possible? Yes, ofc it could happen, but I'm hoping that it wont. Geoff has been working super hard and he deserves more credit than this. Is he code S materail, no. But at this point which non-Koren is?!?!
So Geoff if you read this, there are still people who believe in you!!! No matter what the turn out is im almost sure that they should be great games!!!! <3!!!! Like you always say, "if I can take the game to the wire, there is a positive in there somewhere" (may have been some paraphrasing there haha:D)
This may be InControl's moment to shine. I can't actually imagine how InControl would beat Dimaga, but I have been waiting away for InControl to pull out some miracle and maybe this will be the forum he needs.
Dimage is the obvious and easy pick here, but incontrol has improved a lot lately and those of us who knew about his brood war achievements know that he has it in him. I'll go with the upset here and geoff has a shot at taking this, at the end of the day lets just hope we get to see good games :D
On February 18 2012 01:05 Lorch wrote: Dimage is the obvious and easy pick here, but incontrol has improved a lot lately and those of us who knew about his brood war achievements know that he has it in him. I'll go with the upset here and geoff has a shot at taking this, at the end of the day lets just hope we get to see good games :D
I don't see it that much one-sided, everything can happen. Probably Dimaga's average level a bit higher, but that doesn't mean he can't lose a BO5 series to inControl. I would estimate his chances as 40%.
On February 18 2012 01:05 Lorch wrote: Dimage is the obvious and easy pick here, but incontrol has improved a lot lately and those of us who knew about his brood war achievements know that he has it in him. I'll go with the upset here and geoff has a shot at taking this, at the end of the day lets just hope we get to see good games :D
What achievements?
Winning WCG USA 2007.
I think the games will be close, with each one being one or two mistakes away from a reverse win, but Dima's gonna win 3-1. I love you Jeff, but I don't wanna bet against an eastern european who's that buff.
Whatever happens, I have a feeling that iNcontroL will play at a higher level than he did against Destiny. Whether he wins or not I don't mind, but I hope he wins.
On February 18 2012 10:53 Champloo wrote: Incontrol didn't even beat Destiny, so I guess this will be an easy win for Dimaga.
A terrible series whose result didn't show a modicum of iNconttroL's real skill... I feel like he gets so jittery in casted games... I mean the game losing mistakes for him in that series were really pathetic. Oh, and how a Protoss can never get a 3rd up on Dual Sight.
On February 17 2012 18:04 Immaterial wrote: I love Incontrol and hope he has great results in 2012 but Dimaga will definitely win this showmatch.I would guess 3:1. Regardless if Incontrol does manage to win that would be pretty exciting. I'll definitely tune in.
Considering how good iNcontroL has been getting and how poorly DIMAGA has been playing recently (not like himself for some reason), I think it's too close to call.
Lol, guys I promise these games haven't been played yet. If anything hes trolling iNcontroL.
The way the show works is the hour podcast, followed by a bo5, with a winner interview right after. Why would we make the winner stick around when we can just do them live?
another example of nani's disregard for anyone other than himself -_-
He said in the very next tweet that he was kidding...
I think he was just trying to play it off. I'm pretty sure he knows the result, especially since I think all reasonable people here know + Show Spoiler +
DIMA will 3-0 incontrol
. The 2nd or third best EU zerg against an afterthought NA player? lol.
I think Dimaga is going to go through EG.Incontrol like a knife through hot butter, but I am always a cheerer of the underdogs so I hope he can pull an upset and show really great games. Good luck to both players
On February 18 2012 01:05 Lorch wrote: Dimage is the obvious and easy pick here, but incontrol has improved a lot lately and those of us who knew about his brood war achievements know that he has it in him. I'll go with the upset here and geoff has a shot at taking this, at the end of the day lets just hope we get to see good games :D
What achievements?
Winning WCG USA 2007.
I think the games will be close, with each one being one or two mistakes away from a reverse win, but Dima's gonna win 3-1. I love you Jeff, but I don't wanna bet against an eastern european who's that buff.
Also making like 500$ from bet matches vs Fenix! :D
It was after some fairly major tournament. Probably ESL Major series or IEM, something like that.
Those matches he "played the best brood war of my life" according to him.
WHY GOD?!?!? It's Midnight for EST viewers... Who cares, as long as they're good games it's worth the lost sleep.... and in this case, lost hours at work... because iNcontroL vs Dimaga is worth a "sick" day.
On February 23 2012 06:28 ShatterZer0 wrote: WHY GOD?!?!? It's Midnight for EST viewers... Who cares, as long as they're good games it's worth the lost sleep.... and in this case, lost hours at work... because iNcontroL vs Dimaga is worth a "sick" day.
Agreed haha. I always end up taking the monday after an MLG event off (finals occur around mid day Monday Australian time)
On February 23 2012 06:28 ShatterZer0 wrote: WHY GOD?!?!? It's Midnight for EST viewers... Who cares, as long as they're good games it's worth the lost sleep.... and in this case, lost hours at work... because iNcontroL vs Dimaga is worth a "sick" day.
Agreed haha. I always end up taking the monday after an MLG event off (finals occur around mid day Monday Australian time)
Good games are always an excuse to ditch work.
I usually end up spending most of the day sneaking peeks at the live report thread
On February 23 2012 06:28 ShatterZer0 wrote: WHY GOD?!?!? It's Midnight for EST viewers... Who cares, as long as they're good games it's worth the lost sleep.... and in this case, lost hours at work... because iNcontroL vs Dimaga is worth a "sick" day.
Keep in mind there is a podcast beforehand...so the show match won't start until at least an hour after you're expecting
I'm predicting a 3-1 for Dimaga with Incontrol taking one game from using some kind of timing attack. Afterwards, I expect the obligatory Incontrol post that explains why he lost and how it was a good series. : )
On February 23 2012 13:55 Gentso wrote: I'm predicting a 3-1 for Dimaga with Incontrol taking one game from using some kind of timing attack. Afterwards, I expect the obligatory Incontrol post that explains why he lost and how it was a good series. : )
He should totally say "Well, it's ZvP, protoss is not meant to win."
I like how Incontrol is in every one of these pod-cast talk shows, he must be getting tired saying the same thing about MLG/Patch for the 1242098th time lol
On February 23 2012 14:42 Fubi wrote: I like how Incontrol is in every one of these pod-cast talk shows, he must be getting tired saying the same thing about MLG/Patch for the 1242098th time lol
This type of stuff is exactly why iNcontroL is so valuable to EG. Intel is loving that he is wearing an Intel hoodie right now.
On February 23 2012 13:55 Gentso wrote: I'm predicting a 3-1 for Dimaga with Incontrol taking one game from using some kind of timing attack. Afterwards, I expect the obligatory Incontrol post that explains why he lost and how it was a good series. : )
Slow obs, weird timing, got supply blocked a few times. =/ Does incontrol have nerve issues in showmatches or something? He can't make this many mistakes if he's GM and in a pro house and stuff.
iNcontroL opens up gateway first in base, and super fast double gas. Ret opens pool first then hatch.
5:20 expo from iNcontroL with 3 gates in front. Hallucination on the way (mainly for scouting via phoenix). Fast lair from Ret.
At 7:30, Ret taking his regular third and droning like... well, Ret. Roach and roach tech for him.
At 9:00, twilight goes down. 50 probes to 65 drones. Blink tech on the way. Roach tech and burrow finishing up.
At 11:00, Ret taking spire and fourth regular base. Ret macroed up, it's too late for iNcontrol. 180 supply vs. 110. lol.
At 13:00, engagement occurs. Nice blink and forcefields from iNcontroL, but soooo many roaches. iNcontroL barely holds, but constantly behind by 70 supply.
At 15:00, iNcontroL snipes roach warren. 100 to 200 supply, in favor of Ret. Ret keeps sneaking a few roaches in to mineral lines.
On February 23 2012 15:27 Angelbelow wrote: Dude ret is freaking scary man, 191 supply at like 12 minutes.
Any decent zerg can max at 11:30ish if they don't get pressured at all, which is why most 2 base timings hit before that or at least have some form of zealot pressure..
Ret's biggest weakness is early pressure, if you let him get past 10 minutes without at least harassing you might as well just gg. Incontrol's gonna need to do some 1-base pressure/harass if he wants to even take a game.
On February 23 2012 15:34 quannguyen wrote: lol why the hell did Incontrol insist on making cannons like that? This doesn't make any sense at all.
I think he messed up his cannon placement at the 2nd expo - if you do it right, I believe only a single zergling can hit it. The cannon would actually have finished. For the rest though, meh.
On February 23 2012 15:34 quannguyen wrote: lol why the hell did Incontrol insist on making cannons like that? This doesn't make any sense at all.
I think he messed up his cannon placement at the 2nd expo - if you do it right, I believe only a single zergling can hit it. The cannon would actually have finished.
lol thats no excuse. he was behind by the time his first two cannons were denied.
Game 2 on Daybreak. Ret at top right. iNcontroL at bottom left.
FFE from iNcontroL, natural after cannon shenanigans. Ret goes 14 pool, and iNcontroL pylon blocks Ret's natural. He tries to cannon wall in Ret's third (as Ret directly expands there), but it gets seen and stopped by lings. Ret gets his hatchery up at his third without a problem, and iNcontroL's natural goes up late. Then Ret takes his natural- 3 bases up for him. iNcontroL already behind from wasting so many minerals on pylons and cancelled cannons. All of this tomfoolery ends at around 6 minutes.
At 7:30, Dimaga comes in to cast with Gretorp and Rumcake LOL.
At 9:00, lair and roach warren and mass drones again from Ret. 86 to 43 supply... sigh. 70 drones for Ret.
At 10:00, Ret taking fourth at bottom right, twilight and roach tech going down. 130 to 80 supply. All roaches.
At 12:00, 170 to 90 supply. iNcontroL taking third.
At 13:00, 200 to 100. Burrow-moving roaches invade iNcontroL's base.
Rets maxed at 12 again lol. Incontrol needs to go standard so he can improve his mechanics. No need to go for cannon pressure.. just plyon delay if anything and macro..
I dont know how can incontrol be so bad and be in EG? He keep getting supply block and 100 supply behind by 13 mins? Bad macro, bad decisions, bad player.
On February 23 2012 15:39 warcralft wrote: I dont know how can incontrol be so bad and be in EG? He keep getting supply block and 100 supply behind by 13 mins? Bad macro, bad decisions, bad player.
Eg has shown that popularity/stream views is more important than skill :c
On February 23 2012 15:39 warcralft wrote: I dont know how can incontrol be so bad and be in EG? He keep getting supply block and 100 supply behind by 13 mins? Bad macro, bad decisions, bad player.
Eg has shown that popularity/stream views is more important than skill :c
On February 23 2012 15:39 Angelbelow wrote: Rets maxed at 12 again lol. Incontrol needs to go standard so he can improve his mechanics. No need to go for cannon pressure.. just plyon delay if anything and macro..
Incontrol cannot keep up with Ret in a straight up Macro game so he needs to employ cheesy builds to even have a chance.
On February 23 2012 15:39 Angelbelow wrote: Rets maxed at 12 again lol. Incontrol needs to go standard so he can improve his mechanics. No need to go for cannon pressure.. just plyon delay if anything and macro..
Incontrol cannot keep up with Ret in a straight up Macro game so he needs to employ cheesy builds to even have a chance.
Yeah I agree. But if he keeps on displaying horrible cheeses like last game, he'll have no chance at all. Poor Incontrol
On February 23 2012 15:39 Angelbelow wrote: Rets maxed at 12 again lol. Incontrol needs to go standard so he can improve his mechanics. No need to go for cannon pressure.. just plyon delay if anything and macro..
Incontrol cannot keep up with Ret in a straight up Macro game so he needs to employ cheesy builds to even have a chance.
Not many protoss' can keep up with ret. But thats not the point - the point of playing standard is to improve for the future.
iNcontroL's control feels quite indecisive. I dunno if it's because he's struggling with his multitasking, but he could have done so much more damage than he ended up doing, and without teching to colossus he's not gonna have an easy time getting a third at this point
On February 23 2012 15:51 Ruscour wrote: iNcontroL's control feels quite indecisive. I dunno if it's because he's struggling with his multitasking, but he could have done so much more damage than he ended up doing, and without teching to colossus he's not gonna have an easy time getting a third at this point
His name is actually misleading. Vs most opponents hes not really incontrol but takes a rather passive role.
Game 3 on Shakuras Plateau. Ret at top right. iNcontroL at bottom left.
iNcontroL opens with Nexus before forge. Pylon block at Ret's natural, so Ret takes his side (not pocket) third. Ret kills pylon with lings and takes natural- on 3 bases.
At 6:30, double stargate goes down but it's scouted.
At 8:00, lair and anti-air go down. Void rays and phoenix come out, and take out a lot of overlords. Mass gateway behind this. Infestation pit down too, with burrow.
At 11:00, infestors come out. Twilight down. Still good air harrass from iNcontroL. Tied supply at 108.
At 12:00, phoenixes lifting infestors vs. some fungals going down. Zealots overrunning Ret's third but infested terrans clean them up.
At 14:00, charge and dark shrine go down. Baneling nest and hive go down. iNcontroL taking pocket third.
At 16:00, lots of infestors and slings, some archons and dts. 138 for Ret, 120 for iNcontroL. Ret takes bottom right fourth base.
At 18:00, Ret loses all 20 of his infestors, greater spire goes down, more gateways go down. iNcontroL immediately warp prism drops on the greater spire and kills it off.
At 20:00, robo bay down, Ret up 180 to 140 now, with lots of roaches. iNcontroL taking fourth at top left natural. Fleet beacon going down (his second one apparently?), ultralisk cavern going down. Ret takes a fifth- his original pocket expansion.
At 22:00, big engagement and Ret comes out way on top. 180 to 90 supply- Ret macroing like a beast. iNcontroL's third and fourth bases get popped. iNcontroL pops Ret's fourth (bottom right) with a dt drop.
I feel kinda bad for iNc. First preparing for such a tough opponent as Dimaga and then getting one even a notch above without notice like that. That's some ball breaking stuff right there. >.< Good sport.
Big props to incontrol. He is now going to play Dimaga as well, also HUGE props to Ret for being willing to come in for the showmatch on such short notice.
Wow you guys can be real turds to other people. Being a little polite to others can't really be that hard can it? Ret is one of the best players outside of Korea on his good days. He would have beaten a ton of people like this.
I think Geoff just misunderstood that Dimaga was telling him he had a second fleet beacon. He could have used some of that money that he used to cancel to make a mothership, but it seems that he was still under the impression he didn't have a fleet beacon. Nice to see Dimaga trying to help him out though. I think Geoff just needs to build up his confidence.
Even though I think Dimaga would win 3-1 or 3-0 against iNcontroL anyway, I feel like iNcontroL's gonna be tilting somewhat after the Ret series and after that last conversation x.x
On February 23 2012 16:07 SimDawg wrote: There's aren't many other players that get downright insulted. Not sure the reason for it but it is pretty upsetting.
Yah people like to troll one of the nicest people in the game, who interacts with lots of fans and goes out of his way to talk to them at events etc.
On February 23 2012 16:00 AlternativeEgo wrote: I feel kinda bad for iNc. First preparing for such a tough opponent as Dimaga and then getting one even a notch above without notice like that. That's some ball breaking stuff right there. >.< Good sport.
What makes you think Ret is a notch above Dimaga? Both are top 5 EU zergs with numerous accomplishments, I'd say they are evenly matched.
huge credit to incontrol for agreeing to another series after coming out of an 0-3. gotta be hard to keep cool after that; i know i start playing terribly after a few losses in a row even when they're not broadcasted to thousands of people /=
On February 23 2012 16:00 AlternativeEgo wrote: I feel kinda bad for iNc. First preparing for such a tough opponent as Dimaga and then getting one even a notch above without notice like that. That's some ball breaking stuff right there. >.< Good sport.
What makes you think Ret is a notch above Dimaga? Both are top 5 EU zergs with numerous accomplishments, I'd say they are evenly matched.
b/c every pro agrees rets ZvP is insane...compared to any foreingers
On February 23 2012 16:07 SimDawg wrote: There's aren't many other players that get downright insulted. Not sure the reason for it but it is pretty upsetting.
Yah people like to troll one of the nicest people in the game, who interacts with lots of fans and goes out of his way to talk to them at events etc.
Yeah I really feel bad for Incontrol, the hate he gets on by a bunch of assholes in this community is such a joke. That is a reason many of the pro's just avoid the forums
On February 23 2012 16:00 AlternativeEgo wrote: I feel kinda bad for iNc. First preparing for such a tough opponent as Dimaga and then getting one even a notch above without notice like that. That's some ball breaking stuff right there. >.< Good sport.
What makes you think Ret is a notch above Dimaga? Both are top 5 EU zergs with numerous accomplishments, I'd say they are evenly matched.
I think that Ret is more solid (as in Dimaga being inconsistant).
I just think iNcontroL's gotta take more risk, or punish more opponent risks. A 12 minute max on roaches happens when you're never threatened, plus when you're Ret. It feels like he plays safe too much, such as forge before nexus on Antiga just now. Is this show match cross only Antiga, I wonder?
As I check the game, he's cannoning Dima's greedy 3rd, lol.
Incontrol is one of my favorite sc2 personalities but I dont feel bad for him when he gets undeserved hate. Thats what happens when youre such a polarizing and well known figure. You have a high number of fans but the flip side is that you have a lot of haters too.
Its like the Lakers, they're one of the most popular teams in the NBA but they seemingly have an unhealthy number of haters; this is true even in the city of LA.
Game one on Antiga Shipyard. Dimaga at bottom right, iNcontroL at top left. Ret is casting with Gretorp and Rumcake
iNcontroL opens FFE. Pylon + cannon blocks Dimaga's natural... Dimaga pulls a lot of drones and iNcontroL cancels cannon. Dimaga first expands to his third base before killing off the pylon block and taking his natural as his third hatchery.
At 6:00, iNcontroL cannons Dimaga's hatchery at the third base and it goes down without a fight.
At 7:00, stargate goes down and it's spotted by Dimaga. Double evolution chamber goes down. Baneling nest goes down.
At 8:00, Dimaga takes his middle expo as a new third base. iNcontroL throws down extra gateways (4 total).
At 10:00, void ray takes out Dimaga's new third. 7 gateways now for iNcontroL. Twilight council down. Lair down.
At 12:00, mass zealot warp-ins and 2 voids in Dimaga's main and natural against slings and queens. Dark shrine goes down. Dimaga losing drones and army supply. Loses spawning pool and lair.
At 13:00, dark templar out and mass zealots and still voids, Dimaga just reduced to his natural. 115 to 20 supply.
Nice play from iNcontroL! that's what I was hoping to see against Ret. We kinda saw it in game 3, but a few too many mistakes. Maybe the games against Ret were just warmup
On February 23 2012 16:21 Angelbelow wrote: Incontrol is one of my favorite sc2 personalities but I dont feel bad for him when he gets undeserved hate. Thats what happens when youre such a polarizing and well known figure. You have a high number of fans but the flip side is that you have a lot of haters too.
Its like the Lakers, they're one of the most popular teams in the NBA but they seemingly have an unhealthy number of haters; this is true even in the city of LA.
Lakers and Yankees. If you're big in the community, people are more likely to have a stronger opinion of you, good or bad, as opposed to someone who keeps out of the spotlight.
I also think Incontrol gets a lot of hate for being American.
Should Dimaga have targeted the probes and preventing them from reaching the high ground? I feel like that would be a better response right.. what do you guys think?
On February 23 2012 16:25 Smat wrote: How does Ret have like perfect American english, isn't he European?
Almost all young Europeans speak perfect English. And they're more likely to copy American accents because that is their main reference point when it comes to media.
On February 23 2012 16:00 AlternativeEgo wrote: I feel kinda bad for iNc. First preparing for such a tough opponent as Dimaga and then getting one even a notch above without notice like that. That's some ball breaking stuff right there. >.< Good sport.
What makes you think Ret is a notch above Dimaga? Both are top 5 EU zergs with numerous accomplishments, I'd say they are evenly matched.
b/c every pro agrees rets ZvP is insane...compared to any foreingers
If we look at ZvP alone then yeah Ret is probably ahead.
Dimaga is behind, but I'm not sure he is "SO FAR BEHIND" as RuMCaKe indicates. iNcontroL invested a lot in those cannons + pylons. His nexus was not that early. Would like seeing the resource lost tab.
On February 23 2012 16:31 SgtCoDFish wrote: I love incontrol's mindset of "cannon the fuck out of everything at every opportunity."
Leads to some interesting games
I don't know instead he should work on more solid gameplay instead of creativity with cannons. It's fun and can be succesful from time to time but will this bring him far in the future ?
On February 23 2012 16:25 Smat wrote: How does Ret have like perfect American english, isn't he European?
Almost all young Europeans speak perfect English. And they're more likely to copy American accents because that is their main reference point when it comes to media.
Might have been referring to the accent, I actually can hardly hear any at all in his english
Going cannons out of a FFE should be standard in PvZ. You have to put early pressure on the zerg to keep them honest. The ONLY thing you can make that attack are cannons (and probes*).
Foreigners don't have that great ZvP though. It's basically just Ret and Stephano among foreigner zergs with good ZvP. Sans his win over JYP which can be attributed to being on fire, Sheth's vP has been pretty poor in the recent 'metagame'.
Game two on Tal Darim Altar. Dimaga at bottom left, iNcontroL at bottom right.
iNcontroL opens forge into cannoning-the-fuck-out-of Dimaga's natural, where Dimaga throws away a lot of zerglings and barely holds the rush. iNcontroL gets his natural up and the game settles into 36 to 36 supply at the 7:30 mark. Dimaga behind.
At 9:00, Dimaga kills his third rocks and takes his third base. Roach Warren up. Stargate done with void ray on the way. Twilight on the way. Lair done.
At 12:00, iNcontroL snipes Dimaga's third base with zealots, two voids, and a phoenix. iNcontroL takes ninja expansion at top right main base. Robo done.
At 15:00, infestors coming out. Immortals coming out. Blink and fleet bacon on the way.
At 17:00, robo bay going down. mothership on the way. Colossus starting immediately. Infestor sling roach queen moving out from Dimaga.
At 20:00, thermal lance done, both players maxed. iNcontroL has 87 probes though to Dimaga's 63 drones. Dimaga takes his fourth at the mid left shadow base. iNcontroL taking his fourth where his rocks are, and a ninja fifth at the top mid shadow base.
At 21:00, huge engagement. NP on mothership but nothing else special. iNcontroL comes out slightly on top because of colossi. Next attack, corruptors come out, and the fight is more even. 140 for iNcontroL, Dimaga has 110.
At 24:00, iNcontroL takes mid right shadow base. and pops Dimaga's fourth. Infested terrans take out iNcontroL's brand new... sixth base. Then it gets re-secured.
At 26:00, final engagement. iNcontroL has 200 and Dimaga has 160. Dimaga soon drops down to 60 supply.
Everyone should just auto 11pool18hatch incontrol. It's a negligible loss in econ for cannon proof and auto win late game (someone of dimaga's caliber)
On February 23 2012 16:43 HuKPOWA wrote: haha incontrol gonna be up 2-0....lol wtb haters now
Aaah good old opertunitists. Dima playing the worst i have ever seen, nice play by incontrol no suprise so far. Would they both play at there best i doubt the result would be the same, this does not make incontrol the better player overal.
On February 23 2012 16:45 Froadac wrote: incontrol up 2-0. Cheesy shenanigans, but good cheesy shenanigans.
if you have watched incontrols stream at all he takes that hidden expo for his 3rd all the time against zerg. It's the current metagame of what zerg is doing wrong that incontrol is exploiting. sentry/cannon can hold a main really well on most maps.
On February 23 2012 16:45 Froadac wrote: incontrol up 2-0. Cheesy shenanigans, but good cheesy shenanigans.
if you have watched incontrols stream at all he takes that hidden expo for his 3rd all the time against zerg. It's the current metagame of what zerg is doing wrong that incontrol is exploiting. sentry/cannon can hold a main really well on most maps.
Yeah I liked that location he took honestly. Zerg will have to commit a decent amount of forces to break the wall + cannon and then FF will delay it a little bit and if he commits to much Incontrol can just counter and win or do a ton of damage, or he can warp in units and defend the attack if it isn't to much.
Very smart I like it but that is why I always have 1 ling at like every base so toss can't take bases without me knowing :D
You usually get slightly more than 66 drones for 3 bases because A: you don't usually have time to count perfectly how many drones to make. and B: slightly more drones is good for when you need to make more buildings and shit.
Game three on Dual Sight. Dimaga at the 2 o'clock position; iNcontroL at the 8 o'clock position.
iNcontroL goes nexus before forge. Dimaga goes pool before hatchery (no pylon block), and then a fast third hatchery.
At 8:00, twilight (blink) and 6 gates for iNcontroL. Infestation pit for Dimaga. Macro hatch too.
At 10:00, 70 supply for iNcontroL to 100 supply for Dimaga.
At 12:00, iNcontroL pushes out with mass blink stalker, but sling infestor cleans it up. Dimaga switches to roaches. 140 supply for Dimaga, 60 for iNcontroL.
On February 23 2012 16:55 Odal wrote: You usually get slightly more than 66 drones for 3 bases because A: you don't usually have time to count perfectly how many drones to make. and B: slightly more drones is good for when you need to make more buildings and shit.
I don't get why gretorp keeps talking about it.
Was it not around 55 ? Top end Protoss attack way faster on 2 base, anything above that means you don't have enough units to def.
Really don't like this build for Incontrol. It was really good for awhile but now i feel it hits so late and tht the zerg has to really screw up to lose against it. Obviously Dual Sight is difficult to play a macro game vs zerg, but there are newer 2 base pushes tht we've seen in the GSL tht are much more equipped to the current metagame.
I just played on the korean server today. The patch is there, I downloaded it, played on it and everything.
Is it in Ladder games? I read some place that that the patch is only for non-ladder games
(what makes no sense because that going to effect MLG and GSL with no way to practice it on the ladder)
I know the patch works in ladder games on NA. I imagine so as I believe that was a mistake earlier for it not to be on ladder. I haven't seen ghosts or phoenix and i'm zerg so hard to say xD
Game four on Daybreak. Dimaga bottom left, iNcontroL top right.
iNcontroL FFEs, but pylon blocks Dimaga's natural before placing his nexus. iNcontroL also draws out plenty of drones with two fake cannons at Dimaga's natural. Dimaga takes his third base and then his natural, so he's off three fast bases.
At 8:00, Roach Warren and Lair go down. Stargate goes down. Void ray and phoenix on the way.
At 10:00, zealots warp-in by the third but the +1 push with 1 void and 2 phoenix get cleaned up by mass queens and some lings.
At 13:00, macro hatch, infestation pit, robo, and a lot more gateways go down. iNcontroL takes his third along the right side. Dimaga committing to infestor and roach tech. Burrow on the way. 140 supply for Dimaga, 110 supply for iNcontroL.
At 15:00, Dimaga takes his fourth at the top left. He moves out with queens roaches infestors slings. He attacks into a well-defended third, and gets completely shut down by forcefields, immortals, and stalkers. iNcontroL pops Dimaga's fourth with zealots in the meantime.
At 19:00, blink, colossi, thermal lance, corruptors on the way. Dimaga retaking the same fourth base, has his centerside fifth base too. Both players maxed and engage. Dimaga NPs the colossi and immortals, and iNcontroL loses his whole army in about five seconds. Gretorp says about twenty swear words.
At 22:00, Dimaga takes the top mid and bottom mid bases. Dimaga loses all his infestors ("oops" lol). Mass broodlords incoming. Speedling and broodlords take out iNcontroL's army just seconds before storm finishes, and he's essentially dead.
God Dimaga made that army comp just look so broken haha. Crazy good control. Perfect use of infested terrans, neural, fungal and then the lings + corruptors coming in last.
Definitely cool concept, specially since you get to see Gretorp cast in a more "natural" way compared to his NASL appearances. Also, Ret best co caster.
just putting it out there.. but gretorp could have actually explained HOW their styles are different rather than just rambling on and on about the fact that they are
On February 23 2012 17:29 anycolourfloyd wrote: just putting it out there.. but gretorp could have actually explained HOW their styles are different rather than just rambling on and on about the fact that they are
yea, not to mention that as someone who takes martial arts that analogy was a little bit of a stretch.
Game 5 on Shakuras Plateau. Dimaga at top right; iNcontroL at bottom left.
iNcontroL opens up FFE and pylon blocks Dimaga's natural (as usual). 2 fake cannons cause Dimaga to pull drones, which then get cancelled. Dimaga expands to pocket expansion before his natural.
At 8:00, quick robo with fast immortals and then 4 more gates (5 total). Lair and baneling nest going down. Spines going down. A lot of speedlings and sentries and zealots already out.
At 11:00, as iNcontroL moves out, two separate sling run-bys get in to his base and take out a few probes. iNcontroL pulls back and then moves out again with an incredibly strong force... and then gets obliterated by banelings, even though he has a bunch of sentries x.x Turned a likely win into a loss. Protoss army gets erased.
Sad that Incontrol got reverse all-killed. That last game was just... disappointing, but all in all I'm glad that Incontrol was able to show that he's at least capable of taking players like Dimaga out. Incontrol gets a lot of disappointing losses, but he's way better than most people think he is.
Also, I really like the cannon > stargate > zealot > dt pressures he was doing. I'm going to try it out.
On February 23 2012 17:31 Ruscour wrote: this is why I can't stand PvZ, miss a forcefield and it's instant GG
He took his eye off his army while walking onto Dimaga's side of the map. That's not good no matter what race you play and can be said for every match up. Take your eye off your marines in TvZ... Lose them to banelings. Take your eyes off your lings ZvZ... Lose them to banelings. Etc etc...
Awesome evening guys - great work from Ret helping out. Geoff showed some good stuff too. Agree that the relaxed style and mix of podcast and show match is very cool. Will def tune in again.
Incontrol always plays smart but he plays a little slow.. Not sure why that is but watching his stream vs. other high level players it seems there's more of a macro focus which is nice.. but a step behind on the multitask/micro i guess..
I think a lot of Toss focus too hard on micro and miss a lot of the strategic/macro aspects they can focus on that INC does real well.. but it seems like the weakness in his game is maintaining all the pieces fast enough. No troll Incontrol is really/smart and good obviously but that seems to be a big weakness he's got to address if we wants to be top tier.
That last game was heart breaking to watch, because it's not something that should happen to a player of incontrols caliber.
I watch a decent amount of his stream and leaving a hole in the wall when he pushes out happens enough for comment. Stop losing your advantage of your big army to ling run-bys!
Leave a zealot behind and plug the damn hole or put a pylon down when you move out!
My only question/complaint: why the hell did TT1 cuss out Gretorp in a pm like that? Is he some sort of rude bastard or am I missing a large part of the conversation. From what I saw, TT1 asked Gretorp who he got to play; Gretorp replied with Ret and then TT1 went on a cussing spree that seemed aimed at Gretorp. Double you tee eff was with that?
On February 23 2012 17:56 lavit2099 wrote: Great couple series there.
My only question/complaint: why the hell did TT1 cuss out Gretorp in a pm like that? Is he some sort of rude bastard or am I missing a large part of the conversation. From what I saw, TT1 asked Gretorp who he got to play; Gretorp replied with Ret and then TT1 went on a cussing spree that seemed aimed at Gretorp. Double you tee eff was with that?
TT1 is a bit of an angry drunk.. but they were ex-teammates and friends so probably just joking around.
Geoff has nothing to be ashamed of. A few key mistakes for him cost him the game, not like he was just getting run over. I think he has some learning to do but he is shaping up in a good way. Taking 2 games off a dude like Dimaga is awesome.
That being said, great games by Dimaga. Really showing how the PvZ matchup needs to be played against a style like iNcontroL's. Ling runby + aggressive expanding.
AAAAAAAAAAND, inevitably... Gretorp's casting... the dude needs to learn to be less critical. My goodness. I get that he has some good game knowledge but calling decisions "incorrect" and spending 5 minutes trying to guess when the gg will be called feels so awkward.
On February 23 2012 17:56 lavit2099 wrote: Great couple series there.
My only question/complaint: why the hell did TT1 cuss out Gretorp in a pm like that? Is he some sort of rude bastard or am I missing a large part of the conversation. From what I saw, TT1 asked Gretorp who he got to play; Gretorp replied with Ret and then TT1 went on a cussing spree that seemed aimed at Gretorp. Double you tee eff was with that?
lol dunno double you tee eff was up with dat, u tell me
GGs I'm curious how Inc would rate his level of concentration in this series (considering the time of day he was playing at). Not to make excuses, because pros are expected to perform 24/7/365 but tiredness would certainly explain lapses like in game 5.
On February 23 2012 17:56 lavit2099 wrote: Great couple series there.
My only question/complaint: why the hell did TT1 cuss out Gretorp in a pm like that? Is he some sort of rude bastard or am I missing a large part of the conversation. From what I saw, TT1 asked Gretorp who he got to play; Gretorp replied with Ret and then TT1 went on a cussing spree that seemed aimed at Gretorp. Double you tee eff was with that?
They're good friends and ex-teammates(both were on Fnatic). Safe to say TT1 was playing around.
On February 23 2012 18:36 Durn wrote: Geoff has nothing to be ashamed of. A few key mistakes for him cost him the game, not like he was just getting run over. I think he has some learning to do but he is shaping up in a good way. Taking 2 games off a dude like Dimaga is awesome.
That being said, great games by Dimaga. Really showing how the PvZ matchup needs to be played against a style like iNcontroL's. Ling runby + aggressive expanding.
AAAAAAAAAAND, inevitably... Gretorp's casting... the dude needs to learn to be less critical. My goodness. I get that he has some good game knowledge but calling decisions "incorrect" and spending 5 minutes trying to guess when the gg will be called feels so awkward.
if you didn't think those games were over early then you're out of your mind.
Well it seemed like this showmatch was going to be a disaster when Dimaga didnt show up but it turned out pretty great! Really cool to listen to Dimaga and Ret talk strategy, and to see both of them play iNcontrol.
if you didn't think those games were over early then you're out of your mind.
It's not that the average fan doesn't know those games are over early. It is that it's your job as a caster to make the games both informative and interesting. When you watch traditional sports they don't spend the whole second half of a blowout tearing down the other team or speculating when that team is going to mentally throw in the towel. They use that time to constructively show how the winning team is doing something that the losing team can't counter.
I don't mean this post to be a bashing of casters/casting. 99% of people couldn't do as well as you at this and I really appreciate the high quality of casting. Just be accepting of criticsm that will help you grow in your profession.
I generally like your style of casting and really appreciate matches like this, but I think that criticism was pretty fair and something a lot of casters (even the best) can work on. Didn't catch the last few matches (east coast time) so hopefully these will be on VOD's somewhere?
On February 23 2012 18:36 Durn wrote: Geoff has nothing to be ashamed of. A few key mistakes for him cost him the game, not like he was just getting run over. I think he has some learning to do but he is shaping up in a good way. Taking 2 games off a dude like Dimaga is awesome.
That being said, great games by Dimaga. Really showing how the PvZ matchup needs to be played against a style like iNcontroL's. Ling runby + aggressive expanding.
AAAAAAAAAAND, inevitably... Gretorp's casting... the dude needs to learn to be less critical. My goodness. I get that he has some good game knowledge but calling decisions "incorrect" and spending 5 minutes trying to guess when the gg will be called feels so awkward.
gretorp has gotten better imo, if anything i prefer casters to be critical as opposed to just saying "oh well he played well but got unlucky" or some bullshit
On February 23 2012 18:36 Durn wrote: Geoff has nothing to be ashamed of. A few key mistakes for him cost him the game, not like he was just getting run over. I think he has some learning to do but he is shaping up in a good way. Taking 2 games off a dude like Dimaga is awesome.
That being said, great games by Dimaga. Really showing how the PvZ matchup needs to be played against a style like iNcontroL's. Ling runby + aggressive expanding.
AAAAAAAAAAND, inevitably... Gretorp's casting... the dude needs to learn to be less critical. My goodness. I get that he has some good game knowledge but calling decisions "incorrect" and spending 5 minutes trying to guess when the gg will be called feels so awkward.
if you didn't think those games were over early then you're out of your mind.
Just want to point out that felt the same way as Durn here. Enjoyed the event though! Appreciate putting it together.
if you didn't think those games were over early then you're out of your mind.
It's not that the average fan doesn't know those games are over early. It is that it's your job as a caster to make the games both informative and interesting. When you watch traditional sports they don't spend the whole second half of a blowout tearing down the other team or speculating when that team is going to mentally throw in the towel. They use that time to constructively show how the winning team is doing something that the losing team can't counter.
I don't mean this post to be a bashing of casters/casting. 99% of people couldn't do as well as you at this and I really appreciate the high quality of casting. Just be accepting of criticsm that will help you grow in your profession.
I generally like your style of casting and really appreciate matches like this, but I think that criticism was pretty fair and something a lot of casters (even the best) can work on. Didn't catch the last few matches (east coast time) so hopefully these will be on VOD's somewhere?
Cheers
But this isn't NASL. I don't have to do that. I'm not appealing to that audience. if you don't like it don't watch it. (not actually you)
In this showmatch where it's mine and I can do whatever I want, I choose to not go that route. If you watch my other stuff then yes I do exactly that. I'm not going to fake anything for the sake of super low level people not understanding that the game is over. if people don't get that then the majority of things I say in the cast is compeltely useless to them anyway and they shouldn't be watching.
if you didn't think those games were over early then you're out of your mind.
It's not that the average fan doesn't know those games are over early. It is that it's your job as a caster to make the games both informative and interesting. When you watch traditional sports they don't spend the whole second half of a blowout tearing down the other team or speculating when that team is going to mentally throw in the towel. They use that time to constructively show how the winning team is doing something that the losing team can't counter.
I don't mean this post to be a bashing of casters/casting. 99% of people couldn't do as well as you at this and I really appreciate the high quality of casting. Just be accepting of criticsm that will help you grow in your profession.
I generally like your style of casting and really appreciate matches like this, but I think that criticism was pretty fair and something a lot of casters (even the best) can work on. Didn't catch the last few matches (east coast time) so hopefully these will be on VOD's somewhere?
Cheers
But this isn't NASL. I don't have to do that. I'm not appealing to that audience. if you don't like it don't watch it. (not actually you)
In this showmatch where it's mine and I can do whatever I want, I choose to not go that route. If you watch my other stuff then yes I do exactly that. I'm not going to fake anything for the sake of super low level people not understanding that the game is over. if people don't get that then the majority of things I say in the cast is compeltely useless to them anyway and they shouldn't be watching.
He's not talking about you needing to fake anything. He's just stating that your job as a caster is to come up with something that could be interesting as well as informative even though the game is over ( and we know it's over ).
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