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On August 12 2011 12:44 NewtofDoom wrote:
Watching that final Idra-Mana game was like stepping into a time machine to a few months ago. Zerg is massing roach/corruptor against Protoss death balls and getting stomped, and Idra is flipping about colossus OP. It's like someone hit him on the head with a shovel and he forgot that infestors and hive tech turn games and he can actually do something about a maxed P army besides rage quitting. The meta game has moved on. What is going on here?
Actually roach corruptor was outdated even then, Idra was just severely behind the curve.
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On August 12 2011 12:44 NewtofDoom wrote:
Watching that final Idra-Mana game was like stepping into a time machine to a few months ago. Zerg is massing roach/corruptor against Protoss death balls and getting stomped, and Idra is flipping about colossus OP. It's like someone hit him on the head with a shovel and he forgot that infestors and hive tech turn games and he can actually do something about a maxed P army besides rage quitting. The meta game has moved on. What is going on here?
Actually this game has been played more than a month ago 
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On August 12 2011 12:34 FighterHayabusa wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 12:27 doffe wrote:On August 12 2011 12:23 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:17 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:15 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:13 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:10 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:08 doffe wrote:On August 12 2011 12:04 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 11:59 Heavenly wrote:
[quote]
I think it's pretty silly how roaches cost half of what a stalker does, scales better with upgrades, and in medium-small numbers can easily win engagements. And how the race capable of getting more income much faster has such a powerful early game unit they can mass. Now you expect that unit to also be as powerful in the late-game by massing that unit solely? the reason a stalker ball wins is because of superior range in large army confrontations, not because they're better units without blink. The early game econ advantage Zerg can gain is nullified by two things for Toss: 1. Most are melee units so a wall will stop them; and, 2. Force fields will keep roaches at bay. The biggest issue for Zerg is one of cost efficacy. The problem is that this is fine in the early to mid game, but you cannot continue that economic lead into the late game. At some point you have to stop making drones or you won't have an army. That is what you saw in these games. As the game goes longer the ability to wage a battle where your units aren't cost effective declines as your opponent approaches your income. you are absolutely correct, a roach/hydra comp is not cost effective against toss endgame even with corruptors to handle collosi. If your gonna do this you need to keep the collosicount down alot while maintaining a supplylead. This is not something as a zergplayer you will win a majority of the games using. There is though the unit called the infestor that has proven to add cost effectivity to the zerg even in ZvP. Claiming that the zerg as a race have a hard time being costeffective is wrong, that comp is the problem and something most zergs stopped using a long time ago in lategame. Broodlords can aswell be probably the most costeffective unit in the game... why not use it? BLs are terrible vs Blink stalkers.... LOOOOOOOL god damn bronze league... zergs gonna have more than just brood lords. brood lords with just pure lings are amazing. LOLz someone who thinks they know what they are talking about. BL + Ling would get stomped by that comp, but keep thinking that. cant argue with idiots anymore So you resort to insults? Stay classy. Well, hes not really wrong, when you use a comment like "BLs are terriblt against blinkstalkers" you are begging for comments like that. its like saying mutas are terrible against marines.... well yes, thats why you dont use but one unit. The fact remains that the Issue of cost effectivity lies in Idras comp not the races possibilities... He said BL plus pure Ling, which is terrible vs that comp. Lings get stopped by FF and 1 shot by that many Colossi, and then the stalkers can just Blink under the BLs. BL+Infestor would be better, but again depends more on their mistakes than your skill.
Listen you bronze league moron, ling infestor ultra rapes stalker collosus sentry, so stfu, you just suck, and so does idra in zvp, all he does is cry about balance, when he does the same roach hydra corruptor shit that noone does now adays. Go watch good zergs, idra is some dumb nerd that thinks hes a tough guy, id knock the shit out of him if he bad mouthed me at a lan. fuken dumb nerd, looks like a little turtle. he deserves to be banned from ipl, who does he think he is? Idras infestor micro is also a joke, just watch his stream, he cries about balance with literally every single thing, when the game is well balanced. His macro is what takes him far, not his on the spot thinking and micro, hes such an annoying figure of the community now.
User was temp banned for this post.
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...Did esc0bar really just spoil the results or is he just messing with us?!?
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oh wow i left when idra was up 2 games to 0 on mana and i come back now and look at the results and see that mana reversed the 3 - 0 i have to say mana's looking pretty damn impressive taking out ThorZaIN and now IdrA
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On August 12 2011 12:47 BlueHydra wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 12:34 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:27 doffe wrote:On August 12 2011 12:23 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:17 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:15 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:13 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:10 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:08 doffe wrote:On August 12 2011 12:04 FighterHayabusa wrote:
[quote]
The early game econ advantage Zerg can gain is nullified by two things for Toss:
1. Most are melee units so a wall will stop them; and,
2. Force fields will keep roaches at bay.
The biggest issue for Zerg is one of cost efficacy. The problem is that this is fine in the early to mid game, but you cannot continue that economic lead into the late game. At some point you have to stop making drones or you won't have an army. That is what you saw in these games. As the game goes longer the ability to wage a battle where your units aren't cost effective declines as your opponent approaches your income.
you are absolutely correct, a roach/hydra comp is not cost effective against toss endgame even with corruptors to handle collosi. If your gonna do this you need to keep the collosicount down alot while maintaining a supplylead. This is not something as a zergplayer you will win a majority of the games using. There is though the unit called the infestor that has proven to add cost effectivity to the zerg even in ZvP. Claiming that the zerg as a race have a hard time being costeffective is wrong, that comp is the problem and something most zergs stopped using a long time ago in lategame. Broodlords can aswell be probably the most costeffective unit in the game... why not use it? BLs are terrible vs Blink stalkers.... LOOOOOOOL god damn bronze league... zergs gonna have more than just brood lords. brood lords with just pure lings are amazing. LOLz someone who thinks they know what they are talking about. BL + Ling would get stomped by that comp, but keep thinking that. cant argue with idiots anymore So you resort to insults? Stay classy. Well, hes not really wrong, when you use a comment like "BLs are terriblt against blinkstalkers" you are begging for comments like that. its like saying mutas are terrible against marines.... well yes, thats why you dont use but one unit. The fact remains that the Issue of cost effectivity lies in Idras comp not the races possibilities... He said BL plus pure Ling, which is terrible vs that comp. Lings get stopped by FF and 1 shot by that many Colossi, and then the stalkers can just Blink under the BLs. BL+Infestor would be better, but again depends more on their mistakes than your skill. Listen you bronze league moron, ling infestor ultra rapes stalker collosus sentry, so stfu, you just suck, and so does idra in zvp, all he does is cry about balance, when he does the same roach hydra corruptor shit that noone does now adays. Go watch good zergs, idra is some dumb nerd that thinks hes a tough guy, id knock the shit out of him if he bad mouthed me at a lan. fuken dumb nerd, looks like a little turtle. he deserves to be banned from ipl, who does he think he is? Idras infestor micro is also a joke, just watch his stream, he cries about balance with literally every single thing, when the game is well balanced. His macro is what takes him far, not his on the spot thinking and micro, hes such an annoying figure of the community now.
This post is full of class lol.
I'm not seeing much of a point in the midst of all that garbage.
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On August 12 2011 12:46 rakoth wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 12:44 NewtofDoom wrote:
Watching that final Idra-Mana game was like stepping into a time machine to a few months ago. Zerg is massing roach/corruptor against Protoss death balls and getting stomped, and Idra is flipping about colossus OP. It's like someone hit him on the head with a shovel and he forgot that infestors and hive tech turn games and he can actually do something about a maxed P army besides rage quitting. The meta game has moved on. What is going on here? Actually this game has been played more than a month ago
Oh if that's true then it explains a lot. :O
Why are they broadcasting so long after the matches?
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On August 12 2011 12:53 FighterHayabusa wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 12:47 BlueHydra wrote:On August 12 2011 12:34 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:27 doffe wrote:On August 12 2011 12:23 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:17 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:15 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:13 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:10 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:08 doffe wrote:
[quote]
you are absolutely correct, a roach/hydra comp is not cost effective against toss endgame even with corruptors to handle collosi. If your gonna do this you need to keep the collosicount down alot while maintaining a supplylead. This is not something as a zergplayer you will win a majority of the games using. There is though the unit called the infestor that has proven to add cost effectivity to the zerg even in ZvP. Claiming that the zerg as a race have a hard time being costeffective is wrong, that comp is the problem and something most zergs stopped using a long time ago in lategame.
Broodlords can aswell be probably the most costeffective unit in the game... why not use it? BLs are terrible vs Blink stalkers.... LOOOOOOOL god damn bronze league... zergs gonna have more than just brood lords. brood lords with just pure lings are amazing. LOLz someone who thinks they know what they are talking about. BL + Ling would get stomped by that comp, but keep thinking that. cant argue with idiots anymore So you resort to insults? Stay classy. Well, hes not really wrong, when you use a comment like "BLs are terriblt against blinkstalkers" you are begging for comments like that. its like saying mutas are terrible against marines.... well yes, thats why you dont use but one unit. The fact remains that the Issue of cost effectivity lies in Idras comp not the races possibilities... He said BL plus pure Ling, which is terrible vs that comp. Lings get stopped by FF and 1 shot by that many Colossi, and then the stalkers can just Blink under the BLs. BL+Infestor would be better, but again depends more on their mistakes than your skill. Listen you bronze league moron, ling infestor ultra rapes stalker collosus sentry, so stfu, you just suck, and so does idra in zvp, all he does is cry about balance, when he does the same roach hydra corruptor shit that noone does now adays. Go watch good zergs, idra is some dumb nerd that thinks hes a tough guy, id knock the shit out of him if he bad mouthed me at a lan. fuken dumb nerd, looks like a little turtle. he deserves to be banned from ipl, who does he think he is? Idras infestor micro is also a joke, just watch his stream, he cries about balance with literally every single thing, when the game is well balanced. His macro is what takes him far, not his on the spot thinking and micro, hes such an annoying figure of the community now. This post is full of class lol. I'm not seeing much of a point in the midst of all that garbage.
Youre garbage, theres a lot of truth behind that rage.
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On August 12 2011 12:53 NewtofDoom wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 12:46 rakoth wrote:On August 12 2011 12:44 NewtofDoom wrote:
Watching that final Idra-Mana game was like stepping into a time machine to a few months ago. Zerg is massing roach/corruptor against Protoss death balls and getting stomped, and Idra is flipping about colossus OP. It's like someone hit him on the head with a shovel and he forgot that infestors and hive tech turn games and he can actually do something about a maxed P army besides rage quitting. The meta game has moved on. What is going on here? Actually this game has been played more than a month ago Oh if that's true then it explains a lot. :O Why are they broadcasting so long after the matches?
Who knows, all I know is it gives the results a chance to get leaked which I think they JUST DID earlier in the thread!!! Can anyone confirm if this is true? X.X
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On August 12 2011 12:53 BlueHydra wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 12:53 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:47 BlueHydra wrote:On August 12 2011 12:34 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:27 doffe wrote:On August 12 2011 12:23 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:17 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:15 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:13 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:10 FighterHayabusa wrote:
[quote]
BLs are terrible vs Blink stalkers....
LOOOOOOOL god damn bronze league... zergs gonna have more than just brood lords. brood lords with just pure lings are amazing. LOLz someone who thinks they know what they are talking about. BL + Ling would get stomped by that comp, but keep thinking that. cant argue with idiots anymore So you resort to insults? Stay classy. Well, hes not really wrong, when you use a comment like "BLs are terriblt against blinkstalkers" you are begging for comments like that. its like saying mutas are terrible against marines.... well yes, thats why you dont use but one unit. The fact remains that the Issue of cost effectivity lies in Idras comp not the races possibilities... He said BL plus pure Ling, which is terrible vs that comp. Lings get stopped by FF and 1 shot by that many Colossi, and then the stalkers can just Blink under the BLs. BL+Infestor would be better, but again depends more on their mistakes than your skill. Listen you bronze league moron, ling infestor ultra rapes stalker collosus sentry, so stfu, you just suck, and so does idra in zvp, all he does is cry about balance, when he does the same roach hydra corruptor shit that noone does now adays. Go watch good zergs, idra is some dumb nerd that thinks hes a tough guy, id knock the shit out of him if he bad mouthed me at a lan. fuken dumb nerd, looks like a little turtle. he deserves to be banned from ipl, who does he think he is? Idras infestor micro is also a joke, just watch his stream, he cries about balance with literally every single thing, when the game is well balanced. His macro is what takes him far, not his on the spot thinking and micro, hes such an annoying figure of the community now. This post is full of class lol. I'm not seeing much of a point in the midst of all that garbage. Youre garbage, theres a lot of truth behind that rage.
You buddy, need to chill out and stop insulting people.
These games have been pretty old and I'm willing to bet new Mana vs. new IdrA would give us better games -.-
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On August 12 2011 12:56 CeriseCherries wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 12:53 BlueHydra wrote:On August 12 2011 12:53 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:47 BlueHydra wrote:On August 12 2011 12:34 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:27 doffe wrote:On August 12 2011 12:23 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:17 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:15 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:13 Condor Hero wrote:
[quote]
LOOOOOOOL
god damn bronze league...
zergs gonna have more than just brood lords.
brood lords with just pure lings are amazing. LOLz someone who thinks they know what they are talking about. BL + Ling would get stomped by that comp, but keep thinking that. cant argue with idiots anymore So you resort to insults? Stay classy. Well, hes not really wrong, when you use a comment like "BLs are terriblt against blinkstalkers" you are begging for comments like that. its like saying mutas are terrible against marines.... well yes, thats why you dont use but one unit. The fact remains that the Issue of cost effectivity lies in Idras comp not the races possibilities... He said BL plus pure Ling, which is terrible vs that comp. Lings get stopped by FF and 1 shot by that many Colossi, and then the stalkers can just Blink under the BLs. BL+Infestor would be better, but again depends more on their mistakes than your skill. Listen you bronze league moron, ling infestor ultra rapes stalker collosus sentry, so stfu, you just suck, and so does idra in zvp, all he does is cry about balance, when he does the same roach hydra corruptor shit that noone does now adays. Go watch good zergs, idra is some dumb nerd that thinks hes a tough guy, id knock the shit out of him if he bad mouthed me at a lan. fuken dumb nerd, looks like a little turtle. he deserves to be banned from ipl, who does he think he is? Idras infestor micro is also a joke, just watch his stream, he cries about balance with literally every single thing, when the game is well balanced. His macro is what takes him far, not his on the spot thinking and micro, hes such an annoying figure of the community now. This post is full of class lol. I'm not seeing much of a point in the midst of all that garbage. Youre garbage, theres a lot of truth behind that rage. You buddy, need to chill out and stop insulting people. These games have been pretty old and I'm willing to bet new Mana vs. new IdrA would give us better games -.-
look at what he was posting, and tell me it isnt deserved
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On August 12 2011 12:53 BlueHydra wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 12:53 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:47 BlueHydra wrote:On August 12 2011 12:34 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:27 doffe wrote:On August 12 2011 12:23 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:17 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:15 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:13 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:10 FighterHayabusa wrote:
[quote]
BLs are terrible vs Blink stalkers....
LOOOOOOOL god damn bronze league... zergs gonna have more than just brood lords. brood lords with just pure lings are amazing. LOLz someone who thinks they know what they are talking about. BL + Ling would get stomped by that comp, but keep thinking that. cant argue with idiots anymore So you resort to insults? Stay classy. Well, hes not really wrong, when you use a comment like "BLs are terriblt against blinkstalkers" you are begging for comments like that. its like saying mutas are terrible against marines.... well yes, thats why you dont use but one unit. The fact remains that the Issue of cost effectivity lies in Idras comp not the races possibilities... He said BL plus pure Ling, which is terrible vs that comp. Lings get stopped by FF and 1 shot by that many Colossi, and then the stalkers can just Blink under the BLs. BL+Infestor would be better, but again depends more on their mistakes than your skill. Listen you bronze league moron, ling infestor ultra rapes stalker collosus sentry, so stfu, you just suck, and so does idra in zvp, all he does is cry about balance, when he does the same roach hydra corruptor shit that noone does now adays. Go watch good zergs, idra is some dumb nerd that thinks hes a tough guy, id knock the shit out of him if he bad mouthed me at a lan. fuken dumb nerd, looks like a little turtle. he deserves to be banned from ipl, who does he think he is? Idras infestor micro is also a joke, just watch his stream, he cries about balance with literally every single thing, when the game is well balanced. His macro is what takes him far, not his on the spot thinking and micro, hes such an annoying figure of the community now. This post is full of class lol. I'm not seeing much of a point in the midst of all that garbage. Youre garbage, theres a lot of truth behind that rage.
No, there really isn't. Further, any knowledge you may have is couched in trash, and no one is going to sort through that to find your point.
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HEY. DOWN HERE. EARLIER IN THIS THREAD. WAS THAT SO-CALLED SPOILER TRUE?
Can anyone confirm or deny? Soon as someone does I'll shut up...
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On August 12 2011 12:09 Turenne wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 11:50 Intricate1 wrote:On August 12 2011 11:47 Ruscour wrote:
I've never seen IdrA straight up "fuck you" someone before.
Well deserved win by Mana! I don't buy it, the unprovoked attack like that, idra's a smart guy he took the opportunity to build his brand IMO  ahwell Agreed, Mana most definitely bm'ed him, hopefully we'll find out what he said exactly soon.
Idra fanboys are beyond pathetic. How you can just assume something like that boggles my mind.
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Does Apollo think Moonan and Momam are the same person?
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My god...I don't understand how WhiteRa does it, I'm just glad he does.
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On August 12 2011 12:53 BlueHydra wrote:Show nested quote +On August 12 2011 12:53 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:47 BlueHydra wrote:On August 12 2011 12:34 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:27 doffe wrote:On August 12 2011 12:23 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:17 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:15 FighterHayabusa wrote:On August 12 2011 12:13 Condor Hero wrote:On August 12 2011 12:10 FighterHayabusa wrote:
[quote]
BLs are terrible vs Blink stalkers....
LOOOOOOOL god damn bronze league... zergs gonna have more than just brood lords. brood lords with just pure lings are amazing. LOLz someone who thinks they know what they are talking about. BL + Ling would get stomped by that comp, but keep thinking that. cant argue with idiots anymore So you resort to insults? Stay classy. Well, hes not really wrong, when you use a comment like "BLs are terriblt against blinkstalkers" you are begging for comments like that. its like saying mutas are terrible against marines.... well yes, thats why you dont use but one unit. The fact remains that the Issue of cost effectivity lies in Idras comp not the races possibilities... He said BL plus pure Ling, which is terrible vs that comp. Lings get stopped by FF and 1 shot by that many Colossi, and then the stalkers can just Blink under the BLs. BL+Infestor would be better, but again depends more on their mistakes than your skill. Listen you bronze league moron, ling infestor ultra rapes stalker collosus sentry, so stfu, you just suck, and so does idra in zvp, all he does is cry about balance, when he does the same roach hydra corruptor shit that noone does now adays. Go watch good zergs, idra is some dumb nerd that thinks hes a tough guy, id knock the shit out of him if he bad mouthed me at a lan. fuken dumb nerd, looks like a little turtle. he deserves to be banned from ipl, who does he think he is? Idras infestor micro is also a joke, just watch his stream, he cries about balance with literally every single thing, when the game is well balanced. His macro is what takes him far, not his on the spot thinking and micro, hes such an annoying figure of the community now. This post is full of class lol. I'm not seeing much of a point in the midst of all that garbage. Youre garbage, theres a lot of truth behind that rage.
Did you actually make an account just to rage about how Idra bm'd? Jesus people, why do some of you care so much about what he says?
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On August 12 2011 13:03 Juvant wrote:
Does Apollo think Moonan and Momam are the same person?
I think he does... Thorzain is my favourite player but I decided to turn this broadcast off, I am not enjoying these casters as I feel they present the game at a very low level.
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On August 12 2011 13:00 OmiDeLta wrote:
HEY. DOWN HERE. EARLIER IN THIS THREAD. WAS THAT SO-CALLED SPOILER TRUE?
Can anyone confirm or deny? Soon as someone does I'll shut up...
noooooo don't answer that! As long as there is doubt, we can remain in a blissful semi-unspoiled state. :D
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EPT
