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On May 06 2011 19:07 HolyArrow wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 19:05 Clog wrote:On May 06 2011 19:03 HolyArrow wrote:On May 06 2011 19:02 Clog wrote:On May 06 2011 18:58 HolydaKing wrote:On May 06 2011 18:57 Supamang wrote:
how is mvp losing to this guy "this guy" beat mvp in a macro game, see the second map.  Well... while Bomber definitely played extremely well game 2, MVP mostly lost to supply blocking himself... Being 30 supply down like 9 minutes into a game before any fighting has happened isn't really representative of Bomber beating MVP in a macro game. But that's what I think I guess I do like Bombers decision to all-in on this map though. Hated how MVP handled it I thought the definition of macroing well is in part to not get supply blocked. So, when MVP makes a huge macro mistake that allows Bomber to win, it suddenly doesn't count as really beating MVP in a macro game? ..What? Letting yourself get supply blocked is definitely a macro mistake, but it's not representative of MVP's play is my point. I'm just saying I wouldn't say Bomber is better at macro games than MVP, and then proceed to cite this game. Sure. But we've seen plenty of examples of Bomber's sick macro during his Code A run, and in the GSTL, Bomber was actually ahead in supply but allowed MVP to come back due to being too aggressive. Bomber was also slightly ahead in supply even before MVP had that huge supply block IIRC. Not saying that Bomber is better at macro than MVP, but I argue that there's plenty of evidence to suggest that his macro is at least on par with MVP's.
Indeed. I think bomber's weakness is sometimes makes bad decisions and run into tank lines.
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On May 06 2011 19:05 GoKu` wrote:
Game 1 Was not a cheese, 2 rax pressure into 4 barracks expo is pretty standard.
Game 2 Bomber simply didn't stop scv production and MvP did. He then got out macro'd and do to some very good desision making was able to close out the game
Game 3 Was a cheese after reading where they were positioned on the map. Probably because his 3rd is insanely vunerable to drops and if Bomber were to drop MVP, MVP's units spawn right there. Very smart choices by Bomber.
Game 1 he proxy raxed and tried for a really risky expo and got denied on both ends. Then he failed badly on stopping hellion harass twice.
Game 2 mvp was supply blocked 2x the second for a full minute or so.
Game 3 was a smart timing but mvp handled his positioning poorly after scouting the timing coming quite far in advance, although he missed the scv pull.
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Moletrap left out Tasteless lol
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On May 06 2011 19:08 Supamang wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 19:05 Clog wrote:On May 06 2011 19:03 HolyArrow wrote:On May 06 2011 19:02 Clog wrote:On May 06 2011 18:58 HolydaKing wrote:On May 06 2011 18:57 Supamang wrote:
how is mvp losing to this guy "this guy" beat mvp in a macro game, see the second map. Well... while Bomber definitely played extremely well game 2, MVP mostly lost to supply blocking himself... Being 30 supply down like 9 minutes into a game before any fighting has happened isn't really representative of Bomber beating MVP in a macro game. But that's what I think I guess I do like Bombers decision to all-in on this map though. Hated how MVP handled it I thought the definition of macroing well is in part to not get supply blocked. So, when MVP makes a huge macro mistake that allows Bomber to win, it suddenly doesn't count as really beating MVP in a macro game? ..What? Letting yourself get supply blocked is definitely a macro mistake, but it's not representative of MVP's play is my point. I'm just saying I wouldn't say Bomber is better at macro games than MVP, and then proceed to cite this game. Exactly. No one is saying Bomber is bad. Bomber is very good. Its just that MVPs average level of play is higher than Bombers and hes got the credentials to prove it. I cant believe Bomber fans are like "LOL MVP FANBOI TEARS MMMM" when all we are saying is that MVP isnt playing up to his usual caliber. Honestly its more a case of Bomber fanboi jizz than MVP fanboi tears
I'm not particularly a fan of either, but I recognise they are both pretty good. How you can possibly discern that Mvp is clearly better based on the very few games we've seen them play each other, in which...
GSTL - Bomber gets macro-lead and MVP has miracle comeback
Game 1, this series - Bomber 2raxes and fails, Mvp is ahead and wins
Game 2, Bomber wins in a straight up macro game
Game 3, Bomber all-ins and wins.
All I can say is that, whoever wins this is the best player on today, that is the boldest statement I will make. Anyone who suggests that Bomber doesn't deserve to be 2-1 up against Mvp though because for some reason it is Mvp's god-given right to win, is pretty foolish.
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On May 06 2011 19:09 Clog wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 19:07 HolyArrow wrote:On May 06 2011 19:05 Clog wrote:On May 06 2011 19:03 HolyArrow wrote:On May 06 2011 19:02 Clog wrote:On May 06 2011 18:58 HolydaKing wrote:On May 06 2011 18:57 Supamang wrote:
how is mvp losing to this guy "this guy" beat mvp in a macro game, see the second map. Well... while Bomber definitely played extremely well game 2, MVP mostly lost to supply blocking himself... Being 30 supply down like 9 minutes into a game before any fighting has happened isn't really representative of Bomber beating MVP in a macro game. But that's what I think I guess I do like Bombers decision to all-in on this map though. Hated how MVP handled it I thought the definition of macroing well is in part to not get supply blocked. So, when MVP makes a huge macro mistake that allows Bomber to win, it suddenly doesn't count as really beating MVP in a macro game? ..What? Letting yourself get supply blocked is definitely a macro mistake, but it's not representative of MVP's play is my point. I'm just saying I wouldn't say Bomber is better at macro games than MVP, and then proceed to cite this game. Sure. But we've seen plenty of examples of Bomber's sick macro during his Code A run, and in the GSTL, Bomber was actually ahead in supply but allowed MVP to come back due to being too aggressive. Bomber was also slightly ahead in supply even before MVP had that huge supply block IIRC. Not saying that Bomber is better at macro than MVP, but I argue that there's plenty of evidence to suggest that his macro is at least on par with MVP's. Yeah for sure. I'm just saying that for all the people being like "WOAH Bomber totally outclassing MVP game two!". Bomber certainly deserved to win but it's not like MVP played poorly for the most part, he just made one big screw-up that forced him to play behind all game.
Yeah, I agree game 2 wasn't representative of MVP's usual abilities and that the huge supply block totally cost him the game. The reason I'm trying to praise Bomber's macro is not to suggest that Bomber outclasses MVP, but just to make a point about how dumb it is that people are whining about Bomber all-inning.
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On May 06 2011 19:10 Blasterion wrote:
Moletrap left out Tasteless lol
He voted on bomber
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On May 06 2011 19:04 ZeroxCOOL wrote:
Casters need to calm the fuck down. Even during small battles they shriek and scream until its over.. both of them..with high pitched voices.. at the same god damn time. Gives me a headache. Sorry to troll.
yes I was sitting here just thinking, can you please stop screaming all the time. They are trying way to hard to be exciting. Allmost like the competition we are watching is Moletrap vs Doa.
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Hmm bombers name isn't 3 letters long and doesn't start with an M or end with a P, therefore im picking MvP to win lol. Joking aside, I feel MvP can pull it together like he did in the World Championships after he lost a couple of games to MKP, 1 of them being cheese.
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On May 06 2011 19:09 MrCon wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 19:04 Ansinjunger wrote:
Again, are the coaches allowed to tell the players what happened in between matches? Moletrap hinted at this but somehow avoided the obvious question I asked. yes. I think they can watch the replays too if they want.
I think the casters mentioned that they are not allowed to?
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On May 06 2011 19:07 Kazang wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 19:05 Blasterion wrote:On May 06 2011 19:04 ZeroxCOOL wrote:
Casters need to calm the fuck down. Even during small battles they shriek and scream until its over.. both of them..with high pitched voices.. at the same god damn time. Gives me a headache. Sorry to troll. Have you ever watched Korean Casting ? they be much more baller Yeah but we aren't Korean and find that style of casting kind of annoying. Pacing is needed in english, constant hype just makes everything dull.
Speak for yourself, don't include everyone with your statement. I happen to enjoy that style of casting.
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On May 06 2011 19:10 realstarcrafter wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 19:07 HolyArrow wrote:On May 06 2011 19:05 Clog wrote:On May 06 2011 19:03 HolyArrow wrote:On May 06 2011 19:02 Clog wrote:On May 06 2011 18:58 HolydaKing wrote:On May 06 2011 18:57 Supamang wrote:
how is mvp losing to this guy "this guy" beat mvp in a macro game, see the second map. Well... while Bomber definitely played extremely well game 2, MVP mostly lost to supply blocking himself... Being 30 supply down like 9 minutes into a game before any fighting has happened isn't really representative of Bomber beating MVP in a macro game. But that's what I think I guess I do like Bombers decision to all-in on this map though. Hated how MVP handled it I thought the definition of macroing well is in part to not get supply blocked. So, when MVP makes a huge macro mistake that allows Bomber to win, it suddenly doesn't count as really beating MVP in a macro game? ..What? Letting yourself get supply blocked is definitely a macro mistake, but it's not representative of MVP's play is my point. I'm just saying I wouldn't say Bomber is better at macro games than MVP, and then proceed to cite this game. Sure. But we've seen plenty of examples of Bomber's sick macro during his Code A run, and in the GSTL, Bomber was actually ahead in supply but allowed MVP to come back due to being too aggressive. Bomber was also slightly ahead in supply even before MVP had that huge supply block IIRC. Not saying that Bomber is better at macro than MVP, but I argue that there's plenty of evidence to suggest that his macro is at least on par with MVP's. Indeed. I think bomber's weakness is sometimes makes bad decisions and run into tank lines.
Yeah, totally agree there. That's what made him lose his GSTL match against MVP and that's also what kind of allowed MVP to catch up for a bit during game 2.
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If mvp doesn't start playing well he will get 4-1d convincingly.
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Moletrap doesn't let DoA talk..
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On May 06 2011 19:06 bbQ4Aiur wrote:
Are we gonna know brackets of the U&D today?
oh yes
This will be GOOD.
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Close air spawn on Metalopolis. Could be quick game.
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haven't been on sc2 forums for a while but good to see ppl finally acknowledging DOA's lack of knowledge.
i've been trying to say that since the 1st day he came out yet when i was saying it, the spotlight was on kelly so ppl thought DOA was good....for no reason. -_- ;;
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On May 06 2011 19:10 bennyaus wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 19:08 Supamang wrote:On May 06 2011 19:05 Clog wrote:On May 06 2011 19:03 HolyArrow wrote:On May 06 2011 19:02 Clog wrote:On May 06 2011 18:58 HolydaKing wrote:On May 06 2011 18:57 Supamang wrote:
how is mvp losing to this guy "this guy" beat mvp in a macro game, see the second map. Well... while Bomber definitely played extremely well game 2, MVP mostly lost to supply blocking himself... Being 30 supply down like 9 minutes into a game before any fighting has happened isn't really representative of Bomber beating MVP in a macro game. But that's what I think I guess I do like Bombers decision to all-in on this map though. Hated how MVP handled it I thought the definition of macroing well is in part to not get supply blocked. So, when MVP makes a huge macro mistake that allows Bomber to win, it suddenly doesn't count as really beating MVP in a macro game? ..What? Letting yourself get supply blocked is definitely a macro mistake, but it's not representative of MVP's play is my point. I'm just saying I wouldn't say Bomber is better at macro games than MVP, and then proceed to cite this game. Exactly. No one is saying Bomber is bad. Bomber is very good. Its just that MVPs average level of play is higher than Bombers and hes got the credentials to prove it. I cant believe Bomber fans are like "LOL MVP FANBOI TEARS MMMM" when all we are saying is that MVP isnt playing up to his usual caliber. Honestly its more a case of Bomber fanboi jizz than MVP fanboi tears I'm not particularly a fan of either, but I recognise they are both pretty good. How you can possibly discern that Mvp is clearly better based on the very few games we've seen them play each other, in which... GSTL - Bomber gets macro-lead and MVP has miracle comeback Game 1, this series - Bomber 2raxes and fails, Mvp is ahead and wins Game 2, Bomber wins in a straight up macro game Game 3, Bomber all-ins and wins. All I can say is that, whoever wins this is the best player on today, that is the boldest statement I will make. Anyone who suggests that Bomber doesn't deserve to be 2-1 up against Mvp though because for some reason it is Mvp's god-given right to win, is pretty foolish.
well its a mirror match up so obviously whoever wins is the best player on the day. It cant be otherwise in a mirror as theirs no balancing issues.
People are more arguing/thinking that MVP is the better player overall
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On May 06 2011 19:11 Pekkz wrote:Show nested quote +On May 06 2011 19:04 ZeroxCOOL wrote:
Casters need to calm the fuck down. Even during small battles they shriek and scream until its over.. both of them..with high pitched voices.. at the same god damn time. Gives me a headache. Sorry to troll. Allmost like the competition we are watching is Moletrap vs Doa.
QFT It feels like that 100% mostly coming from Moles side. Is it possible to watch this from the Korean commentary POV?
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Close air positions on Metalapolis. According to Moletrap Bomber thinks this is his worst map.
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On May 06 2011 19:12 hmmm... wrote:
haven't been on sc2 forums for a while but good to see ppl finally acknowledging DOA's lack of knowledge.
i've been trying to say that since the 1st day he came out yet when i was saying it, the spotlight was on kelly so ppl thought DOA was good....for no reason. -_- ;;
He's not good for his knowledge, his jokes are quite funny usually and his ''talking about what's happening'' (I forgot what the name was for this) is good imo.
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EPT
